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Relaxation of restrictions Part II

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  • #8342
    snotboogie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭snotboogie


    Arghus wrote: »
    Most of you here would do well to read the words of the poster in this thread. A consultant in an Irish hospital, whose hard factual information has been extremely sobering over the last few weeks.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=113352900#post113352900

    This answer to a question from earlier today, should shock some of you back to reality, but I doubt it at this stage:

    Listen to the most recent freakonomics podcast where they talk to experts working on vaccines from around the world. The expectations of a vaccine in Q4 2020 would represent the largest achievement in medical history. The fastest turnaround for a vaccine ever was 5 years for ebola. The average turnaround time is 10 years. There are no approved vaccines for SARS or MERS. Yes, there will be unprecidented resources going into the Covid 19 vaccine but a 9 month turnaround would be extraordinary and a 9 month turnaround with a supply chain to even just vaccinate the most vulnerable is borderline impossible. There is a good chance we could be facing into 2022 or 2023 with no vaccine.


  • #8343
    hopalongcass
    Closed Accounts Posts: 109 ✭✭hopalongcass


    Arghus wrote: »
    Most of you here would do well to read the words of the poster in this thread. A consultant in an Irish hospital, whose hard factual information has been extremely sobering over the last few weeks.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=113352900#post113352900

    This answer to a question from earlier today, should shock some of you back to reality, but I doubt it at this stage:

    Ridiculous statement,guy is just pulling figures out of his head and splitting the difference between 10 and 20k just because of how he thinks people will behave along with the line that people don't care as long as its someone elses Grandparents.

    Scaremongering so they can keep dipping into the bond market and signing us up to as many ventilators and tests as possible,no doubt deals they have already promised to their paymasters and are just using all their tools to swing the population into accepting spending their children and grandchildren into debt slavery.

    You are quick to point out what one consultant said maybe you would do well to listen to other consultants,Prof. Michael O'Keefe Consultant Surgeon in the Mater in Dublin tonight just said he doesn't see any use in the 2km or 5km along with most of the restrictions he said makes no sense.

    He also said with all his patients he is seeing missing appointments with hospitals virtually closed,in his opinion it will definitely cause more deaths than the actual virus itself.


  • #8344
    Arghus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,151 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    hopalongcass wrote: »
    Scaremongering so they can keep dipping into the bond market and signing us up to as many ventilators and tests as possible,no doubt deals they have already promised to their paymasters and are just using all their tools to swing the population into accepting spending their children and grandchildren into debt slavery.

    tinfoil hat stuff


  • #8345
    Arghus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,151 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    hopalongcass wrote: »
    You are quick to point out what one consultant said maybe you would do well to listen to other consultants,Prof. Michael O'Keefe Consultant Surgeon in the Mater in Dublin tonight just said he doesn't see any use in the 2km or 5km along with most of the restrictions he said makes no sense.

    I watched Prof O' Keefe on the tonight show earlier - and not for the first time.

    As usual, his opinions about the lockdown were completely at odds with every opinion I've heard expressed by every single other medical expert since the beginning of this crisis.

    You can say our fellow poster is pulling figures out of his arse, but months ago he did predict our death rate by May with frightening accuracy.

    I sincerely hope he's way off this time.


  • #8346
    hopalongcass
    Closed Accounts Posts: 109 ✭✭hopalongcass


    Arghus wrote: »
    tinfoil hat stuff

    Facts are now" tinfoil hat stuff',what a bizarre world we are turning into up is down and down is up.

    If you weren't a shill and were actually here for reasonable debate i would point you towards plenty of economists who are of the same opinion that the debt we are taking on for this is on a scale we can't sustain without drastic cuts across the board over the next few years,far worse than we ever seen.

    But obviously pointless,because you are just here to shill and sway opinion towards endless lockdowns.

    But whatever your angle in this and you are obviously doing ok financially at the minute to be here cheering on this madness,but as much as you might be having fun now i assure you pain is going to come your way too.

    It's not going to just be dumped on the masses as usual(they will try no doubt)but this is gonna hit everyone and unless you are in the elite of the elite in this country you are going to feel whats coming in the next couple of years and in reality you deserve it because you went along with this madness.

    Its the rest of us who didn't agree with this that doesn't deserve what is coming down the line.


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  • #8347
    Arghus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,151 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    I'm not arguing in favour of endless lockdowns, I never have been.

    I am not a member of any elite. I work for just above minimum wage.

    Economic pain is coming no matter what, I've never denied that.


  • #8348
    Salty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,116 ✭✭✭Salty


    jmayo wrote: »
    I am fooking tired of this shyte about how the younger generations have it so such more difficult.

    Younger generations, anyone that was born after mid 1980s have for the most part has had the option of staying in this state.
    A fooking option not afforded to most people of previous generations.
    Yes there was downturn after construction bubble burst, but it seemed to afford a fair share a chance to go on almighty p**sup in Australia.

    Younger generations have enjoyed unknown advantages never before experienced by most people born in this state.
    Talk to older generations and find out how they had to travel to find a job and a life, not a fooking stag weekend or a post exam pi**up.

    Most people of older generations, the ones that some now want to see sacrificed to this disease, did not have access to second level education never mind fooking third level.
    Now almost everyone gets a shot at some third level or other.

    And another thing that a fair few of our older generations had to suffer was war because when they did emigrate some of them ended up in foreign armies fighting a real war.
    Some made the ultimate sacrifice for not alone their adopted country, but also the world as a whole.

    But some of the fookers today see the fact they can't go out and down the pub as the ultimate sacrifice.

    Every generation has their share of struggles. This is a fact. And it is also a fact that the current generation of young people are struggling hugely to acquire their first home. Can we all be a bit more acknowledging that everyone has struggled and is struggling, rather than deriding whole generations and calling them soft. I am thundering towards 30 and I am still years away from buying a house...I want to get back to work so I can continue to save, couldn't give a crap about drinking in pubs.
    SusieBlue wrote: »
    All cervical cancer screenings, smear tests & colposcopies have been cancelled until further notice. Early intervention is critical with this cancer, yet no services can be accessed nationwide by anyone.

    I doubt they want yet another health scandal on their hands but at this point it’s inevitable.
    There are going to be a lot of people who were either delayed in accessing services, or who couldn’t access services at all, who will be furious in a few months when the repercussions from paralysing our hospitals & health system becomes clear.

    The colposcopy clinic in Cork is still operating according to my GP. But it seems that whether clinics continue or not is left to their own discretion, and many up and down the country are closed. Extremely worrying stuff. Cancer waits for no pandemic.


  • #8349
    FintanMcluskey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,621 ✭✭✭FintanMcluskey


    Arghus wrote: »
    Most of you here would do well to read the words of the poster in this thread. A consultant in an Irish hospital, whose hard factual information has been extremely sobering over the last few weeks.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=113352900#post113352900

    This answer to a question from earlier today, should shock some of you back to reality, but I doubt it at this stage:

    Read them alright. My opinion is
    -Public health advice is an incredibly sensitive subject that needs to be handled with extreme caution to avoid causing unnecessary anxiety among vulnerable people. Many medical professionals are disagreeing now on this virus (see Dr Marcus Brun)
    -As the per the last statement in the quote, this is not my fault and nobody will force me to accept responsibility for Covid, or am I at fault for suggesting the economic catastrophe looming Ireland requires consideration. Ireland has plans for restrictions months after Europe.


  • #8350
    Arghus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,151 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    FintanMcluskey wrote: »
    Read them alright. My opinion is
    -Public health advice is an incredibly sensitive subject that needs to be handled with extreme caution to avoid causing unnecessary anxiety among vulnerable people. Many medical professionals are disagreeing now on this virus (see Dr Marcus Brun)
    -As the per the last statement in the quote, this is not my fault and nobody will force me to accept responsibility for Covid, or am I at fault for suggesting the economic catastrophe looming Ireland requires consideration. Ireland has plans for restrictions months after Europe.

    The ranting of Marcus de Brún does not constitute disagreement from "many medical professionals".

    Ireland's plan for restrictions that are phased over months will change depending on how things progress. They aren't 100% guaranteed. It's been said countless times since they were put forward that parts of the plan will be accelerated if the conditions are right.

    If transmission rates, ICU admissions and death rates stay reliably low enough there is zero chance that the final restrictions will last until August. Things will open up far before then if that is the case. The political pressure on the government will be too strong. Despite how many people here talk about it the state has actually nothing to gain in extending the lockdown past the point where it is unnecessary.

    Believes it or not I hope that this happens. I would love it, truly love it if we could have a relatively normal life again sooner rather than later. But my opinion is that we have moved too fast and it will ultimately cost us more in the long run.

    Time will tell.


  • #8351
    FintanMcluskey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,621 ✭✭✭FintanMcluskey


    Arghus wrote: »
    The ranting of Marcus de Brún does not constitute disagreement from "many medical professionals".

    Whatever it is in your opinion the guy is a GP who was elected to the Irish medical council by Simon Harris


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  • #8352
    kaymin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,551 ✭✭✭kaymin


    Arghus wrote: »
    I watched Prof O' Keefe on the tonight show earlier - and not for the first time.

    As usual, his opinions about the lockdown were completely at odds with every opinion I've heard expressed by every single other medical expert since the beginning of this crisis.

    You can say our fellow poster is pulling figures out of his arse, but months ago he did predict our death rate by May with frightening accuracy.

    I sincerely hope he's way off this time.

    Over 60% of deaths have been in nursing homes - this should never have happened. Our death rate would have been far far less except for the incompetence of our government and CMO.


  • #8353
    pjohnson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,013 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    Ah I missed this thread. Nice to see the same boyos whipping up a frenzy!


  • #8354
    Pitch n Putt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 581 ✭✭✭Pitch n Putt


    uli84 wrote: »
    Got informed today that screening will be restarted “as soon as it is deemed safe to do so”, anybody knows when that is?
    We’re talking here about 1:1 appointment lasting 5 minutes max

    Yeah true and all the private clinics will reopen with 5 minute consultations too and that’ll be €250 for the consultation , thank very much sir.

    From the same consultants that refused to assist with the Covid crisis.


  • #8355
    lawrencesummers
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,786 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    kaymin wrote: »
    Over 60% of deaths have been in nursing homes - this should never have happened. Our death rate would have been far far less except for the incompetence of our government and CMO.

    And so another day begins with another expert in hindsight Weighing in


  • #8356
    lawrencesummers
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,786 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    Pitch n Putt wrote: »
    Yeah true and that’ll be €250 for the consultation , thank very much sir.

    From the same consultants that refused to assist with the Covid crisis.

    Don’t forget cash only, we don’t want to be taking debit or credit cards because then you run the risk of having to pay tax on all your income.


  • #8357
    Arghus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,151 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    kaymin wrote: »
    Over 60% of deaths have been in nursing homes - this should never have happened. Our death rate would have been far far less except for the incompetence of our government and CMO.

    Big mistakes were made in the handling of the threat faced by nursing homes. I agree with you 100%.

    But if we are concerned about the ongoing risk to nursing homes then we should all exercise extra caution in our attitude and behaviours, towards preventing further spread of the disease in the community. People from outside bring the disease into nursing homes and we all know know how dangerous it is for nursing home residents.

    So if you want to do something as an individual to protect the future health of nursing home residents, well then be responsible in trying to curb the further spread of the virus in the wider community, which inevitably leads to further infection in care home and nursing home settings. Stick with the restrictions, don't give the virus a chance to spread.


  • #8358
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    wrote:
    To put it into perspective we would normally have about 31,000 dead in a 12 month period so that 15,000 would mean 46,000 dead in the 12 month period which is a roughly 50% spike in deaths. That is very significant.
    Can anyone spot the gaping hole in that analysis?


  • #8359
    Loozer
    Closed Accounts Posts: 168 ✭✭Loozer


    Arghus wrote: »
    Big mistakes were made in the handling of the threat faced by nursing homes. I agree with you 100%.

    But if we are concerned about the ongoing risk to nursing homes then we should all exercise extra caution in our attitude and behaviours, towards preventing further spread of the disease in the community. People from outside bring the disease into nursing homes and we all know know how dangerous it is for nursing home residents.

    So if you want to do something as an individual to protect the future health of nursing home residents, well then be responsible in trying to curb the further spread of the virus in the wider community, which inevitably leads to further infection in care home and nursing home settings. Stick with the restrictions, don't give the virus a chance to spread.

    Not sure about this^

    The nursing home residents need to be isolated from the wider community, virus is going to spread in the community regardless


  • #8360
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 4,727 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Arghus wrote: »
    Most of you here would do well to read the words of the poster in this thread. A consultant in an Irish hospital, whose hard factual information has been extremely sobering over the last few weeks.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=113352900#post113352900

    This answer to a question from earlier today, should shock some of you back to reality, but I doubt it at this stage:

    HSE or not, That guy is a scaremongering, doomsday nut. I argued with him back in Jan/Feb when he was saying that 300000 Irish would die.

    Seems he is massively backtracking now and yet still predicting numbers that just won’t happen if we properly protect care homes.

    He also told people he had a 20% chance of dying if he caught Covid.

    He also explained how he takes hours upon hours to decontaminate his groceries that get delivered.

    Read the tone of his posts. Smacks of someone who thinks he is better than everyone in society. I ignored him long ago and so should you all.


  • #8361
    celt262
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,719 ✭✭✭celt262


    kaymin wrote: »
    Over 60% of deaths have been in nursing homes - this should never have happened. Our death rate would have been far far less except for the incompetence of our government and CMO.

    How would you suggest the government could have kept it out of nursing homes? It has been a problem worldwide.


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  • #8362
    snowcat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,218 ✭✭✭snowcat


    gozunda wrote: »
    It does not matter whether you or anyone are mandated not to mix with he "over 70s". Their carers live in the wider community. There is no way that those in nursing homes (with the current issue of care home outbreaks) and other elderly people can totally effectively cocoon or completely socially isolate whilst staff and carers interact with them but also others in the wider community. There are calls for care staff to completely isolate but I've no idea whether that's totally realistic either.

    But more importantly - the issue of Covid-19 is not only with the over 70s and those in care homes. Only half the current deaths can be attributed to this cohort. Vulneralbities exist across all age groups - whether asthma, diabetes or other long term illnesses. And the disease affects a significant proportion of otherwise healthy under 70 year olds and results in a significant number of those infected being hospitalised.

    And precisely because of this - countries across the would have adopted restrictions to control the numbers of those infected and to prevent health services being overrun. This is not unique to Ireland btw. It is a fact that many other countries are further along with their restrictions and / or have varying demographics than us.

    There is a lot that could be done with nursing homes to mitigate risk. Resources and testing should have been prioritised in those settings. Thousands of tests and capacity was wasted on the worried well. Test every health care worker and every resident daily for example. Essential visitors too.


  • #8363
    Nickindublin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 724 ✭✭✭Nickindublin


    Balf wrote: »
    The last phase, 10 August. Before that, just shops with their own entrance

    I don’t get this. Most shopping centres are open as pharmacy and supermarket operate in them.


  • #8364
    Bobtheman
    Site Banned Posts: 2,799 ✭✭✭Bobtheman


    Black market in hair dressing is all over the place. It's ok for Paschal Donohue. He has hardly any hair.


  • #8365
    Penfailed
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,679 ✭✭✭Penfailed


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    Those unfortunate cases are extremely rare for anyone that age

    Don't you think that there may be a correlation due to the fact that we've had a lockdown? Would they be less rare if we had carried on as normal? There's no way to tell though.

    Gigs '24 - Ben Ottewell and Ian Ball (Gomez), The Jesus & Mary Chain, The Smashing Pumpkins/Weezer, Pearl Jam, Green Day, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Electric Picnic, Pixies, Ride, Therapy?, Public Service Broadcasting, IDLES, And So I Watch You From Afar

    Gigs '25 - Spiritualized, Supergrass, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Queens of the Stone Age, Electric Picnic, Vantastival



  • #8366
    Nickindublin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 724 ✭✭✭Nickindublin


    celt262 wrote: »
    How would you suggest the government could have kept it out of nursing homes? It has been a problem worldwide.

    Didn’t they recommend the closure of playgrounds a full week before nursing homes. Absolute disgrace.


  • #8367
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 3,656 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Bobtheman wrote: »
    Black market in hair dressing is all over the place. It's ok for Paschal Donohue. He has hardly any hair.

    He actually has a fantastic head of hair! :confused:


  • #8368
    Nermal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,836 ✭✭✭Nermal


    The chap who helped start the panic party, reneging on his promises.

    https://twitter.com/JordanSchachtel/status/1257811977272950784


  • #8369
    Nickindublin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 724 ✭✭✭Nickindublin


    Bobtheman wrote: »
    Black market in hair dressing is all over the place. It's ok for Paschal Donohue. He has hardly any hair.

    That will be a massive problem. House to house to another house. 4 or 5 clients in one house.


  • #8370
    celt262
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,719 ✭✭✭celt262


    Nickindublin wrote: »
    Didn’t they recommend the closure of playgrounds a full week before nursing homes. Absolute disgrace.

    They cant close nursing homes.


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  • #8371
    Jackman25
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 456 ✭✭Jackman25


    Deleted User wrote: »
    HSE or not, That guy is a scaremongering, doomsday nut. I argued with him back in Jan/Feb when he was saying that 300000 Irish would die.

    Seems he is massively backtracking now and yet still predicting numbers that just won’t happen if we properly protect care homes.

    He also told people he had a 20% chance of dying if he caught Covid.

    He also explained how he takes hours upon hours to decontaminate his groceries that get delivered.

    Read the tone of his posts. Smacks of someone who thinks he is better than everyone in society. I ignored him long ago and so should you all.

    I stopped reading after the following paragraph:
    I also suggested in a post earlier in this thread that what would determine our death toll over the next year would be the balance that would have to be struck between acceptable casualties and economic/social activity. At the time I said that everyone was backing the lockdown but, unfortunately, as I expected, human nature, short-sightedness and selfishness are presenting themselves again and already a significant minority of people are openly admitted they're happy to return to normal so long as they're only killing other peoples' parents/grandparents.

    Like something one of the loons or trolls on here would say. And bull**** also. Where has anyone openly admitted what he said here.


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