How will schools be able to go back in September?

trapp · 30-05-2020 05:15PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Like jester said earlier it will be absolutely ridiculous if the kids are playing together and mixing in playgrounds to have social distancing in school in September
By then cousins , friends, neighbours will be all mixing and playing together
Kids in creches also mixing and under 6 not obligated to socially distance in creches
Be it right or wrong young kids are allready playing outdoors on greens together and its only beginning of June .

Exactly.

Children everywhere playing together today, I can hear the laughter from the road outside.

And its only the begin of June.

No point in teachers panicking too much about social distancing by september as most children seem to be mixing and playing together now

wirelessdude01 · 30-05-2020 05:58PM

trapp wrote: »

Exactly.

Children everywhere playing together today, I can hear the laughter from the road outside.

And its only the begin of June.

No point in teachers panicking too much about social distancing by september as most children seem to be mixing and playing together now

Who said anything about us teachers going into panic about social distancing? We've already been well forewarned that social distancing is here to stay for the foreseeable future. Within the school grounds it will be up to us to implement whatever the guidelines are at that time. Remember insurance is going to be a huge issue, actually already is based on what insurance companies said was and wasn't allowed occur during book collection due around the country. Guess who will be to blame if an out real or cluster was to happen due to us not doing what we have been told to do? All goes back to guidelines and us having to implement them where we have to. What happens outside of school time and events is not something we can control or be held accountable for. That's where parents have to step up and do what they see fit and accept if something happens due to their actions or lack there of.

kaymin · 30-05-2020 06:31PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Who said anything about us teachers going into panic about social distancing? We've already been well forewarned that social distancing is here to stay for the foreseeable future. Within the school grounds it will be up to us to implement whatever the guidelines are at that time. Remember insurance is going to be a huge issue, actually already is based on what insurance companies said was and wasn't allowed occur during book collection due around the country. Guess who will be to blame if an out real or cluster was to happen due to us not doing what we have been told to do? All goes back to guidelines and us having to implement them where we have to. What happens outside of school time and events is not something we can control or be held accountable for. That's where parents have to step up and do what they see fit and accept if something happens due to their actions or lack there of.

Proving where and how kids catch the virus would be impossible and serves little purpose.

In any case kids are already mixing yet positive cases are on the floor. Also more and more evidence indicates children don't transmit well.

Even if there is a cluster of positive cases, it should just be dealt with through standard contact tracing / isolation procedures. We should not lose sight of the goal of flattening the curve not eliminating the virus completely. If opening schools makes flattening the curve impossible then we deal with that when the time comes. Sacrificing the education system for something that may happen is not on.

ldy4mxonucwsq6 · 30-05-2020 06:32PM

trapp wrote: »

Exactly.

Children everywhere playing together today, I can hear the laughter from the road outside.

And its only the begin of June.

No point in teachers panicking too much about social distancing by september as most children seem to be mixing and playing together now

Exactly, wonderful to see and hear them without a care in the world. Amazing resilience from children who have bounced back to normality without any difficulty.

3 months is a long time and plenty of time for social distancing to have had its day.

Quite a number of stakeholders involved and I see the children's ombudsman has been talking now to ensure all kids have a fair chance at education come end of August.

They will all have to find a mutual ground and agree on what's needed but I agree it's jumping the gun worrying about it when we've the whole summer holidays to work it out.

kandr10 · 30-05-2020 06:41PM

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

Exactly, wonderful to see and hear them without a care in the world. Amazing resilience from children who have bounced back to normality without any difficulty.

3 months is a long time and plenty of time for social distancing to have had its day.

Quite a number of stakeholders involved and I see the children's ombudsman has been talking now to ensure all kids have a fair chance at education come end of August.

They will all have to find a mutual ground and agree on what's needed but I agree it's jumping the gun worrying about it when we've the whole summer holidays to work it out.

Both your post here and the one you quote imply that that is happening without social distancing. When questioned on it, you claim to be following the guideline of 2m distance between kids during their supervised play, with groups of no more than 4. So which is it? Is it that other kids in your neighbourhood are not following the guidelines but yours are. If that’s the case why would you not want them to follow any guidelines that are still there come September?
You seem to be jumping on the bandwagon of teachers not wanting schools to open at all when it’s very clearly not what most are saying. We want a plan. We don’t want a free for all. The plan doesn’t have to be 2m distance if that’s not deemed necessary. But whatever is deemed necessary in the wider society, that is what teachers will expect, irregardless of whether people choose to follow those guidelines or not.

ldy4mxonucwsq6 · 30-05-2020 06:46PM

kandr10 wrote: »

Both your post here and the one you quote imply that that is happening without social distancing. When questioned on it, you claim to be following the guideline of 2m distance between kids during their supervised play, with groups of no more than 4. So which is it? Is it that other kids in your neighbourhood are not following the guidelines but yours are. If that’s the case why would you not want them to follow any guidelines that are still there come September?
You seem to be jumping on the bandwagon of teachers not wanting schools to open at all when it’s very clearly not what most are saying. We want a plan. We don’t want a free for all. The plan doesn’t have to be 2m distance if that’s not deemed necessary. But whatever is deemed necessary in the wider society, that is what teachers will expect, irregardless of whether people choose to follow those guidelines or not.

There's been a free for all for quite some time, a lot of the neighborhood kids here have never been kept apart never mind social distancing.

And guess what, they are all perfectly fine as are their families.

We've followed the guidelines all along ourselves here. I don't have any young toddlers thankfully so I can explain what's needed and why.

There is huge scope for those guidelines to change between now and end of August, hopefully cases stay low and we will have nothing to worry about.

kaymin · 30-05-2020 06:51PM

kandr10 wrote: »

Both your post here and the one you quote imply that that is happening without social distancing. When questioned on it, you claim to be following the guideline of 2m distance between kids during their supervised play, with groups of no more than 4. So which is it? Is it that other kids in your neighbourhood are not following the guidelines but yours are. If that’s the case why would you not want them to follow any guidelines that are still there come September?
You seem to be jumping on the bandwagon of teachers not wanting schools to open at all when it’s very clearly not what most are saying. We want a plan. We don’t want a free for all. The plan doesn’t have to be 2m distance if that’s not deemed necessary. But whatever is deemed necessary in the wider society, that is what teachers will expect, irregardless of whether people choose to follow those guidelines or not.

You just have to walk into any park to see kid's are not exercising social distancing. And it seems to have no effect on the number of positive cases. Surely that's what is important here. The government guidelines are a joke imo We need more cop on.

ldy4mxonucwsq6 · 30-05-2020 06:59PM

kaymin wrote: »

You just have to walk into any park to see kid's are not exercising social distancing. And it seems to have no effect on the number of positive cases. Surely that's what is important here. The government guidelines are a joke imo We need more cop on.

I think the guidelines were probably needed at the time but aren't so much any more.

Once they see that everything is still OK after phase 1 I'd say we'll see an acceleration through the rest of the phases.

They are being way too conservative with the current road map.

kandr10 · 30-05-2020 06:59PM

kaymin wrote: »

You just have to walk into any park to see kid's are not exercising social distancing. And it seems to have no effect on the number of positive cases. Surely that's what is important here. The government guidelines are a joke imo We need more cop on.

As I’ve said here before I regularly walk in the local park and am not seeing that. Genuinely I’ve seen a few groups teenagers in groups of 4-5 with no sense of distance . Most other groups I see are family units.

kandr10 · 30-05-2020 07:00PM

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

There's been a free for all for quite some time, a lot of the neighborhood kids here have never been kept apart never mind social distancing.

And guess what, they are all perfectly fine as are their families.

We've followed the guidelines all along ourselves here. I don't have any young toddlers thankfully so I can explain what's needed and why.

There is huge scope for those guidelines to change between now and end of August, hopefully cases stay low and we will have nothing to worry about.

So if you’re continuing to follow the guidelines you must see them as necessary? Otherwise your own kids would be part of that free for all you talked about.

trapp · 30-05-2020 07:00PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Who said anything about us teachers going into panic about social distancing? We've already been well forewarned that social distancing is here to stay for the foreseeable future. Within the school grounds it will be up to us to implement whatever the guidelines are at that time. Remember insurance is going to be a huge issue, actually already is based on what insurance companies said was and wasn't allowed occur during book collection due around the country. Guess who will be to blame if an out real or cluster was to happen due to us not doing what we have been told to do? All goes back to guidelines and us having to implement them where we have to. What happens outside of school time and events is not something we can control or be held accountable for. That's where parents have to step up and do what they see fit and accept if something happens due to their actions or lack there of.

The rest of your post my poor friend makes it clear that you are panicing and stoking fear.

Do you really think children are going to be asked to remain two metres apart at all times in school?????????

The guidelines as you call them will likely be something like children only play with others in their own class but no need for distancing.

And before you come back to ask how it would work on a schoolyard each class has a seperate break time.

kaymin · 30-05-2020 07:06PM

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

I think the guidelines were probably needed at the time but aren't so much any more.

Once they see that everything is still OK after phase 1 I'd say we'll see an acceleration through the rest of the phases.

They are being way too conservative with the current road map.

Agreed. When the facts change or emerge adapt the approach accordingly.

I still don't get the decision not to hold the leaving cert. Students have had little incentive to study. The education of 1000s compromised. Moronic imo given how the number of positive cases has been on a downward spiral for weeks.

kaymin · 30-05-2020 07:12PM

kandr10 wrote: »

As I’ve said here before I regularly walk in the local park and am not seeing that. Genuinely I’ve seen a few groups teenagers in groups of 4-5 with no sense of distance . Most other groups I see are family units.

Are you not contradicting yourself there?

cazzer22 · 30-05-2020 07:17PM

trapp wrote: »

I have plenty of respect for teachers but this is absolute hyperbolic nonsense.

Teachers might be trying their best but online teaching is not real teaching and other than one or two on here almost every teacher would agree.

It is not for the lack of trying on teachers part but going to school is an essential part of being educated.

It cant be done from behind a screen.

Once safe to do so schools must reopen to as many children as possible.

Believe me, we are dying to get back. And just FYI, since the 18th of May (since we were given the go ahead to go back in under strict conditions) I've been in three times and will be going in as often as I can to help or prepare. Teachers are doing their best, but up until this point we have been teaching with little or no resources. We were told at half 11 on Thursday schools would be closing and not allowed to return until 18th of May. Most of us really felt we would be back in June. It's the Dept of Ed that the frustration should be directed towards. They have given us little or no guidance as to what is happening. The reality is, parents find out any information regarding schools opening when we do. We find out through Leo's speeches.

I agree that face to face contact is so important for teaching and what we can do is limited, but we really are trying, despite having no support from the Dept. Online teaching may still have to happen to a certain degree, even in September. Although I really hope we will be back and things will be as they were.

trapp · 30-05-2020 07:23PM

cazzer22 wrote: »

Believe me, we are dying to get back. And just FYI, since the 18th of May (since we were given the go ahead to go back in under strict conditions) I've been in three times and will be going in as often as I can to help or prepare. Teachers are doing their best, but up until this point we have been teaching with little or no resources. We were told at half 11 on Thursday schools would be closing and not allowed to return until 18th of May. Most of us really felt we would be back in June. It's the Dept of Ed that the frustration should be directed towards. They have given us little or no guidance as to what is happening. The reality is, parents find out any information regarding schools opening when we do. We find out through Leo's speeches.

I agree that face to face contact is so important for teaching and what we can do is limited, but we really are trying, despite having no support from the Dept. Online teaching may still have to happen to a certain degree, even in September. Although I really hope we will be back and things will be as they were.

Exactly I think teachers are doing a great job but online teaching is not really teaching.

Thats not there fault.

My argument is the minority of teachers including a couple on here who are stoking fear and shouting down any attempt to return to work.

Teachers in general I have no issue with.

Just the scaremongering few on here that a quick read of the thread will show up.

kandr10 · 30-05-2020 07:28PM

kaymin wrote: »

Are you not contradicting yourself there?

Nope. I’m saying the majority are family units and I’ve seen only a few instances of teenagers not Respecting social distance. It was to counter an earlier argument that the majority are not following social distance.

cazzer22 · 30-05-2020 07:29PM

trapp wrote: »

Exactly I think teachers are doing a great job but online teaching is not really teaching.

Thats not there fault.

My argument is the minority of teachers including a couple on here who are stoking fear and shouting down any attempt to return to work.

Teachers in general I have no issue with.

Just the scaremongering few on here that a quick read of the thread will show up.

I get you and understand that. I think we can and will return in some capacity and schools will have to be very flexible while this happens. I just hope we are back, must be very hard for parents at home.

wirelessdude01 · 30-05-2020 07:32PM

trapp wrote: »

The rest of your post my poor friend makes it clear that you are panicing and stoking fear.

Do you really think children are going to be asked to remain two metres apart at all times in school?????????

The guidelines as you call them will likely be something like children only play with others in their own class but no need for distancing.

And before you come back to ask how it would work on a schoolyard each class has a seperate break time.

Would you go and jump. I made it very clear that whatever is in place that we as public servants will have to abide by them and also implement them on school grounds. Where exactly in my post am I panicing or stoking fear? I'm very fact orientated and a realist.

khalessi · 30-05-2020 07:32PM

Evening all, I can't think of any teacher on here who has said no to school reopening. I do think people misinterpret for their own reasons. I myself am glad schools are reopening in September 2020.

Internet teaching is fine, but it misses the personal interaction and craic between students and teachers

kandr10 · 30-05-2020 07:34PM

kaymin wrote: »

Agreed. When the facts change or emerge adapt the approach accordingly.

I still don't get the decision not to hold the leaving cert. Students have had little incentive to study. The education of 1000s compromised. Moronic imo given how the number of positive cases has been on a downward spiral for weeks.

I agree the lc was not handled very well. However they were making a decision on a future event based on the data they had available at the time. They didn’t know that case numbers would be what they are now. Perhaps they could’ve waited and cancelled if necessary closer to the time but that would’ve been potentially worse for the students involved - more time spent wasted on studying for an exam that wasn’t happening. I wonder how far into the planning process they got and whether it was the financial cost Involved in planning how to manage the exams within restrictions that stopped thEm going ahead? Or was it just that they weren’t bothered planning at all? It’d be nice to see more justification of the decision making.

Benimar · 30-05-2020 07:37PM

kandr10 wrote: »

I agree the lc was not handled very well. However they were making a decision on a future event based on the data they had available at the time. They didn’t know that case numbers would be what they are now. Perhaps they could’ve waited and cancelled if necessary closer to the time but that would’ve been potentially worse for the students involved - more time spent wasted on studying for an exam that wasn’t happening. I wonder how far into the planning process they got and whether it was the financial cost Involved in planning how to manage the exams within restrictions that stopped thEm going ahead? Or was it just that they weren’t bothered planning at all? It’d be nice to see more justification of the decision making.

Leo and Co gave in to a fecking Social Media campaign! It was a terrible decision to cancel the LC on May 8th and the decision is looking worse by the day.

wirelessdude01 · 30-05-2020 07:40PM

Benimar wrote: »

Leo and Co gave in to a fecking Social Media campaign! It was a terrible decision to cancel the LC on May 8th and the decision is looking worse by the day.

A few very vocal students drove the narrative. Idiots like Ciara Kelly and some IT journalists jumped on the bandwagon and drove it relentlessly. Ciara Kelly was in no way objective as she had skin in the game. Once they achieved what they wanted they then decided that the next campaign was to get primary schools opened for JI and 6th.

trapp · 30-05-2020 07:41PM

khalessi wrote: »

Evening all, I can't think of any teacher on here who has said no to school reopening. I do think people misinterpret for their own reasons. I myself am glad schools are reopening in September 2020.

Internet teaching is fine, but it misses the personal interaction and craic between students and teachers

You spent the last few weeks objecting and stoking fear my friend.

Glad to see you have changed your mind.

Also internet teaching is not teaching.

The vast majority of students in disadvantaged areas have not been learning so it is not 'fine'

Banned

bettyoleary · 30-05-2020 07:43PM

kaymin wrote: »

If this thread has informed me of one thing it's how belligerent some teachers can be. I pity students having to put up with this.

Btw - how many teachers have arts degrees?

I don't know how may teachers have arts degrees? why are you asking me that? They have degrees and that is what is required to teach. What is obvious from this thread is that some posters have a problem with teachers and resent them being paid. Whatever these posters agendas are and they do have agendas or they wouldn't be posting, it dosent matter. The teachers are following the guidelines. They have never refused to teach. They continue to work and will be part of implementing guidelines in schools when they are made available.

They will have their holidays and if the guidelines are not issued prior to school holidays then they will need time in September to put the guidelines into place whatever they are. They wont be using their summer holidays to do this. No body knows the trajectory of Covid and no body knows what the situation will be in September. We all hope for the best. In my opinion parents need to be getting online for guidance on teaching from home. Ensuring their children abide by the Govt rules which I'm sure they will be happy to do if the reasons are explained to them. If not then discipline comes into it. Exactly what is required.

Lillyfae · 30-05-2020 07:43PM

bettyoleary wrote: »

AND GET A NANNY IF YOU DONT WANT TO LOOK AFTER YOUR KIDS.

Wow.

bettyoleary · 30-05-2020 07:54PM

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

Excuse me, how exactly am I stupid in your opinion?? Did you misread my post or something.

It reads from your thread that you are inciting people to allow children to ignore the Govt guidelines. Would you agree with this? You are also complicit in bullying teachers.For the few teachers that even post on here and bother arguing with you, I feel sorry for. You have absolutely no right to question any teacher on this site. Unfortunately, and if your not thick, you will understand that in every walk of life there are people who dont toe the line and this includes some teachers. But the majority of teachers, in my opinion are dedicated caring and very intelligent people who we should be grateful to. If it wasn't for them we wouldn't have scientists working on a vaccine

Leave them alone and look at yourself.

bettyoleary · 30-05-2020 07:58PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Source or did you hear that from Karen in the local shop, who heard it from her dog, who dreamt it after eating some out of date cat food?

Yes nice one and you probably heard you should go on a Ryanair flight to Turkey as you will get a haircut and a pint. Work away. Teachers are never going on Covid payment. Perhaps Karen forgot to tell me that.

bettyoleary · 30-05-2020 08:01PM

bettyoleary wrote: »

Yes nice one and you probably heard you should go on a Ryanair flight to Turkey as you will get a haircut and a pint. Work away. Teachers are never going on Covid payment. Perhaps Karen forgot to tell me that.

OOps forgot to say when you come home with your big red face be sure to hide in some bushes to avoid quarantine and as soon as its safe to emerge join the Mcdonalds queue for a big map. Nice one lad.

ldy4mxonucwsq6 · 30-05-2020 08:04PM

bettyoleary wrote: »

It reads from your thread that you are inciting people to allow children to ignore the Govt guidelines. Would you agree with this? You are also complicit in bullying teachers.For the few teachers that even post on here and bother arguing with you, I feel sorry for. You have absolutely no right to question any teacher on this site. Unfortunately, and if your not thick, you will understand that in every walk of life there are people who dont toe the line and this includes some teachers. But the majority of teachers, in my opinion are dedicated caring and very intelligent people who we should be grateful to. If it wasn't for them we wouldn't have scientists working on a vaccine

Leave them alone and look at yourself.

Not at all, but don't let that get in the way of your entitled triggered rant.

I have every right to give my opinion but I also know there's a difference between expressing an opinion and being downright rude.

You might want to show me where I incited people to flout rules or bullied teachers just in case I'm too thick or stupid.

downthemiddle · 30-05-2020 08:04PM

The members of the NPHET are as follows:

Dr Tony Holohan, chief medical officer at the Department of Health.

Prof Colm Bergin, infectious diseases consultant at St James’s Hospital and Professor of Medicine at Trinity College Dublin.

Paul Bolger, director of Department of Health resources division.

Dr Eibhlin Connolly, deputy chief medical officer at the Department of Health.

Tracey Conroy, assistant secretary in the acute hospitals division of the Department of Health.

Dr John Cuddihy, interim director of the Health Protection Surveillance Centre (HPSC).

Dr Cillian de Gascun, director of the National Virus Reference Laboratory in UCD.

Colm Desmond, assistant secretary for corporate legislation, mental health, drugs policy and food safety division in the Department of Health.

Dr Lorraine Doherty, national clinical director for health protection in the HPSC.

Dr Mary Favier, president of the Irish College of General Practitioners.

Dr Ronan Glynn, deputy chief medical officer in the Department of Health.

Fergal Goodman, assistant secretary in the primary care division in the Department of Health.

Dr Colm Henry, HSE chief clinical officer.

Dr Kevin Kelleher, HSE assistant national director of public health.

Marita Kinsella, director of the national patient safety office in the Department of Health.

David Leach, HSE deputy national director of communications.

Dr Kathleen Mac Lellan, assistant secretary in Department of Health social care division.

Dr Jeanette McCallion, Health Products Regulatory Authority (HPRA) medical assessor.

Tom McGuinness, assistant national director at HSE office of emergency planning.

Dr Siobhán Ní Bhrian, HSE lead for integrated care.

Prof Philip Nolan, chair of Irish Epidemiological Modelling Advisory Group and president of Maynooth University.

Kate O’Flaherty, head of health and wellbeing at Department of Health.

Dr Darina O’Flanagan, special adviser to NPHET at Department of Health.

Dr Siobhán O’Sullivan, chief bioethics officer at Department of Health.

Dr Michael Power, national clinical lead of HSE critical care programme and consultant in intensive care medicine at Beaumont Hospital.

Phelim Quinn, chief executive of Health Information and Quality Authority (Hiqa).

Dr Máirín Ryan, deputy chief executive and director of health technology assessment at Hiqa.

Dr Alan Smith, Department of Health deputy chief medical officer.

Dr Breda Smyth, HSE director of health and public health medicine.

David Walsh, HSE national director of community operations.

Deirdre Watters, head of communications at Department of Health.

Liam Woods, HSE national director of acute operations.

Lorraine Doherty, HPSC clinical director for health protection

These are the people advising the government. If there is any poster who thinks they are better able to issue advice please tell us why.

How will schools be able to go back in September?

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