Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VI - Read OP for Mod Warnings

drunkmonkey · 15-10-2020 09:53AM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

The points I have made:
1. Masks have not ground life to a halt.
2. Masks have not put 150million people into extreme poverty.

1. False life has stopped for hundreds of millions. Do I really need to post a picture of a starving child for you to understand that.

2. Correct masks on their own haven't put 150 million into extreme poverty. The are the most visable sign of a wider group of restrictions causing extreme poverty, fear and anxiety around the world.

Now back to my points.
1. Masks have not achieved any notable success in surpressing or retracting the community spread of Covid. In fact all the data points to the opposite effect as noted in the fact based research before their introduction.
2. The unintended consequences of our reaction to Covid are causing more harm to people than if we never reacted.

Lundstram · 15-10-2020 09:54AM

Ryanair closing their bases in Shannon and Cork for the winter. Absolutely devastating news for workers not long before Christmas.

I hear the word reckless thrown around a lot these days but the treatment of airlines in this country by our government is nothing short of scandalous.

The cracking a nut with a sledgehammer approach still goes on.

Wanderer78 · 15-10-2020 09:55AM

Lundstram wrote: »

Ryanair closing their bases in Shannon and Cork for the winter. Absolutely devastating news for workers not long before Christmas.

I hear the word reckless thrown around a lot these days but the treatment of airlines in this country by our government is nothing short of scandalous.

what could they have done? dreadful news though

15-10-2020 09:57AM

The fact is our airports should all be closed anyway, we have no hope if we are importing the virus as well as having it spread in the country.

Wanderer78 · 15-10-2020 09:59AM

Jorge Limited Maze wrote: »

The fact is our airports should all be closed anyway, we have no hope if we are importing the virus as well as having it spread in the country.

i wouldnt say closed, but definitely stricter controls, airport operations are critical to our economy

15-10-2020 10:00AM

Wanderer78 wrote: »

i wouldnt say closed, but definitely stricter controls, airport operations are critical to our economy

Closed to everything but verified absolutely essential travel which would drastically reduce the numbers of people leaving and coming into the country.

Zebra3 · 15-10-2020 10:01AM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Unless you consider saddling the country and future generations with still more debt as not a big deal. This will all have to be repaid (even in part) eventually - austerity may be off the agenda now, but wait till things finally DO start picking up again and the likes of Germany demand "fiscal responsibility"

It is an interesting approach though - I'm no fan of SF and the lefties but how often were they (rightly) derided for fantasy policies and notions that were based on the existence of the same magical money tree that our "responsible, sensible" Government are now liberally picking from?

We've been here before.

When Zimbabwe started printing money everyone was laughing about their irresponsibility.

A few years later western economies were doing the same thing, but suddenly it was called quantitative easing.

It's make it up as you go along and yet people just look at the news and lap it all up like nodding dogs.

Wanderer78 · 15-10-2020 10:01AM

Jorge Limited Maze wrote: »

Closed to everything but verified absolutely essential travel which would drastically reduce the numbers of people leaving and coming into the country.

you could just quarantine people

Wanderer78 · 15-10-2020 10:03AM

Zebra3 wrote: »

We've been here before.

When Zimbabwe started printing money everyone was laughing about their irresponsibility.

A few years later western economies were doing the same thing, but suddenly it was called quantitative easing.

It's make it up as you go along and yet people just look at the news and lap it all up like nodding dogs.

zimbabwe's situation was far more complex than just money creation, it also involved serious supply side issues, hence its hyperinflation outcome, baring in mind, theres deflationary concerns currently in the eurozone

drunkmonkey · 15-10-2020 10:16AM

Jorge Limited Maze wrote: »

The fact is our airports should all be closed anyway, we have no hope if we are importing the virus as well as having it spread in the country.

It's the most unpalatable secnario for Government, it can only happen with an agreement with northern leaders. It has to also include ports and mandatory quarantine for everyone including essential workers like Truck drivers. It's very extreme but will get us back to normal after a no nonsense everything closed Lockdown. Medical staff, Guards and other emergency service staff can not be allowed to home after work during this lockdown.
It needs to be well flagged so people can buy 14 days shopping as all shops need to close for the period along with everything else.

Once we do this, it's mandatory quarantine at all the points of entry to any part of the island.

I've no doubt it will work. There is absolutely no way the Government will do it.

topper75 · 15-10-2020 10:40AM

Zebra3 wrote: »

We've been here before.

When Zimbabwe started printing money everyone was laughing about their irresponsibility.

A few years later western economies were doing the same thing, but suddenly it was called quantitative easing.

It's make it up as you go along and yet people just look at the news and lap it all up like nodding dogs.

History is littered with examples of blind trust in government not ending well.

What baffles me is that all Irish must legally attend school to a certain age. This schooling involves critical thinking modules such as analysis of characters in novels and plays along with geometry theorems and conducting science experiments. How after all that do you end up with a populace so lacking in its ability to thinking critically? The mainstream media line is swallowed like a worm in a chick's beak.

Wanderer78 · 15-10-2020 10:42AM

topper75 wrote: »

History is littered with examples of blind trust in government not ending well.

What baffles me is that all Irish must legally attend school to a certain age. This schooling involves critical thinking modules such as analysis of characters in novels and plays along with geometry theorems and conducting science experiments. How after all that do you end up with a populace so lacking in its ability to thinking critically? The mainstream media line is swallowed like a worm in a chick's beak.

rote learning has little or nothing to do about critical thinking, its a giant memory test!

Tenzor07 · 15-10-2020 10:49AM

drunkmonkey wrote: »

It's the most unpalatable secnario for Government, it can only happen with an agreement with northern leaders. It has to also include ports and mandatory quarantine for everyone including essential workers like Truck drivers. It's very extreme but will get us back to normal after a no nonsense everything closed Lockdown. Medical staff, Guards and other emergency service staff can not be allowed to home after work during this lockdown.
It needs to be well flagged so people can buy 14 days shopping as all shops need to close for the period along with everything else.
Once we do this, it's mandatory quarantine at all the points of entry to any part of the island.
I've no doubt it will work. There is absolutely no way the Government will do it.

Exactly! This is War! And we must put the country into a Wartime status now! Covid is the Spanish flu!
Closure of ports both sea and air, seal the borders with N.I, all 300 crossing points!
All workers from Retail to Schools must close, only Hospitals will remain staffed...
Gardai and Army to work from home.
Farmers to stay 1km from home and not operate machinery...

Wanderer78 · 15-10-2020 10:50AM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Exactly! This is War! And we must put the country into a Wartime status now! Covid is the Spanish flu!
Closure of ports both sea and air, seal the borders with N.I, all 300 crossing points!
All workers from Retail to Schools must close, only Hospitals will remain staffed...
Gardai and Army to work from home.
Farmers to stay 1km from home and not operate machinery...

im sure it wouldnt cause issues with our most critical of needs, food supplies etc!

RobitTV · 15-10-2020 11:03AM

The decision to ban household visits is the final nail in the coffin for many people who will now face months of isolation. They will extend this past Christmas, mark my words!

They have no intention of letting these restrictions end without causing as much social and economic instability as possible.

The damage has already been done and now they want to add more fuel to the already blazing inferno.

This is now down to the people of Ireland and Europe to make a stand against dodgy government propaganda and the blown out of proportion nonsense they announce daily.

Let's see them try and impose a lockdown in Bradford or Oldham or in dangerous areas of Marseille or in parts of Brussels. These are places where the violence is going to explode.

Wanderer78 · 15-10-2020 11:04AM

RobitTV wrote: »

The decision to ban household visits is the final nail in the coffin for many people who will now face months of isolation. They will extend this past Christmas, mark my words!

They have no intention of letting these restrictions end without causing as much social and economic instability as possible.

The damage has already been done and now they want to add more fuel to the already blazing inferno.

This is now down to the people of Ireland and Europe to make a stand against dodgy government propaganda and the blown out of proportion nonsense they announce daily.

Let's see them try and impose a lockdown in Bradford or Oldham or in dangerous areas of Marseille or in parts of Brussels. These are places where the violence is going to explode.

what?

RobitTV · 15-10-2020 11:10AM

This is an example of what happens when you live in area of poverty, social deprivation, high unemployment, crime, drug wars between local gangs - Some of these areas will ignore lockdown restrictions.

Wanderer78 · 15-10-2020 11:11AM

RobitTV wrote: »

This is an example of what happens when you live in area of poverty, social deprivation, high unemployment, crime, drug wars between local gangs.

we already know, this, whats your point?

RobitTV · 15-10-2020 11:11AM

Wanderer78 wrote: »

we already know, this, whats your point?

You haven't even asked a question. You just said 'what'....

Wanderer78 · 15-10-2020 11:12AM

RobitTV wrote: »

You haven't even asked a question, you just said 'what'....

fair enough, what are you on about?

RobitTV · 15-10-2020 11:13AM

Wanderer78 wrote: »

fair enough, what are you on about?

Did you read my post? do you have an opinion to share? im a little lost myself now.

Mitch Connor · 15-10-2020 11:14AM

drunkmonkey wrote: »

1. False life has stopped for hundreds of millions. Do I really need to post a picture of a starving child for you to understand that.

What do you mean 'False'? I have not said life is normal for everyone, or anyone. I have not said people have not been impacted in many ways. What would a picture of a starving child prove? that the pandemic and the restrictions put in place in response to that has caused hardship for people? Why would you look to prove that when I have never said it is not true?

My point is simple: Masks are not the cause of this. the lockdown restrictions are the cause of this.
Yes, Masks are a very visible indication of restrictions - but masks are not the closing of gyms, cinemas, restaurants or shops. Masks are not the restriction of social interaction and visits. I can shop, go to the cinema, go to a restaurant, go to the gym, visit family etc while wearing a mask. I can't do those things when lockdown restrictions stop me from doing so.

If the restrictions were largely removed from everything else but mask use was retained as a measure (i am not going to comment on usefulness as that is not relevant) life would return to normal or extremely close to it and the economy would have a chance at getting back.

Lockdown restrictions have ground life to a halt for many.
Lockdown restrictions have pushed people into poverty.

If those were the points you had made, I'd agree. But those are not the points you have made, those are not the points you have repeatidly doubled down on. You said masks did those things. Masks.

Masks =/= Lockdown.

drunkmonkey · 15-10-2020 11:16AM

RobitTV wrote: »

The decision to ban household visits is the final nail in the coffin for many people who will now face months of isolation. They will extend this past Christmas, mark my words!

There is no ban, it's public health advice nothing more, you can't get in trouble for ignoring it.

15-10-2020 11:16AM

RobitTV wrote: »

.

Let's see them try and impose a lockdown in Bradford or Oldham or in dangerous areas of Marseille or in parts of Brussels. These are places where the violence is going to explode.

The police will fight back against them, water cannon them etc. They won’t be let do what they want like would happen here.

It almost sounds like you support this thuggish bordering on terrorist behaviour by people.

Mitch Connor · 15-10-2020 11:17AM

RobitTV wrote: »

They have no intention of letting these restrictions end without causing as much social and economic instability as possible.

why?

RobitTV · 15-10-2020 11:17AM

drunkmonkey wrote: »

There is no ban, it's public health advice nothing more, you can't get in trouble for ignoring it.

I have no doubt many people will choose to ignore this advice. As if people are going to stop themselves from visiting relatives.

RobitTV · 15-10-2020 11:20AM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

why?

It's a good question which needs to be directed at Michael Martin and Leo Varadkar. I would love to know what is running through their brains on a daily basis :pac:

They have lost the confidence and trust of the public.

RobitTV · 15-10-2020 11:22AM

Jorge Limited Maze wrote: »

The police will hammer them, water cannon them etc. They won’t be let do what they want like would happen here.

It almost sounds like you support this thuggish bordering on terrorist behaviour by people.

Hilarious Nox :pac: don't you know these areas are out of control of the local police forces? they have attacked the local police station itself...

I don't support them actually, i would rather law and order prevailed in these dangerous areas. They are very unstable and dangerous.

The police are even too scared to enter some of these areas.

Mitch Connor · 15-10-2020 11:23AM

RobitTV wrote: »

It's a good question which needs to be directed at Michael Martin and Leo Varadkar. I would love to know what is running through their brains on a daily basis :pac:

They have lost the confidence and trust of the public.

No, it needs to be directed at you. You are the one saying they want to cause as much economic damage as possible. So.... why? Why are you saying that is their goal. beyond not liking them or not agreeing with them, why do you believe they want to damage the country as much as they can?

RobitTV · 15-10-2020 11:28AM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

No, it needs to be directed at you. You are the one saying they want to cause as much economic damage as possible. So.... why? Why are you saying that is their goal. beyond not liking them or not agreeing with them, why do you believe they want to damage the country as much as they can?

Because we have gone through one of Europe's strictest lockdowns. They have ignore the wishes of businesses to remain open and trade, they have damaged the jobs market which will mean 320,000 people will let go in 2021.

What about the future of our young people? who will face years of economic hardship thanks to government decision making. Will they be able to get a secure job when they leave school or college?

We are running a budget deficit of 21 billion euro, which will have to sorted out with years of austerity down the road....

We are now going backwards again. You should ask the people on PUP who have rent and multiple children to feed how they are coping.

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VI - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VI - Read OP for Mod Warnings