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How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

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Comments

  • #1922
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,558 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    Sunday Sunday wrote: »
    Might not be, everyone might be pleasantly surprised (or disappointed maybe?) when things actually go alright and most schools remain open over the coming months.

    It's not necessarily a given that things are going to go badly. I'm looking forward to seeing our school plan, hopefully soon.

    Sorry, I should explain a bit. That’s our plan on paper. In reality it will be 28-30 in classrooms as normal. The 1m social distancing is a farcical dream that simply cannot be enforced, particularly outside the classroom. I can tell from the way management are talking that mask wearing is not going to be heavily policed either.

    It’s basically a normal return to school with a load of optics.


  • #1923
    lulublue22
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,496 ✭✭✭lulublue22


    Sunday Sunday wrote: »
    Might not be, everyone might be pleasantly surprised (or disappointed maybe?) when things actually go alright and most schools remain open over the coming months.

    It's not necessarily a given that things are going to go badly. I'm looking forward to seeing our school plan, hopefully soon.

    I will be very happy if my school stays open as hopefully it means less chance of me bringing covid home to my at risk child. Also hopefully means said child will be able to go to school without compromising her health.


  • #1924
    Mrsmum
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,860 ✭✭✭Mrsmum


    Purplewaters wrote: »
    Parents can view the plan and we don't know much more than that plan provides. I think honestly parents have more power. Teachers have no public support and are accused of being a protected species. Parents would be listened to but have a little more choice in the matter as they can refuse to send their child in. A teacher can't financially refuse to go into work. Parents not working from home also are in a bind.

    The thing is too though that schools are very much keeping their worries away from parents. Like for instance, this last week we got a video message from the principal and another message from our children's secondary school, short on detail but very bright and breezy in tone, saying how much the staff were looking forward to having all the kids back, how much they missed them and that they were working hard to be ready for back to school and to ensure our children safety. So I'm certainly not getting any message from the school that they want the power of my voice at all.


  • #1925
    caveat emptor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,134 ✭✭✭caveat emptor


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    The thing is too though that schools are very much keeping their worries away from parents. Like for instance, this last week we got a video message from the principal and another message from our children's secondary school, short on detail but very bright and breezy in tone, saying how much the staff were looking forward to having all the kids back, how much they missed them and that they were working hard to be ready for back to school and to ensure our children safety. So I'm certainly not getting any message from the school that they want the power of my voice at all.


    Yeah similar story here. All "great to get back to normal", no staggering etc.
    I just read this about how Denmark did it.
    We are not Denmark, not even close.
    At a certain point optimism becomes naivety with this virus.
    People are going to have to be responsible for their own decisions regarding the safety of their children. If I don't see a workable plan (one that doesn't try to make 1 meter equal 2) then I'll have to look at other options.

    https://twitter.com/threadreaderapp/status/1294982512792473603?s=20


  • #1926
    Purplewaters
    Closed Accounts Posts: 194 ✭✭Purplewaters


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    The thing is too though that schools are very much keeping their worries away from parents. Like for instance, this last week we got a video message from the principal and another message from our children's secondary school, short on detail but very bright and breezy in tone, saying how much the staff were looking forward to having all the kids back, how much they missed them and that they were working hard to be ready for back to school and to ensure our children safety. So I'm certainly not getting any message from the school that they want the power of my voice at all.

    All of that is true but schools cannot send parents messages saying we think this plan is wrong. We just can't. Unfortunately it needs to start with the parents. The plan is clear for anyone to read. Are parents OK with nodistancing in the classrooms? Especially under second its zero? And no masks? If not it needs to come from them. Teachers are contacting their own unions but they can't tell the parents how they're feeling. We will all be trying our best for everyone's sake to keep it safe but we can't work miracles.


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  • #1927
    i_surge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,093 ✭✭✭i_surge


    Purplewaters wrote: »
    All of that is true but schools cannot send parents messages saying we think this plan is wrong. We just can't. Unfortunately it needs to start with the parents. The plan is clear for anyone to read. Are parents OK with nodistancing in the classrooms? Especially under second its zero? And no masks? If not it needs to come from them. Teachers are contacting their own unions but they can't tell the parents how they're feeling. We will all be trying our best for everyone's sake to keep it safe but we can't work miracles.

    Great resource there on the Danish and their approach worked. Limited mixing before and after school, outdoor classes if possible, limiting numbers present, at least 2m, hygiene, masks added later on.

    To your point, I wonder if most parents are unaware and assuming things will be up to scratch?


  • #1928
    Sunday Sunday
    Closed Accounts Posts: 187 ✭✭Sunday Sunday


    Redordeadqwwer wrote: »
    Sorry, I should explain a bit. That’s our plan on paper. In reality it will be 28-30 in classrooms as normal. The 1m social distancing is a farcical dream that simply cannot be enforced, particularly outside the classroom. I can tell from the way management are talking that mask wearing is not going to be heavily policed either.

    It’s basically a normal return to school with a load of optics.

    Kids will be all over each other the second they walk out of the building anyway.

    No point getting worked up about keeping them exactly apart all day in school when they can do what they like when outside of school.

    All anyone can do is try their best, but getting caught up in it too much stresses everyone out and isn't doing anyone any favours.


  • #1929
    Mrsmum
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,860 ✭✭✭Mrsmum


    i_surge wrote: »
    Great resource there on the Danish and their approach worked. Limited mixing before and after school, outdoor classes if possible, limiting numbers present, at least 2m, hygiene, masks added later on.

    To your point, I wonder if most parents are unaware and assuming things will be up to scratch?

    I totally think they are. You might even say they are getting a false sense of security from looking forward to seeing you messages from the school.


  • #1930
    Purplewaters
    Closed Accounts Posts: 194 ✭✭Purplewaters


    Sunday Sunday wrote: »
    Kids will be all over each other the second they walk out of the building anyway.

    No point getting worked up about keeping them exactly apart all day in school when they can do what they like when outside of school.

    All anyone can do is try their best, but getting caught up in it too much stresses everyone out and isn't doing anyone any favours.




    Maybe your situation is different to the people who are very worried.


  • #1931
    khalessi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,216 ✭✭✭khalessi


    Sunday Sunday wrote: »
    Kids will be all over each other the second they walk out of the building anyway.

    No point getting worked up about keeping them exactly apart all day in school when they can do what they like when outside of school.

    All anyone can do is try their best, but getting caught up in it too much stresses everyone out and isn't doing anyone any favours.

    As has been said many times before here, what children do outside school is up to them, in school they have rules to obey and behaviour policies, so they will have to adhere to sd policies.


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  • #1932
    BonsaiKitten
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,798 ✭✭✭BonsaiKitten


    Purplewaters wrote: »
    All of that is true but schools cannot send parents messages saying we think this plan is wrong. We just can't. Unfortunately it needs to start with the parents. The plan is clear for anyone to read. Are parents OK with nodistancing in the classrooms? Especially under second its zero? And no masks? If not it needs to come from them. Teachers are contacting their own unions but they can't tell the parents how they're feeling. We will all be trying our best for everyone's sake to keep it safe but we can't work miracles.

    Plus even if we contact our unions, some unions are not engaging. I've emailed the INTO but they are on holidays (at the worst possible time) and I won't get a reply before school starts. The INTO (and the headJohn Boyle in particular) have badly let their members down during all this.


  • #1933
    Purplewaters
    Closed Accounts Posts: 194 ✭✭Purplewaters


    Mrsmum wrote: »
    I totally think they are. You might even say they are getting a false sense of security from looking forward to seeing you messages from the school.


    They are in a tough position. They can't say leave your kids at home, it's not safe.


  • #1934
    Purplewaters
    Closed Accounts Posts: 194 ✭✭Purplewaters


    BonsaiKitten wrote: »
    Plus even if we contact our unions, some unions are not engaging. I've emailed the INTO but they are on holidays (at the worst possible time) and I won't get a reply before school starts. The INTO (and the headJohn Boyle in particular) have badly let their members down during all this.

    Yep I agree. Feel it's too late now. The government won't say full reopening if safe. It's just full reopening will happen, repeated.


  • #1935
    Sunday Sunday
    Closed Accounts Posts: 187 ✭✭Sunday Sunday


    Purplewaters wrote: »
    All of that is true but schools cannot send parents messages saying we think this plan is wrong. We just can't. Unfortunately it needs to start with the parents. The plan is clear for anyone to read. Are parents OK with nodistancing in the classrooms? Especially under second its zero? And no masks? If not it needs to come from them. Teachers are contacting their own unions but they can't tell the parents how they're feeling. We will all be trying our best for everyone's sake to keep it safe but we can't work miracles.


    Most kids have been living their lives as usual for quite some time now.

    Without distancing or masks etc

    Any parents I know aren't too concerned about the details, to be honest realistically school will be the only place where the kids will be encountering many restrictions these days.


  • #1936
    i_surge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,093 ✭✭✭i_surge


    Purplewaters wrote: »
    They are in a tough position. They can't say leave your kids at home, it's not safe.

    I'm quite shocked to hear it going ahead with 1m distance not even possible and no reduction of numbers and a mixed bag of mask policies. The only way I know about it is from this place.


  • #1937
    Purplewaters
    Closed Accounts Posts: 194 ✭✭Purplewaters


    Sunday Sunday wrote: »
    Most kids have been living their lives as usual for quite some time now.

    Without distancing or masks etc

    Any parents I know aren't too concerned about the details, to be honest realistically school will be the only place where the kids will be encountering many restrictions these days.

    This fact actually makes schools more dangerous. The less distancign outside the more contacts each child has for contact tracing if there is cases. I don't understand how people think this is a good thing. If kids were told to restrict their movements like cocooners were then maybe it would be safer but that won't happen.


  • #1938
    Sunday Sunday
    Closed Accounts Posts: 187 ✭✭Sunday Sunday


    khalessi wrote: »
    As has been said many times before here, what children do outside school is up to them, in school they have rules to obey and behaviour policies, so they will have to adhere to sd policies.

    I'm just saying teachers shouldn't be sweating the small stuff too much, it's wasted efforts really.

    I wouldn't be happy to spend my day bending over backwards to keep kids apart and then see them hugging each other the minute they walk out of school, which is what will be happening.


  • #1939
    Purplewaters
    Closed Accounts Posts: 194 ✭✭Purplewaters


    Sunday Sunday wrote: »
    I'm just saying teachers shouldn't be sweating the small stuff too much, it's wasted efforts really.

    I wouldn't be happy to spend my day bending over backwards to keep kids apart and then see them hugging each other the minute they walk out of school, which is what will be happening.

    I suppose outbreaks in the class put every other child, child's family, and teacher ans teacher's family at risk. That is why they are trying.


  • #1940
    smellyoldboot
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,075 ✭✭✭smellyoldboot


    Sunday Sunday wrote: »
    Most kids have been living their lives as usual for quite some time now.

    Without distancing or masks etc

    Any parents I know aren't too concerned about the details, to be honest realistically school will be the only place where the kids will be encountering many restrictions these days.

    Its exactly that reason why I won't be in a hurry to send my one back to school. Some of us have been following guidance and restrictions for the duration of this thing. And then there are others....

    School just forces the children from responsible well behaving people into the company of what in some cases are absolute dregs, mammy and/or daddy have been drinking and partying their way through lock down, no distancing etc. And others who are just too important to get the virus so they didn't bother following any rules.

    This isn't normally too much of an issue as the worst you would get is lice or a tummy bug. But the game has changed more than a little now.


  • #1941
    Blondini
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭Blondini


    Sunday Sunday wrote: »
    Most kids have been living their lives as usual for quite some time now.

    Without distancing or masks etc

    Any parents I know aren't too concerned about the details, to be honest realistically school will be the only place where the kids will be encountering many restrictions these days.

    Welcome back. ;)


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  • #1942
    Jinglejangle69
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,136 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    smellyoldboot wrote: »
    Its exactly that reason why I won't be in a hurry to send my one back to school. Some of us have been following guidance and restrictions for the duration of this thing. And then there are others....

    School just forces the children from responsible well behaving people into the company of what in some cases are absolute dregs, mammy and/or daddy have been drinking and partying their way through lock down, no distancing etc. And others who are just too important to get the virus so they didn't bother following any rules.

    This isn't normally too much of an issue as the worst you would get is lice or a tummy bug. But the game has changed more than a little now.

    Well done for making a responsible choice.

    That's totally your decision.

    Just respect other people's decisions.


  • #1943
    isup
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 649 ✭✭✭isup


    Sunday Sunday wrote: »
    Most kids have been living their lives as usual for quite some time now.

    Without distancing or masks etc

    Any parents I know aren't too concerned about the details, to be honest realistically school will be the only place where the kids will be encountering many restrictions these days.

    I'm quite surprised that most parents I see or know are not getting their kids to distance or wash hands and so on. Which is another reason i don't feel comfortable about them going back and mixing closely and being indoors for long periods. Also for my kids it will be a big change . Going from keeping distance, not going into shops or playgrounds to or seeing friends indoors to being in close proximity to kids for long periods. It will send mixed messages. And also probably divide some kids .
    Are the teachers going to explain the situation to the kids and the risks involved or are the government not allowing that? I hear kids saying that they can't catch the virus which means you will have lots of kids with different ideas of what's safe and what's not


  • #1944
    wirelessdude01
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,445 ✭✭✭wirelessdude01


    Sunday Sunday wrote: »
    Most kids have been living their lives as usual for quite some time now.

    Without distancing or masks etc

    Any parents I know aren't too concerned about the details, to be honest realistically school will be the only place where the kids will be encountering many restrictions these days.

    This sounds very like a very prominent previous poster on here.


  • #1945
    Blondini
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭Blondini


    wirelessdude01 wrote: »
    This sounds very like a very prominent previous poster on here.
    With a very prominent hairstyle!


  • #1946
    i_surge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,093 ✭✭✭i_surge


    Sunday Sunday wrote: »
    I'm just saying teachers shouldn't be sweating the small stuff too much, it's wasted efforts really.

    I wouldn't be happy to spend my day bending over backwards to keep kids apart and then see them hugging each other the minute they walk out of school, which is what will be happening.

    One huge difference is the maths of it when you look at the network effects of kids playing with their mates vs. an entire school of these subgroups then add the interactions at home.

    It could probably be modelled to find the safe goldilocks number of students. I'm dreaming and fantasising now about a world where people don't embrace doing the wrong thing so easily.


  • #1947
    jrosen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭jrosen


    Parents I have spoken to are satisfied with what they have been told by their schools (secondary) as am I.

    We cant keep schools closed or kids out and there has been nothing set up to actually provide an education to students remotely. So there isn't really the option for blended learning. Certainly not now.

    I think if there had been parents would be more open to the idea of a blended approach but for many parents, its into school or not much else. I accept some schools were doing a great job but others were not.


  • #1948
    Sunday Sunday
    Closed Accounts Posts: 187 ✭✭Sunday Sunday


    jrosen wrote: »
    Parents I have spoken to are satisfied with what they have been told by their schools (secondary) as am I.

    We cant keep schools closed or kids out and there has been nothing set up to actually provide an education to students remotely. So there isn't really the option for blended learning. Certainly not now.

    I think if there had been parents would be more open to the idea of a blended approach but for many parents, its into school or not much else. I accept some schools were doing a great job but others were not.

    What changes have your school made for secondary if you don't mind me asking? Interested in finding out the approaches as haven't heard anything from ours and not sure what to expect.


  • #1949
    Sunday Sunday
    Closed Accounts Posts: 187 ✭✭Sunday Sunday


    :confused:
    wirelessdude01 wrote: »
    This sounds very like a very prominent previous poster on here.


  • #1950
    Bright n Breezy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9 ✭Bright n Breezy


    If teachers are looking for the backing of parents where do parents make their voice heard...

    I'm not happy with my children being guinea pigs, will the government return to the dail after their holidays?? I think not, they will remain in the convention centre. I think its a crying shame that the government care so little for both the children of Ireland and their families.

    I am in the lucky position that I don't work so I can provide childcare for my children but there are plenty of families who rely on granny and grandad to do school drops and pick ups, what has happened in the last 6 months that its ok all of a sudden to make grand parents lambs to the slaughter collecting the children from a petri dish of germs and viruses..

    It just doesn't make any sense the whole lot of it...


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  • #1951
    caveat emptor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,134 ✭✭✭caveat emptor


    It kinda feels like the options are
    • send them
    • hope they don't get it
    • wait for school to be shut down
    • isolate

    or
    • don't send them
    • isolate

    Not great options really. Would be great if there some plans to actually confront the virus which hasn't gone away.


This discussion has been closed.
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