Brexit discussion thread IX (Please read OP before posting)

ambro25 · 17-07-2019 07:48PM

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Brexit secretary claims EU will start trade talks very quickly after no-deal because of UK's 'size and importance'

"They need us more than we need them".

Zero progress made since end March 2017.

They've not only wasted the extension, they've managed to get into negative equity since March 2019.

At the nation state level, that takes some doing.

Headshot · 17-07-2019 07:55PM

I'm watching the Conservative leadership on Sky News at the moment. It still puzzles me how anyone can vote for Boris. I hope they start keep tracking of his lies like what they do for Trump.

I do look forward though when he comes PM because it's going to be comedy gold. Boris will get some wake up call and the Brexiters will turn on him in no time.

Popeleo · 17-07-2019 08:01PM

BluePlanet wrote: »

Tariffs will be cut to zero on 87% of imports to the UK as part of a temporary no-deal plan, but prices of some imports including meat, shoes, underpants and cars will go up.

Remember when JRM was constantly banging on about the prices of food, clothing and footwear reducing outside the Customs Union? He is very quiet these days.

Call me Al · 17-07-2019 08:03PM

Headshot wrote: »

I'm watching the Conservative leadership on Sky News at the moment. It still puzzles me how anyone can vote for Boris. I hope they start keep tracking of his lies like what they do for Trump....

It's confirmation bias. He's telling them what they want to hear.
What they need to hear is something completely different, but that won't gain any traction at this stage. Unfortunately they've gone too far down that rabbit-hole.

Professor Moriarty · 17-07-2019 08:11PM

Popeleo wrote: »

Remember when JRM was constantly banging on about the prices of food, clothing and footwear reducing outside the Customs Union? He is very quiet these days.

Au contraire. Here he is in The Express today. Apparently Britain will be 80 billion better off after No Deal. Which is nice.

Headshot · 17-07-2019 08:14PM

It's funny Boris makes up so much crap he cant keep up with all of them lol

J Mysterio · 17-07-2019 08:16PM

Gintonious wrote: »

/YOUTUBE]

Another glorious watch from C4.

The amount of dodgy money funding people is scary, and the politicians, police and judiciary of the UK don't want anything to do with it. This person was funded - perhaps very well - and has been seemingly groomed for for her position. Disturbing.

ancapailldorcha · 17-07-2019 08:17PM

Gintonious wrote: »

Another glorious watch from C4.

Please don't just paste videos here. Thanks.

Popeleo · 17-07-2019 08:27PM

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Au contraire. Here he is in The Express today. Apparently Britain will be 80 billion better off after No Deal. Which is nice.

Thanks. I was obviously looking in the wrong (or right) places. And even the Express were reporting on an article he wrote in the Torygraph. Preaching to the deluded there.

I found one of those quotes on his website, from a DM article:

There is also the even more important issue of the customs union. Remaining in it is proposed as the back-stop plan in case nothing else could be agreed. However, it would prevent us from cutting tariffs, denying the nation one of Brexit's major benefits. It would hit the least well-off the most by keeping the pricing of food, clothing and footwear higher than necessary to protect inefficient continental businesses.

https://www.jacobreesmogg.com/brexiteer-compromise

J Mysterio · 17-07-2019 08:29PM

Headshot wrote: »

I'm watching the Conservative leadership on Sky News at the moment. It still puzzles me how anyone can vote for Boris. I hope they start keep tracking of his lies like what they do for Trump.

I do look forward though when he comes PM because it's going to be comedy gold. Boris will get some wake up call and the Brexiters will turn on him in no time.

I'm watching this also, its bizarre. Where is Hunt?

Joe_ Public · 17-07-2019 08:30PM

J Mysterio wrote: »

I'm watching this also, its bizarre. Where is Hunt?

The hustings are done in sequence, they're not debates. He can literally say anything here and they'll lap it up.

Joe_ Public · 17-07-2019 08:50PM

"When i travel to other countries i'm always struck that those countries seem to have more respect for us than we have for ourselves." - Jeremy Hunt.

I'm actually not sure about that one Jezza, there's not a single country in Europe that isn't laughing at you right now and i have a good inkling you're a laughing stock beyond the continent at this stage.

Enzokk · 17-07-2019 08:52PM

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Brexit secretary claims EU will start trade talks very quickly after no-deal because of UK's 'size and importance'

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/no-deal-brexit-eu-trade-talks-stephen-barclay-a9008136.html

Here is a link to the evidence he was giving in that story if anyone is interested.

Parliament TV link

I don't know what the purpose of this hustings is. Surely most of the Conservative Party members have voted already so both can say what they want as it will not matter much. Either way I haven't really seen any evidence that Hunt was making any ground on Johnson and his performance has not been great to move the momentum in his direction.

Foghladh · 17-07-2019 08:57PM

Gerry T wrote: »

Now back to the election of the next UK prime minister, a vote of the people, well 260,000 of them anyway, a true democracy.

Well to be fair the current Taoiseach received the direct mandate of about 3700 people, being Fine Gael members.

Tell me how · 17-07-2019 08:58PM

Enzokk wrote: »

Here is a link to the evidence he was giving in that story if anyone is interested.

Parliament TV link

I don't know what the purpose of this hustings is. Surely most of the Conservative Party members have voted already so both can say what they want as it will not matter much. Either way I haven't really seen any evidence that Hunt was making any ground on Johnson and his performance has not been great to move the momentum in his direction.

The only purpose all the hustings have served to do is to highlight the lack of knowledge/strategy Johnson and Hunt have. I know they have to have their process but given the gap at the outset, the 3 weeks of Johnson being found to only be interested in saying anything which will get him through an interview and Hunt to wax lyric knowing it doesn't matter a whit has been damaging to the UK.

All this after the EU granted the last extension saying it was not to be wasted. You could be forgiven for thinking that the Tories did this just to give 2 fingers to the EU.

And in the meantime, Labour are trying to steal the headlines with their anti-semitism are they/aren't they shenanigans.
If I worked for a company whose management behaved like this, I'd have handed in my notice.

Joe_ Public · 17-07-2019 09:00PM

Hunts coming across as a right try-hard tonight, but he really is a dull, dull man whose only strategy now is to play his way onto Johnson's A team.

BluePlanet · 17-07-2019 09:07PM

Government opposes moves to end seasonal clock changes for Ireland

Mr Flanagan said the principal reason for not supporting the change was the situation that would arise after Brexit where the UK, including Northern Ireland, would be in a different time zone for seven months of the year.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/government-opposes-moves-to-end-seasonal-clock-changes-for-ireland-1.3959638

Oh ok, so in this case we allow the UK to cause us to drift from EU harmonization.

Capt'n Midnight · 17-07-2019 09:14PM

MrMusician18 wrote: »

That is all conjecture on behalf of person quoted. No evidence is offered. The fall in house prices could also be attributed to a slowing global economy either as the business cycle ends.

Every bad news story cannot be pinned on Brexit, at least not without evidence. In fact this fall in process should've been seen earlier as Brexit was already meant to have happened.

Houses don't change hands overnight , especially if there's a Chain involved.

It's London. House prices in most other UK regions went up by 3% in comparison.

And the biggest fall in London was for detached houses so more likely to be at the richer end.

This is made up of the 6.1% fall for detached homes, as well as drops of 5% for flats and maisonettes, 4% for semi-detached houses, and 2.9% for terraced homes.

gimli2112 · 17-07-2019 09:15PM

BluePlanet wrote: »

Government opposes moves to end seasonal clock changes for Ireland

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/government-opposes-moves-to-end-seasonal-clock-changes-for-ireland-1.3959638

Oh ok, so in this case we allow the UK to cause us to drift from EU harmonization.

I find it really difficult to believe that almost 70% of those surveyed favour the switch but not if it puts us an hour ahead of the UK. That has little relevance for most of the country.

BluePlanet · 17-07-2019 09:18PM

gimli2112 wrote: »

I find it really difficult to believe that almost 70% of those surveyed favour the switch but not if it puts us an hour ahead of the UK. That has little relevance for most of the country.

I interpreted that as 70% support the switch, however the government are over-ruling anyway due to Brexit.

Irish Praetorian · 17-07-2019 09:18PM

BluePlanet wrote: »

Government opposes moves to end seasonal clock changes for Ireland

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/government-opposes-moves-to-end-seasonal-clock-changes-for-ireland-1.3959638

Oh ok, so in this case we allow the UK to cause us to drift from EU harmonization.

I think its a reasonable enough move to try and avoid having a different time for seven months of the year between Northern Ireland and the Republic.

One might hope that more eagle eyed Brexiteer might be able to appreciate the motives in a smaller nation having to cut its coat by its cloth when it comes to policy decisions made by the economic giant next door, but that might be too optimistic of me.

Joe_ Public · 17-07-2019 09:19PM

In other news an amendment on the Northern Ireland executive bill was debated and passed in the Lords today by 272 to 169. Crucially, this rules out any PM being able to prorogue parliament as it ensures there will have to be sitting days in order for the Commons to debate legislation relating to the bill (something like that anyway!) Seems to suggest there were 169 peers of the realm quite ok with the idea of prorogation, but not entirely certain it was as simple as that.

Capt'n Midnight · 17-07-2019 09:27PM

irishash wrote: »

Sterling has lost value to all other major traded currencies in the last year.

Not according to BBC news. https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49015116

The Post Office says it has seen a surge in sales of Turkish lira, which has been hit by political turmoil.

Compared to last summer, the pound is up around 14% against the lira. Iceland is also better value than last year, the pound is up 12% against the Icelandic krona.

Iceland is better value ?

Not unless all their prices stayed the same which sounds unlikely for an island nation that imports lots of stuff.

Harry Palmr · 17-07-2019 09:36PM

The invention of Boris Johnson on Channel 4 is full confirmation of what we know or suspect. An opportunist blank canvas upon which the beguiled cast thier dreams. What is clear is that he is not ideologically against the EU at all but scepticism is the way to power.

Foghladh · 17-07-2019 09:37PM

marno21 wrote: »

With that level of unfounded arrogance you would depressingly accept the relatively high chance of no deal happening. Comical stuff.

What exactly was arrogant about it?

brickster69 · 17-07-2019 09:52PM

Foghladh wrote: »

Well to be fair the current Taoiseach received the direct mandate of about 3700 people, being Fine Gael members.

How many candidates were in that race? Don't say one. :eek:

BonnieSituation · 17-07-2019 10:02PM

Foghladh wrote: »

Well to be fair the current Taoiseach received the direct mandate of about 3700 people, being Fine Gael members.

Eh...

That was to become FG leader.

The Taoiseach is elected by the Dáil.

This is nothing like that situation!

Foghladh · 17-07-2019 10:04PM

brickster69 wrote: »

How many candidates were in that race? Don't say one. :eek:

I believe it was two in that particular race and the winner didn't even win the popular vote. My point is that we tend to criticise the UK system but fail to recognise that our own is similar. The leader of the party in power is the Head of Government, usually, if they receive the backing in parliament. If elected Johnsons mandate would be no less than Varadkars

BonnieSituation · 17-07-2019 10:07PM

Foghladh wrote: »

I believe it was two in that particular race and the winner didn't even win the popular vote. My point is that we tend to criticise the UK system but fail to recognise that our own is similar. The leader of the party in power is the Head of Government, usually, if they receive the backing in parliament. If elected Johnsons mandate would be no less than Varadkars

It would be exactly less!

The Dáil elected the Taoiseach who receives his seal of office from our elected President.

In the case of the UK it's just a nod and a wink from the outgoing PM to a hereditary monarch as to who the outgoing PM thinks might have a command of parliament.

If the HOC even voted for the PM after they are nominated, you may have an iota of a point. But they don't, so you don't.

The UK system deserves all the criticism it gets.

Professor Moriarty · 17-07-2019 10:08PM

BonnieSituation wrote: »

It would be exactly less!

The Dáil elected the Taoiseach who receives his seal of office from our elected President.

In the case of the UK it's just a nod and a wink from the outgoing PM to a hereditary monarch.

The UK system deserves all the criticism it gets.

FPTP. Enough said.

Brexit discussion thread IX (Please read OP before posting)

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