Random Fitness Questions

Alf Veedersane · 26-10-2020 11:08AM

Cill94 wrote: »

It doesn't really matter in my experience. Do one until you hit a wall and then try the other.

Adding a pause or just doing timed static holds is also an option.

Or even just slowing the movement through the full range of motion.

RedRochey · 01-11-2020 12:20PM

Newbie here, I've struggled with doing push ups, I'd be following a at home workout using only dumbbells and do ok with all the exercises except when it comes to push ups

At best I could do 20 in a row at the start, but that quickly lowers when I try to do then again

Any tips here? Should I be lowering my chest to the floor and locking out my elbows at the top?

Alf Veedersane · 01-11-2020 12:39PM

RedRochey wrote: »

Newbie here, I've struggled with doing push ups, I'd be following a at home workout using only dumbbells and do ok with all the exercises except when it comes to push ups

At best I could do 20 in a row at the start, but that quickly lowers when I try to do then again

Any tips here? Should I be lowering my chest to the floor and locking out my elbows at the top?

Yep that's how you do them.

If 20 is a max effort, then maybe look at doing 15 the first set and see if you can keep that level for a few sets before it drops off. It's just trying to balance effort and reps in order to accumulate more total reps across the sets

Black Sheep · 01-11-2020 12:46PM

If I understand you correctly, your first set of push ups is 20 reps. I take it that when you say it 'quickly lowers' you mean that you can't perform 20 in subsequent sets.

That's not uncommon. If 20 reps is you working to failure, then if you rest 2-3 minutes it's still likely there would be a tapering off. It doesn't mean you're necessarily bad at push ups, you just won't fully recover from a set like that.

There are different views on the value of working close to failure versus keeping a few reps in the tank, I think both approaches can be valid.

In terms of push up form - there are endless articles and videos out there which are worth perusing.

Patsy167 · 01-11-2020 01:16PM

As mentioned above, there's any amount of information on correct technique available depending on how you like to learn. I've been following this site for tips and have found it excellent - https://www.nick-e.com/exercise-library/calisthenics/upper-body/pushup/

Cill94 · 01-11-2020 01:49PM

RedRochey wrote: »

Newbie here, I've struggled with doing push ups, I'd be following a at home workout using only dumbbells and do ok with all the exercises except when it comes to push ups

At best I could do 20 in a row at the start, but that quickly lowers when I try to do then again

Any tips here? Should I be lowering my chest to the floor and locking out my elbows at the top?

If 20 is your max, and you're aiming to beat that, you could give this progression a try.

Session One: 4x5
Two: 5x5
Three: 5x6
Four: 4x8
Five: 3x10
Six: 2x15
Seven: 1x 20+

And yes all reps should be hips and chest to floor, and then full lockout of elbows.

caviardreams · 01-11-2020 10:18PM

This is a good push up video imo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IODxDxX7oi4

Mellor · 02-11-2020 04:34AM

Cill94 wrote: »

If 20 is your max, and you're aiming to beat that, you could give this progression a try.

Session One: 4x5
Two: 5x5
Three: 5x6
Four: 4x8
Five: 3x10
Six: 2x15
Seven: 1x 20+

And yes all reps should be hips and chest to floor, and then full lockout of elbows.

In those first 4 sessions he is barely working imo.
I like the set progression. But I'd flatten the jumps.

Session One: 4x10
Two: 5x10+*
Three: 5x12
Four: 4x14
Five: 3x16
Six: 2x18
Seven: 1x 20+

*Last set in session 2 to be as many as possible. And use that number to to recalibrate the jumps

Cill94 · 02-11-2020 02:12PM

Mellor wrote: »

In those first 4 sessions he is barely working imo.
I like the set progression. But I'd flatten the jumps.

Session One: 4x10
Two: 5x10+*
Three: 5x12
Four: 4x14
Five: 3x16
Six: 2x18
Seven: 1x 20+

Yes mine is deliberately more conservative. The only downside to starting lighter is it takes longer to reach the goal, which is not really a negative imo. Starting easy and progressing slowly means making progress for longer, less chance of injury, and more room to work on technique (which it sounds like he's a bit iffy on).

You have him starting with double the volume of his max reps, and then moving to treble that within three sessions. I personally think that's too much for some people, and riskier where injury is considered, especially given that beginners lack the experience to know when it's time to ease off.

Mellor · 02-11-2020 02:44PM

Cill94 wrote: »

Yes mine is deliberately more conservative. The only downside to starting lighter is it takes longer to reach the goal, which is not really a negative imo. Starting easy and progressing slowly means making progress for longer, less chance of injury, and more room to work on technique (which it sounds like he's a bit iffy on).

But it’s not progressing slower. Or taking longer to reach the goal. Both progressions hit the same reps in week 7 and go for a PR.
If anything the bigger jumps first progression are more aggressive, where as the second is slow and steady even increases.

I just think that the first few weeks doing 5-8 are not providing the required stress for somebody with a max on 20.

You have him starting with double the volume of his max reps, and then moving to treble that within three sessions. I personally think that's too much for some people, and riskier where injury is considered, especially given that beginners lack the experience to know when it's time to ease off.

2 x max reps is pretty low volume tbh. 3 sub-max sets is common, spreading reps over 5 sets is much lower intensity.
Details weren’t provided, but they are maybe doing 50 reps over 3 sets as it stands. Only two weeks of the above have mire total reps and both do it with lower intensity sets.

LLMMLL · 02-11-2020 04:07PM

Anyone know the location of a pull up bar (or something that could conceivably be used as one) in public within 5k of central Dublin? Am having an extraordinarily difficult time finding anything suitable (in.parks etc. )

RedRochey · 02-11-2020 05:19PM

Thanks everyone for the push-up help, the only reason I asked was because I kept seeing videos of guys doing loads of push ups but barely straightening their arms, nevermind locking them

LLMMLL wrote: »

Anyone know the location of a pull up bar (or something that could conceivably be used as one) in public within 5k of central Dublin? Am having an extraordinarily difficult time finding anything suitable (in.parks etc. )

I know in Belgrave park between Rathmines & Ranelagh there's a few trees, pretty sure a guy cut around a branch during the first lockdown in order to use it for pull ups

Cill94 · 02-11-2020 05:19PM

Mellor wrote: »

But it’s not progressing..

I think your approach is well-reasoned and could work great. I've just found the more conservative approach to work better for myself and people I coach, as the worst case scenario is you find it's not enough and you just add a bit more work (although I rarely have to do this). I've seen a lot of people go ham on volume for things like push-ups and pull-ups and **** elbows or shoulders up.

Patsy167 · 03-11-2020 09:31AM

LLMMLL wrote: »

Anyone know the location of a pull up bar (or something that could conceivably be used as one) in public within 5k of central Dublin? Am having an extraordinarily difficult time finding anything suitable (in.parks etc. )

https://www.reddit.com/r/Dublin/comments/fj35pc/calisthenicsstreet_workout_park_around_the_center/

ThunbergsAreGo · 03-11-2020 09:46AM

RedRochey wrote: »

Thanks everyone for the push-up help, the only reason I asked was because I kept seeing videos of guys doing loads of push ups but barely straightening their arms, nevermind locking them

I know in Belgrave park between Rathmines & Ranelagh there's a few trees, pretty sure a guy cut around a branch during the first lockdown in order to use it for pull ups

Mountjoy Square or Gardiner Street (Diamond Park) both have areas that could be used.

Used to use the Gardiner Street one when in work all the time.

Shedite27 · 03-11-2020 09:59AM

I've been trying to do a body weight workout each day during lockdown. Currently doing sets of:
Push Ups
Planks
Dips
Burpees

Any suggestions for what I should be adding to those, don't have any home exercise equipment or weights unfortunately.

Black Sheep · 03-11-2020 11:35AM

Shedite27 wrote: »

I've been trying to do a body weight workout each day during lockdown. Currently doing sets of:
Push Ups
Planks
Dips
Burpees

Any suggestions for what I should be adding to those, don't have any home exercise equipment or weights unfortunately.

In exercise selection terms you’re lacking options for the lower body and for the back.

For the lower body you can perform air squats, lunges and Bulgarian split squats.

The back is harder without equipment but door frame rows or table rows are possible.

More broadly the issue for so many people at home is how they are programming to improve over several weeks / months. Keep track of sets, reps, and add either where you can. Shortening rest periods is another option.

Alf Veedersane · 03-11-2020 11:43AM

I'd second all of the above. Make sure to add in the lower body exercises and try to some form of pulling exercise like rows.

I'd also drop burpees. People butcher the bejaysus out of them but they seem to be popular because they're tiring.

Just to the exercises - good selection given by Black Sheep - with a decent intensity of effort and throw in some form of cardio at the end if you wish.

new2tri19 · 23-11-2020 03:09PM

I'm following GZCLP program. Last week managed bench at 67.5kg for 5 sets of 3. Today i was due to do 5 sets of 3 at 70kg. Well i just couldn't lift it not even 1 rep

feeling deflated . I unracked the bar touched it to chest and had no power to lift it up past maybe 6 inches.
After failing you go to 6 sets of 2 at same weight next week , if i fail that which seems inevitable i move to 10 sets of 1 at same weight. I can't imagine doing that either but maybe today was a weak day.
Anyway its not mentioned in plan what to do if you fail and i wanted to do some exercise that would help me next week so did 3 sets of 10 at 60kg.
I'm struggling to see how i'll be able to ever lift much above 70-80kg on bench , should i buy fractional plates now and accept that the jumps will be much smaller. Or has it happened to anyone here they couldn't lift 70 say a year ago but can do 90-100 now are them types of jumps possible eventually? Thanks

Mellor · 23-11-2020 03:19PM

If you previously hit 67.5x3, your 1rm should be 71-72kg, and 2rm should be 70kg it so.
You probably just had an off day. Try 70kg again, you’ll probably get it. Increasing takes time.

23-11-2020 03:22PM

if you can do 67.5 5x3 it does just sound like a high gravity day

the baby bull elephant · 23-11-2020 03:51PM

new2tri19 wrote: »

I'm following GZCLP program. Last week managed bench at 67.5kg for 5 sets of 3. Today i was due to do 5 sets of 3 at 70kg. Well i just couldn't lift it not even 1 rep feeling deflated . I unracked the bar touched it to chest and had no power to lift it up past maybe 6 inches.
After failing you go to 6 sets of 2 at same weight next week , if i fail that which seems inevitable i move to 10 sets of 1 at same weight. I can't imagine doing that either but maybe today was a weak day.
Anyway its not mentioned in plan what to do if you fail and i wanted to do some exercise that would help me next week so did 3 sets of 10 at 60kg.
I'm struggling to see how i'll be able to ever lift much above 70-80kg on bench , should i buy fractional plates now and accept that the jumps will be much smaller. Or has it happened to anyone here they couldn't lift 70 say a year ago but can do 90-100 now are them types of jumps possible eventually? Thanks

So the good news is based on what you've said here you most likely didn't fail due to strength. You did 15 reps of a weight that was only 2.5kg lighter than what you did for 0 this week. (Side note have you been doing the last set as an AMRAP? You said before you were only doing them on squat and deadlift I think?)

As others have said it could just be an off day, everybody has them. You could have built up more fatigue than you thought.

It's pretty likely your technique had a big impact. Bench despite what many think is one of the more technical lifts. It is quite possible that compared to last week you changed something in your set up or didn't keep the same par path and thus made the weight a lot harder than the actual weight on the par should have. It's not a big deal and just part of being a beginner.

If you already have plates enabling a 2.5kg jump I'm not sure how much more fractional you want to go? I certainly wouldn't at this stage.

Your eventual potential is tied to your bodyweight and sex but certainly if you're an adult man 80kg is absolutely possible and you're really not that far off it now. Going from 70-90/100kg in a year is also well within the realms of possibility for most men. I'd say most male beginners make such gains in their first 1/2 years though of course there will be outliers either way. It's mostly just about consistency and effort.

If you're looking for technique guides https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ji5ieq8JdnQ -is the first in a three part series from Brian Alsruhe (other good videos out there from the likes of Calgary Barbell and Juggernaut Training

If you don't like Youtube videos the definitive written guide: https://www.strongerbyscience.com/how-to-bench/

new2tri19 · 23-11-2020 04:31PM

the baby bull elephant wrote: »

So the good news is based on what you've said here you most likely didn't fail due to strength. You did 15 reps of a weight that was only 2.5kg lighter than what you did for 0 this week. (Side note have you been doing the last set as an AMRAP? You said before you were only doing them on squat and deadlift I think?)

As others have said it could just be an off day, everybody has them. You could have built up more fatigue than you thought.

It's pretty likely your technique had a big impact. Bench despite what many think is one of the more technical lifts. It is quite possible that compared to last week you changed something in your set up or didn't keep the same par path and thus made the weight a lot harder than the actual weight on the par should have. It's not a big deal and just part of being a beginner.

If you already have plates enabling a 2.5kg jump I'm not sure how much more fractional you want to go? I certainly wouldn't at this stage.

Your eventual potential is tied to your bodyweight and sex but certainly if you're an adult man 80kg is absolutely possible and you're really not that far off it now. Going from 70-90/100kg in a year is also well within the realms of possibility for most men. I'd say most male beginners make such gains in their first 1/2 years though of course there will be outliers either way. It's mostly just about consistency and effort.

If you're looking for technique guides https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ji5ieq8JdnQ -is the first in a three part series from Brian Alsruhe (other good videos out there from the likes of Calgary Barbell and Juggernaut Training

If you don't like Youtube videos the definitive written guide: https://www.strongerbyscience.com/how-to-bench/

Thanks for the advice guys , last week 67.5 was a real struggle the first rep was okish but by the time got to the 3rd rep of each set it was really hard to lock out but got it just. So there was no armap last week as 3 was the max reps.

I probably had the wrong mindset going into it, i was remembering how hard it was last week and thinking this is going to be a real struggle.

I think my form is ok i have watched a fair few videos will have a look at the ones linked thanks. I touch the bar off my chest and follow the bar path thats recommended in videos close enough. That intial push off chest i struggle with the most.

I'll chalk it down to a weak day as everything else felt really difficult aswell. I found myself reducing weights on a few accessorie excercises near the end as i just felt weak.

Yes the strong app i use says my 1 RM is 71 so its very close to my max.

Thanks guys

new2tri19 · 27-11-2020 04:50PM

Them videos linked where really helpful watched the video right before attempting 70kg again and managed to get it. It wasn't bench day so i just did 2 at 70kg so feeling more confident now thanks.

Another triathlete i swim with started lifting around the same time as me and is following the same plan, he is lifting heavier than me on squats and deadlifts (although i am not maxed out yet on these) but he hasn't gained a pound of weight. He has jokingly suggested i am not doing this naturally but i have gone as far as send him what i eat each day. We seem to be eating the same things and doing same workouts and where at the same weight roughly starting. Can genetics play a roll ?

Cill94 · 27-11-2020 05:06PM

new2tri19 wrote: »

Another triathlete i swim with started lifting around the same time as me and is following the same plan, he is lifting heavier than me on squats and deadlifts (although i am not maxed out yet on these) but he hasn't gained a pound of weight.

Can genetics play a roll ?

Unfortunately yeah. When you lift for long enough you realise that genetics plays a massive role. At the same time, there’s nothing you can do about it so it’s pointless to worry about. There will always be someone stronger than.

Alf Veedersane · 27-11-2020 05:25PM

new2tri19 wrote: »

Them videos linked where really helpful watched the video right before attempting 70kg again and managed to get it. It wasn't bench day so i just did 2 at 70kg so feeling more confident now thanks.

Another triathlete i swim with started lifting around the same time as me and is following the same plan, he is lifting heavier than me on squats and deadlifts (although i am not maxed out yet on these) but he hasn't gained a pound of weight. He has jokingly suggested i am not doing this naturally but i have gone as far as send him what i eat each day. We seem to be eating the same things and doing same workouts and where at the same weight roughly starting. Can genetics play a roll ?

It could also be better neuromuscular adaptation and being a bit more mechanically efficient. You can get stronger without putting on much size, especially at the start.

Black Sheep · 27-11-2020 11:54PM

It could also be that in fact his diet is not as adequate for mass gain as yours, even if he thinks it is.

People really have an inherently poor sense of both the overall calories they’re eating, and the macros.

If his body composition has changed and he’s the same weight then he still could have gained lean muscle mass. If his body composition is unchanged and he’s the same weight then he’s either completely sandbagging in the gym or he’s not eating enough to support any adaptation and mass gain. Or could be both

Triathletes wouldn’t strike me as optimal mass gainers at the best of times. You’re an outlier!

new2tri19 · 28-11-2020 10:56AM

Ah yes could be anything thanks for advice I'll let him know he's probably sandbagging

.
He hasn't increased his diet that much he always ate more than me so just added some protein shakes.
His body composition hasn't changed at all really that's what's annoying him , he's still very strong though and probably has a few more beers than he says

.

Well i only started triathlon in 2019 as was unhappy with how running was making me feel which was very weak at anything other than running . Moved to triathlon as I figured it was a healthier lifestyle. I think people are much more aware of the importance of weight training now and it's certainly something I noticed going from running to triathlon alot more triathletes hit the gym .I'm not that good a runner or triathlete to be ever concerned about winning races and too old to think about it . So I just want to be the healthiest I can be , weight training im really enjoying now especially love deadlifts and squats my back has never felt stronger .
My father was big into cycling and running and can barely walk now very underweight no muscle mass , he never weight trained and now in early 60's struggles to walk , doctor recommended he starts pilates and some light weight training but he's just too weak. This alone is spurring me on not to neglect the importance of weight training as I'm 40 now not getting younger .
It's great to see the changes in your body also my tee shirts are all too tight and too short now and same with all my jeans I'll need a whole new wardrobe. Most people comment now I look much healthier so it's a win win.

So thanks lads alot of people like myself don't like going to the gym as it's a bit intimating starting off so it's forums like this and YouTube videos etc which are a godsend for some pointers. I'll be honest the day I got that barbell delivered to the door I think the delivery driver was laughing at me struggling to lift it in , I remember walking to the shed with it and attempting to rack it but my arms where tired from the walk and I thought what the heck am I doing here I'm not cut out for this , but I'm delighted I stuck it out . Sorry I'm going on a bit now !!

Alf Veedersane · 28-11-2020 01:12PM

I've found this forum great over the years. There have always been people who posted here regularly willing and able to offer good advice so always ask away.

Ultimately, focus on your own numbers. Enjoy your own progres and don't compare with others because you'll see in time, it's always only ever you vs you.

Black Sheep · 28-11-2020 02:01PM

I'll be honest the day I got that barbell delivered to the door I think the delivery driver was laughing at me struggling to lift it in , I remember walking to the shed with it and attempting to rack it but my arms where tired from the walk and I thought what the heck am I doing here I'm not cut out for this , but I'm delighted I stuck it out . Sorry I'm going on a bit now !!

This reminds me of being in a gym many years ago, and an Eastern European coach was showing me his 16kg kettlebell. He had brought it with him from Lithuania, and explained that it had been with him since he used it to pass his schoolboy P.E test. Students were required to press it overhead a certain amount of times. Can't recall exactly, but could have been ten reps per side, maybe more.

Anyway, I was so weak at the time I could only press it overhead a single time... And very shakily at that. He didn't laugh, I'd say he was more focused on trying to hide the embarrassment he probably felt on my behalf!

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