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Covid 19 Part XXVIII- 71,942 ROI(2,050 deaths) 51,824 NI (983 deaths) (28/11) Read OP

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  • Options
    #8612
    polesheep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,950 ✭✭✭polesheep


    growleaves wrote: »
    I think people are making it too personal with their references to Tony Holohan.

    The government are ultimately using NPHET are a shield from criticism even as NPHET seem to be out-flanking them with strong messaging via leaks.

    I think the Gov should disband NPHET as a committee and therefore take full responsibility for the authority they exercise.

    They could still take advice from from former members and other doctors and scientists but imo the abstraction of "public health" as a standalone concern separate from other aspects of life isn't working.

    Covid isn't the New Black Death which is why the mass of people won't any longer accept public health measures as a super-priority overriding all other things. Most people go where they please now.

    I think the fundamental mistake was to give NPHET autonomy. It should have been chaired by a senior government official (not the CMO). And at no point should anyone from NPHET have be allowed to speak to the media.


  • Options
    #8613
    blowitupref
    Registered Users Posts: 2,028 ✭✭✭blowitupref


    fred funk }{ wrote: »
    George Lee is some doom merchant. He just can't help himself.
    He's a worn out gimmick routine at this stage. 7 day average from last Thursday and people requiring hospital treatment from last Monday is way down but his role is to tell the watching public that we aren't where we need to be.


  • Options
    #8614
    WoollyRedHat
    Registered Users Posts: 10,462 ✭✭✭✭WoollyRedHat


    Do you know what the government/HSE have done in 6 weeks of lockdown to alleviate public health teams by providing them more resources i.e. recruitment of more public health doctors? Nothing, in fact they pissed off the public health body so much they've voted for industrial action. That's what decades of neglect will do. Government are great at playing the blame game and allowing advisory bodies to take the slack caused by their own dithering and inaction..they were recommended to stop non-essential travel in the summer and what did they do? Nothing.


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    #8615
    Eod100
    Registered Users Posts: 11,670 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    ACitizenErased wrote: »
    You’re not happy? God, thats a shock.
    Government makes the decisions btw, not NPHET, so the decision will likely be a responsible one and not a “****ting the bed” one.

    Same process it always has been and yet some people on here screaming bloody murder


  • Options
    #8616
    Necro
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 51,150 Mod ✭✭✭✭Necro


    Gael23 wrote: »
    This may well be Houlihan last Christmas with his wife and he wants to spend it in level 5 lockdown

    What a miserable man

    Mod:

    Threadbanned

    Folks, you are perfectly entitled to criticize NPHET or Tony Holohan but comments like this serve no purpose

    Calling people names such as Dr. Death or Saint Tony only weaken your argument, it's the lowest form of wit.

    Keep it civil and on topic and you can discuss the restrictions or your opposition to them as much as you like


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  • Options
    #8617
    polesheep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,950 ✭✭✭polesheep


    froog wrote: »
    it is an actual fact that NPHET have no power to enact their own recommendations though.

    But they do have the power to make them happen.


  • Options
    #8618
    Ficheall
    Registered Users Posts: 9,024 ✭✭✭Ficheall


    polesheep wrote: »
    I think the fundamental mistake was to give NPHET autonomy. It should have been chaired by a senior government official (not the CMO). And at no point should anyone from NPHET have be allowed to speak to the media.
    Which of the politicians would you have preferred speaking to the media?


  • Options
    #8619
    MOR316
    Registered Users Posts: 2,206 ✭✭✭MOR316


    polesheep wrote: »
    I think the fundamental mistake was to give NPHET autonomy. It should have been chaired by a senior government official (not the CMO). And at no point should anyone from NPHET have be allowed to speak to the media.

    This!

    I've said it before but as time went on, those press conferences did not sit well with me.

    I understand the argument of people wanting information but, all the info you got was the case numbers and deaths. Every other question that was and has been put to them is never fully answered*

    *Except for questions on weddings of course. Thanks Zara


  • Options
    #8620
    AlmightyCushion
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 35,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭AlmightyCushion


    shinzon wrote: »
    https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1126/1180734-astrazeneca-vaccine-study/?fbclid=IwAR0ryi8_XHcCA1x1EQ5kGmu9nCBuyCRSELHEvZ7WaojZ0DEgQcBrXCyIN_U



    They want to run another global trial yet in Europe be grand :confused::confused::confused:

    Shin

    If you read the whole article you will see the study is to validate the efficacy of the vaccine. For some people they accidentally gave them a half dose followed by a full dose later on. In this group, the vaccine was found to be more effective. The study is to check this out further.


  • Options
    #8621
    ACitizenErased
    Registered Users Posts: 11,638 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    Eod100 wrote: »
    Same process it always has been and yet some people on here screaming bloody murder

    Indeed. Government have to make a decision from an economic and social perspective based on the health advice.
    I believe NPHET are gone on a bit of a mad one to be honest. Level 4.5 for a decreasing positivity rate and stable hospitals is ridiculously overkill.


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  • Options
    #8622
    polesheep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,950 ✭✭✭polesheep


    ElJeffe wrote: »
    Terrible numbers yet again. Zero chance of pubs opening imo. Would be the height of irresponsibility by the government.

    No, they are not. The numbers are nothing to be alarmed about.


  • Options
    #8623
    froog
    Registered Users Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭froog


    polesheep wrote: »
    But they do have the power to make them happen.

    no.

    they.

    don't.

    the government has the only say on what recommendations are enacted. NPHET is advisory.


  • Options
    #8624
    Eod100
    Registered Users Posts: 11,670 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    ACitizenErased wrote: »
    Indeed. Government have to make a decision from an economic and social perspective based on the health advice.
    I believe NPHET are gone on a bit of a mad one to be honest. Level 4.5 for a decreasing positivity rate and stable hospitals is ridiculously overkill.

    I'm referring to people going mad over NPHET's advice btw. I can understand both sides. I assume NPHET know that whatever the recommendations are for Christmas people will meet up anyway so want to get cases as low as possible.

    If it's really about Christmas then people may have to sacrifice more in the lead up to it. Unfortunately this year has to be different.


  • Options
    #8625
    Pete_Cavan
    Registered Users Posts: 6,765 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    KrustyUCC wrote: »
    That's a lot of denotifications

    My understanding is the denotifications come off the total after todays cases are added but i could be wrong

    They announce the number of new reported cases but the running total usually goes up by less as denotifications are taken out. If you check worldometers.com, they give the net new cases rather than the gross which gets announced.

    I just wonder where this fits in with the situation where cases announced can be well above or below positive swabs? Our figures are far from straightforward.


  • Options
    #8626
    polesheep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,950 ✭✭✭polesheep


    Ficheall wrote: »
    Which of the politicians would you have preferred speaking to the media?

    I would have preferred a dedicated government spokesperson advising the media of government actions taken subsequent to advice from NPHET. NPHET's role is to advise the government not engage with the media.


  • Options
    #8627
    Kermit.de.frog
    Registered Users Posts: 23,553 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    I don't see any reason to lift restrictions in the current circumstances a part from loosening the family visits for Christmas day itself.

    Open things up now and by Christmas eve we will be dealing with well in excess of 1,000 cases per day.

    More people get the disease, more people will die.

    The government should have a proper understanding that eaten bread is soon forgotten and the public won't be forgiving for a heath catastrophe in January.

    They need to follow scientific advice and not the whims of cranks.

    No one will care about a missed Christmas on December 27th. And the same people, failing to understand the gravity of the situation, for wholly selfish reasons will be the same ones shouting against the govt about the fallout afterward.

    Don't make stupid decisions you'll regret.


  • Options
    #8628
    Ficheall
    Registered Users Posts: 9,024 ✭✭✭Ficheall


    AlmightyCushion wrote: »
    If you read the whole article you will see the study is to validate the efficacy of the vaccine. For some people they accidentally gave them a half dose followed by a full dose later on. In this group, the vaccine was found to be more effective. The study is to check this out further.
    I thought that was an intentional difference?


  • Options
    #8629
    ACitizenErased
    Registered Users Posts: 11,638 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    Eod100 wrote: »
    I'm referring to people going mad over NPHET's advice btw. I can understand both sides. I assume NPHET know that whatever the recommendations are for Christmas people will meet up anyway so want to get cases as low as possible.

    If it's really about Christmas then people may have to sacrifice more in the lead up to it. Unfortunately this year has to be different.

    We’ve sacrificed enough with a promise of a relatively normal Christmas.
    NPHETs advice said **** off to everyone.


  • Options
    #8630
    polesheep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,950 ✭✭✭polesheep


    froog wrote: »
    no.

    they.

    don't.

    the government has the only say on what recommendations are enacted. NPHET is advisory.

    I know it's subtle but bear with me. NPHET playing the media allows them to bypass the government. We've actually seen this happen.


  • Options
    #8631
    ElJeffe
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 725 ✭✭✭ElJeffe


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    I don't see any reason to lift restrictions in the current circumstances a part from loosening the family visits for Christmas day itself.

    Open things up now and by Christmas eve we will be dealing with well in excess of 1,000 cases per day.

    More people get the disease, more people will die.

    The government should have a proper understanding that eaten bread is soon forgotten and the public won't be forgiving for a heath catastrophe in January.

    They need to follow scientific advice and not the whims of cranks.

    No one will care about a missed Christmas on December 27th. And the same people, failing to understand the gravity of the situation, for wholly selfish reason will be the same ones shouting against the govt about the fallout afterward.

    Don't make stupid decisions you'll regret.

    Absolutely spot on. This is the time for real leadership. The government have done an outstanding job up until now. Let's not drop the ball as we head into the end zone.


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  • Options
    #8632
    ACitizenErased
    Registered Users Posts: 11,638 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    1000 per day by Christmas eve :D I swear some on here wear NPHET t-shirts. It’s alright lads, ye can disagree with Tony, he won’t hurt ya.


  • Options
    #8633
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,457 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    I don't see any reason to lift restrictions in the current circumstances a part from loosening the family visits for Christmas day itself.

    Open things up now and by Christmas eve we will be dealing with well in excess of 1,000 cases per day.

    More people get the disease, more people will die.

    The government should have a proper understanding that eaten bread is soon forgotten and the public won't be forgiving for a heath catastrophe in January.

    They need to follow scientific advice and not the whims of cranks.

    No one will care about a missed Christmas on December 27th. And the same people, failing to understand the gravity of the situation, for wholly selfish reasons will be the same ones shouting against the govt about the fallout afterward.

    Don't make stupid decisions you'll regret.

    I'll say it again. We were rushed into level 5 without giving level 3 enough time. And then later it turned out that level 3 was probably just fine.

    So now level 5 is the gold standard and level 3 or below is deemed armageddon. This is total alarmist bull.

    People have very short memories.


  • Options
    #8634
    stephenjmcd
    Registered Users Posts: 15,202 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    shinzon wrote: »
    https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1126/1180734-astrazeneca-vaccine-study/?fbclid=IwAR0ryi8_XHcCA1x1EQ5kGmu9nCBuyCRSELHEvZ7WaojZ0DEgQcBrXCyIN_U



    They want to run another global trial yet in Europe be grand :confused::confused::confused:

    Shin

    Its the way the FDA want the data. Separate to EMA. FDA want the trials to have data submitted from USA. Half dose full dose didn't take place in the US and can't be submitted there


  • Options
    #8635
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 4,727 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    I don't see any reason to lift restrictions in the current circumstances a part from loosening the family visits for Christmas day itself.

    Open things up now and by Christmas eve we will be dealing with well in excess of 1,000 cases per day.

    More people get the disease, more people will die.

    The government should have a proper understanding that eaten bread is soon forgotten and the public won't be forgiving for a heath catastrophe in January.

    They need to follow scientific advice and not the whims of cranks.

    No one will care about a missed Christmas on December 27th. And the same people, failing to understand the gravity of the situation, for wholly selfish reasons will be the same ones shouting against the govt about the fallout afterward.

    Don't make stupid decisions you'll regret.

    Source for 1000 cases a day?


  • Options
    #8636
    Ficheall
    Registered Users Posts: 9,024 ✭✭✭Ficheall


    polesheep wrote: »
    I would have preferred a dedicated government spokesperson advising the media of government actions taken subsequent to advice from NPHET. NPHET's role is to advise the government not engage with the media.
    In principle, I'd agree - though it is good to have NPHET members available to answer questions a spokesperson might not be able to. However, I wouldn't have high hopes for the government choosing a good spokesperson..


  • Options
    #8637
    Eod100
    Registered Users Posts: 11,670 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    ACitizenErased wrote: »
    We’ve sacrificed enough with a promise of a relatively normal Christmas.
    NPHETs advice said **** off to everyone.

    I agree about the sacrifices but the message I got was there's costs to making choices government want. I can understand wanting to open up as much as possible, whether that is feasible is the issue. Like I said NPHET know people will enjoy Christmas as much as possible so trying to get cases as low as possible before then but it's not an easy message to accept.


  • Options
    #8638
    ACitizenErased
    Registered Users Posts: 11,638 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Source for 1000 cases a day?

    Blah blah blah exponential growth blah blah blah level 3 didnt work blah blah blah “end zone” blah blah


  • Options
    #8639
    froog
    Registered Users Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭froog


    https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1126/1180723-santa-claus-christmas-covid-travel/

    He added: "It's important to say to all children in the country that we regard Santa Claus's travels as essential travel for essential purposes and therefore he is exempt from the need to self-quarantine for 14 days and should be able to come in and out of Irish airspace and indeed in and out of Irish homes without having to restrict his movement.



    ONE RULE FOR SANTA AND ONE FOR THE REST OF US!! BLOODY NPHET!!! REEEEEEEEEEEEEE


  • Options
    #8640
    ACitizenErased
    Registered Users Posts: 11,638 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    Eod100 wrote: »
    I agree about the sacrifices but the message I got was there's costs to making choices government want. I can understand wanting to open up as much as possible, whether that is feasible is the issue. Like I said NPHET know people will enjoy Christmas as much as possible so trying to get cases as low as possible before then but it's not an easy message to accept.

    Disagree. They’ve hooked onto some other country’s data to justify a ridiculous recommendation. It’s pure and utter power trip at this stage.


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    #8641
    Benimar
    Registered Users Posts: 7,778 ✭✭✭Benimar


    ACitizenErased wrote: »
    1000 per day by Christmas eve :D I swear some on here wear NPHET t-shirts. It’s alright lads, ye can disagree with Tony, he won’t hurt ya.

    We first hit 1,000 cases on October 10th. 28 days earlier we had 196 cases.

    We have 300+ cases today. What’s 28 days time? Yep, Christmas Eve.

    It’s not impossible that if we open too much up we could hit 1,000 cases in a month.


This discussion has been closed.
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