Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

splinter65 · 06-09-2019 04:43PM

Cupp3r wrote: »

When the Psychiatrist reports are due recording to reports. Id imagine the day wont be made public untill the evening before.

The judge probably has the psych reports now and is studying them and reflecting on them and getting further advise pre sentencing. He’ll have to spend some time then coming to a decision about an appropriate sentence.

Ralph Ciffereto · 06-09-2019 04:47PM

Cupp3r wrote: »

I have no interest in knowing their names personally. It's your right I suppose if that interests you. But more so for the Kriegel family I'd rather they faded into obscurity and names never mentioned again. The very mention of the name who have murdered their beautiful daughter will bring it all back up.

I can't speak for them. Maybe they do want them forgotten about. I'd wager most people in that position would want them exposed. They'd want the case to follow them forever, impacting their ability to get a job, or to acquire a relationship with anyone other than types like that Russian lunatic who was writing to Graham Dwyer.

abff · 06-09-2019 04:57PM

I think most people would prefer that anyone capable of doing what they did could not possible exist in the first case.

iamwhoiam · 06-09-2019 05:01PM

abff wrote: »

I think most people would prefer that anyone capable of doing what they did could not possible exist in the first case.

Most ? Everyone I would presume .
Personally I would like to know who they so my granddaughters will never encounter them in the future

Vicarious Function · 06-09-2019 06:24PM

Ralph Ciffereto wrote: »

I can't speak for them. Maybe they do want them forgotten about. I'd wager most people in that position would want them exposed. They'd want the case to follow them forever, impacting their ability to get a job, or to acquire a relationship with anyone other than types like that Russian lunatic who was writing to Graham Dwyer.

I just saw an update on the Menendez brothers who murdered their parents out of selfishness and are in prison for life without parole - they are both married now!!!! :eek: :eek:

hatrickpatrick · 06-09-2019 06:29PM

The reason Boy B was more widely named and people were more interested in his identity is most likely because his father outed himself as a complete and utter scumbag in court, and I think most people are now making the fair assumption that there’s a real possibility of his savagery being directly related to being brought up by said complete and utter scumbag. Apples and trees, etc. His father sounds like the kind of person who should be totally ostracized from society and I suspect that this is why more people are interested in knowing who he is vs Boy A.

tuxy · 06-09-2019 07:49PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The reason Boy B was more widely named and people were more interested in his identity is most likely because his father outed himself as a complete and utter scumbag in court, and I think most people are now making the fair assumption that there’s a real possibility of his savagery being directly related to being brought up by said complete and utter scumbag. Apples and trees, etc. His father sounds like the kind of person who should be totally ostracized from society and I suspect that this is why more people are interested in knowing who he is vs Boy A.

But a relative of Boy B was attacked when the trial was ongoing and before that incident you talk about.
People what the names as it helps play out their revenge fantasies and a small number of those people may actully carry it out.

McCrack · 06-09-2019 08:37PM

murderer A and murderer B is more suitable description

monty_python · 06-09-2019 08:41PM

McCrack wrote: »

murderer A and murderer B is more suitable description

Has the sentencing happened yet ?

headnorth · 06-09-2019 08:47PM

monty_python wrote:

Has the sentencing happened yet ?

No. Full details will be up on the courts.ie website, under legal diary, the day before they are sentenced. Court room number, time, judge etc will all be up there.

splinter65 · 06-09-2019 08:56PM

monty_python wrote: »

Has the sentencing happened yet ?

No it’ll be some time in October.

GT_TDI_150 · 06-09-2019 10:36PM

McCrack wrote: »

murderer A and murderer B is more suitable description

As long as they introduce themself to you by those names when they move in next door after theiy are released, but id bet their identities may be changed come release time, robeet thompson and jon venables style.

Road-Hog · 07-09-2019 06:47AM

McCrack wrote: »

murderer A and murderer B is more suitable description

They are more than just murderers....’sadistic sexual deviant abominations’.........

Why does the judge have to so ‘thorough’ before sentencing is it to ensure that grounds for appeal are reduced? These ‘freaks of nature’ deserve the absolute maximum period of time ‘locked up’.....most likely he will not impose the max......seeking psychological reports from experts etc can only mean one outcome ie thay he will take into account their ‘genetic disorder/flaws’ /poor parenting etc and reduce the duration of their time in ‘detention’.......I’m going to guess they serve ten years max.......

Also find it still very disturbing when you read about the suggestion by the defense for A/B that the sexual part of the attack could have been ‘consensual’.,,,just imagine how upsetting and insensitive it was for anas parents to have to sit and listen to this plus also her mother was asked to confirm that Ana had condoms under her pillow/somewhere in her bedroom....but of course they the defense are only doing job we are told, it’s their constitutional right to have a defense and up to the state to convince the jury of their guilt......how anyone could remotely suggest that the whole thing was a ‘sexual encounter’ that got out of hand given the evidence to the contrary is just astounding.....50 plus barbaric wounds inflicted on the poor girl then dragged around a room and left semi if not totally naked....

splinter65 · 07-09-2019 08:40AM

If you don’t get the basics of our justice system ( which is the only justice system in this world that works) then you just don’t get it.
In order to make sure that Ana Kriegel got justice the trial had to give the defenders of the murderers every opportunity to prove that they weren’t guilty.
They put forward all their evidence. The jury didn’t believe them. They were found guilty. That’s justice.
We can’t sentence guilty people based on our emotional reaction to the crimes.
If we did that then there would be no need for judges to decide the sentence.
A mob would decide the sentence.
That’s what happens in some very miserable places and it doesn’t work.
The murderers weren’t born evil.
They became evil.
What made them evil?
Their parents went wrong somewhere either by deliberately teaching them that they could do whatever they liked with no consequences (unlikely) or just not spending enough time making sure that they knew the difference between right and wrong (more likely).
For that, the murderers are not responsible. The psychological report will reveal the level to which the murderers will need treatment in order to try and correct the damage that’s been done by parental neglect.
The judge has to balance this against punishing them for deliberately putting a beautiful girl to a horrific execution and her being in her grave.
The judge also needs to protect us from them.
The judge also needs to send a message to other potential murderers that their lives will be more or less over if they attempt this.
So, it’s all quite complicated and I’m glad I’m not the judge.

Kidchameleon · 07-09-2019 08:49AM

splinter65 wrote: »

Their parents went wrong somewhere either by deliberately teaching them that they could do whatever they liked with no consequences (unlikely) or just not spending enough time making sure that they knew the difference between right and wrong (more likely).

As has been discussed many, MANY times on this very thread, plenty of evil people were brought up in good homes. How do you explain A's and B's siblings leading very healthy, normal lives?

splinter65 wrote: »

for deliberately putting a beautiful girl to a horrific execution

What have her looks got to do with it. Again, that is a creepy as f**k thing to say

splinter65 wrote: »

So, it’s all quite complicated and I’m glad I’m not the judge.

I'm really glad your not the judge too :eek:

splinter65 · 07-09-2019 08:53AM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

As has been discussed many, MANY times on this very thread, plenty of evil people were brought up in good homes. How do you explain A's and B's siblings leading very healthy, normal lives?

What have her looks got to do with it. Again, that is a creepy as f**k thing to say

I'm really glad your not the judge too :eek:

How do you know that the siblings live healthy normal lives? You just don’t know is the answer.
As discussed here before on this thread you are the only person posting here who thinks this is creepy. The fact that you clearly attribute sexual connotations to describing a child as beautiful says it all about how your mind works, tbh. So cop yourself on.

07-09-2019 09:00AM

personally i couldnt give two hoots about the families of boy a or b.

Kidchameleon · 07-09-2019 09:09AM

splinter65 wrote: »

How do you know that the siblings live healthy normal lives? You just don’t know is the answer.

You have constantly tried to extract information from me about the identity of A and B, stop it right now.

splinter65 wrote: »

As discussed here before on this thread you are the only person posting here who thinks this is creepy.

Well I am the only person with the balls to call it out. It is messed up. You can say whatever you want about her without having to mention her physical appearance, plenty of posters have managed that. Also, I did not say anything about sexual connotations, that is your pathetic attempt to silence me, its not going to work my friend.

Kidchameleon · 07-09-2019 09:10AM

Deleted User wrote: »

personally i couldnt give two hoots about the families of boy a or b.

There's a difference between not giving a hoot about them and blaming them on a horrific murder

splinter65 · 07-09-2019 09:24AM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

You have constantly tried to extract information from me about the identity of A and B, stop it right now.

Well I am the only person with the balls to call it out. It is messed up. You can say whatever you want about her without having to mention her physical appearance, plenty of posters have managed that. Also, I did not say anything about sexual connotations, that is your pathetic attempt to silence me, its not going to work my friend.

I’m not your friend.
You know nothing about the siblings of the two murderers. Nobody cares wether you do or not.
You’ve described referring to children being beautiful as “creepy” despite it being a widespread practice, throughout the world across all cultures. Other posters have pulled you on this. It’s reflective of you, not me. It’s not indicative of you having “balls”, btw.
I’ll take this opportunity to remind posters here that earlier in this thread you partially blamed Ana Kriegels father for her death because apparently he allowed his teenage daughter to leave the house on a bright sunny early evening instead of keeping her locked up.
You also used inverted commas (“parents”) when referring to the Kriegels as apparently the fact that she was adopted relegates them somewhat in your eyes, particularly when it comes to murderer Bs father who in your opinion is a shining guiding beacon of parenthood who is deserving of far more respect and sympathy in the courtroom then the parents of the victim.
Enough.

Kidchameleon · 07-09-2019 11:15AM

My friend, I simply pointed out that Patric did not know who Ana was going out with that evening and if A&B's parents are responsible for the crime because they did not know what their boys were up to (as posters were arguing) then Patric should have some blame apportioned to himself. I was pointing out a hypocrisy and I was right though it was not easy for me to say. Patric is a lovely man and Ana was lucky to be adopted by him.

splinter65 wrote: »

You know nothing about the siblings of the two murderers. Nobody cares wether you do or not.

Well then stop hinting at me to tell you weather I do or not.

McCrack · 07-09-2019 11:22AM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

My friend, I simply pointed out that Patric did not know who Ana was going out with that evening and if A&B's parents are responsible for the crime because they did not know what their boys were up to (as posters were arguing) then Patric should have some blame apportioned to himself. I was pointing out a hypocrisy and I was right though it was not easy for me to say. Patric is a lovely man and Ana was lucky to be adopted by him.

Well then stop hinting at me to tell you weather I do or not.

Here we go again

splinter65 · 07-09-2019 11:23AM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

My friend, I simply pointed out that Patric did not know who Ana was going out with that evening and if A&B's parents are responsible for the crime because they did not know what their boys were up to (as posters were arguing) then Patric should have some blame apportioned to himself. I was pointing out a hypocrisy and I was right though it was not easy for me to say. Patric is a lovely man and Ana was lucky to be adopted by him.

Well then stop hinting at me to tell you weather I do or not.

I’m not sure if you misread the signals from women in your life generally or if it’s just here, (I’ve a feeling you do) but I’m not “hinting” at you and for the second time, I’m not your friend.
That’s enough to get you spoken to about harassment these days in an actual social/work setting but ...carry on..

Portsalon · 07-09-2019 11:33AM

splinter65 wrote: »

The murderers weren’t born evil.

Given that people are born every day who are physically or mentally ill, or both - I hope that description doesn't cause offence to anyone - how can you be certain that people cannot be born evil?

Kidchameleon · 07-09-2019 11:41AM

Portsalon wrote: »

Given that people are born every day who are physically or mentally ill, or both - I hope that description doesn't cause offence to anyone - how can you be certain that people cannot be born evil?

100% agreed. The same disgusting attitude was used in the past to attack homosexuals

splinter65 · 07-09-2019 11:45AM

Portsalon wrote: »

Given that people are born every day who are physically or mentally ill, or both - I hope that description doesn't cause offence to anyone - how can you be certain that people cannot be born evil?

You’re absolutely right. I’ve no expertise at all in this area, I think it’s probably that I prefer to think that we’re not born with the capacity to be that bad.
I suppose I have to accept that history tells us that some people are in fact evil.
What I won’t accept is that good parents can have an evil child and not “see” evidence of the evil before the age of 13.
A good parent will at least “see” it, even if they then go into denial and do nothing about it.

splinter65 · 07-09-2019 12:03PM

This is it wrote: »

You're very quick to blame the parents with your admitted "no level of expertise".

You're speculating, that's all.

Frankly the below is bullshît, you have no idea, nor do I.

I’m not speculating at all. I’m generalising really. I’m not referring specifically to the parents of these two murderers. It’s just my opinion about very bad children, and their parents reaction to evidence of their badness.

Kidchameleon · 07-09-2019 12:22PM

splinter65 wrote: »

I’m not speculating at all. I’m generalising really. I’m not referring specifically to the parents of these two murderers. It’s just my opinion about very bad children, and their parents reaction to evidence of their badness.

Very poor form to do that about two innocent sets of parents. Shame on you.

splinter65 · 07-09-2019 12:36PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Very poor form to do that about two innocent sets of parents. Shame on you.

Sure. Shame on me....

Kidchameleon · 07-09-2019 12:40PM

splinter65 wrote: »

Sure. Shame on me....

Indeed, we know nothing about the parents of the boys yet you are speculating. At the very least, Patric has admitted that he did not know who Ana was going out with or where she was going.

Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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