Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - Read OP for Mod Warnings

average_runner · 04-06-2020 09:51AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Those are the same people who vote that govt is lifting restrictions too quickly and are afraid to go to back to work cus "fears of covid"?

You are right, messed up society.

Using "fears of covid" as an excuse as they are attending house parties and drinking in their streets, hanging out in groups.

One of them is a friend of our family, wants to enjoy her summer off on 350 a week

Stark · 04-06-2020 09:52AM

average_runner wrote: »

One of them is a friend of our family, wants to enjoy her summer off on 350 a week

Luckily that payments being reduced soon (for part-time workers to begin with, followed by full-time at some point). Will be interesting to see survey results then.

Pete_Cavan · 04-06-2020 09:53AM

is_that_so wrote: »

AdamD wrote: »

And yet we will never know what constitutes enough progress..

We do, Phase 2 is coming right up. You need to parse what the CMO says for actual meaning. There has been no "we are not in a a position" or "concern" for about a week and a half and the disease is under control and behaving as they would like. Even the demeanour is far more relaxed.

It seems as though moving from one Phase to the next is based on reaching a set date (which has no medical relevance) on the calendar rather than any actual statistic on the virus. I don't know how anyone can find that reassuring.

average_runner · 04-06-2020 09:55AM

Deleted User wrote: »

what if someone wants to go from Gorey to Fethard?

Well if its essential then do it. Only that person knows if it has to be done.
I had to rush to Wexford from Dublin last week to bring a parent the hospital.
But i have been in my locale for the last 3 months

Penfailed · 04-06-2020 09:59AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

but anyways this Sweden stuff is way off topic

Oh please. You have been using Sweden to back up your stance from the start yet any time there are facts coming from Sweden that go against your narrative, it's "off topic."

Ginger n Lemon · 04-06-2020 10:02AM

Penfailed wrote: »

Oh please. You have been using Sweden to back up your stance from the start yet any time there are facts coming from Sweden that go against your narrative, it's "off topic."

Oh please you havent posted anything of meaning in this thread for weeks if not months, called out numerous times now too.

All you do is attack individual posts, although attack is a strong word. Just gibberish about half a sentence lol.

Chill pill :rolleyes:

KrustyUCC · 04-06-2020 10:11AM

average_runner wrote: »

That was always the plan. They had to go with the emergency plan first, now things are clearing up they can reduce it.

What is happening and I know a few people doing it, they are refusing to go to work as they are better off on the 350 per week. Such a society

What should happen is that anybody who refused to go back to work goes straight to jobseekers

Employers have PPS numbers

Joe Bloggs has refused an offer of re-employment

04-06-2020 10:12AM

average_runner wrote: »

Well if its essential then do it. Only that person knows if it has to be done.
I had to rush to Wexford from Dublin last week to bring a parent the hospital.
But i have been in my locale for the last 3 months

Either regionalize the country or treat it as one zone - the 5/20/xxk distinctions don't make sense. From Monday I can meet someone who lives 40k away at the halfway mark, who in turn can then meet someone another 40k away. So in such a small country with no regional distinction such distance limits are non-nonsensical, as in a couple of contacts spread can jump any artificial limit. Its the behaviour when you get to your destination, not the distance that contains the spread

frillyleaf · 04-06-2020 10:15AM

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

The only thing it will achieve is making sure that the tourism and entertainment sector in this country is decimated.

They’ll likely lift the 20 km limit at the end of June

faceman · 04-06-2020 10:17AM

average_runner wrote: »

Aer Lingus and Ryanair have cancelled most of their July Flights.
Our one to France is gone in July

Ryanair have started putting on extra flights to open destinations in July. Some of their July Spain flights on the new 40% schedule are already full from Dublin

ZX7R · 04-06-2020 10:17AM

KrustyUCC wrote: »

What should happen is that anybody who refused to go back to work goes straight to jobseekers

Employers have PPS numbers

Joe Bloggs has refused an offer of re-employment

That has been the case all along ,
It also involves revenue.
Where an employee is put back on the cards revenue contacts the department of social welfare

FintanMcluskey · 04-06-2020 10:19AM

Listening to loads of tripe about Sweden doing so badly and its been a disgrace the way the have handled Covid.

Now they haven't seen 200k deaths of course but its the whole lockdown justification thing as the evidence mounts lockdowns are an effective tool to hurtle back to 1930s Ireland.

Many articles I've seen are using the deaths per 100k accross the complete population metric to judge Sweden.

Thats bolix. Over 95% of deaths are over 65. A young healthy population will obviuosly come out favorably using those metrics.

Ive said it before, to see how a country is performing the deaths per 100k most be calculated using the relevant stats ie population over 65

Sweden 2m/4971 = 248 deaths per 100k

Ireland 670k/1659 = 247 deaths per 100k

frillyleaf · 04-06-2020 10:19AM

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

Our health system coped with the first surge which is always likely to be the worst (there was little or no social distancing at the time, lots of commuters using public transport, etc. now we have social distancing, a lot of wfh, 100k+ with antibodies so won't be getting it again, etc.).

There is no evidence of a surge despite countries being in their fourth week of what we consider to be Phase 4 level of opening. Where is the evidence on which this fear of a surge or second wave is based?

I disagree with this. Our healthcare didn’t cope with the increase of cases. We had to take over private hospitals and cancel most non emergency treatments to manage a relatively small number of cases

KrustyUCC · 04-06-2020 10:20AM

frillyleaf wrote: »

They’ll likely lift the 20 km limit at the end of June

I'd like you to be right but I'm not sure after listening to Simon Harris and Leo being worried about lifting restrictions too early

They've got spooked since the Sunday Indo article

Stark · 04-06-2020 10:21AM

At least there's no more bank holidays between now and August that could spook the poor dears.

frillyleaf · 04-06-2020 10:22AM

KrustyUCC wrote: »

I'd like you to be right but I'm not sure after listening to Simon Harris and Leo being worried about lifting restrictions too early

They've got spooked since the Sunday Indo article

What article ? They won’t keep the 20km restriction after June, it would kill tourism industry completely and we need to get that rolling ASAP

KrustyUCC · 04-06-2020 10:23AM

I'm sure they'll think of something for the August one

Mitch Connor · 04-06-2020 10:24AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Listening to loads of tripe about Sweden doing so badly and its been a disgrace the way the have handled Covid.

Now they haven't seen 200k deaths of course but its the whole lockdown justification thing as the evidence mounts lockdowns are an effective tool to hurtle back to 1930s Ireland.

Many articles I've seen are using the deaths per 100k accross the complete population metric to judge Sweden.

Thats bolix. Over 95% of deaths are over 65. A young healthy population will obviuosly come out favorably using those metrics.

Ive said it before, to see how a country is performing the deaths per 100k most be calculated using the relevant stats ie population over 65

Sweden 2m/4971 = 248 deaths per 100k

Ireland 670k/1659 = 247 deaths per 100k

Ah yes, people over 65, the expendables and those not to be worried about. they were probably a tax drain anyway.

who cares if those young, fit, healthy people infected those over 65 tax drains.

TaurenDruid · 04-06-2020 10:25AM

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

It seems as though moving from one Phase to the next is based on reaching a set date (which has no medical relevance) on the calendar rather than any actual statistic on the virus. I don't know how anyone can find that reassuring.

Well, genius, what method you have them use to lift restrictions instead?

What they've done is plan a roadmap where - assuming there are no upticks in infection stats - they can assume containment, and a further relaxation can be introduced. If there is an uptick - they can delay the next phase.

There's no indication the first wave was the worst, you're just hoping/guessing. The second wave of Spanish Flu was far worse than the first and killed millions. Our health system only coped with first wave by cancelling outpatients, all other testing, elective procedures, and taking over private hospitals for three months.

KrustyUCC · 04-06-2020 10:26AM

frillyleaf wrote: »

What article ? They won’t keep the 20km restriction after June, it would kill tourism industry completely and we need to get that rolling ASAP

The Sunday Indo article was about bringing the travel restrictions earlier

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/irish-news/move-to-scrap-travel-limit-from-june-29-to-save-summer-39247219.html

Since then public health officials have come out against the plan and Harris etc seem to be rowing back

Stark · 04-06-2020 10:26AM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Ah yes, people over 65, the expendables and those not to be worried about. they were probably a tax drain anyway.

who cares if those young, fit, healthy people infected those over 65 tax drains.

Don't think that was the point. Point was Ireland's figures look better than the likes of the UK and Sweden because we have a younger population, not because we did anything particularly well.

04-06-2020 10:28AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Listening to loads of tripe about Sweden doing so badly and its been a disgrace the way the have handled Covid.

Now they haven't seen 200k deaths of course but its the whole lockdown justification thing as the evidence mounts lockdowns are an effective tool to hurtle back to 1930s Ireland.

Many articles I've seen are using the deaths per 100k accross the complete population metric to judge Sweden.

Thats bolix. Over 95% of deaths are over 65. A young healthy population will obviuosly come out favorably using those metrics.

Ive said it before, to see how a country is performing the deaths per 100k most be calculated using the relevant stats ie population over 65

Sweden 2m/4971 = 248 deaths per 100k

Ireland 670k/1659 = 247 deaths per 100k

Redo your numbers in 4 weeks and lets see where we are with Sweden still having 50 deaths per day and Ireland <5

is_that_so · 04-06-2020 10:34AM

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

It seems as though moving from one Phase to the next is based on reaching a set date (which has no medical relevance) on the calendar rather than any actual statistic on the virus. I don't know how anyone can find that reassuring.

It's a plan that was drawn up well over a month ago and has been acknowledged as cautious. If we knew then what we know now is not planning. They say there is flexibility in it but that was never going to happen for Phase 1 and largely unlikely for Phase 2. Now there may be some adjustments to Phase 2.

Not sure how the medical advice fits in here and who you mean. There are 40 odd on NPHET and reopening elsewhere is like here, a calculated guess and a learning process. I think your attitude depends on how easily you frustrate and where you are on the spectrum from indefinite lockdown to complete normality now.

Caution has served us well to date and will probably do for most of Phase 2 but without any unforeseen deterioration in numbers we need to see that flexibility at work for later parts of the roadmap.

04-06-2020 10:40AM

I've not seen any evidence to suggest that we actually will speed up the reopening. Everything I hear from Tony, NPHET, Simon and the media is almost always negative. Even the positive messages are almost reluctantly stated along with lots of finger wagging and warnings.

The people are still terrified in Ireland. We had a lad on here last night that created a thread asking if people really recover. He seems to think that even the people that recovered must be left with severe lung issues. Support remains high for the lockdown.

If anything, I think Tony won't be comfortable to bring anything forward. He might even look to remain in phases or go backwards.

We have already flattened the curve, the illness is gone from the community and cases are dropping. Its difficult to see how we are going to do better without completely eradicating the illness, if its even possible.

But this is the situation we are in unfortunately. Longest reopening plan in Europe, citizens are terrified and no real appetite from anybody to get back to living.

uli84 · 04-06-2020 10:41AM

So will homeware part of homestore & more open on Monday or because of Ikea it will be forever closed off?

Clonmel1000 · 04-06-2020 10:43AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I've not seen any evidence to suggest that we actually will speed up the reopening. Everything I hear from Tony, NPHET, Simon and the media is almost always negative. Even the positive messages are almost reluctantly stated along with lots of finger wagging and warnings.

The people are still terrified in Ireland. We had a lad on here last night that created a thread asking if people really recover. He seems to think that even the people that recovered must be left with severe lung issues. Support remains high for the lockdown.

If anything, I think Tony won't be comfortable to bring anything forward. He might even look to remain in phases or go backwards.

We have already flattened the curve, the illness is gone from the community and cases are dropping. Its difficult to see how we are going to do better without completely eradicating the illness, if its even possible.

But this is the situation we are in unfortunately. Longest reopening plan in Europe, citizens are terrified and no real appetite from anybody to get back to living.

Unfortunately I have to agree with you. It’s like being stuck in 1930s Ireland with the Swinging 60s starting in the rest of Europe. We are at heart a backward inward conservative country with little appetite for any risk or alternative discourse it seems.

is_that_so · 04-06-2020 10:45AM

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

Unfortunately I have to agree with you. It’s like being stuck in 1930s Ireland with the Swinging 60s starting in the rest of Europe. We are at heart a backward inward conservative country with little appetite for any risk or alternative discourse it seems.

Always amused at the living stream of consciousness that is Boards. You never know where it might lead you!

Penfailed · 04-06-2020 10:45AM

Idbatterim wrote: »

Save your cash now, the crash is coming! Ill be back here to gloat, hopefully with many of you, when the bill arrives...

Seriously? Stay classy.

is_that_so · 04-06-2020 10:47AM

uli84 wrote: »

So will homeware part of homestore & more open on Monday or because of Ikea it will be forever closed off?

I doubt you'll see too many make announcements until the official word tomorrow.

From their website.

Once governmental guidelines allow us, we will re-open the closed off sections.

04-06-2020 10:49AM

Deleted User wrote: »

........... Longest reopening plan in Europe, citizens are terrified and no real appetite from anybody to get back to living.

There's a significant majority who are either still working or who are state employees on full pay. Those still working are very much beavering away, be it in retail, haulage, farming, pharma, healthcare or work from home.

Many of the remainder are not badly off on the €350/week compared to previously.............. folk are living away and many are enjoying the extra time with family etc etc alongside the obvious negatives that the lockdown brings.

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - Read OP for Mod Warnings