Relaxation of restrictions Part II

Tokyo

Continuation of the "Relaxation of restrictions" from here.

Please note that all mod warnings and threadbans carry through from the previous thread.

Polar101

lillyfae wrote:

On this. I don't understand why it's all a cloak of secrecy. Why can't they just outline what they are planning to do and then continue planning it until it happens? Why can't they even trust the public to have a bit of information? Plans are likely to change as the situation is doing, but the Irish government don't want to release anything until the concrete has dried.

2 weeks (well, almost) is a long time during this pandemic. In two weeks the number of new cases will probably be quite different to what it is now, and then there will be some data available from countries such as Czechia and Austria on how the lifting of restrictions is going on. So there's no real point in publishing plans now, as there is very little benefit in that and I'm pretty sure none of their plans are finalised anyway.

Assetbacked

Bundesliga due to resume in May and finish the season by the end of June. Think that's about 7 matches.

Nil_fhios_agam

As released by the Government yesterday any social gathering of greater than 5k are banned until September.

Can someone explain the logic of selecting the 5k figure? Surely, if even one person had Covid19 within this 5k population at a music festival, that'll have the same exponential dangerous increase whether it were 5k or 7k? As in not all the 5k or 7k population may not get Covid19 at the social gathering but exponentially 100s will still get infected and travel back home to spread it to family and friends.

Will it be okay to have 4,999 people at a party but not 5,001??

Alkers

All that the announcement said was that any event with over 5,000 would be automatically not even considered for a license. That doesn't mean that anything below 5,000 will be automatically granted one. It will depend on the event and the social distancing measures that can be implemented at each particular event I would imagine.

Away With The Fairies

Nil_fhios_agam wrote: »

As released by the Government yesterday any social gathering of greater than 5k are banned until September.

Can someone explain the logic of selecting the 5k figure? Surely, if even one person had Covid19 within this 5k population at a music festival, that'll have the same exponential dangerous increase whether it were 5k or 7k? As in not all the 5k or 7k population may not get Covid19 at the social gathering but exponentially 100s will still get infected and travel back home to spread it to family and friends.

Will it be okay to have 4,999 people at a party but not 5,001??

There won't be a music festival or concert with 4,999 people. If an organizer can't make it safe and guarantee social distancing, they won't be getting a licence.

drunkmonkey

Your into a whole different arena when it comes to planning and resources required, that's why you'll see little festivals with less than 5000 tickets, independence in cork is one example. The 5k number is nothing new here.

seamus

Events of over 5,000 people require a licence. Events under, don't.

That's where it came from, they're just saying that no large events will be licenced this Summer, not that events under 5,000 will still go ahead.

plodder

Yep, social distancing rules still apply. So, no responsible organisation is going to hold any event where all present can't keep 2 metres apart etc.

As one report observed, this sounds like the first step in letting the public know there isn't going to be any GAA championship or other major sporting event this year.

jester77

They had to put some number on it, I would assume they did some calculations.

In Germany, they are opening shops that have a size less than 800 sqm. When asked why this number, Merkel replied that they only wanted a certain % of shops opened at the start and 800 sqm was the point where they could hit that % number. They had no other metrics to quickly do this.

So it is probably something similar for the 5k number to cut down on a certain % of events.

Nil_fhios_agam

How can 5,000 people attend a social event yet still practice social distancing?

Why couldn't they just say 10k for all the difference it makes or make it a realistic 500

Nil_fhios_agam

seamus wrote: »

Events of over 5,000 people require a licence. Events under, don't.

That's where it came from, they're just saying that no large events will be licenced this Summer, not that events under 5,000 will still go ahead.

Okay I didn't know that.

But an event with 4,999 can go ahead?

What about group cycle events of say 2,000??

suicide_circus

i thought the thread title referred to the number of house parties my neighbours have had since restrictions began

plodder

Nil_fhios_agam wrote: »

What about group cycle events of say 2,000??

Depends on what kind of restrictions are in place at the time. It's impossible to know. This isn't a definitive statement of what will or won't be allowed.

Speakerboxx

Stupid putting out a number like that. Smaller festivals will go ahead now and they will say they have all social distancing in place.

Tacitus Kilgore

I now understand why we need these kinds of signs

drunkmonkey

Nil_fhios_agam wrote: »

Okay I didn't know that.

But an event with 4,999 can go ahead?

What about group cycle events of say 2,000??

I dunno about cycling or running anyone coughing or sneezing in front is going to give a few people behind them a good dose. Anything that requires running with the heard should be avoided just from a common sense perspective for your own safety.

drunkmonkey

Speakerboxx wrote: »

Stupid putting out a number like that. Smaller festivals will go ahead now and theys say they have all social distancing in place.

Social distancing is your own responsibility, don't go if you don't want to.

Hubertj

Assetbacked wrote: »

Bundesliga due to resume in May and finish the season by the end of June. Think that's about 7 matches.

some live sport at last!

Speakerboxx

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Social distancing is your own responsibility, don't go if you don't want to.

Another naive response. That doesn't stop the spread of the virus.

s1ippy

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Social distancing is your own responsibility, don't go if you don't want to.

What an amazing solution just like we have now. Oh wait we had to have a lockdown because people cannot be trusted with this.

The mere fact that local amenities are still having to be closed and monitored so that people don't flout the rules shows how much people think that this is something that happens to someone else.

drunkmonkey

Speakerboxx wrote: »

Another naive response. That doesn't stop the spread of the virus.

The virus shouldn't be spreading in 2 weeks, that's why we're in lockdown, if it is spreading it will be at a greatly reduced number. Social distancing isn't a law, self isolating isn't a law, cocooning isn't a law even if you have it, your being asked to do these things on a voluntary basis. No confirmed case not in a health care setting is being monitored for compliance.
What's naive is some people think we tuned into a Communist country like china since lockdown.

Beasty

Threads merged

Speakerboxx

drunkmonkey wrote: »

The virus shouldn't be spreading in 2 weeks, that's why we're in lockdown, if it is spreading it will be at a greatly reduced number. Social distancing isn't a law, self isolating isn't a law, cocooning isn't a law even if you have it, your being asked to do these things on a voluntary basis. No confirmed case not in a health care setting is being monitored for compliance.
What's naive is some people think we tuned into a Communist country like china since lockdown.

You still aren't getting it. Social distancing will be here for few months at the very least. How can a concert with less than 5000 people safely social distance? How do they control toilet ques without queing for a hour to use the toilet and safely social distance? Its not possible. You are naive if you think this is possible. Nothing communist about that.

Quantum Erasure

drunkmonkey wrote:

What's naive is some people think we tuned into a Communist country like china since lockdown.

And yet...

I think that some people sometimes take things too literally. I remember when the 2km was first announced, people were actually asking what to do if their local supermarket was 2.1km away... like use common sense.

We are still in lockdown at this moment in time.
Crowds of 5000 are banned until September.

Further communication will likely come to clarify crowds smaller than 5000.

Irish Aris

Assetbacked wrote: »

Bundesliga due to resume in May and finish the season by the end of June. Think that's about 7 matches.

There are 9 matches left in Bundesliga, so if they squeeze a couple of midweek gameweeks it's doable.

road_high

I see Suprmacs are re-opening now too. It's obvious, businesses can't go on any longer with this shutdown and must get the tills ringing again.

growleaves

Welcome to Ireland 2020.... not exactly the spirt of 1916, 104 years and here is where we are at, fûck... Dev, Collins, Griffith, Pearce, Connolly, Clarke, McDiarmada... died and fought for freedom, so people could live, not make shît loads of cash for others, international corporations and fûckin die in the process.

With every small business in the country nuked to oblivion, international corporations will be able to swoop in and buy up the shells of those businesses.

For instance instead of a countrywide network of independent pubs with Irish owners we could have all UK-owned megacorp chain pubs.

The effect will be the same as all the colonial crises of the 18th and 19th centuries where ordinary people lost their land-holdings and fell into an "open pit of pauperism". Except this time its considered blameless and unavoidable.

Tacitus Kilgore

Speakerboxx wrote: »

Stupid putting out a number like that. Smaller festivals will go ahead now and they will say they have all social distancing in place.

Speakerboxx wrote: »

Another naive response. That doesn't stop the spread of the virus.

Naiive people in glass houses.... and all that

goalscoringhero

Assetbacked wrote: »

Bundesliga due to resume in May and finish the season by the end of June. Think that's about 7 matches.

That statement is not true.

What is true is that there is a consideration put forward to restart season without spectators with strings attached:
- social distancing guidelines observed in all aspects
- continuous monitoring and testing of all involved

Health authorities would have to be onboard with this plan.

Source: https://www.spiegel.de/sport/fussball/geheimes-konzept-der-fussball-bundesliga-so-sollen-ab-mai-die-geisterspiele-aussehen-a-f9b327e5-580f-4bec-8ffb-5a84b4ed62fc

Irish Aris

I would be very surprised if they allow gatherings of 500, never mind 5000.
I just got a text from National Concert Hall that a concert I had on the 25th of May is now rescheduled for February 2021.

Again different country, but in Belgium my colleague told me that the easing of restrictions (May 4th for them) will allow gatherings of up to 10 people. She also plays tennis and the guidance will be up to 2 people allowed to play against each other, so only singles matches

I reckon something similar could happen here. This would allow people some more freedom of movement and the ability to meet with friends and family without going completely crazy about it. If this works, then more restrictions to be lifted after the June bank holiday weekend.

NuttyMcNutty

I think they should allow hardware and garden centers open so people can stay at home gardening or doing up the house especially coming up to bank holiday, people are bored and want to get out off the house, If I could get my hands on paint I'd paint the whole fcking house and I'm sure a lot off others would do the same and keep them in the house.

goalscoringhero

jester77 wrote: »

They had to put some number on it, I would assume they did some calculations.

In Germany, they are opening shops that have a size less than 800 sqm. When asked why this number, Merkel replied that they only wanted a certain % of shops opened at the start and 800 sqm was the point where they could hit that % number. They had no other metrics to quickly do this.

So it is probably something similar for the 5k number to cut down on a certain % of events.

The 800 sqm limit was chosen to prevent megastores opening and drawing big crowds into the shopping areas, which would make social distancing more difficult as a result.

facehugger99

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Social distancing is your own responsibility, don't go if you don't want to.

I'd imagine most of the bunker-brigade rarely venture out of their darkened bedrooms, much less attend outdoor festivals.

Nil_fhios_agam

Nil_fhios_agam wrote: »

What about group cycle events of say 2,000??

I’m wondering about the Ring of Beara, rescheduled for August 29. I’d love it to go ahead - something to look forward to - but I don’t see it

s1ippy

NuttyMcNutty wrote: »

I think they should allow hardware and garden centers open so people can stay at home gardening or doing up the house especially coming up to bank holiday, people are bored and want to get out off the house, If I could get my hands on paint I'd paint the whole fcking house and I'm sure a lot off others would do the same and keep them in the house.

Make sure tis well ventilated or you'll be off your game for weeks.

KrustyUCC

Irish Aris wrote: »

I would be very surprised if they allow gatherings of 500, never mind 5000.
I just got a text from National Concert Hall that a concert I had on the 25th of May is now rescheduled for February 2021.

Again different country, but in Belgium my colleague told me that the easing of restrictions (May 4th for them) will allow gatherings of up to 10 people. She also plays tennis and the guidance will be up to 2 people allowed to play against each other, so only singles matches

I reckon something similar could happen here. This would allow people some more freedom of movement and the ability to meet with friends and family without going completely crazy about it. If this works, then more restrictions to be lifted after the June bank holiday weekend.

Good Post

Would be great even if we could have gatherings of up to 5 initially and able to travel to meet people

Porthallian

Might be the wrong thread so apologies, but with relaxing of restrictions do people foresee flights becoming available for foreign travel?
This isn't for a carefree holiday, my girlfriend is from Spain and despite the worse situation over there, she is desperate to get home to her family (particularly her elderly father).

I know as things stand you can book flights after the 5th May date. But probably no point until we see how things stand after that. Hard to put a timeframe on it but I'd like to be able to give her some hope.

NuttyMcNutty

NuttyMcNutty wrote: »

I think they should allow hardware and garden centers open so people can stay at home gardening or doing up the house especially coming up to bank holiday, people are bored and want to get out off the house, If I could get my hands on paint I'd paint the whole fcking house and I'm sure a lot off others would do the same and keep them in the house.

I’d say these premises will be among the first to open. Maybe they could do it on a booking system of hour time slots to ensure not too many in the store at any one time.

Pitch n Putt

KrustyUCC wrote: »

Good Post

Would be great even if we could have gatherings of up to 5 initially and able to travel to meet people

It’s necessary now for restrictions to be lifted and 5,10,20 people initially is fine but people are going to have to get used to being in crowds again because this virus is going nowhere and we can’t continue to restrict gatherings whilst waiting for a vaccine that may never arrive.

First of all and most important is getting back to visiting family and keep that contact going then expand from there.

We were never meant to have grandparents see their grandchildren growing up on video calls.

We have to get away from the fear factor and aim for some normality before everyone forgets what normal used to be like.

Irish Aris

Porthallian wrote: »

Might be the wrong thread so apologies, but with relaxing of restrictions do people foresee flights becoming available for foreign travel?
This isn't for a carefree holiday, my girlfriend is from Spain and despite the worse situation over there, she is desperate to get home to her family (particularly her elderly father).

I know as things stand you can book flights after the 5th May date. But probably no point until we see how things stand after that. Hard to put a timeframe on it but I'd like to be able to give her some hope.

I reckon flights would be available, but like you say you need to wait and see how things will play out here and in Spain. I guess there could be some self isolating involved, probably though something she could leave with.
Hope all goes well for you, your girlfriend and your families

Porthallian

Irish Aris wrote: »

I reckon flights would be available, but like you say you need to wait and see how things will play out here and in Spain. I guess there could be some self isolating involved, probably though something she could leave with.
Hope all goes well for you, your girlfriend and your families

They are definitely available, I guess we will wait until the 5th for a further announcement and if we book flights ensure we have enough insurance cover.
It's a scary time and very upsetting to see her struggle. Self isolation wouldn't be an issue at all. We'd stay in her family home for the 2 weeks no problem.
Thank you very much, that's really kind.
Hope you and everyone in the forum are safe and well!

Cork Boy 53

road_high wrote: »

I see Suprmacs are re-opening now too. It's obvious, businesses can't go on any longer with this shutdown and must get the tills ringing again.

Only for takeaways though.

normanoffside

facehugger99 wrote: »

I'd imagine most of the bunker-brigade rarely venture out of their darkened bedrooms, much less attend outdoor festivals.

I'm noticing a trend in the bunker brigade.
They dominate this thread from about 4pm onward every day but never seem to be around before midday.

I wonder what the reason is?

Cork Boy 53

Deleted User wrote: »

I’d say these premises will be among the first to open. Maybe they could do it on a booking system of hour time slots to ensure not too many in the store at any one time.

One of my local hardware/DIY stores has already been doing this since last week.

seamus

Nil_fhios_agam wrote: »

Okay I didn't know that.

But an event with 4,999 can go ahead?

No. But it doesn't require a licence.

This was merely a direction to local councils to reject all applications they have sitting on their desks, and it provides a teaser of what we as a population can expect for the next 6 months.

One can argue that a plan should be made and communicated in one go, but slowly drip-feeding out the certainties will make it all less of a shock when the plan is set out.

road_high

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

Only for takeaways though.

Baby steps, baby steps. Businesses are sensible and will keep any risk to an absolute minimum.

ZX7R

Porthallian wrote: »

They are definitely available, I guess we will wait until the 5th for a further announcement and if we book flights ensure we have enough insurance cover.
It's a scary time and very upsetting to see her struggle. Self isolation wouldn't be an issue at all. We'd stay in her family home for the 2 weeks no problem.
Thank you very much, that's really kind.
Hope you and everyone in the forum are safe and well!

Seemly a member of the EU commission stated yesterday that family members will be able to travel in the EU to visit or return to their country.
I can't find an official statement on it though.
Worth bearing in mind even if the Irish government has an advisory not to fly to another country it is only an advisory if a flight is scheduled the flights would still go ahead , travel insurance may not cover you in this circumstances.

mooseknunkle

NuttyMcNutty wrote: »

I think they should allow hardware and garden centers open so people can stay at home gardening or doing up the house especially coming up to bank holiday, people are bored and want to get out off the house, If I could get my hands on paint I'd paint the whole fcking house and I'm sure a lot off others would do the same and keep them in the house.

I wish they would allow them to open too,my local woodies is twice the size of the lidl next to it and it has big aisles that are easy to maintain social distancing for both staff and customers!,it would keep people occupied at home if they had a few projects to do.

Cork Boy 53

road_high wrote: »

Baby steps, baby steps. Businesses are sensible and will keep any risk to an absolute minimum.

I hope you`re right. Time will tell I suppose.