Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VI - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow!!! Look at the last 2 pages of discussion over on the main thread.

Suggestions that 45% of hospitalisations are in hospital WITH Covid. In other words, are not in hospital because of Covid.

I need to look into this some more and see what information is available.

I am not normally one for conspiracy theories but it’s so clear that we are not getting the full picture. Figures are completely manipulated to show the situation as much worse than it is.

I was suspecting that HSE were sandbagging for about 6 weeks now. Or some other forces for that matter. This just does not surprise me. Motivated reasoning continues.

I took a few notes for anyone who’s interested in the press briefing this evening. Apologies for the long post!

Tony Holohan saying they use Amárach polls for the baseline of their information... Saying that 81% of people were reporting staying at home rather than going out for the month of Oct...

1. Zara King - cases question. Dr Holohan - (paraphrasing) too early to jump to any conclusions. We need to ‘keep this up’ and look at other indicators.
Contact tracing - Dr Holohan dismissing it as a possible reason for cases dropping.
Schools - keeping them open remains a priority. Speed of testing for schools question not really answered.

2. Didn’t get this reporters name...
Infection fatality rate question - doesn’t answer today & says they’ll have the information later in the week. Holohan states the death rate is lower than thought.
Was level 5 needed - Dr Holohan doesn’t like the question...states it’s too early to draw conclusions although he hopes there’s a stabilisation or decrease in cases. States Level 3 could be an option to stabilise cases at a particular level. ECDC quoted by him - as recommending stricter ‘non-pharmaceutical’ measures, eg higher levels of restrictions...

3. Fergal Bowers - is it too early to be positive re case numbers? Any signs for optimism...
Dr Holohan - (paraphrasing) compliance data, pre emptive behaviour by threat of level 5 may be helped...People’s individual behaviour is important, goes into the usual steps they can take.
Contact tracing question, Dr Holohan sounding defensive saying it’s robust...
3,500 applications for swabbers, currently being trained in.

4. Stephen Murphy - Newstalk. Will level 5 be extended if criteria isn’t met to reduce?
Dr Holohan - is hopeful it won’t have to be. Need a high level compliance for level 5 now.
Interesting point from Holohan, doesn’t agree with Penal provisions as it might discourage people coming forward for testing. Refers to ICU capacity level in major European cities, that they’re currently coming under pressure.
Question re North - they haven’t been approached for helping with ICU.
Retail - looking for a quote from Dr Holohan here. Solidarity needed, urges retailers to play fair...

5. Irish Examiner question - positivity rate in Primary Schools + Secondary. Slightly higher positivity level for Primary, question as to why. Gives pods, groups, etc as possible reason. States it’s still far lower than 10% positivity rate in the Community.
Should schools reopen - they don’t anticipate that schools should close.
Teacher Unions - safety of staff: States there are Public Health teams on site to deal with issues..not a great answer.
R rate question - NPHET wanted 0.5. Government wanted 1. Holohan states why they wanted 0.5, re case numbers and reopening.

Traffic light system question - Dr Holohan is completely against it. Doesn’t want International travel.

6. TheJournal.ie journalist - Can people travel home for Christmas...
He doesn’t really answer this question. But clearly doesn’t support it.
Halloween - can we celebrate it. Short answer from Dr Holohan, not with others.

Vaccines - people in the HSE are working on plans of a rollout. Depends on what vaccine & data comes through.
Question re poll showing just 55% of uptake possible with a vaccine. Dr Holohan, would be a concern if uptake was low.
Need to have vaccine uptake high to lessen transmission.

rob316 wrote: »

I was talking to my neighbour yesterday and he was giving out mad about the virus. He said I can imagine the conversation I'll have with my kid when she's older about this.

Daddy we learned about COVID-19 today in school, what was it like living through it? Terrible, everything was closed, couldn't travel, loads out of work.

But it was a pandemic daddy, so lots of people died? No not really about 2000 people.

There must of been loads of people in hospital sick daddy? No about 300 people at once.

But there is over 5 million people in the country, why did we close everything for 300 sick people daddy? I'm still trying to figure it out love.

At that stage, hopefully, someone like Bethany McLean, will pick this topic up and explain how it went down. There be plenty of work in the literature reflecting on this disaster caused not by the virus but by the human kind.

Not to mention this being a gold mine for researchers in cognitive science, psychology, behavioural economics and decision making. These guys must be just beaming with joy as there is a pile of interesting work for them ahead.

CruelSummer wrote: »

I took a few notes for anyone who’s interested in the press briefing this evening. Apologies for the long post!

Tony Holohan saying they use Amárach polls for the baseline of their information... Saying that 81% of people were reporting staying at home rather than going out for the month of Oct...

1. Zara King - cases question. Dr Holohan - (paraphrasing) too early to jump to any conclusions. We need to ‘keep this up’ and look at other indicators.
Contact tracing - Dr Holohan dismissing it as a possible reason for cases dropping.
Schools - keeping them open remains a priority. Speed of testing for schools question not really answered.

2. Didn’t get this reporters name...
Infection fatality rate question - doesn’t answer today & says they’ll have the information later in the week. Holohan states the death rate is lower than thought.
Was level 5 needed - Dr Holohan doesn’t like the question...states it’s too early to draw conclusions although he hopes there’s a stabilisation or decrease in cases. States Level 3 could be an option to stabilise cases at a particular level. ECDC quoted by him - as recommending stricter ‘non-pharmaceutical’ measures, eg higher levels of restrictions...

3. Fergal Bowers - is it too early to be positive re case numbers? Any signs for optimism...
Dr Holohan - (paraphrasing) compliance data, pre emptive behaviour by threat of level 5 may be helped...People’s individual behaviour is important, goes into the usual steps they can take.
Contact tracing question, Dr Holohan sounding defensive saying it’s robust...
3,500 applications for swabbers, currently being trained in.

4. Stephen Murphy - Newstalk. Will level 5 be extended if criteria isn’t met to reduce?
Dr Holohan - is hopeful it won’t have to be. Need a high level compliance for level 5 now.
Interesting point from Holohan, doesn’t agree with Penal provisions as it might discourage people coming forward for testing. Refers to ICU capacity level in major European cities, that they’re currently coming under pressure.
Question re North - they haven’t been approached for helping with ICU.
Retail - looking for a quote from Dr Holohan here. Solidarity needed, urges retailers to play fair...

5. Irish Examiner question - positivity rate in Primary Schools + Secondary. Slightly higher positivity level for Primary, question as to why. Gives pods, groups, etc as possible reason. States it’s still far lower than 10% positivity rate in the Community.
Should schools reopen - they don’t anticipate that schools should close.
Teacher Unions - safety of staff: States there are Public Health teams on site to deal with issues..not a great answer.
R rate question - NPHET wanted 0.5. Government wanted 1. Holohan states why they wanted 0.5, re case numbers and reopening.

Traffic light system question - Dr Holohan is completely against it. Doesn’t want International travel.

6. TheJournal.ie journalist - Can people travel home for Christmas...
He doesn’t really answer this question. But clearly doesn’t support it.
Halloween - can we celebrate it. Short answer from Dr Holohan, not with others.

Vaccines - people in the HSE are working on plans of a rollout. Depends on what vaccine & data comes through.
Question re poll showing just 55% of uptake possible with a vaccine. Dr Holohan, would be a concern if uptake was low.
Need to have vaccine uptake high to lessen transmission.

With respect to the traffic light system, as soon as that comes in I'll be booking a few trips. Tony can go for a long walk off a short plank as far as I'm concerned.

rusty cole wrote: »

Fergal bowers said NEPHET will have a meeting this week regards compliance. He said theyll be using mobile phoness etc to determine if people are staying put...surely this is a breach of privacy for anyone to have access to your whereabouts...i dont get this. COMPUTERS and all things algorythmical are alien to me but i dont like where that's going really.

All data is publicly available here.

https://www.google.com/covid19/mobility/

rusty cole wrote: »

Fergal bowers said NEPHET will have a meeting this week regards compliance.

Maybe if they ask nicely the government will get to listen in for a few minutes, if they stay quiet down the back.

I wonder does Tony get along with the rest of NPHET..

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Tony is out of control at this stage.

Where will this stop?

I've been saying n this for ages, he sees himself as 'Big Brother'.

normanoffside wrote: »

I've been saying n this for ages, he sees himself as 'Big Brother'.

This call to monitoring of people’s mobile phones needs to be blocked as a priority and is a new low even for this shower of numpties.

Do we have a civil liberties protection presence in Ireland or are they just nodding along to their overlords too

john4321 wrote: »

There is no call to monitor peoples phones. The anonymous data is freely available. The hyperbole on this thread is something else at times.



Apple

https://covid19.apple.com/mobility


Google

https://www.google.com/covid19/mobility/

I assume those "concerned" dont use any type of smart phone anyway. Otherwise they are in for a nasty shock.

The tracing app idea probably terrified them for life anyway.

john4321 wrote: »

There is no call to monitor peoples phones. The anonymous data is freely available. The hyperbole on this thread is something else at times.

Yep. This information was used during the first lockdown too. I can't understand why people are getting so worked up about it.

funnydoggy wrote: »

I wonder does Tony get along with the rest of NPHET..

You're asking the wrong question.




Does the rest of NPHET get along with Tony?!!!!

Tony need not bother is hole checking mobile data. It's very clear from being out and about that this is nowhere like March/April. The roads are busy, loads of people out and about. People are not cowering away this time.

Missed the start. Only switched over when Luke O'Neill and that remote guy were on.
And it was all vaccines aren't what people think they are. Vaccine is just a tool. Together with the other tools like distancing and masks etc For the foreseeable.

Are we're being softened up for that now? And would people go with that? Only thing I learned over the last 8 moths is that nothing seems impossible anymore.