How will schools be able to go back in September?

joe40 · 21-07-2020 08:54PM

Mrsmum wrote: »

Would it help at all in these exceptional times to allow 5th and 6th years do five rather than seven subjects. (I think I'm right in saying our students study more subjects than in other countries.)They could all choose their best five and that would mean less students in at least some, if not all, classrooms, therefore safer for everyone, shorter school day also. And obviously the LC exam would be based on that ??

I'm beginning to come to the opinion that the next few weeks, at least Sept /Oct won't be exceptional times anymore it will be the new normal for the foreseeable future.
There may not be any vaccines developed, we might just have to live with this virus like any other.
Better hand washing, social distancing, reduced international travel will all help.
I'm saying this as a teacher and a parent, I think schools need to reopen in September and we need to get back to a semblance of normal. Education is a mainstay of our society.

If further restrictions for 6 months would help I would fully support that but at this stage what difference will 6 months make. The same issues will exist then.

wirelessdude01 · 21-07-2020 08:59PM

joe40 wrote: »

I'm beginning to come to the opinion that the next few weeks, at least Sept /Oct won't be exceptional times anymore it will be the new normal for the foreseeable future.
There may not be any vaccines developed, we might just have to live with this virus like any other.
Better hand washing, social distancing, reduced international travel will all help.
I'm saying this as a teacher and a parent, I think schools need to reopen in September and we need to get back to a semblance of normal. Education is a mainstay of our society.

If further restrictions for 6 months would help I would fully support that but at this stage what difference will 6 months make. The same issues will exist then.

I think what most of us teachers on here want is some semblance of a plan of action from the department. I want to go back to the school building with some/all of my class Infront of me. Inorder for that to happen the department need to be proactive.

I'm sick of people everywhere telling me that I should be sorting things out. I'm just the bloody teacher. I have ZERO influence on policy or what happens. Kids sit Infront of me and I teach them. End of.

Mrsmum · 21-07-2020 09:16PM

joe40 wrote: »

I'm beginning to come to the opinion that the next few weeks, at least Sept /Oct won't be exceptional times anymore it will be the new normal for the foreseeable future.
There may not be any vaccines developed, we might just have to live with this virus like any other.
Better hand washing, social distancing, reduced international travel will all help.
I'm saying this as a teacher and a parent, I think schools need to reopen in September and we need to get back to a semblance of normal. Education is a mainstay of our society.

If further restrictions for 6 months would help I would fully support that but at this stage what difference will 6 months make. The same issues will exist then.

With respect, I can't see how your response addresses the merits or opposite of my actual suggestion at all. It's just I'm starting to feel in order to hold on to what would have been the norm before Covid, we will make a pure hash of it and that it might be better to cut our cloth to what might be more doable in the current circumstances. That's not to minimise the importance of education at all. But we are told classrooms won't be safe so senior cycle students may end up learning at home (rubbish system) so might it not be better to explore a suggestion to lessen the number of students in each classroom and to lessen the school day. without disadvantaging anyone If students are doing five instead of seven subjects all those aims are covered.

the corpo · 21-07-2020 09:26PM

“ Meanwhile, Ms Foley told a briefing of Opposition spokespeople on Tuesday that there would be clarity on the plans to reopen schools in August and September before July 31. TDs were also told that the Department would centrally procure all protective equipment and screens for schools that will have to enforce social distancing measures.”

So no news for a while yet

morebabies · 21-07-2020 09:28PM

Two big obstacles to the full reopening of schools we keep hearing about:

- it's only now we're discovering that covid 19 has serious side effects that can last months. Health care workers with PPE are still suffering - is it fair to expose teachers to that in an even less hygienic environment? Of course not.

- the expected surge of cases with the easing of lockdown has begun - and we're only in July. Imagine this alongside flu season and seasonal viruses.

My only proposed solution would be to plan for the worst, get a solid online curriculum to be made available if necessary, back it up with comprehensive notes to be posted to students with no or limited Internet access and some kind of real follow up for any students not engaging. I'm sure my plan is flawed in some way, but I just wish we would hear something more productive from the Department.

lulublue22 · 21-07-2020 09:32PM

There is good progress being made with the oxford vaccine. All going well ( and fair enough that’s a big ask ) they are looking at the middle of next year in terms of distribution. They are presently at stage 3 or close enough to starting. Interview today on CNN was very positive. While this in no way indicates how schools will look in Sep nor address the issue of covid flare up over winter. It is at least a positive in the sea if doom and gloom. Perhaps there is an end in sight after all.

wirelessdude01 · 21-07-2020 09:35PM

the corpo wrote: »

“ Meanwhile, Ms Foley told a briefing of Opposition spokespeople on Tuesday that there would be clarity on the plans to reopen schools in August and September before July 31. TDs were also told that the Department would centrally procure all protective equipment and screens for schools that will have to enforce social distancing measures.”

So no news for a while yet

Either they have this stockpiled already or there is gonna be a great shortage.

Think the Friday of the August bank holiday is looking good for that announcement. Predict it is gonna provide more questions than answers and those questions will fall on deaf ears as all the relevant people will be gone on holidays. Will be left up to schools themselves to try and decipher what is required from some gobbledegook circular with a promise of an IOU to be repaid at an indeterminable date in the future.

downthemiddle · 21-07-2020 09:36PM

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

I really don't know how teachers would work for a department that has these deeply ingrained issues, it's not something I could do myself in good conscience. It must be very frustrating for newly appointed teachers to realise they are working for a sector that's, let's face it, a poorly organised dinosaur.

There were no need for the clarification that you couldn't be a teacher.
Why is it frustrating for newly appointed teachers and not more experienced ones?

mirrorwall14 · 21-07-2020 09:48PM

the corpo wrote: »

“ Meanwhile, Ms Foley told a briefing of Opposition spokespeople on Tuesday that there would be clarity on the plans to reopen schools in August and September before July 31. TDs were also told that the Department would centrally procure all protective equipment and screens for schools that will have to enforce social distancing measures.”

So no news for a while yet

At least it clarifies we might actually get some protective equipment and screens.....

wirelessdude01 · 21-07-2020 09:49PM

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/parents-alerted-after-childcare-worker-diagnosed-with-covid-19-but-creche-remains-opens-39386417.html

mirrorwall14 · 21-07-2020 10:00PM

the corpo wrote: »

“ Meanwhile, Ms Foley told a briefing of Opposition spokespeople on Tuesday that there would be clarity on the plans to reopen schools in August and September before July 31. TDs were also told that the Department would centrally procure all protective equipment and screens for schools that will have to enforce social distancing measures.”

So no news for a while yet

Actually rereading that. ‘For schools that will have to enforce’... what schools won’t have to enforce?

joe40 · 21-07-2020 10:01PM

Mrsmum wrote: »

With respect, I can't see how your response addresses the merits or opposite of my actual suggestion at all. It's just I'm starting to feel in order to hold on to what would have been the norm before Covid, we will make a pure hash of it and that it might be better to cut our cloth to what might be more doable in the current circumstances. That's not to minimise the importance of education at all. But we are told classrooms won't be safe so senior cycle students may end up learning at home (rubbish system) so might it not be better to explore a suggestion to lessen the number of students in each classroom and to lessen the school day. without disadvantaging anyone If students are doing five instead of seven subjects all those aims are covered.

Sorry I wasn't knocking your idea it may well be helpful. Reduced hours in school may help.
I was just making the point that I think the measures in place for the next stage Sept/ Oct time, whatever they are, will have to be in place over the longer term. Several years perhaps.

Whatever that is whether it is PPE in classrooms, online lessons etc we will have to accept this as the new normal. The virus isn't going away, and vaccines are a long way off.

I think the best we can hope for are improved treatment for serious cases as doctors worldwide learn more.

r93kaey5p2izun · 21-07-2020 10:01PM

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

Actually rereading that. ‘For schools that will have to enforce’... what schools won’t have to enforce?

Junior schools up to 2nd class.

mirrorwall14 · 21-07-2020 10:03PM

Yosef Stocky Backspace wrote: »

Junior schools up to 2nd class.

Ah of course. Blonde moment sorry. And I have a senior infant child lol

iamwhoiam · 21-07-2020 10:12PM

Yosef Stocky Backspace wrote: »

Junior schools up to 2nd class.

Am I right in saying schools for children with special needs also ?

ldy4mxonucwsq6 · 21-07-2020 10:12PM

downthemiddle wrote: »

There were no need for the clarification that you couldn't be a teacher.
Why is it frustrating for newly appointed teachers and not more experienced ones?

No I definitely couldn't be a teacher, it would drive me crazy to be managed by a department that is clearly completely inept as has been stated by teachers many times here. That and having no real autonomy in my job wouldn't be for me.

The more experienced teachers already know the score and are very well used to it. Whereas the newly appointed ones coming in full of zest, enthusiasm and new ideas have no clue yet what they'll be up against.

Its the same in many companies where there's a problem with company culture and its a big cause of staff retention issues.

mcsean2163 · 21-07-2020 11:46PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

I think what most of us teachers on here want is some semblance of a plan of action from the department. I want to go back to the school building with some/all of my class Infront of me. Inorder for that to happen the department need to be proactive.

I'm sick of people everywhere telling me that I should be sorting things out. I'm just the bloody teacher. I have ZERO influence on policy or what happens. Kids sit Infront of me and I teach them. End of.

To suggest that teachers have no agency is.... sad.

Murple · 22-07-2020 12:02AM

Yosef Stocky Backspace wrote: »

Junior schools up to 2nd class.

All schools will have to enforce social distancing measures as no school is just made up of children. Social distancing will have to be enforced between staff, visitors and parents.
It also seems a bit of a joke that children in a creche must be in small pods and not mix with other pods but the plan is to have a free for all once they are in the early years of primary school.

wirelessdude01 · 22-07-2020 12:16AM

mcsean2163 wrote: »

To suggest that teachers have no agency is.... sad.

What are you spoofing about now?

FishOnABike · 22-07-2020 01:51AM

Murple wrote: »

All schools will have to enforce social distancing measures as no school is just made up of children. Social distancing will have to be enforced between staff, visitors and parents.
It also seems a bit of a joke that children in a creche must be in small pods and not mix with other pods but the plan is to have a free for all once they are in the early years of primary school.

Social distancing will also be needed between children. They are not immune to CoViD-19. Research¹ has shown children as young as 10 are as likely, if not more likely, to transmit the virus. Younger children are less likely to transmit the virus though it is unclear if this would be counteracted by the increased difficulty in younger children following hygiene and social distancing guidelines.

Schools cannot safely ignore the potential for pupils to be a vector for CoViD-19.

¹ https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/18/health/coronavirus-children-schools.html?smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur

heldel00 · 22-07-2020 04:22AM

Murple wrote: »

All schools will have to enforce social distancing measures as no school is just made up of children. Social distancing will have to be enforced between staff, visitors and parents.
It also seems a bit of a joke that children in a creche must be in small pods and not mix with other pods but the plan is to have a free for all once they are in the early years of primary school.

There is no correlation between preschool and creches, and primary schools. One is under guidance of HSE and other is told to "give it a go and see how you get on" by Dept of Ed.
Children in preschool would come from ratio of 1:6 and then 8 weeks later 1:25 plus in Junior Infant classroom.
It's crazy.

inatissy · 22-07-2020 08:13AM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I agree with most of your post but while asking people to stop slagging off teachers you need to be careful not to slag off parents
The vast majority of parents I know can be trusted not to send a child with a temp to school . So Yes , parents in the whole can be trusted , a small majority maybe not
We need to be careful not to lump all parents into one group just as we need to be careful not to lump all teachers into one group

Yeah totally agree, didnt mean for it to come across that way. 99% of parents are great, I also understand that they are in a tough position. They need to work etc. Thanka.

Hubertj · 22-07-2020 08:18AM

mcsean2163 wrote: »

To suggest that teachers have no agency is.... sad.

I’ve read a number of your posts and I’m sorry to say that you are talking too much common sense for this thread. I hope the type of teachers that post in here are in a minority across the education sector. If they spent half as much time on their job as they do posting on boards something might be accomplished.

mcsean2163 · 22-07-2020 08:30AM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

What are you spoofing about now?

##I'm sick of people everywhere telling me that I should be sorting things out. I'm just the bloody teacher. I have ZERO influence on policy or what happens. Kids sit Infront of me and I teach them. End of.##

Contrary to your statement I believe teachers have a voice. Teachers can contact their union, TDs and even parents of students if they feel strongly enough. I was encouraged to contact the government here and I did, I wrote to Joe McHugh. If you feel strongly enough you can do similar.

Blondini · 22-07-2020 08:38AM

Hubertj wrote: »

If they spent half as much time on their job as they do posting on boards something might be accomplished.

I'm a teacher. You've more posts in 3 months than I have in 10 years.

Take care.

Lillyfae · 22-07-2020 08:48AM

Blondini wrote: »

I'm a teacher. You've more posts in 3 months than I have in 10 years.

Take care.

Maybe they're retired? Or in receipt of a PUP because they're unable to work? They're not claiming to be putting in 14 hour days teaching online while simultaneously posting inane comments in this thread every 5 minutes.

Blondini · 22-07-2020 08:55AM

Lillyfae wrote: »

They're not claiming to be putting in 14 hour days teaching online while simultaneously posting inane comments in this thread every 5 minutes.

I'm a teacher. You've more posts in 23 months than I have in 10 years.

Take care

alroley · 22-07-2020 09:14AM

Hubertj wrote: »

If they spent half as much time on their job as they do posting on boards something might be accomplished.

Says the person with over 500 posts in 3 months.

Wanderer78 · 22-07-2020 09:17AM

This crÃ¨che situation is worrying, is there any cases of kids getting this thing?

Lillyfae · 22-07-2020 09:24AM

Wanderer78 wrote: »

This crèche situation is worrying, is there any cases of kids getting this thing?

I've seen a very vague report on it but if that's all the information there is then it's really not enough to warrant being worried. Questions that come to my mind are:

When did the worker test positive? Was it since they went back to work?
Was the worker at work in the last few weeks? (one could assume that they were but this hasn't been explicitly stated)
Were they at particular risk of contracting the virus? (ie travelled to a country with higher number of cases/ in close contact with someone who has/had the virus)
Did they continue to work while showing symptoms?
Has contact tracing been completed for the infected worker?

How will schools be able to go back in September?

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