Formula 1 2020 - General Discussion Thread (See MOD warning on first post)

kksaints · 17-11-2020 5:32pm

Verstappen is undoubtedly the quickest driver in wet conditions but he takes very risky lines and it was clear enough on Sunday to see that he was taking some big chances on grip levels at the start of the race and the risks didn't pay off.

Infoanon · 17-11-2020 5:47pm

kksaints wrote: »

Verstappen is undoubtedly the quickest driver in wet conditions .

Lewis has proved himself to be the quickest time and time again - Max is up there but is not as quick or in as much control as Lewis.

kksaints · 17-11-2020 5:59pm

Infoanon wrote: »

Lewis has proved himself to be the quickest time and time again - Max is up there but is not as quick or in as much control as Lewis.

I'd say on a single lap Verstappen is the quickest but as you correctly pointed out Hamilton has better control and is more consistent than Verstappen in wet weather.

Frank Bullitt · 17-11-2020 6:09pm

Roger the cabin boy wrote: »

Hamilton ran a magnificent race as he usually does. A very worthy winner. His tyre management is fantastic.

I'd like to see him do a season with Ferrari. If not next year as #1, then the year after as perhaps a #2 and mentor to Le clerc.

That made me giggle. Fair play.

GarIT · 17-11-2020 6:30pm

kksaints wrote: »

Verstappen is undoubtedly the quickest driver in wet conditions but he takes very risky lines and it was clear enough on Sunday to see that he was taking some big chances on grip levels at the start of the race and the risks didn't pay off.

Not in a million years. He was handily beaten by drivers like Perez and Vettel.

AMKC · 18-11-2020 11:14am

Well it looks like Mercedes is planning a gradual pull out of F1.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motorsport/aston-martin-provide-f1-safety-cars-2021

Still that will be a nice change to the safety car. It's boring seeing the same car the whole time and it will give them drivers a bit of variety for a while at least.
Have to start somewhere so these first and then the F1 team maybe in 2 year or 5 years time?

Infoanon · 18-11-2020 11:28am

AMKC wrote: »

Well it looks like Mercedes is planning a gradual pull out of F1.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motorsport/aston-martin-provide-f1-safety-cars-2021

Bit of a leap to put it mildly - the safety cars have nothing to do with the F1 team and are a marketing tool for Mercedes.

Mercedes part ownership of the car manufacturer Aston Martin is allowing the Astons some publicity.

Mercedes were the safety car supplier long before their entry into F1

El_Duderino 09 · 18-11-2020 12:34pm

AMKC wrote: »

Well it looks like Mercedes is planning a gradual pull out of F1.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motorsport/aston-martin-provide-f1-safety-cars-2021

Still that will be a nice change to the safety car. It's boring seeing the same car the whole time and it will give them drivers a bit of variety for a while at least.
Have to start somewhere so these first and then the F1 team maybe in 2 year or 5 years time?

Never occurred to me that he safety car was part of the entertainment.

The physical safety car is only a marketing tradition at this stage. It could be done more effectively by setting mandatory lap times. The idea of using a slow car to set the pace, is quaint. They could balance the need to bunch the cars and slow them down to give marshals time to do whatever they need to do. But they could manage the speed so the tyres and brakes don’t get too cold.

Going at the speed of whatever sports car that bid the most sponsorship, is a terrible way to set the speed for safety
car periods.

18-11-2020 2:14pm

Came across this, claims F1 is more competitive than ever, load of nonsense. :pac:
One stat I thought of in my head without checking anything, number of different drivers champions in each decade;
2010s: 3
2000s: 5
1990s: 6

This one I have to check, different constructors champions;
2010s: 2 (4 in a row then 6 in a row)
2000s: 3
1990s: 4

Again the thing that is easy to overlook especially when you're in the time is just how Goddamn long it's been going on. Seeing that someone like Ricciardo is already 31 is pretty depressing to me. It's easy to think about how popular he is among fans and the press and forget just how good he actually is. To have one team dominate for 8 years is half a generation of drivers never having a shot at the title.
For a while we had the most champions on the grid I think (Hamilton, Button, Vettel, Alonso, Kimi, Schumacher) whereas it's not hard very hard to imagine in 2022 there could be none.
Unfortunately this is what happens when you allow the teams to have too much power. The only comparable period of domination (Ferrari in 2000s) had the FIA changing rules and plenty of attempts to break that dominance. Right now despite the teams talking a good game they mostly seem happy to just follow the leader.

H3llR4iser · 18-11-2020 6:40pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Unfortunately this is what happens when you allow the teams to have too much power. The only comparable period of domination (Ferrari in 2000s) had the FIA changing rules and plenty of attempts to break that dominance. Right now despite the teams talking a good game they mostly seem happy to just follow the leader.

Further supporting the statement - Ferrari's early 2000s domination was actually the direct result of the FIA giving them too much consideration in the definition of the rules from the mid-90s onwards (e.g. refueling being introduced to reduce the disadvantage V12s were suffering compared to V10s and V8s, banning active suspension...banning basically anything McLaren came up with in 1998/99

).

I reality what we're seeing ain't that different - when the Hybrid rules were approved, Mercedes was already halfway down the line developing their powertrain. Then they added a very effective chassis to the mix.

SMC92Ian · 19-11-2020 1:31am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Yeah this was one of the rare occasions where his car didn't seem suited to the conditions and he really had to earn he win.

Zero change of him moving to Ferrari to mentor another driver. That's just not how it works. Would be great to see him in a car that isn't the best though. We've all seen what he can o in the best car - win almost every race and championship

We've seen him in a car plenty of times that doesn't win.

El_Duderino 09 · 19-11-2020 11:23am

SMC92Ian wrote: »

We've seen him in a car plenty of times that doesn't win.

We have. But the poster suggested going from the obvious best car to a car that's really struggling this year. A seriously good advance in design for next year would probably pull them level with the tier below Red Bull. So Hamilton is almost certainly not going to move there. They also suggested he would move to be mentor and no.2 to Leclerc. I mean, come on. Whatever about going to a less good team through lack of options but going by choice for a challenge (I don't think I've ever seen a driver do that since Michael Schumacher, towards the start of his career).

Frank Bullitt · 19-11-2020 5:20pm

SMC92Ian wrote: »

We've seen him in a car plenty of times that doesn't win.

Which cars?

eviltimeban · 19-11-2020 5:28pm

Gintonious wrote: »

Which cars?

The McLarens of around 2009 - 2013, he won a few races each year but IIRC the highest he placed in the championship across those years was fourth.

Frank Bullitt · 19-11-2020 5:43pm

eviltimeban wrote: »

The McLarens of around 2009 - 2013, he won a few races each year but IIRC the highest he placed in the championship across those years was fourth.

The 2009 was underdeveloped at the start of the year, but once McLaren got their double diff working, it became competitive towards the end of the year.

For 2013 with Merc, Rosberg had won twice in that car before Hamilton. Not a great car by any stretch but it could win.

Jordan 199 · 19-11-2020 5:51pm

The 2011 McLaren MP4/26 had funky sidepods:

flazio · 19-11-2020 5:52pm

https://twitter.com/C4F1/status/1329461937600483328?s=19

Good choice.

Frank Bullitt · 19-11-2020 6:06pm

Jordan 199 wrote: »

The 2011 McLaren MP4/26 had funky sidepods:

I LOVED that car, so distinct. Button really drove well that season as well.

skipper_G · 19-11-2020 8:55pm

flazio wrote: »

https://twitter.com/C4F1/status/1329461937600483328?s=19

Good choice.

Agreed, He does an excellent job on F3 and F2 commentary.

pjohnson · 19-11-2020 9:44pm

Antonio Fuoco is getting one of the Young Driver Abu Dhabi test seats for Ferrari. :pac:

Ilott has been named for Alfa Romeo.

Nissany and Aitken are doing it for Williams.

Interestingly Shwartzman has been named as Ferrari's second driver.

Mick is expected to take one of the Haas seats with Fittipaldi possibly running the other.

Zhou expected to run for Renault/Alpine.

eviltimeban · 20-11-2020 9:11am

flazio wrote: »

https://twitter.com/C4F1/status/1329461937600483328?s=19

Good choice.

Now do Crofty.

flazio · 20-11-2020 9:26am

eviltimeban wrote: »

Now do Crofty.

In a perfect world, Ben would stay where he is and Alex Jacques would be replacing David Croft. But such is life.

muckwarrior · 20-11-2020 5:03pm

I half thought they might be prepping Webber as a replacement since they had him join commentary in Turkey, but I'm glad they're not. While I like Webber, he does get a bit tongue tied and don't think he'd be great as a full time colour commentator.

El_Duderino 09 · 20-11-2020 5:50pm

muckwarrior wrote: »

I half thought they might be prepping Webber as a replacement since they had him join commentary in Turkey, but I'm glad they're not. While I like Webber, he does get a bit tongue tied and don't think he'd be great as a full time colour commentator.

I remember Coulthard being very poor when he started and he’s improved into a very good commentator. Martin Brundle was the sidekick to Murray Walker to begin with. He’s turned into maybe the best around (until he became leader of the Hamilton fan club).

The Sky boys might be limited in what they can say. Webber would probably be a guy who’s more likely to say what he thinks but Sky might muzzle him the same as the rest.

weisses · 21-11-2020 1:03pm

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Max's impatience is an issue that had never surfaced this season because he's practically been racing in a void in 3rd place all the time. He's in his 6th season, so the argument of "inexperience" can't really be applied anymore.

Sometimes I wonder if the whole media banging the drum of the "wonderkid", "once in 30 years talent" and so on isn't playing a part into this. The fact he was gonna spin or put it in the wall, yesterday, was apparent in the way he placed the car on track since the moment he was stuck behind Vettel.

Hamilton on the other hand, put in a masterclass - damage limitation when the car wouldn't work the tires well, and as soon as he got some grip, he disappeared into the distance.

Ferrari, they could've taken the risk of slicks, especially with Seb, it might have won them the race; Yet in hindsight, 3rd and 4th is a super result considering the season...

Verstappen his left front wing angle was off a full 7 degrees .. Imagine they only change them in 0.5 increments ... It made the car very tricky .. which resulted in a lot of work changing settings on the steering wheel every single lap this then resulted in the front tyre degrading to quick ... Which then lead to more pitstops .... I get it that you don't like the guy, it's why your I'll informed opinion should be taken with a bucket of salt

Cool_CM · 23-11-2020 8:16pm

This just popped up on my feed, gutted that I didn't see it sooner to send it on to some of of my friends that teach in secondary schools.

https://www.f1inschools.ie/

It's pretty cool that this exists!

24-11-2020 12:31am

One thing that's been in my head the last while to improve the show would be introducing some immediacy to the rewards. Have a purse for winning individual races and other positions. Points have already been devalued to a ridiculous extent and a lower team winning can be cancelled out by another team in two races with decent performances. Obviously the big teams have their money guaranteed but imagine a team getting $5 million for winning a race, it would make it more relatable for the casual fans.

El_Duderino 09 · 24-11-2020 10:10am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

One thing that's been in my head the last while to improve the show would be introducing some immediacy to the rewards. Have a purse for winning individual races and other positions. Points have already been devalued to a ridiculous extent and a lower team winning can be cancelled out by another team in two races with decent performances. Obviously the big teams have their money guaranteed but imagine a team getting $5 million for winning a race, it would make it more relatable for the casual fans.

Yeah but then Mercedes gets an extra $60m a year and that won’t make the show any better the next year when they use that money to grow the performance gap and win even more races.

I don’t know about your financial situation but I can tell you $5m is not a relatable sum of money to me. It’s Disney Dollars to me. Might as well be $10m or $1m.

Who should pay the money (track, sponsors, FIA, the few oil wealthy countries left hosting races when the cost shoots up by $5m per race)?

And they said reverse grids were a gimmick. More money in f1 is not the solution particularly when there’s a global recession on the way and they are struggling to introduce a budget cap.

GarIT · 24-11-2020 1:51pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

One thing that's been in my head the last while to improve the show would be introducing some immediacy to the rewards. Have a purse for winning individual races and other positions. Points have already been devalued to a ridiculous extent and a lower team winning can be cancelled out by another team in two races with decent performances. Obviously the big teams have their money guaranteed but imagine a team getting $5 million for winning a race, it would make it more relatable for the casual fans.

Ban teams paying drivers. Ban teams contracting drivers. Drivers get paid from the teams prize pool at a base salary of £1m +£100,000 per point for their first 100 points and £50,000 per point after that.

Drivers are picked by teams on a draft system at the start of each year. Teams pick drivers in order of last year's constructors championship and each team gets to pick their 2nd driver when the team 3 below them has picked their first. Then at the end each team pick and official reserve driver who must be under 25 and must get at least 1/4 of the FP1s.

pjohnson · 24-11-2020 1:54pm

Did Kimi not almost bankrupt Lotus due to a performance clause in his deal :pac:

Formula 1 2020 - General Discussion Thread (See MOD warning on first post)

Comments