How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

s1ippy · 11-08-2020 05:28PM

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/co-meath-creche-closes-after-five-covid-19-cases-confirmed-1.4327506

A Co Meath creche has been temporarily closed after five Covid-19 cases were confirmed.

Three children and two staff members at the Daoine Óga Community Childcare Centre in Navan tested positive for the disease in the past week.

Management had closed three of the creche’s eight rooms in response to the cluster, but the entire centre has now closed following a recommendation from a public health officer. The centre is to reopen on August 18th.

The three affected children were said to be asymptomatic while the two adults have demonstrated mild Covid-19 symptoms. Children using the creche had been split into pods of up to eight since it reopened in June.

Local Sinn Féin councillor Eddie Fennessy is awaiting results for his two-year old son, Ned, who has underlying health issues and was tested at a centre in Slane on Monday.

“The outbreak is in a creche where scores of children attend daily so the potential for mass transmission is high,” he said. “I’m not qualified to give a medical assessment on how to manage a pandemic but I can tell you one thing for sure – it is downright dangerous for almost a week to pass before you test people who’ve been in direct contact with an infected person.”

Maynooth University immunologist Prof Paul Moynagh said delays in testing some children at the centre were “concerning” .

Prof Moynagh said waiting almost a week to test close contacts of confirmed cases meant the process would be of “little or no value”.

“It is very concerning if direct contacts of confirmed cases are not being immediately contacted and tested as part of the test and trace system operated by the HSE,” he said. “If the test and trace system is not done with speed, it is wholly ineffective.”

The creche’s chief executive Marie Daly said parents and staff were notified of the decision to close on Monday evening.

“We have always followed all guidelines and advice given to us from all the relevant bodies since the first staff member tested positive, and we have always kept staff and parents up to date with the situation,” she said, adding that it was “extremely devastating” news after investing in protective equipment and other Covid-19 measures.

“We have done everything we can to try and stop this virus coming into this building and the worrying thing is that all the children who contracted the virus are asymptomatic. Everyone is worried but the parents and pre-school inspectors have been extremely supportive to us.”

The HSE said it could not comment on individual cases or outbreaks as it would breach its duty of confidentiality to the individuals concerned.

In a statement it said that if HSE public health staff determine there is an outbreak, a control team is convened to advise on control measures. The HSE said there is no delay in testing GP referred cases.

bettyoleary · 11-08-2020 05:32PM

s1ippy wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/co-meath-creche-closes-after-five-covid-19-cases-confirmed-1.4327506

Id say you will find less and less teachers arguing on here anymore. Because unless your prepared to say. I dont give a fk about teachers or my kids, I want them out of my hair, you wouldnt even be posting on here. Its not safe to send kids back to school. Its putting lives at risk. If anyone can prove differently. Ill give them 1k.

teachinggal123 · 11-08-2020 05:34PM

I’ve just heard someone in the know saying it’s likely that the lockdown may be extended for 4 more weeks in Kildare/Laois/Offaly. This will mean the schools won’t be going back until the end of Sept or into October.

Things getting serious now. It’s not safe for teachers or kids to go back yet.

s1ippy · 11-08-2020 05:34PM

Baseless speculation.

teachinggal123 · 11-08-2020 05:35PM

s1ippy wrote: »

Baseless speculation.

Maybe, but it is possible

TheValeyard · 11-08-2020 05:35PM

teachinggal123 wrote: »

I’ve just heard someone in the know saying it’s likely that the lockdown may be extended for 4 more weeks in Kildare/Laois/Offaly. This will mean the schools won’t be going back until the end of Sept or into October.

Things getting serious now.

I've been talking with few friends in those schools and schools are still intending to open at the end of Aug.

Edit: to the PMs. Current response from North Kildare schools is to reopen. But that could change.

Mrsmum · 11-08-2020 05:36PM

bettyoleary wrote: »

Id say you will find less and less teachers arguing on here anymore. Because unless your prepared to say. I dont give a fk about teachers or my kids, I want them out of my hair, you wouldnt even be posting on here. Its not safe to send kids back to school. Its putting lives at risk. If anyone can prove differently. Ill give them 1k.

So what do you say to teachers sending their kids to school ?

wirelessdude01 · 11-08-2020 05:36PM

teachinggal123 wrote: »

I’ve just heard someone in the know saying it’s likely that the lockdown may be extended for 4 more weeks in Kildare/Laois/Offaly. This will mean the schools won’t be going back until the end of Sept or into October.

Things getting serious now. It’s not safe for teachers or kids to go back yet.

Was discussed on Morning Ireland this morning. I'll find the link.

https://www.midlands103.com/news/midlands-news/immunology-expert-suggests-local-lockdown-could-last-6-weeks/

The Wordress · 11-08-2020 06:08PM

I was so positive about a month ago about our return to school. Now, I am as nervous as feck. I do not want to be sending my own children out to these petri dishes of germs. I do not want my pupils to be guinea pigs either.

At the minute, I think it's mankind against the virus.

I think everything else is secondary at the minute.

downthemiddle · 11-08-2020 06:30PM

khalessi wrote: »

Have similar set up
More than 2 class groups each year and each year group a bubble with over 100 children and then as SET I am already in 3 confirmed bubbles and more depending on sick leave.

Re the masks I am wearing one regardless of school viewpoint.

All school staff are obligated to wear face coverings.

wirelessdude01 · 11-08-2020 06:33PM

downthemiddle wrote: »

All school staff are obligated to wear face coverings.

Only if they are within 2m of others. Similar applies to students at secondary.
This was our interpretation of the circular.

Mad that these bloody things are left to individual schools to interpret.

downthemiddle · 11-08-2020 06:34PM

teachinggal123 wrote: »

To be fair, the constant posts telling me how unhappy I must be and that I need to move schools/career is whats pulling the thread off topic.

I have replied honestly and given detail of *my own* experiences. I will continue to do that without personally insulting anyone.

You have used your own experiences to make assumptions about other teachers. Your experiences are not related to the thread title. Your "experiences" are insulting to the thousands of dedicated teachers who have done their utmost for the students in their care.

khalessi · 11-08-2020 06:34PM

downthemiddle wrote: »

All school staff are obligated to wear face coverings.

Thinking this will do the trick

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Zorb-Ball-Zorbing-PVC-Adults/dp/B00SG1Y6R8

lulublue22 · 11-08-2020 06:36PM

downthemiddle wrote: »

All school staff are obligated to wear face coverings.

Hi can you clarify that - I thought guidelines indicated masks in primary only if 2 m SD can’t be maintained.

lulublue22 · 11-08-2020 06:38PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Only if they are within 2m of others. Similar applies to students at secondary.
This was our interpretation of the circular.

Mad that these bloody things are left to individual schools to interpret.

That was our interpretation also.

downthemiddle · 11-08-2020 06:40PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Only if they are within 2m of others. Similar applies to students at secondary.
This was our interpretation of the circular.

Mad that these bloody things are left to individual schools to interpret.

Sorry, you are correct
https://www.education.ie/en/Press-Events/Press-Releases/2020-press-releases/PR20-08-07.html
It is now recommended that teachers and secondary school students wear face coverings, similar to those worn in shops or on public transport, when a physical distance of 2 metres cannot be maintained.

teachinggal123 · 11-08-2020 06:41PM

downthemiddle wrote: »

You have used your own experiences to make assumptions about other teachers.

As has every other poster on this thread.

khalessi · 11-08-2020 06:41PM

Well it was said prior to holidays when I mentioned mask wearing, that there was no point in us wearing masks if everyone didnt wear it. My approach to that is as a nurse I worked with infectious diseases and I wore a mask while the patient didnt and I did not catch anything. There is no way 2m distance can be maintained so mask it is.

downthemiddle · 11-08-2020 06:43PM

teachinggal123 wrote: »

As has every other poster on this thread.

Throw away the spade.

teachinggal123 · 11-08-2020 06:45PM

downthemiddle wrote: »

Throw away the spade.

Please stop dragging the thread off topic. There was a good conversation going until you couldn’t resist getting another dig in.

/edit/ actually, forget it - I’m not engaging any more - carry on

Murple · 11-08-2020 06:49PM

teachinggal123 wrote: »

I’ve just heard someone in the know saying it’s likely that the lockdown may be extended for 4 more weeks in Kildare/Laois/Offaly. This will mean the schools won’t be going back until the end of Sept or into October.

Things getting serious now. It’s not safe for teachers or kids to go back yet.

It’s not full lockdown though. People are permitted to travel for work. Crèches and preschools are allowed to continue operating. It’s mainly socialising that has been curtailed with the closing of pubs, restaurants, gyms, cinemas etc. I would say they may continue with these measures but go ahead with opening schools.
There’s a fair amount of teachers working in Dublin but living in Kildare as they wouldn’t be able to afford Dublin prices. They will still have to travel to work.

I have a feeling that, like Boris, the government are determined to open schools and keep them open even if other things are shut down again. Their ‘plan’ for reopening schools has clearly been based on the idea that children don’t spread the virus, don’t get it easily and when they do, don’t get ill. The fact that this theory has been seriously called into question is being ignored.

gabeeg · 11-08-2020 06:49PM

I assume there's an open all windows and doors policy?

downthemiddle · 11-08-2020 06:57PM

teachinggal123 wrote: »

Please stop dragging the thread off topic. There was a good conversation going until you couldn’t resist getting another dig in.

/edit/ actually, forget it - I’m not engaging any more - carry on

teachinggal123 wrote: »

Yeah, the really intelligent ones spend all day on discussion forums.

teachinggal123 wrote: »

This is 100% correct. It’s madness fully reopening schools in September 2020.

Stay fully closed until January 2021 and then reevaluate. A partial opening at best Jan-June 2021 if things go well.

Aim to fully reopen ONLY AFTER A VACCINE hopefully in September 2021.

teachinggal123 wrote: »

To be fair, the constant posts telling me how unhappy I must be and that I need to move schools/career is whats pulling the thread off topic.

I have replied honestly and given detail of *my own* experiences. I will continue to do that without personally insulting anyone.

At this stage it is clear that you are on the wind up or on the road to martyrdom.

Murple · 11-08-2020 08:25PM

gabeeg wrote: »

I assume there's an open all windows and doors policy?

As far as possible but it won’t always be possible or practical e.g. open doors in a junior infant room are pretty much an invitation to a child to make a run for it. With some children with special needs, again there’s a flight risk so the classroom door needs to be kept closed.
When the weather is okay, open windows are fine but I know from all the classrooms I’ve taught in, certain weather types will mean windows will have to closed to avoid the place being flooded or the ceiling lifting off. Plus there are classrooms where it’s not warm in the winter even with doors and windows closed so children will have to be wearing multiple extra layers plus hats and gloves to stay warm if the windows are to be opened. Of course you then have prefab dwellers where there may only be small windows, sometimes with a metal grate for security reasons that prevents the window opening more than a crack. Yes, that is 21st century Irish school buildings!

ceadaoin. · 11-08-2020 09:58PM

Well my child went back to school yesterday here. Safety measures in place are

-mandatory masks for students and teachers,
-social distancing. For example my daughter told me they played tag on their lunchbreak but were given pool noodles to do the tagging lol
-extra cleaning, they even wipe down their backpacks on entry
-temperature checks before entering in the morning
-drive thru drop off and pick up only, no parents allowed on campus
-no communal lunches, they stay in their classroom.
-regular hand washing breaks throughout the day. Hand washing on the way out at the end of the day

I sent her back because I'm happy that these measures will limit the spread and weighed up the risks against the fact that not seeing another kid since march was starting to have an effect on her. Class sizes are small anyway (10-15 per class) so hopefully everyone stays safe. There is also the option of online only but only 1 child in the class if doing this. Obviously, based on how it goes I will review whether we should stick with the in person for the year

gabeeg · 11-08-2020 10:00PM

Murple wrote: »

As far as possible but it won’t always be possible or practical e.g. open doors in a junior infant room are pretty much an invitation to a child to make a run for it. With some children with special needs, again there’s a flight risk so the classroom door needs to be kept closed.
When the weather is okay, open windows are fine but I know from all the classrooms I’ve taught in, certain weather types will mean windows will have to closed to avoid the place being flooded or the ceiling lifting off. Plus there are classrooms where it’s not warm in the winter even with doors and windows closed so children will have to be wearing multiple extra layers plus hats and gloves to stay warm if the windows are to be opened. Of course you then have prefab dwellers where there may only be small windows, sometimes with a metal grate for security reasons that prevents the window opening more than a crack. Yes, that is 21st century Irish school buildings!

Jesus. I don't envy you.

I'm no expert, obviously, but from what I've read if you open just the one window then the child/children nearest to it will be at the biggest disadvantage as any virus in room will pass by them constantly on its way out.

I can try to dig a link out if you're interested

gabeeg · 11-08-2020 10:02PM

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Well my child went back to school yesterday here. Safety measures in place are

-mandatory masks for students and teachers,
-social distancing. For example my daughter told me they played tag on their lunchbreak but were given pool noodles to do the tagging lol
-extra cleaning, they even wipe down their backpacks on entry
-temperature checks before entering in the morning
-drive thru drop off and pick up only, no parents allowed on campus
-no communal lunches, they stay in their classroom.
-regular hand washing breaks throughout the day. Hand washing on the way out at the end of the day

I sent her back because I'm happy that these measures will limit the spread and weighed up the risks against the fact that not seeing another kid since march was starting to have an effect on her. Class sizes are small anyway (10-15 per class) so hopefully everyone stays safe. There is also the option of online only but only 1 child in the class if doing this. Obviously, based on how it goes I will review whether we should stick with the in person for the year

Where's here?

On the face of it, it sounds pretty good

ceadaoin. · 11-08-2020 10:11PM

gabeeg wrote: »

Where's here?

On the face of it, it sounds pretty good

The US, state is seeing a sustained drop in cases but still around 600-700 new cases a day. Masks have been mandatory everywhere for a while now and it seems to be working.

Its a small private school with less than 200 students in total. If it was a huge school then I probably wouldn't send her back and definitely not without some measures in place. if we turn into Florida and start seeing thousands of cases a day then I'll take her out. Public schools will be starting online only which honestly i think will have way more long term effects, especially on poorer students, than the low risk of the virus in younger kids.

lulublue22 · 11-08-2020 10:38PM

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Well my child went back to school yesterday here. Safety measures in place are

-mandatory masks for students and teachers,
-social distancing. For example my daughter told me they played tag on their lunchbreak but were given pool noodles to do the tagging lol
-extra cleaning, they even wipe down their backpacks on entry
-temperature checks before entering in the morning
-drive thru drop off and pick up only, no parents allowed on campus
-no communal lunches, they stay in their classroom.
-regular hand washing breaks throughout the day. Hand washing on the way out at the end of the day

I sent her back because I'm happy that these measures will limit the spread and weighed up the risks against the fact that not seeing another kid since march was starting to have an effect on her. Class sizes are small anyway (10-15 per class) so hopefully everyone stays safe. There is also the option of online only but only 1 child in the class if doing this. Obviously, based on how it goes I will review whether we should stick with the in person for the year

TBH I would be happy with those steps. On the other hand we are hell bent on sending all children back with the following provisions -

Masks are not mandatory in primary school.
SD in theory but class numbers make it difficult in reality.
No temp checks
No facility for drive tru type drop off.
Class size in and around 30 so between 2 - 3 times the volume of children per class than your example.

ceadaoin. · 11-08-2020 10:52PM

lulublue22 wrote: »

TBH I would be happy with those steps. On the other hand we are hell bent on sending all children back with the following provisions -

Masks are not mandatory in primary school.
SD in theory but class numbers make it difficult in reality.
No temp checks
No facility for drive tru type drop off.
Class size in and around 30 so between 2 - 3 times the volume of children per class than your example.

Yeah masks and temp checks are the very least that should be done, especially if space or funding makes it difficult to implement other measures. Keeping kids out of school until a vaccine isn't an option.

How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

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