Sage Barista Express

keith_d99 · 02-09-2020 8:21pm #1

After 6 years with a Delonghi Magnifica B2C - am thinking of going upgrading to a semi-automatic machine .... and specifically the Barista Express.
Always buy fresh beans .. so might as well think about using a better machine?

Have read reviews, watch vids etc. ... and the only negative is that the grinder adjustments could be a bit finer.

What I do like ...

- reviews are very positive otherwise
- the gauge ... which genuinely should help produce a good shot
- the price @ 575
- separate grinder and something like the Gaggia Classic would be more expensive
- Looks great (which makes it an easier sell to the missus)
- frother gets good kudos too

Any owners out there that could give feedback?

Also ... any B2C machine owners make a similar upgrade? Can I expect much higher quality shots than the Delonghi?

cython · 03-09-2020 10:12am

keith_d99 wrote: »

After 6 years with a Delonghi Magnifica B2C - am thinking of going upgrading to a semi-automatic machine .... and specifically the Barista Express.
Always buy fresh beans .. so might as well think about using a better machine?

Have read reviews, watch vids etc. ... and the only negative is that the grinder adjustments could be a bit finer.

What I do like ...

- reviews are very positive otherwise
- the gauge ... which genuinely should help produce a good shot
- the price @ 575
- separate grinder and something like the Gaggia Classic would be more expensive
- Looks great (which makes it an easier sell to the missus)
- frother gets good kudos too

Any owners out there that could give feedback?

Also ... any B2C machine owners make a similar upgrade? Can I expect much higher quality shots than the Delonghi?

On the bolded, you can do better, just do you know: https://velocoffee.ie/products/the-barista-express-by-sage

Considering a B2C of some form myself at the moment, and seesawing between an automatic like the DeLonghi (if one comes up on a discount), and something like this, so interested in other comments on this thread.

skerry · 03-09-2020 10:27am

keith_d99 wrote: »

After 6 years with a Delonghi Magnifica B2C - am thinking of going upgrading to a semi-automatic machine .... and specifically the Barista Express.
Always buy fresh beans .. so might as well think about using a better machine?

Have read reviews, watch vids etc. ... and the only negative is that the grinder adjustments could be a bit finer.

What I do like ...

- reviews are very positive otherwise
- the gauge ... which genuinely should help produce a good shot
- the price @ 575
- separate grinder and something like the Gaggia Classic would be more expensive
- Looks great (which makes it an easier sell to the missus)
- frother gets good kudos too

Any owners out there that could give feedback?

Also ... any B2C machine owners make a similar upgrade? Can I expect much higher quality shots than the Delonghi?

I have the previous model of the Barista Express for over a year now and its been great. Its my first bean to cup machine so can't give any comparison there. Think last machine was a Delonghi but with no grinder so used pre ground and obviously the Sage is miles better than that system.

Get lovely shots out of it once dialled in and milk frother is more than up to the task. Regarding the grinder settings, I read the same about the graduations but its not been an issue for me. For the odd time it needs to be dialled in that precisely I've seen people put one of those heavy duty paper clips on to hold it in place but I've never had to do that.

Is the DeLonghi an automatic job? I looked at those but I actually enjoy the whole hands on process of dialling in my shots more. In short, great machine and no complaints in over a years use.

keith_d99 · 03-09-2020 10:55am

cython wrote: »

On the bolded, you can do better, just do you know: https://velocoffee.ie/products/the-barista-express-by-sage

Considering a B2C of some form myself at the moment, and seesawing between an automatic like the DeLonghi (if one comes up on a discount), and something like this, so interested in other comments on this thread.

Yeah I was gonna go for the all silver version @ 575 .... but it has since sold out!

VeloCoffee got back to me to say that they won't have more until October at the earliest as Sage are struggling to produce enough to meet demand. Covid related no doubt.

(btw VeloCoffee seem to a decent outfit ... their response time was excellent)

Might just go for the black.

They are also in Currys/Harvey Normans but up at 670?!
BT also do them ... but no sure on price/availability.
They are sold out on their online store.

keith_d99 · 03-09-2020 11:00am

skerry wrote: »

I have the previous model of the Barista Express for over a year now and its been great. Its my first bean to cup machine so can't give any comparison there. Think last machine was a Delonghi but with no grinder so used pre ground and obviously the Sage is miles better than that system.

Get lovely shots out of it once dialled in and milk frother is more than up to the task. Regarding the grinder settings, I read the same about the graduations but its not been an issue for me. For the odd time it needs to be dialled in that precisely I've seen people put one of those heavy duty paper clips on to hold it in place but I've never had to do that.

Is the DeLonghi an automatic job? I looked at those but I actually enjoy the whole hands on process of dialling in my shots more. In short, great machine and no complaints in over a years use.

The Delonghi is fully automatic yeah ... and can't be knocked for convenience

The frother does the job also ... but is limited. I just get the feeling you can get a much better brew with a semi-automatic (with more control).

Came across a review that compared brews from machines ...
Delonghi got a respectable 7/10 ... the Barista Express 9/10

Colonel Claptrap · 03-09-2020 8:58pm

DID are selling it for 549 and that includes a free 1kg bag of coffee beans.

You don't want to waste good coffee when trying to figure out how to pull good shots, so use their cheapo beans.

It takes about 1 week for DID to order it in.

raytaxi · 03-09-2020 10:06pm

I got one off Velo was Excellent to deal with and came with 3 bags of coffee beans to start off with.

flipflophead22 · 11-09-2020 11:11pm

Thinking of geting one, are ye happy with the purchase?

raytaxi · 12-09-2020 9:36am

Yeah am happy with it, takes while to get used to. I’d have like the pro one for faster heating for milk, but couldn’t justify the cost at time

flipflophead22 · 12-09-2020 11:48am

raytaxi wrote: »

Yeah am happy with it, takes while to get used to. I’d have like the pro one for faster heating for milk, but couldn’t justify the cost at time

good to hear, yeah unless the pro one was on sale.

Does it take long to get used to it. Think i will order from Velo too, i prefer the black to the silver.

raytaxi · 12-09-2020 12:33pm

Works pretty much out of box, everyone I know with them says that. Was pretty easy to get drinkable coffee it longer to get very good.
You will go thru quite a lot of coffee it seems to be set up to use 18/19 g a double shot. Depending on where you are your more than welcome to try it.

mad m · 13-09-2020 1:00pm

Is there much difference between this model and the Sage Barista pro ( other than having an LCD readout)?

raytaxi · 13-09-2020 1:05pm

Using different system for heating newer design. Faster heat up, faster switching for heating milk stepless grinder.

forumdedum · 13-09-2020 1:06pm

I have used 2 sage machines. Current 1 Sage Barista Pro is 9 months old and touch wood behaves. Slightly more manual (the milk) than the other.

The other a Sage Barista Touch broke after 11 months. Firstly the milk frother wouldn't work. Then immediately after that the grinder went crazy, it wouldn't stop. Just kept throwing ground coffee all over the place.

Then, it tripped the electrics in my kitchen (which never happens)

Lovely coffee :-)

keith_d99 · 14-09-2020 9:00am

Went ahead and got the Barista Express

Fantastic upgrade from the Delonghi B2C ... coffee is on another level.

Be prepared to watch plenty of YouTube vids (especially on "dialling it in"

). Pretty easy to use all the same though. Had it producing a decent shot within minutes. The frother is quite easy to use as well. Once you get used to the machine ... it's very enjoyable to use if that makes sense. You have a lot more control over the type of shot you produce and indeed the froth. The pressure needle is very useful in getting the grind right.

Build quality is very impressive. Would highly recommend the machine.

flipflophead22 · 14-09-2020 10:09am

keith_d99 wrote: »

Went ahead and got the Barista Express

Fantastic upgrade from the Delonghi B2C ... coffee is on another level.

Be prepared to watch plenty of YouTube vids (especially on "dialling it in" ). Pretty easy to use all the same though. Had it producing a decent shot within minutes. The frother is quite easy to use as well. Once you get used to the machine ... it's very enjoyable to use if that makes sense. You have a lot more control over the type of shot you produce and indeed the froth. The pressure needle is very useful in getting the grind right.

Build quality is very impressive. Would highly recommend the machine.

Sounds great, im looking to buy one within the next week or two. Are they loud?

Colonel Claptrap · 14-09-2020 10:30am

flipflophead22 wrote: »

Sounds great, im looking to buy one within the next week or two. Are they loud?

Quite loud. Particularly the grinder.

flipflophead22 · 14-09-2020 10:36am

Ok dont think it will stop me anyway, everyone seems to love this machine. Whats the warranty out of curiosity?

Klopp · 14-09-2020 11:55am

Colonel Claptrap wrote: »

Quite loud. Particularly the grinder.

I would echo both points, the Barista is loud.

Lots of frustration trying to dial in and get decent pressure but worth it when you get great coffee

flipflophead22 · 14-09-2020 12:40pm

Klopp wrote: »

I would echo both points, the Barista is loud.

Lots of frustration trying to dial in and get decent pressure but worth it when you get great coffee

How long to get used to it?

Klopp · 14-09-2020 2:05pm

flipflophead22 wrote: »

How long to get used to it?

I watched a lot videos on tips and the reviews before i decided to make the purchase. I got use to it within a few days. I got a bit ocd trying to get it all perfect, the extraction and timing. The only negative i came across was the inbuilt grinder isn't great and i agree.

Alanstrainor · 14-09-2020 2:42pm

I only got my Barista Express recently too. It's my first go at espresso; I've had a tonne of coffee gadgets over the years (aeropress, moka pot, v60, nanopresso etc). But I've been loving mine. It did take some time to get used to, but for me the beans I started with just weren't right for espresso, they were a light roast and produced a sour shot no matter what you did. After getting some beans roasted for espresso I was able to dial it in very quickly. Now pulling great shots with minimal effort.

I'd definitely recommend it, although I don't have any experience outside of this machine. I find the grinder does a good job; I did invest in a bottomless portafilter to watch the process more closely which is fun. Espresso is definitely one of those hobbies where online communities are always drawn to very expensive gear (maybe the Barista Express is example enough!), but you can get great results from the machine as it is.

Damo 2k9 · 14-09-2020 3:10pm

Have had mine since approx. March, just before lockdown and find it great. Took some serious getting used to, and I would echo the above points that the grinder may hold it back, but I get really nice espresso from mine now.

Youtube, youtube and more youtube to help you out with it.

I had to adjust the upper burr setting to go finer, and even now I find the regular grind setting as low as 2 to get some decent shots out of it.
I am using bean in dingle at the moment, their house blend, with a grind setting of 2.
18.5 in, 38 out in 29/30 seconds on average.

I wish I didnt have to go as far as adjusting the upper burr, but ah well. Works a treat now.

killbillvol2 · 14-09-2020 6:26pm

Damo 2k9 wrote: »

Have had mine since approx. March, just before lockdown and find it great. Took some serious getting used to, and I would echo the above points that the grinder may hold it back, but I get really nice espresso from mine now.

Youtube, youtube and more youtube to help you out with it.

I had to adjust the upper burr setting to go finer, and even now I find the regular grind setting as low as 2 to get some decent shots out of it.
I am using bean in dingle at the moment, their house blend, with a grind setting of 2.
18.5 in, 38 out in 29/30 seconds on average.

I wish I didnt have to go as far as adjusting the upper burr, but ah well. Works a treat now.

That post is as valuable as 10 YouTube videos. (I hate getting info from YouTube - too much waffle before they get to the point.)

Damo 2k9 · 14-09-2020 10:34pm

Also another note, the steam wand is not the strongest. It's a single hole steam wand so frothing milk does take that big longer than most machines like the BE.

Learning to froth milk is a whole other ball game...be warned :pac:

ExMachina1000 · 14-09-2020 10:45pm

Dont be afraid to remove and properly clean the grinder gears from time to time.

Also descaling the machine is vital if you want to hold onto it for a few years.

Damo 2k9 · 15-09-2020 11:59am

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Dont be afraid to remove and properly clean the grinder gears from time to time.

Also descaling the machine is vital if you want to hold onto it for a few years.

What do you use for descaling?

Alanstrainor · 15-09-2020 3:04pm

Damo 2k9 wrote: »

What do you use for descaling?

Also interested in this. I've just ordered some of the cleaning tablets that you get a sample of with the machine. I have yet to do any cleaning so far though.

Also, this just landed in the post:

https://www.ebay.ie/itm/Breville-Barista-Express-Pro-Touch-Dosing-Funnel-Grinder-Trigger-Button-BES870XL/264819160856?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=564644360997&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

A dosing funnel to make things a bit cleaner/neater when grinding into the portafilter. It also allows you to de-clump the grounds before tamping. I just pulled my first shot using it and made an immediate difference. Worth it for the relatively low cost I'd say.

skerry · 15-09-2020 3:59pm

Damo 2k9 wrote: »

What do you use for descaling?

I descaled mine today and used the Astonish descaler. Think herself for it in Dealz for a couple of euro for a litre. Works perfect

Klopp · 15-09-2020 7:45pm

I descaled my Sage using UrnexCafiza i ordered on Amazon, the delivery took 5 weeks but otherwise i would recommend.

To anyone looking to remove the burr to ajust the grind setting.

I removed my own burr grinder, the first time i found it easy to remove and it clicked back in but the second time it wouldn't click or if it did wasn't a loud click like the first time and i spent ages listening out for the loud click which never happened. The burr is lined up to the lock position and grinder is working away. The flimsy wire is lazy engineering on the design and i found it difficult so be careful.

ExMachina1000 · 15-09-2020 8:42pm

Damo 2k9 wrote: »

What do you use for descaling?

Any generic kettle descaler will do. The programme itself is very short as in the descaler doesn't sit long in the machine. I usually repeat the process a couple of times with descaler in the tank and then do the rinse part a few times too.

Because the descaler doesn't sit in the machine for long it wont actually remove any solid deposits. Therefore I find it better to carry out the descaling regularly so those deposits dont get a chance to build up!

If the machine gets badly clogged with scale you will have a pain in your ass trying to find someone who will repair it. You may end up having to bin it! Its vital!
All depends on your water hardness of course. Mine is very bad

ExMachina1000 · 15-09-2020 8:47pm

Klopp wrote: »

I descaled my Sage using UrnexCafiza i ordered on Amazon, the delivery took 5 weeks but otherwise i would recommend.

To anyone looking to remove the burr to ajust the grind setting.

I removed my own burr grinder, the first time i found it easy to remove and it clicked back in but the second time it wouldn't click or if it did wasn't a loud click like the first time and i spent ages listening out for the loud click which never happened. The burr is lined up to the lock position and grinder is working away. The flimsy wire is lazy engineering on the design and i found it difficult so be careful.

I think the upper burr with clip can be bought. Its around 20 quid. You are dead right about the wire. Lazy afterthought for sure.

Klopp · 15-09-2020 9:50pm

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

I think the upper burr with clip can be bought. Its around 20 quid. You are dead right about the wire. Lazy afterthought for sure.

Yes, the one good thing Sage have is the replacement of the moving parts. Luckily i don't need a new burr just yet, the grind seems to be working, i might move it back to the default setting tomorrow and see if it clicks back in place.

Damo 2k9 · 16-09-2020 12:43pm

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Any generic kettle descaler will do. The programme itself is very short as in the descaler doesn't sit long in the machine. I usually repeat the process a couple of times with descaler in the tank and then do the rinse part a few times too.

Because the descaler doesn't sit in the machine for long it wont actually remove any solid deposits. Therefore I find it better to carry out the descaling regularly so those deposits dont get a chance to build up!

If the machine gets badly clogged with scale you will have a pain in your ass trying to find someone who will repair it. You may end up having to bin it! Its vital!
All depends on your water hardness of course. Mine is very bad

Cheers!! I have done the cleaning cycle with the provided tablets, but thats a backflush and not a descale.

Im good mates with the local coffee shop, so I might ask him for some espresso cleaning tabs whilst I wait on mine as the light is flashing. Ill run a descale cycle too as I havent ran that yet.

ExMachina1000 · 16-09-2020 1:23pm

Damo 2k9 wrote: »

Cheers!! I have done the cleaning cycle with the provided tablets, but thats a backflush and not a descale.

Im good mates with the local coffee shop, so I might ask him for some espresso cleaning tabs whilst I wait on mine as the light is flashing. Ill run a descale cycle too as I havent ran that yet.

Half a tablet or the powder equivalent will do if it's a product used for cleaning commercial machines. Break the half tablet up so it dissolves better.

(I used to be a coffee machine service engineer in the uk)

DaveyDave · 16-09-2020 2:53pm

I bought some tablets on Amazon for the back flush, any recommendations on filters? How often should a descale be done?

I had to adjust my internal burr to the lowest setting with the grind on 2. Fair difference between 2 and 1 on the dial, one borderline chokes the machine while the other one is probably the 12 o clock position. Finding it very hard to dial in due to having to adjust the internal burr so much. Fresh espresso beans from Bell Lane and Badger & Dodo have the same result. I wonder should I look into that spacer from Sage people talk about?

flipflophead22 · 16-09-2020 4:08pm

Out of curiosity is there anything on par with this in a similar price range?

Klopp · 16-09-2020 4:12pm

DaveyDave wrote: »

I bought some tablets on Amazon for the back flush, any recommendations on filters? How often should a descale be done?

I had to adjust my internal burr to the lowest setting with the grind on 2. Fair difference between 2 and 1 on the dial, one borderline chokes the machine while the other one is probably the 12 o clock position. Finding it very hard to dial in due to having to adjust the internal burr so much. Fresh espresso beans from Bell Lane and Badger & Dodo have the same result. I wonder should I look into that spacer from Sage people talk about?

How many grams of beans are you using?

I had to adjust my internal burr yesterday for fresh beans I bought ( Rave signature blend ) it was at 6 by default and I moved it to 5. I moved the dial back and after a few attempts settled on 6 ( Coarser )with 18.5g of beans and I am getting pressure and can taste the difference.

Klopp · 18-09-2020 9:01am

If anyone is looking around or interested, i bought these Descaler sachets off Amazon and have had no issue. The important part as you know is to flush out using a full tank of water.

BoardsMember · 18-09-2020 9:25am

I've been trying not to buy a B2C machine for ages. We use a bog standard krups 75 grinder (single blade) and a bialetti moka express. The coffee tastes really good. Wondering if people have changed from manual like this to b2c, and "never looked back" or similar?

Klopp · 21-09-2020 8:56pm

I use the default Portafilter and no issue with it. I never cared much about the plastic insert inside until I read online some people take out the plastic insert with conflicting stories about its purpose? I am toying with the idea of buying a Bottomless Portafilter, my main question is has anyone else bought one and noticed any differences apart from the ascetics and looks?

dubstepper · 22-09-2020 3:02pm

Just on price, it is well worth shopping around. I bought mine near black friday from Amazon for £378. They occasionally drop it down. I saw it in harvery norman for 640!

DaveyDave · 22-09-2020 3:12pm

Klopp wrote: »

How many grams of beans are you using?

I had to adjust my internal burr yesterday for fresh beans I bought ( Rave signature blend ) it was at 6 by default and I moved it to 5. I moved the dial back and after a few attempts settled on 6 ( Coarser )with 18.5g of beans and I am getting pressure and can taste the difference.

Using around 18g. Internal burr on 1 and the dial on 2-3 was the only way to slow the extraction time. Taste still isn't great, I've managed this long as I'm mainly doing cappuccino.

Klopp · 22-09-2020 3:23pm

DaveyDave wrote: »

Using around 18g. Internal burr on 1 and the dial on 2-3 was the only way to slow the extraction time. Taste still isn't great, I've managed this long as I'm mainly doing cappuccino.

I adjusted the burr on my own and ended up switching it back to the default setting of 6. With the same beans i bought from Rave ( Signature blend ) one day the grind is at 8 and today its at 6, never ending battle.

dubstepper · 22-09-2020 3:28pm

I have to have the grind setting down near 2 to get the pressure up into the infusion range. That is applying reasonable tamping pressure. Much higher I couldn't get the pressure. With a good quality bean and a fine setting I get excellent espresso.

Alanstrainor · 22-09-2020 4:26pm

Klopp wrote: »

I use the default Portafilter and no issue with it. I never cared much about the plastic insert inside until I read online some people take out the plastic insert with conflicting stories about its purpose? I am toying with the idea of buying a Bottomless Portafilter, my main question is has anyone else bought one and noticed any differences apart from the ascetics and looks?

I bought this one:

https://www.ebay.ie/itm/54mm-Stainless-Steel-Coffee-Machine-Bottomless-Filter-Holder-Portafilter-Q8T8/353135482338

22 quid or so and the handle is a thing of beauty. Really impressed with it, and it arrived very quickly from China.

As for your question, no there is no difference in the quality of the shots. It uses the same filter basket after all. But what this gives you is a better insight into small issues, most notably channelling. What I discovered was that my grind was clumping, so I now use a paper clip to mix the grinds before tamping.

The other side of the bottomless filter is that it is messy when your shot isn't perfect. You will get coffee spraying around the place. But since I've been de-clumping it happens much less.

In short, is it essential? Definitely not. Does it have benefits? Maybe. If you're seeking perfection, then yes I think it does have value. Is it really cool to watch? Absolutely. It is amazing to watch, mesmerising.

keith_d99 · 22-09-2020 5:07pm

dubstepper wrote: »

I have to have the grind setting down near 2 to get the pressure up into the infusion range. That is applying reasonable tamping pressure. Much higher I couldn't get the pressure. With a good quality bean and a fine setting I get excellent espresso.

I have grind setting at 8?!

.... pressure dial hits about 12pm - and timing of the shot is good @ 25ish seconds. Again with a reasonable tamp.

I haven't weighed exactly how many beans (as I don't have a scale) - but the grind amount is about 4 O'clock ... and the grind is heaped to the point I lose some grind.

My machine is new but seems like the grind setting is very much bean dependent? (Am using Ponaire beans at the moment).

keith_d99 · 22-09-2020 5:10pm

dubstepper wrote: »

Just on price, it is well worth shopping around. I bought mine near black friday from Amazon for £378. They occasionally drop it down. I saw it in harvery norman for 640!

Ah a pre-Covid bargain!

I did plenty of looking ... the machines are in demand. Cheapest I could find was on velocoffee.ie

ExMachina1000 · 22-09-2020 7:36pm

keith_d99 wrote: »

My machine is new but seems like the grind setting is very much bean dependent? (Am using Ponaire beans at the moment).

For sure. Every change of bean will require grinder adjustment to find the sweet spot. I like a roughly 2.5 to 1 ratio. Ie 18 grams in 36 to 45 grams (ml) out into the cup. Il aim for a 30 second extraction but again this completely changes depending on the bean!

Klopp · 22-09-2020 7:45pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I bought this one:

https://www.ebay.ie/itm/54mm-Stainless-Steel-Coffee-Machine-Bottomless-Filter-Holder-Portafilter-Q8T8/353135482338

22 quid or so and the handle is a thing of beauty. Really impressed with it, and it arrived very quickly from China.

As for your question, no there is no difference in the quality of the shots. It uses the same filter basket after all.

I love the look and the price is reasonable. I never thought to look on eBay in my search. Yes, it is the same pressured basket, i hadn't thought of that when asking about shot quality but i didn't think it would make any difference as it is more quailty of coffee, the grind and correct pressure.

Klopp · 23-09-2020 7:38pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I bought this one:

https://www.ebay.ie/itm/54mm-Stainless-Steel-Coffee-Machine-Bottomless-Filter-Holder-Portafilter-Q8T8/353135482338

22 quid or so and the handle is a thing of beauty. Really impressed with it, and it arrived very quickly from China.

I purchased this, now how quick was your delivery

Sage Barista Express

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