Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - Read OP for Mod Warnings

vid36 · 28-05-2020 05:01PM

France are reopening, bars, restaurants and cafes from next week in their green zones. All staff must wear masks.Customers must wear masks too when moving through the premises ie when entering, exiting the premises or going to the bathroom.All customers must be seated. 1m between tables.

fr336 · 28-05-2020 05:06PM

LeeroyJ. wrote: »

Germany, like the Czech republic made wearing masks mandatory. There is a staggering amount of people here though that want the economy to reopen but will fight tooth and nail against wearing mask to help stop the spread and protect others. Wearing mask indoors should have been made mandatory a long time ago and still should once retail reopens.its a tiny concession to help people keep safer and feel safer

This this this. They want all the luxuries back they consider rights without even going through the "ordeal" of wearing a mask. It's just not socially acceptable to them. Well until they cop on maybe they'll have to keep dealing with half the economy being shut down.

titan18 · 28-05-2020 05:09PM

Seen this there

https://nltimes.nl/2020/05/28/thousands-dutch-covid-19-patients-likely-permanent-lung-damage-doctor-says

Permanent lung damage for people who get it even in younger age groups

ednwireland · 28-05-2020 05:11PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Its an even sadder reflection our government cant provide Cervical, Breast, Bowel & Diabetic Retinopathy screening programmes to its citizens - HSE says it can not give any date for resumption.

If i had a daughter who needed such test I would be out there in front of government buildings making some serious noise day and night. This is getting to mass murder stage that will only be identified next year.

As other poster said heads really should roll for this

totally agree (even though im unaffected) i cant believe that this wasnt planned in from day one of the lockdown as in how to resume treatments and screening absolutely crazy that people arent getting treatment after diagnosis.

stephenjmcd · 28-05-2020 05:12PM

titan18 wrote: »

Seen this there

https://nltimes.nl/2020/05/28/thousands-dutch-covid-19-patients-likely-permanent-lung-damage-doctor-says

Permanent lung damage for people who get it even in younger age groups

The key word in the first sentence "may". Its a complete unknown at this stage. Can only say this months down the line whenever or if they review patients that had it

Clonmel1000 · 28-05-2020 05:14PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Legislation lapses 18th June so will have to be reviewed before then.

I'd be surprised if Leo or whoever is in charge in June didn't have contact from the commission in advance seeing as most european countries will be lifting restrictions on travel through June and July.

Thanks for that appreciated.

Ginger n Lemon · 28-05-2020 05:14PM

titan18 wrote: »

Seen this there

https://nltimes.nl/2020/05/28/thousands-dutch-covid-19-patients-likely-permanent-lung-damage-doctor-says

Permanent lung damage for people who get it even in younger age groups

Thats very misleading?

Even the doctor himself says "likely"

THOUSANDS OF DUTCH COVID-19 PATIENTS LIKELY HAVE PERMANENT LUNG DAMAGE, DOCTOR SAYS

This is not a scientific study, its an opinion of a doctor.

Van den Toorn expects that "there may be thousands of people in the Netherlands who suffered permanent injury to the lungs from corona"

This is basically Dutch Gerry Killeen. Please ensure you post words like "likely" and "may be" if that is what the article is about.

"So far 45,500 people in the Netherlands tested positive for the coronavirus. Many did not get sick enough to need hospital care. In this group, Van den Toorn expects that permanent problems will be less serious, but still possible."

Lol he said "may be" "likely" "possible" in 1 interview. when you get 3 of these in an article you know its Gerry Killeen.

fr336 · 28-05-2020 05:14PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

The key word in the first sentence "may". Its a complete unknown at this stage. Can only say this months down the line whenever or if they review patients that had it

Those advocating a rushed relaxation of lockdown work on maybe's all the time. Possible permanent lung damage for young people, but they still have their jobs I suppose.

Ginger n Lemon · 28-05-2020 05:17PM

ednwireland wrote: »

totally agree (even though im unaffected) i cant believe that this wasnt planned in from day one of the lockdown as in how to resume treatments and screening absolutely crazy that people arent getting treatment after diagnosis.

The most infuriating and scary thing is, deep inside we know this is the only country to do this to non covid services.

This is something i am still not able to get to grips with even though Ive known the issue for over 2 weeks, in an Irish examiner article a 22 year old was ringing every GP she could to avail of these services yet no resolution. Simon Harris later on admitted that 1 person per hour in this country dies of cancer and some of these deaths are preventable if identified early. I actually feel worse and worse typing this.

SusieBlue · 28-05-2020 05:19PM

titan18 wrote: »

Seen this there

https://nltimes.nl/2020/05/28/thousands-dutch-covid-19-patients-likely-permanent-lung-damage-doctor-says

Permanent lung damage for people who get it even in younger age groups

You do know that chest infections and pneumonia can cause scarring on the lungs too?
I’m asthmatic, it doesn’t give me much trouble but my lungs do have some scarring from it.

It’s a lot more common and easier to get than you would think, but not just from coronavirus. Many run of the mill illnesses can cause it too.

stephenjmcd · 28-05-2020 05:21PM

fr336 wrote: »

Those advocating a rushed relaxation of lockdown work on maybe's all the time. Possible permanent lung damage for young people, but they still have their jobs I suppose.

No the people advocating for a quicker easing are basing their opinion off the experience of other European countries which is backed up by their stats and experience of the virus.

The article contains no fact, your post is trying to create an argument when there isn't one by the needless last line.

Chest infections, asthma etc all cause scaring on the lungs, but sure that doesn't get mentioned at any other time. It's not exactly rare.

nickkinneg · 28-05-2020 05:21PM

Reported in UK that 54000 infected this week slightly down from 61000 last week - guess that’s a positive

Penfailed · 28-05-2020 05:24PM

polesheep wrote: »

You said that there was no secret made of the fact that we have an appalling health service. That's not true. The government continually defends the health service and has never conceded that it is appalling.

I never mentioned that the health service is appalling. That was you. It's not secret that the reason for the lockdown was that the health service couldn't cope, hence flattening the curve.

Ginger n Lemon · 28-05-2020 05:31PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

No the people advocating for a quicker easing are basing their opinion off the experience of other European countries which is backed up by their stats and experience of the virus.

The article contains no fact, your post is trying to create an argument when there isn't one by the needless last line.

Chest infections, asthma etc all cause scaring on the lungs, but sure that doesn't get mentioned at any other time. It's not exactly rare.

You are too nice. The article & post are both crazy, basically says below

"there may be thousands of people, of all ages, getting permanent lung damage if they've contracted covid19"

0 proof, 0 scientific research, 0 facts. Kind of feel like "medics" and "professors" are treating this as a popularity contest, whoever says most wildest prediction wins. Real shame on the profession.

Spanish Eyes · 28-05-2020 05:32PM

A large majority of people out there in the real world (not here in a bubble of resentment and impatience!) actually support a softly softly cautious approach to reopening things.

I doubt the rants here are representative of the general population at all.

In time things will get back to some normality. I'm happy enough with the cautious approach for now anyway, and I doubt I am alone either.

If flights are operational off you go, no one is stopping you.

polesheep · 28-05-2020 05:40PM

Penfailed wrote: »

I never mentioned that the health service is appalling. That was you. It's not secret that the reason for the lockdown was that the health service couldn't cope, hence flattening the curve.

I said: "I suspect it was because we have such an appalling health service and any other response would have led to it being quickly overwhelmed."

You said: "You suspect? There was no secret made of the fact that that was the reason."

Ginger n Lemon · 28-05-2020 05:45PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

A large majority of people out there in the real world (not here in a bubble of resentment and impatience!) actually support a softly softly cautious approach to reopening things.

I doubt the rants here are representative of the general population at all.

In time things will get back to some normality. I'm happy enough with the cautious approach for now anyway, and I doubt I am alone either.

If flights are operational off you go, no one is stopping you.

Thankfully, minority and Michael Martin in particular thinks that the softly softly cautious approach has a lot of nonsense elements. But feel free to continue to support it.

He told the Dail: “There is no remaining serious justification for the 5km limit. The public health concern is how people behave around others — not how far they are from their home.

“In fact, the research shows that this limit may be forcing people in urban areas into more crowded situations. I think this also applies to the 20km rule which is envisaged to replace the 5km rule.

“I don’t see a logic to it and I don’t see any scientific basis to it and I think we need to deal with that more expeditiously is my view and I am saying it here in the House.

“Equally the current distinctions between different types of shop are at best arbitrary. Supermarkets have been open throughout the pandemic while implementing measures about distancing and hygiene. The figures on community spread suggest the supermarkets have not played a role in spreading the virus, where the overwhelming issue is clustering in health facilities, nursing homes and some workplaces like meat factories.

He added: “In relation to the 2m guidance, which it has been acknowledged is not required by the science, it has been helpful but it cannot be allowed to block Ireland restarting activity which is already underway elsewhere without a negative impact.

“If it is true our capacity to rapidly test, trace and isolate is now in place, then we need to see this reflected in the loosening of policies put in place in part because we lacked this capacity.”

https://www.thesun.ie/news/5476595/sun-seekers-stay-home-micheal-martin-travelling-no-sense/

Man speaks sense. Every bold part you just cant say "oh well thats a lie". You cant. But feel free to comment.

fr336 · 28-05-2020 05:48PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

You are too nice. The article & post are both crazy, basically says below

"there may be thousands of people, of all ages, getting permanent lung damage if they've contracted covid19"

0 proof, 0 scientific research, 0 facts. Kind of feel like "medics" and "professors" are treating this as a popularity contest, whoever says most wildest prediction wins. Real shame on the profession.

Should all the doctors and scientists advocating quick route out of lockdown shut up too? Leave it to the politicians etc?

Ginger n Lemon · 28-05-2020 05:51PM

fr336 wrote: »

Should all the doctors and scientists advocating quick route out of lockdown shut up too? Leave it to the politicians etc?

Quick?

When you have a 5 month lockdown announced, exiting such after 3 months or 3.5 can be called quick.

Unfortunately.

(it doesnt mean its quick in reality though, when you consider other European nations)

stephenjmcd · 28-05-2020 05:57PM

From RTE:
France will allow cafes, bars and restaurants to reopen with restrictions from next week and will also end limits on travel within the country as the coronavirus crisis eases, the prime minister has confirmed.

Edouard Philippe said France was making progress in its fight against the Covid-19 outbreak as he unveiled steps to further relax restrictions.

On 2 June, France's beaches will reopen, the ban on anyone travelling more than 100 km from their homes, except in special cases, is to be lifted while cafes, bars and restaurants are to reopen with customers kept at least one metre apart.

Other restrictions include a maximum of 10 diners per table. Staff will wear masks and customers must wear them too except when seated at their table.

In areas of the country designated as higher-risk "orange zones", only the outdoor areas of cafes, bars and restaurants will be allowed to reopen (this includes Paris).

Parks and public gardens in Paris, until now deemed to be in a Covid-19 "red zone", will also reopen on 2 June.

fr336 · 28-05-2020 06:03PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

From RTE:
France will allow cafes, bars and restaurants to reopen with restrictions from next week and will also end limits on travel within the country as the coronavirus crisis eases, the prime minister has confirmed.

Cue UK public demanding bars and restaurants open immediately "cos the Europeans are getting back to normal" even though they have worst excess death rate in world!

uli84 · 28-05-2020 06:05PM

Good God, im so terrified what nonsense they will come up with when it comes to schools re-opening

When i hear the word “roadmap” I know it’ll be no good, making decisions so much ahead will probably result in similar crap like Leaving Certs

timmy_mallet · 28-05-2020 06:13PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

From RTE:
France will allow cafes, bars and restaurants to reopen with restrictions from next week and will also end limits on travel within the country as the coronavirus crisis eases, the prime minister has confirmed.

Edouard Philippe said France was making progress in its fight against the Covid-19 outbreak as he unveiled steps to further relax restrictions.

On 2 June, France's beaches will reopen, the ban on anyone travelling more than 100 km from their homes, except in special cases, is to be lifted while cafes, bars and restaurants are to reopen with customers kept at least one metre apart.

Other restrictions include a maximum of 10 diners per table. Staff will wear masks and customers must wear them too except when seated at their table.

In areas of the country designated as higher-risk "orange zones", only the outdoor areas of cafes, bars and restaurants will be allowed to reopen (this includes Paris).

Parks and public gardens in Paris, until now deemed to be in a Covid-19 "red zone", will also reopen on 2 June.

Leo: "Heh, *chuckle*, heh, well, we're not for experimenting here, heh, we will just see how this goes and then, heh, we will see... Ehhh, who's next, ehhh, CMO"

Tony H: "Well, it's the opinion of the CMO, that *takes drink of water*, this is against our own guidelines and that I cannot speak for anyone else here, the Vintners will have to see, and in no certain terms, what, and this includes cafes, pubs, bar the guidance is and work around that and I see, and this is for everywhere, no change to the 2m guideline, in fact, at 99% safe, we still have a risk there, that may impact the public health services, and to be honest, we could be looking at 2.5m to remove that risk in phase 2. *LOOKS LEFT/RIGHT/LEFT* Ehhh, minister..."

Simon H: "WOULD YOU EVER COP ON. COP ON. BARS? COP ON."

road_high · 28-05-2020 06:21PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

From RTE:
France will allow cafes, bars and restaurants to reopen with restrictions from next week and will also end limits on travel within the country as the coronavirus crisis eases, the prime minister has confirmed.

Edouard Philippe said France was making progress in its fight against the Covid-19 outbreak as he unveiled steps to further relax restrictions.

On 2 June, France's beaches will reopen, the ban on anyone travelling more than 100 km from their homes, except in special cases, is to be lifted while cafes, bars and restaurants are to reopen with customers kept at least one metre apart.

Other restrictions include a maximum of 10 diners per table. Staff will wear masks and customers must wear them too except when seated at their table.

In areas of the country designated as higher-risk "orange zones", only the outdoor areas of cafes, bars and restaurants will be allowed to reopen (this includes Paris).

Parks and public gardens in Paris, until now deemed to be in a Covid-19 "red zone", will also reopen on 2 June.

How I yearn for the continent. Always light years ahead of this place. We can’t even do a lockdown and reopening without it being turned into a fiasco that will bankrupt us. We are stuck here as well. At least if you were in Austria or Italy etc you’d have half a dozen other countries to just get away to on the excellent rapid train services they all have. Part of our problem is the isolated nature of our island- we didn’t use it at all it our advantage when we should have but now it’s being used as a stick to beat us with. Still very much small country syndrome going on sadly

Spanish Eyes · 28-05-2020 06:22PM

If pubs and cafes in Ireland had as much outdoor terraced space as France, Spain and Italy we'd be flying!

As it is you cannot even walk down a street (in Dublin anyway) because the pavements are so narrow. If outdoor drinking/eating was possible that sector would open much sooner.

And before you start on about the weather here, I've been to many places in Europe in deepest Autumn/Winter and outdoor drinking/eating was rampant. That's because A. they had the space, and B. it was heated and blankets were provided. Always great to sit outside and people watch/watch the world go by.

We haven't embraced it much in cities here because it is nigh on impossible, or the Council would look for millions to place a few tables outside or something.

Time has come to think it out again!

road_high · 28-05-2020 06:23PM

timmy_mallet wrote: »

Leo: "Heh, *chuckle*, heh, well, we're not for experimenting here, heh, we will just see how this goes and then, heh, we will see... Ehhh, who's next, ehhh, CMO"

Tony H: "Well, it's the opinion of the CMO, that *takes drink of water*, this is against our own guidelines and that I cannot speak for anyone else here, the Vintners will have to see, and in no certain terms, what, and this includes cafes, pubs, bar the guidance is and work around that and I see, and this is for everywhere, no change to the 2m guideline, in fact, at 99% safe, we still have a risk there, that may impact the public health services, and to be honest, we could be looking at 2.5m to remove that risk in phase 2. *LOOKS LEFT/RIGHT/LEFT* Ehhh, minister..."

Simon H: "WOULD YOU EVER COP ON. COP ON. BARS? COP ON."

Can just hear Harris with his fake posh accent saying that. I believe that chap came from nothing (Nothing wrong with that btw) but acts as if there’s a silver spoon rammed up his rear end
“Social distancing “ is fav phrase

road_high · 28-05-2020 06:24PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

If pubs and cafes in Ireland had as much outdoor terraced space as France, Spain and Italy we'd be flying!

As it is you cannot even walk down a street (in Dublin anyway) because the pavements are so narrow. If outdoor drinking/eating was possible that sector would open much sooner.

And before you start on about the weather here, I've been to many places in Europe in deepest Autumn/Winter and outdoor drinking/eating was rampant. That's because A. they had the space, and B. it was heated and blankets were provided. Always great to sit outside and people watch/watch the world go by.

We haven't embraced it much in cities here because it is nigh on impossible, or the Council would look for millions to place a few tables outside or something.

Time has come to think it out again!

The weather is horrendous here for outdoor dining most of the time that’s why

iamwhoiam · 28-05-2020 06:29PM

uli84 wrote: »

Good God, im so scarred what nonsense they will come up with when it comes to schools re-opening

When i hear the word “roadmap” I know it’ll be no good, making decisions so much ahead will probably result in similar crap like Leaving Certs

And September is 3 months away anyway . So much can change in 3 months
By then kids will be playing with cousins and friends and mixing freely

Spanish Eyes · 28-05-2020 06:30PM

road_high wrote: »

The weather is horrendous here for outdoor dining most of the time that’s why

Read my post again, I addressed this.

28-05-2020 06:33PM

Incredible that countries hit much harder than us are going to be fully reopen and a huge number of Irish are not even allowed to see family for another 2 months almost.

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - Read OP for Mod Warnings