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Schools closed until March/April? (part 4) **Mod warning in OP 22/01**

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  • #1712
    wirelessdude01
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,441 ✭✭✭wirelessdude01


    Mohamed Thoughtless Adhesive wrote: »
    Saw that today. Child should be removed from parents.

    All this vulnerable children talk. The reality is there is a sizeable cohort of parents who rely on teachers and schools to raise their children. Its sad that there are so many children who are physically, mentally and emotionally safer in schools than in their homes. But the angle is always how schools being closed affects them. It is never about tackling the home circumstances.

    The cutbacks in all the various services that should be dealing with something like this are the cause, not school closures. What happens during the summer when schools are closed for 2/3 months depending on the school. We can't and shouldn't be expected to plug the failure of government to provide and find proper services.


  • #1713
    km79
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,440 ✭✭✭✭km79


    I have heard of something local tonight that has brought home the virility of this strain
    It would be absolute MADNESS for schools to reopen
    I think if people put aside their hatred for teachers and/or heard first hand of how easily it is rampaging through houses , families and communities this thread would be a lot different

    Lives are more important than a few weeks education. I won’t say anymore .


  • #1714
    lulublue22
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,496 ✭✭✭lulublue22


    wirelessdude01 wrote: »
    The cutbacks in all the various services that should be dealing with something like this are the cause, not school closures. What happens during the summer when schools are closed for 2/3 months depending on the school. We can't and shouldn't be expected to plug the failure of government to provide and find proper services.

    That’s a core issue - cutbacks in services with the push back on schools to fill the gap. I was listening to an interview linked here on the need for schools to reopen. The one thing that stood out to me is that one very vocal proponent of schools reopening listed all the ancillary services that were closed and made the statement that schools had to open basically to pick up the slack.


  • #1715
    downthemiddle
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,649 ✭✭✭downthemiddle


    wirelessdude01 wrote: »
    The cutbacks in all the various services that should be dealing with something like this are the cause, not school closures. What happens during the summer when schools are closed for 2/3 months depending on the school. We can't and shouldn't be expected to plug the failure of government to provide and find proper services.

    It has taken a pandemic for a certain cohort of individuals to see the role schools play in society. While teaching and learning is the main objective quite often they can be the least important aspect of a teacher's day.
    However, there will always be the "but the holidays" brigade.


  • #1716
    am_zarathustra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,404 ✭✭✭am_zarathustra


    lulublue22 wrote: »
    That’s a core issue - cutbacks in services with the push back on schools to fill the gap. I was listening to an interview linked here on the need for schools to reopen. The one thing that stood out to me is that one very vocal proponent of schools reopening listed all the ancillary services that were closed and made the statement that schools had to open basically to pick up the slack.

    Absolutely, where are social services in this?

    I'll also ask if anyone here who has made a welfare referral to TUSLA has felt they were super on top of their game. It's a complete gamble, we'd know based on the case worker whether anything would happen......we had one we always hoped for, 1 out of a dozen or so


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  • #1717
    downthemiddle
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,649 ✭✭✭downthemiddle


    am_zarathustra wrote: »
    Absolutely, where are social services in this?

    I'll also ask if anyone here who has made a welfare referral to TUSLA has felt they were super on top of their game. It's a complete gamble, we'd know based on the case worker whether anything would happen......we had one we always hoped for, 1 out of a dozen or so

    Social services in this country are an embarrassment, underfunded, under resourced, understaffed and overwhelmed.


  • #1718
    khalessi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,216 ✭✭✭khalessi


    tigger123 wrote: »
    Teachers previously were able to catch these kind of cases though, plus, the kids were getting some relief from neglectful or abusive parents.

    Its not about people pawning their kids off for the day.

    Apparently principal went to house and child involved with Social workers so where were they?


  • #1719
    brookers
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 408 ✭✭brookers


    km79 wrote: »
    I have heard of something local tonight that has brought home the virility of this strain
    It would be absolute MADNESS for schools to reopen
    I think if people put aside their hatred for teachers and/or heard first hand of how easily it is rampaging through houses , families and communities this thread would be a lot different

    Lives are more important than a few weeks education. I won’t say anymore .

    That jen hogan does my head in, her and her 7 children, oh how awful home schooling is, imagine what it would be like if they were in a hospital. do they ever listen to themselves and how stupid they sound. Cant believe irish times allow her silly articles. These people need to get a grip. its a pandemic, teachers are not responsible for the kids who are being raised by evil parents.


  • #1720
    Stateofyou
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,431 ✭✭✭Stateofyou


    downthemiddle wrote: »
    Social services in this country are an embarrassment, underfunded, under resourced, understaffed and overwhelmed.

    So, just like the education sector? :rolleyes:
    Bet the Dail bar is fully resourced, funded and staffed.


  • #1721
    downthemiddle
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,649 ✭✭✭downthemiddle


    Stateofyou wrote: »
    So, just like the education sector? :rolleyes:
    Bet the Dail bar is fully resourced, funded and staffed.

    Which one? The one in Leinster House or the one in the Conference Centre?


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  • #1722
    Akabusi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,134 ✭✭✭Akabusi


    If this goes ahead my wife is back in on Thursday to teach two kids. Out of the whole school, there is one family insisting that their kids go to school. There would be another 6 -7 kids eligible to attend if they wanted but the parents are not sending them in. For us this means we will now have to work out some arrangements to look after our kids as I work as well. There is no creche option so my wife's parents would have to step in but they live down the country, hardly ideal to have them drive two hours each way every day and they are quite elderly. We don't know what to do, parental leave is an option and we just do without the wage. Also If she goes on that the school looses out on a resource as she was doing the Maths lessons for the 4th, 5th and 6th classes while they've been shut.
    What an ill thought out idea.


  • #1723
    Dickie10
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,067 ✭✭✭Dickie10


    im presuming most people here of opinion its after mid term at the earliset before any sign of schols back in any way? thats about feb 20th


  • #1724
    jimmytwotimes 2013
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,797 ✭✭✭jimmytwotimes 2013


    Dickie10 wrote: »
    im presuming most people here of opinion its after mid term at the earliset before any sign of schols back in any way? thats about feb 20th

    Think they're going to push for LCs at start of Feb


  • #1725
    km79
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48,440 ✭✭✭✭km79


    Dickie10 wrote: »
    im presuming most people here of opinion its after mid term at the earliset before any sign of schols back in any way? thats about feb 20th

    That’s when it should be
    When it will be is anyone’s guess


  • #1726
    Birdy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 124 ✭✭Birdy


    Claire Byrne now.


  • #1727
    dinneenp
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,230 ✭✭✭dinneenp


    Akabusi wrote: »
    If this goes ahead my wife is back in on Thursday to teach two kids. Out of the whole school, there is one family insisting that their kids go to school. There would be another 6 -7 kids eligible to attend if they wanted but the parents are not sending them in. For us this means we will now have to work out some arrangements to look after our kids as I work as well. There is no creche option so my wife's parents would have to step in but they live down the country, hardly ideal to have them drive two hours each way every day and they are quite elderly. We don't know what to do, parental leave is an option and we just do without the wage. Also If she goes on that the school looses out on a resource as she was doing the Maths lessons for the 4th, 5th and 6th classes while they've been shut.
    What an ill thought out idea.

    There's multiple other professions already in this situation.


  • #1728
    Akabusi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,134 ✭✭✭Akabusi


    Birdy wrote: »
    Claire Byrne now.

    See that, while it helps my family personally I do feel for the families of special needs kids, something does have to be done but in a proper structured way.


  • #1729
    dirkmeister
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,683 ✭✭✭dirkmeister


    Go on, Adam...say children have a constitutional right to an education again.


  • #1730
    irishproduce
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,840 ✭✭✭irishproduce


    It's shameful that we cannot put in place a structure to allow the most deprived and vulnerable children, along with those with the most special needs, to be brought back in to school.
    We designate essential workers and so there should be provision that those children most suffering can attend with their friends and teachers.
    It's very sad.
    The government has to find a solution. Norma Foley needs to get the stakeholders together and all arrive at the solution.
    What's going on is quite selfish from the education sector.
    Either the education of children is essential or its not.


  • #1731
    KrustyUCC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,077 ✭✭✭KrustyUCC


    Dickie10 wrote: »
    im presuming most people here of opinion its after mid term at the earliset before any sign of schols back in any way? thats about feb 20th

    Minimum but I'd be surprised if it's that early


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  • #1732
    Akabusi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,134 ✭✭✭Akabusi


    dinneenp wrote: »
    There's multiple other professions already in this situation.

    Correct there is, pretty ****ty situation for everyone.


  • #1733
    Stateofyou
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,431 ✭✭✭Stateofyou


    irishproduce wrote: »
    It's shameful that we cannot put in place a structure to allow the most deprived and vulnerable children, along with those with the most special needs, to be brought back in to school.
    We designate essential workers and so there should be provision that those children most suffering can attend with their friends and teachers.
    It's very sad.
    The government has to find a solution. Norma Foley needs to get the stakeholders together and all arrive at the solution.
    What's going on is quite selfish from the education sector.
    Either the education of children is essential or its not.

    Either we're in the middle of a raging pandemic and told it's essential to stay home/work from home, or we're not.

    Getting some control over the spread and getting our hospitals and track/trace back to some type of proper functioning first doesn't send any kind of message that education of children isn't essential. :rolleyes: Education can and is still happening. And it's not the education sectors fault. Try the DES/Minister(s) of Education.


  • #1734
    yerwanthere123
    Moderators, Sports Moderators, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,776 Mod ✭✭✭✭yerwanthere123


    irishproduce wrote: »
    It's shameful that we cannot put in place a structure to allow the most deprived and vulnerable children, along with those with the most special needs, to be brought back in to school.
    We designate essential workers and so there should be provision that those children most suffering can attend with their friends and teachers.
    It's very sad.
    The government has to find a solution. Norma Foley needs to get the stakeholders together and all arrive at the solution.
    What's going on is quite selfish from the education sector.
    Either the education of children is essential or its not.

    No, it's not. School staff shouldn't be expected to risk their health or even their lives to deliver education. They were already working in an environment with zero social distancing and up to thirty unmasked children in small classrooms. Now they're being expected to return to work when there's still thousands of cases a day being diagnosed, and with the true numbers being higher due to close contacts not being tested currently. If returning to school in the middle of a pandemic wave was as essential as Norma Foley and co. are trying to say then teachers wouldn't be eleventh in the vaccination queue.


  • #1735
    St.Spodo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,027 ✭✭✭St.Spodo


    It's really sad that in-person special ed won't take place from Thursday, but ultimately this is a consequence of our failure to deal with the pandemic and specifically the political decisions that were made in the run up to Christmas. Pretending schools are somehow safe when the virus is rampant in the communities in which the school population live isn't going to wash anymore. We need to get serious about getting the numbers down, keeping them down, and getting our children back to school for good where they belong.


  • #1736
    Piehead
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 471 ✭✭Piehead


    KrustyUCC wrote: »
    Minimum but I'd be surprised if it's that early

    Possibly post Easter but may be Sept


  • #1737
    KrustyUCC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,077 ✭✭✭KrustyUCC


    Piehead wrote: »
    Possibly post Easter but may be Sept

    Can't see that happening again but we'll see


  • #1738
    yerwanthere123
    Moderators, Sports Moderators, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,776 Mod ✭✭✭✭yerwanthere123


    Piehead wrote: »
    Possibly post Easter but may be Sept

    Ah now let's not get ahead of ourselves.


  • #1739
    rob316
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,679 ✭✭✭✭rob316


    Disgraceful. Teachers are like endangered species with this carry on from the unions. I'll remind you, your an essential public service, you have been mandated by your employer to go back to work so you should. Special needs kids can not be reached remotely, it's ridiculous to even try to, your totally abandoning the needs of these kids and there parents.

    All in this together apparently.


  • #1740
    E36Ross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 262 ✭✭E36Ross


    irishproduce wrote: »
    Norma Foley needs to get the stakeholders together and all arrive at the solution.
    What's going on is quite selfish from the education sector.
    Either the education of children is essential or its not.

    I think if they all sat around the socially distanced table and Norma actually acknowledged the very awkward position of schools, that they are not truly safe but they really are essential for the benefit of SEN children and actually spoke to the very people she represents to see what would help to make it a safer environment. She would earn a lot more respect from everyone!

    But instead she continues to play the same tune of "Schools are safe" and seemingly ignores any concerns.

    The whole thing is a laughing stock and really shows how tragic our government is, I don't envy there position as it really is an awful situation to call but with information continously half arsed leaked through the media and the constant indecisive decisions they really aren't showing a leadership.


    Since Christmas,

    ALL schools opening Wednesday 6th.

    No wait,
    ALL schools open Monday the 11th

    Actually make that,
    SEN schools and leaving certs open the 11th

    Hang on,
    Maybe we'll open the 1st of Feb?

    Okay we'll try again,
    SEN schools open Thursday 21st with a half arsed rumour of LC back the 1st of Feb with the rest back on the 22nd Feb.

    I'm not even sure on dates anymore as there's been so much rumours, newspaper articles etc..


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  • #1741
    wirelessdude01
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,441 ✭✭✭wirelessdude01


    St.Spodo wrote: »
    It's really sad that in-person special ed won't take place from Thursday, but ultimately this is a consequence of our failure to deal with the pandemic and specifically the political decisions that were made in the run up to Christmas. Pretending schools are somehow safe when the virus is rampant in the communities in which the school population live isn't going to wash anymore. We need to get serious about getting the numbers down, keeping them down, and getting our children back to school for good where they belong.

    Probably not representative at all but one of my neighbours has a child that would be in the criteria to return on Thursday. They have constant visitors to their house. Workmen have been landscaping their back garden since mid last week. People need to realise that their actions are the reason why this rubbish is occurring. The reasons why I am sitting at my kitchen table every day and not infront of my class where I would much rather be the reason why we can't go to the beach for a walk, the reason why most shops are shut. People are the reason why we are where we are. People need to wake the hell up and take some personal responsibility.


This discussion has been closed.
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