COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures Megathread [Mod Warning - Post #1]

stephenjmcd · 21-10-2020 08:03AM

Le Bruise wrote: »

I believe the EU are trying to close deals with a further 4 vaccine suppliers (on top of the two you mention). Not sure how far along in the talks they are?

The J&J deal was done only in the last 10 days after initial agreement was reached end of August. Sanofi /GSK deal also concluded.

Initial agreement with Pfizer followed early in September so you'd imagine the final contract is almost there based on the J&J timeline from agreement to final deal singed. EU also in talks with Moderna according to reports.

Le Bruise · 21-10-2020 08:09AM

chrisbonnie wrote: »

At the risk of sounding like a baffoon.

Surely getting people to administer an injection must be the simplest part of the whole logistical process.

How many kids inject themselves for diabetes and don't get me started on junkies, and they certainly haven't got a steady hand.

As farcical as this sounds, you'd like to think they would have a drive through system much like the testing. You drive up, hop out, bish bash bosh.

Assume they mean training to administer en masse? Of course I can’t find where I read it now!!

You would hope drive through test centres, hospital car parks, pharmacies etc will all be used in the logistical roll out. My point was we’re hearing these things from the U.K., but not here! We’ll have to assume all these amazing plans are being put in behind the scenes....

Gael23 · 21-10-2020 08:09AM

mandrake04 wrote: »

Yeah I did read that.

https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/health/pfizer-video-sparks-hope-covid19-vaccine-could-be-ready-by-december/news-story/83e8daef7e06b4799dbb1a6b1afed88e

Disappointing if true

Le Bruise · 21-10-2020 08:11AM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

The J&J deal was done only in the last 10 days after initial agreement was reached end of August. Sanofi /GSK deal also concluded.

Initial agreement with Pfizer followed early in September so you'd imagine the final contract is almost there based on the J&J timeline from agreement to final deal singed. EU also in talks with Moderna according to reports.

Brilliant. Was looking looking for a link but September was the last I could find. Didn’t know if there was updates since then.

Irish Stones · 21-10-2020 08:15AM

eastie17 wrote: »

Pfizers is due end of November, over 40K people in the test group.
Only issue with it is that it requires a cold chain supply chain and requires two shots. That makes it more difficult to distribute

How can a cold chain be a problem?
We all buy frozen food, that travels through a very cold chain, and not an issue has ever arisen.

mandrake04 · 21-10-2020 08:16AM

chrisbonnie wrote: »

At the risk of sounding like a baffoon.

Surely getting people to administer an injection must be the simplest part of the whole logistical process.

How many kids inject themselves for diabetes and don't get me started on junkies, and they certainly haven't got a steady hand.

As farcical as this sounds, you'd like to think they would have a drive through system much like the testing. You drive up, hop out, bish bash bosh.

The problem with drive through is there is usually a 15 minute observation period for adverse reaction like anaphylactic shock, driving off into the sunset could be dangerous.

This was trialed with flu vaccine in Australia and required parking observation bays especially if people were alone in the car.

conor_mc · 21-10-2020 08:29AM

Indestructable wrote: »

I think this vaccine thread will need to be split like it is done on the weather forum for big events.

Technical information/news/data/facts in one thread.

Inane chat in another thread. I doubt if many people care about ill informed opinions on vaccinations, but if you feel the need to express yourself do so here.

It's only going to get worse as we progress towards approvals.

Like MT Cranium’s daily weather forecasts, I think hmmvis should have his own locked thread for proper scientific updates and his commentary.

“Well I won’t be taking any rushed vaccine” is becoming a bit repetitive and dull!

XsApollo · 21-10-2020 08:32AM

Irish Stones wrote: »

How can a cold chain be a problem?
We all buy frozen food, that travels through a very cold chain, and not an issue has ever arisen.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/Health/pfizer-win-covid-vaccine-race-distributing-matter/story%3fid=72862724

stephenjmcd · 21-10-2020 08:36AM

Le Bruise wrote: »

Brilliant. Was looking looking for a link but September was the last I could find. Didn’t know if there was updates since then.

Yeah I was having a look last night and there was silence on the J&J deal between agreement in principle and final contract signed.

The Pfizer deal is agreed in principle since September, no update on final contract signed but can't imagine based on J&J timeline that it'll take much longer given that EMA have the rolling review underway.

Government here is opted into the first 2 contracts the EU tied up with AstraZeneca & J&J so you'd imagine they'll just continue to opt into whatever deals the EU get.

Sky King · 21-10-2020 08:39AM

Gael23 wrote: »

Of the 100 million Pfizer vaccines available this year the UK claim they are getting 40 million. I doubt that’s true?

The only consolation is that it might sort out the basket case up north....

Irish Stones · 21-10-2020 08:41AM

XsApollo wrote: »

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/Health/pfizer-win-covid-vaccine-race-distributing-matter/story%3fid=72862724

OK, but I don't think it's a big problem to make thousands -100°C freezers. We are able to reach the absolute zero in certain contexts.

Anyway I think that if something is so critical for its storage, then something is wrong with it.

Gael23 · 21-10-2020 08:54AM

Sky King wrote: »

The only consolation is that it might sort out the basket case up north....

But then there’s only 60 million for the rest of the world. That’s before the US get any. Read somewhere else they want to buy the entire supply from AZ this year

mandrake04 · 21-10-2020 09:05AM

Gael23 wrote: »

But then there’s only 60 million for the rest of the world. That’s before the US get any. Read somewhere else they want to buy the entire supply from AZ this year

Pfizer will be manufactured in USA at Kalamazoo, Andover and St Louis. It probably wont leave the US...at least in the near future.

The rest will probably be manufactured in Belgium.

Gael23 · 21-10-2020 09:11AM

mandrake04 wrote: »

Pfizer will be manufactured in USA at Kalamazoo, Andover and St Louis. It probably wont leave the US...at least in the near future.

The rest will probably be manufactured in Belgium.

Didn’t know that. So it will take even longer for them to fill the EU order

stephenjmcd · 21-10-2020 09:12AM

mandrake04 wrote: »

Pfizer will be manufactured in USA at Kalamazoo, Andover and St Louis. It probably wont leave the US...at least in the near future.

The rest will probably be manufactured in Belgium.

The EU supply is to be manufactured out of Germany and Belgium as per Pfizer

stephenjmcd · 21-10-2020 09:12AM

Gael23 wrote: »

Didn’t know that. So it will take even longer for them to fill the EU order

Separate manufacturering sites for US & EU

drunkmonkey · 21-10-2020 09:14AM

If the BCG vaccine is only in stage 3 trials with results not expected for a year how is it possible to have any other vaccine within a shorter timeframe seen as that one started in march.
https://www.macaubusiness.com/brazil-tests-tuberculosis-vaccine-against-covid-19/

Gael23 · 21-10-2020 09:15AM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Separate manufacturering sites for US & EU

Is the suggested 100 million this year between both sites or 100m each?

Sweet.Science · 21-10-2020 09:16AM

drunkmonkey wrote: »

If the BCG vaccine is only in stage 3 trials with results not expected for a year how is it possible to have any other vaccine within a shorter timeframe seen as that one started in march.
https://www.macaubusiness.com/brazil-tests-tuberculosis-vaccine-against-covid-19/

I would guess there isn't the resources for every single vaccine to be reviewed thoroughly . Some will take preference

is_that_so · 21-10-2020 09:17AM

drunkmonkey wrote: »

If the BCG vaccine is only in stage 3 trials with results not expected for a year how is it possible to have any other vaccine within a shorter timeframe seen as that one started in march.
https://www.macaubusiness.com/brazil-tests-tuberculosis-vaccine-against-covid-19/

That research is going on in multiple countries. India have been working on it too.

stephenjmcd · 21-10-2020 09:35AM

Gael23 wrote: »

Is the suggested 100 million this year between both sites or 100m each?

All here, its 100m worldwide by end of 2020 with similar each month of which EU total is 200m rising to 300m.

https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-potentially-supply-eu-200-million-doses

The UK deal is 30m doses in total 2020 & 2021.

https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-announce-agreement-united-kingdom-30

Le Bruise · 21-10-2020 10:10AM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

All here, its 100m worldwide by end of 2020 with similar each month of which EU total is 200m rising to 300m.

https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-potentially-supply-eu-200-million-doses

The UK deal is 30m doses in total 2020 & 2021.

https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-announce-agreement-united-kingdom-30

That alone should see all EU vulnerable/frontline vaccinated in Q1-Q2 of 2021. 100 million per month is incredible output.....and that's just one vaccine.

FintanMcluskey · 21-10-2020 10:16AM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

All here, its 100m worldwide by end of 2020 with similar each month of which EU total is 200m rising to 300m.

https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-potentially-supply-eu-200-million-doses

The UK deal is 30m doses in total 2020 & 2021.

https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-announce-agreement-united-kingdom-30

Why is this not more publicly know?

Why is this not the focus of Ireland’s roadmap for Covid?

astrofool · 21-10-2020 10:17AM

drunkmonkey wrote: »

If the BCG vaccine is only in stage 3 trials with results not expected for a year how is it possible to have any other vaccine within a shorter timeframe seen as that one started in march.
https://www.macaubusiness.com/brazil-tests-tuberculosis-vaccine-against-covid-19/

It's also looking for different results, they think BCG activates the immune system reducing the seriousness of the illness, rather than providing immunity to SARS-COV-2 specifically, so you're looking for improved outcomes, rather than elimination of a disease.

It's also a vaccine that's already available (most Irish people have had it, and results of a test may recommend a booster for many) and isn't being tested for safety, but efficacy. It's less of a priority than other vaccines in development, but may be useful for other disease outbreaks.

astrofool · 21-10-2020 10:19AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Why is this not more publicly know?

Why is this not the focus of Ireland’s roadmap for Covid?

It will only become part of the roadmap when the results are known, and supply/distribution numbers have been then figured out.

We're in a dynamic situation, the only certainty is that in 3 months time the plan will be different, but we don't know what that plan will be today.

hmmm · 21-10-2020 10:34AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Why is this not more publicly know?

Why is this not the focus of Ireland’s roadmap for Covid?

I don't think anyone wants to stick their neck out and say the vaccines will work until the results are released. The tone has changed in the UK only this week - until now it's been "they hopefully will work" but in the past week it has become "get the logistics in place it's happening".

Le Bruise · 21-10-2020 10:40AM

hmmm wrote: »

I don't think anyone wants to stick their neck out and say the vaccines will work until the results are released. The tone has changed in the UK only this week - until now it's been "they hopefully will work" but in the past week it has become "get the logistics in place it's happening".

I would assume it's because Ireland aren't developing a vaccine and so aren't privy to what's really happening with the trials? Obviously some top brass in the UK have been given a behind the scenes look at the Oxford vaccine this week and have liked what they've seen!

Micky 32 · 21-10-2020 11:08AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Why is this not more publicly know?

Why is this not the focus of Ireland’s roadmap for Covid?

Maybe because it’s not misery or doom and gloom enough.

snotboogie · 21-10-2020 11:09AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Why is this not more publicly know?

Why is this not the focus of Ireland’s roadmap for Covid?

Because the government and official Ireland have constantly been a few months behind whats happening internationally. The comments from Michael Martin about 2021 were terribly timed and don't match with the current best estimates for getting out of this. The message in April should have been clear that 2020 was almost certainly a write off, instead there was a tacit implication that things would go back to normal after the initial lockdown, despite there being no plan at all for how this would be facilitated. That was the time to prepare the public. Instead, when public morale is at an all time low, they declare 2021 a write off, despite the previous week being arguably the most positive for vaccine news since the virus took hold.

cgc5483 · 21-10-2020 11:10AM

Le Bruise wrote: »

I would assume it's because Ireland aren't developing a vaccine and so aren't privy to what's really happening with the trials? Obviously some top brass in the UK have been given a behind the scenes look at the Oxford vaccine this week and have liked what they've seen!

It's a double blinded study. They can't have unblinded the data until the study completes meaning they have no idea who got the vaccine or who got placebo and simply can't know if its effective or not. They are obviously just gambling that the trial will meet its primary objective

COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures Megathread [Mod Warning - Post #1]

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