Sub 5 minute mile

Dubh Geannain · 27-01-2019 12:56am #1

I'm the wrong side of 35 now and have spent the prime of my sporting life playing GAA.

The new football manager last year didn't fancy me as much as his predecessor so I got to sit and watch a lot of games last year (2018). The upshot was that by October when the season wrapped up I was relatively unscathed after what would typically be a grueling season.

What to do, I thought, with this spare energy I had? I went back to doing my usual 4.7 km run a couple of times per week. Times have been consistently around 18 minutes and into the 17's sometimes (over 6 years). I managed to hit 17 minutes once during a few months out of the football when that was all I was doing.

Anyway, I was working out that if I wanted to break 17 minutes on that particular run I'd be looking to run at a speed of 5.8 minutes per mile or thereabouts. Then the brain wave hit me. "I bet I could run a 5 minute mile at my current fitness level, I just never tried it".

I couldn't. Pride before the fall and all that.

My pedigree
1990s: U17 All Ireland 10 km. Time - 40 minutes. I came 12th or 15th I can't remember exactly.
2007: Connamarathon 1/2 marathon. Time - 01:29:xx

Not a lot there really

but I always kept up the bit of jogging when not playing ball.

I was never a speedster and found the half marathon above curtailed my speed even further so I swore I'd not train for any long distances again until I was definitely finished playing football. I've definitely got a little regret now that I wasn't smart enough to try and do a bit around sprints and middle distances but in my head I think I'd resigned myself to playing my part as a Brian Dooher type forward.

Condition of right foot
1x bunion (has become more prominent in the past year)
Range of motion limitation in my right ankle

Obviously around the turn of the year (I only started seriously on November 19th) was never the best time to be starting out so discipline was always going to be a little issue to start with.

I set about following my own plan which no doubt is flawed but wanted to see where it might take me. I'll detail how it's gone so far in my next post. Hopefully tomorrow, if not Monday.

Incidentally, my mile run is along a stretch of road that incorporates a humpback bridge and I suspect a slight incline overall but will confirm my actual time on a track if I feel I'm close enough.

I just want to add finally, this challenge re-ignited an interest I forgot I had in athletics (there's a tangential change in my youtube viewing history in late 2018). Even if I don't make it due to injury or otherwise it has been worth it so far and I look forward to passing on what I've learned to the kids.

Itziger · 27-01-2019 9:50pm

Dubh Geannain wrote: »

I'm the wrong side of 35 now and have spent the prime of my sporting life playing GAA.

The new football manager last year didn't fancy me as much as his predecessor so I got to sit and watch a lot of games last year (2018). The upshot was that by October when the season wrapped up I was relatively unscathed after what would typically be a grueling season.

What to do, I thought, with this spare energy I had? I went back to doing my usual 4.7 km run a couple of times per week. Times have been consistently around 18 minutes and into the 17's sometimes (over 6 years). I managed to hit 17 minutes once during a few months out of the football when that was all I was doing.

Anyway, I was working out that if I wanted to break 17 minutes on that particular run I'd be looking to run at a speed of 5.8 minutes per mile or thereabouts. Then the brain wave hit me. "I bet I could run a 5 minute mile at my current fitness level, I just never tried it".
I couldn't. Pride before the fall and all that.

My pedigree
1990s: U17 All Ireland 10 km. Time - 40 minutes. I came 12th or 15th I can't remember exactly.
2007: Connamarathon 1/2 marathon. Time - 01:29:xx

Not a lot there really but I always kept up the bit of jogging when not playing ball.

I was never a speedster and found the half marathon above curtailed my speed even further so I swore I'd not train for any long distances again until I was definitely finished playing football. I've definitely got a little regret now that I wasn't smart enough to try and do a bit around sprints and middle distances but in my head I think I'd resigned myself to playing my part as a Brian Dooher type forward.

Condition of right foot
1x bunion (has become more prominent in the past year)
Range of motion limitation in my right ankle

Obviously around the turn of the year (I only started seriously on November 19th) was never the best time to be starting out so discipline was always going to be a little issue to start with.

I set about following my own plan which no doubt is flawed but wanted to see where it might take me. I'll detail how it's gone so far in my next post. Hopefully tomorrow, if not Monday.

Incidentally, my mile run is along a stretch of road that incorporates a humpback bridge and I suspect a slight incline overall but will confirm my actual time on a track if I feel I'm close enough.

I just want to add finally, this challenge re-ignited an interest I forgot I had in athletics (there's a tangential change in my youtube viewing history in late 2018). Even if I don't make it due to injury or otherwise it has been worth it so far and I look forward to passing on what I've learned to the kids.

I was wondering about this!! Don't forget the extra 9 metres now. Good luck.

Sacksian · 27-01-2019 10:05pm

Based on your background, I suspect that you could be able to do this quite quickly - as long as your training is sensible, which is probably the biggest caveat.

There's a mile on the indoor track in Abbottstown next week if you want to get a benchmark - there might be some others there who will pull you along. The competition will probably get you a few extra seconds too. You don't have to be a member of a club to run and it is extremely accessible (you will definitely not be the slowest there).

Best of luck with the challenge.

By the way, there are plenty more opportunities to run middle distance if you sign up with a local club (especially for masters runners). As a masters runner, you have even more opportunities for racing than a senior athlete. Even if you're not training with the club, registering will let you enter a lot of county, provincial, and open track competitions that non-club members can't. Very few racing opportunities for non-club runners.

IvoryTower · 28-01-2019 9:21am

Would love to go sub 5 myself, also considering it this Tues. Best of luck with it will follow your training

Sacksian · 28-01-2019 1:23pm

IvoryTower wrote: »

Would love to go sub 5 myself, also considering it this Tues. Best of luck with it will follow your training

What's your 5k time, Ivory Tower? You can run a decent 800m, so your limiter is presumably the endurance end?

Having speed gives you a decent cushion and you can do a lot off a little mileage if you have speed. 2 back-to-back 2:29s shouldn't sound too crazy if you're running an 800m around 2:10.

But as you go up the distances the more important strength (or endurance) becomes to hit certain times. And it helps with the shorter distances too. Or at least that's what I hope. There's a 9s per 400m fall-off between my 800m and mile pb, which is pretty bad so I'm trying to convert myself to a higher-mileage middle distance runner at the moment - hopefully, see you both on the track during the summer!

IvoryTower · 28-01-2019 1:56pm

I was about 20min in the winter but im doing more mileage now so hopefully my endurance is improving, although I guess it takes time to build that engine. Yeah say hello, I haven't a clue who you are but if you're running 2min for 800 I wont be long figuring it out

Dubh Geannain · 28-01-2019 11:55pm

The two weeks before Week 1 I was doing 1-3 runs per week of 3.5 to 4.65 kms. I initially thought of setting a 5 km time and trying to improve that and it was only after November 19th I decided to target the 1 mile. So...

Any day I've filled in "sprints" usually involves a jog to and from the training location of 2-4 kms.
Also, I try and do a 15 - 20 minutes weights session 1-2 times per week. I don't do too much. Short and sharp. I have my own free weights sitting out the back of my workplace along with a bench press. The strength stuff here was more to help with the football but obviously doesn't do any harm here.

Week 1 starts November 19th

Week 1

19 Nov - 16 x 100 m @ 15-16 secs per 100 m
21 Nov - 4.65 km run - 18:18
23 Nov - 4.65 km run - 17:58

Not even a week in I decide to see if I need to be bothering with a lot of training at all. So I run my first ever mile -
25 Nov - 1 mile - 05:31 (This killed me. I needed to walk for almost half the distance back to my starting point before I could muster something resembling a jog

Week 2

26 Nov - 10 x 100 m and 3 x 500 m. I can't remember times for these. 500 m would have been only at 60 % probably though
29 Nov - 3.5 km run
02 Dec - I played a testimonial soccer match. My first in 10 years. Only 80 minutes were played.

Week 3

03 Dec - 10 x 1 minute temp runs
05 Dec - 4.65 km - 17:34. I jarred my knee a little right at the end of this run as I was looking to finish strong. It wasn't a noticeable pang of pain, more of a dull twinge.
06 Dec - 10 x 100 m @ 14-15 secs per 100 m
08 Dec - 3.5 km run

My knee was not really sore but it didn't feel quite right even particularly while driving. I felt I'd developed a little weakness but not with forward motion only turning.

Week 4

10 Dec - 10 x 30 m hill sprints (2 sets). No times for these but rest between sets of 2 minutes (on grass)
14 Dec - 4.65 km - 18:15
15 Dec - 6 x 1 minute tempos

I wasn't feeling well in week 4 but with a few Christmas pints planned over the next couple of weeks I was determined to have another go at the mile before the inevitable break in discipline.

17 Dec - 1 mile - 05:29. I was naturally disappointed with what looked like zero progress. Even allowing for the fact I wasn't feeling well and I might have held back a little because of my knee. I also think I saved myself a little too much for the end. I took solace in the fact that unlike my first murderous attempt, after finishing this time I was straight into a jog back to my place of work. So, my recovery time had seriously improved.

Because of my knee I made the decision to try and run more on grass if I could. It definitely felt better on the knee anyway.

Week 5

19 Dec - 3.5 km run
20 Dec - 8 x 230 m sprints (On grass)
23 Dec - 10 x long hills (130 m. On grass)

As luck would have it I was actually sick on Christmas day. I wasn't chalked down to do any cooking anyway. Just keep the kids entertained which wasn't too difficult given the day that was in it. Then, Christmas trips to my home place, followed by the in-laws, a wedding, annual meet ups. All the usual excuses

Week 6

30 Dec - 4.9 km run. This was a struggle as my legs wanted to go faster than the rest of me did. More drinks followed that evening as December 30th has kind of turned into our New Years over the last few years.

Work-wise, November and December 2018 were the busiest I'd been in several years. The challenge and the exercise that went with it helped keep the stress levels down a lot as I putting in late evenings in at work and at home on the laptop plus some weekend work. Incidentally, I didn't go to the work Christmas party this year as I didn't want to be reminded of the place. I went for a run that evening instead.

Dubh Geannain · 29-01-2019 12:02am

Sacksian wrote: »

Based on your background, I suspect that you could be able to do this quite quickly - as long as your training is sensible, which is probably the biggest caveat.

There's a mile on the indoor track in Abbottstown next week if you want to get a benchmark - there might be some others there who will pull you along. The competition will probably get you a few extra seconds too. You don't have to be a member of a club to run and it is extremely accessible (you will definitely not be the slowest there).

Best of luck with the challenge.

By the way, there are plenty more opportunities to run middle distance if you sign up with a local club (especially for masters runners). As a masters runner, you have even more opportunities for racing than a senior athlete. Even if you're not training with the club, registering will let you enter a lot of county, provincial, and open track competitions that non-club members can't. Very few racing opportunities for non-club runners.

Thanks. It's something I might consider. I wasn't aware there was much buzz around the mile at all these days. Almost everyone that is doing a bit of running is training long distance. I'd be interested to look into that more at some point.

Dubh Geannain · 29-01-2019 12:45am

You don't find the weeks clocking up.

Week 7

02 Jan - 4 x 2 minute tempos (on grass)
03 Jan - 2 sets of 10 x 30 m hill sprints (on grass). 7 seconds roughly per sprint. 13 seconds rest between sprints. 2 minutes between sets

For some reason I can't remember what went on here exactly but week 7 into week 8 was certainly short on workouts.

Week 8

10 Jan - 3.5 km run
11 Jan - 4.65 km - 17:21

Week 9

15 Jan - 5 x 2 minute tempos (on grass)
17 Jan - 1 hard 5 minutes. Then 10 x 10 second sprints and 6 x 10 second sprints. Because it was dark, I was doing these on a path and sure enough felt the knee again so had to stop after 6 sprint on the second set.
19 Jan - 25 minute jog
20 Jan - 3 x 3 minute tempos (on grass). Total workout time 32 minutes

I got my first pair of new runners for my run on the 20th. Anyway on that run I was finding pins and needles in my right foot. I'd forgotten when I got my last pair of runners this happened initially on longer than normal runs too. Probably a couple of years ago.

I'm putting it down to the bunion on my foot but it could be something else. I'm hoping it's a case of the sole being moulded better to my foot shape over time. That's what I'm hoping anyway but will talk to a chiropodist... eventually. Maybe after I get that crown on my tooth done but probably not before I follow up and get that MRI scan done on my right ankle which I've had a referral letter for for over 12 months

Week 10

15 Jan - 5 x 2 minute tempos (on grass)
17 Jan - 1 hard 5 minutes. Then 10 x 10 second sprints and 6 x 10 second sprints. Because it was dark, I was doing these on a path and sure enough felt the knee again so had to stop after 6 sprint on the second set.
19 Jan - 25 minute jog (more pins and needles)
20 Jan - 3 x 3 minute tempos (on grass). Total workout time 32 minutes

Week 11

23 Jan - 2 set of 10 x 30 m hill sprints (on grass). 7 seconds sprint, 13 seconds rest. 2 minutes between sets. Then 1 km hard. Total workout time 30 minutes
24 Jan - 3.5 km run. First 5 minutes hard.
26 Jan - 6 km long run. 27 minutes. Pins and needles again grrrr.
27 Jan - 2 x 4 minute tempos. (on grass) Followed by 10 strides. 32 minutes running in total

That's it so far. I really don't know how much use it has been yet for my end goal. January is almost done so I I'm thinking (weather permitting) I'll have another go at the mile on either the 29th (tomorrow) or the 30th.

Ye can place your bets now at what my time might be. I haven't a clue but it better be below 05:20.

The better educated among you can tell me what I'm doing wrong. the main thing I feel is that I'm not doing enough total mileage week on week but time really has been precious the last couple of months.

Dubh Geannain · 29-01-2019 9:46am

I remembered what happened around week 7 and week 8 now. Both kids were sick and missed the return back to school. There was a lot of juggling between myself and the missus.

And repeat. Both of them have tonsilitis again so we'll see how the next day or two pans out now.

IvoryTower · 29-01-2019 12:10pm

are you following a plan? if this - 4.65 km - 17:21 is accurate then you're in pretty good nick for someone just starting off

you have a long run there as 6k, I reckon you should build this up slowly, to about 8-10 miles. I'm sure more experienced guys here will be able to advise you on this.

Sacksian · 29-01-2019 2:32pm

I don't really like giving advice because one of the things I liked most when I started running was figuring out for myself what suited me and what I enjoyed doing. So, if whatever you're doing is getting you out running, then that's a good place to start.

However, people specifically training for a mile are a rare breed on boards so here goes....

I ran 4:37 for the mile aged 38 and this is some of the stuff that worked/works for me. I can't vouch for it other than my own personal experience - probably reflects what I enjoy doing in training more than anything else.

The most important thing to get your head around is that (based on your 100s) you already have the speed to run a 5-minute mile. You're just lacking the endurance.

I really like that you're doing 10 x 100m and 30m hills. Those sessions are good for coordination and keeping in touch with speed but they don't really help that much with the mile so, if you're going to keep them up, think about more volume in the 100s (maybe even 3-4 x 10 x 100m with a walk-back between reps and a few minutes between sets, starting around mile pace, and build into it) and longer hills (200m-300m).

Once you go beyond 800m as a race distance, the aerobic element gets really important. If you can, try and do 10-15mins very easy jogging before and after the sessions. That'll get you a little bump in mileage without taxing you at all.

For longer intervals at race pace, I would strongly recommend 40 seconds fast (around 5:10-5:20 pace) with 30 seconds slow jog in between. You don't want to be walking the 30 seconds portion so slow down the pace of the 40 seconds if you find yourself wanting to walk the breaks in between. You can start off at 10-12 reps or 2 sets of 8 and ultimately, you want to get to 20 x 200m @mile pace (@37.5 seconds) off 100m jog. A few weeks of building that up and you'll feel yourself getting fitter. You can do this as diagonals on a football pitch too.

Breaking the steady runs up into manageable tempo sections is a really good idea - and a good example of you figuring out how you're going to get yourself mile fit quickly. My favourite would be 6-8 x 3mins steady with 90s jog in between. Keep it nice and relaxed and you'll see the benefits in a couple of weeks. If you do it at your current tempo pace, you're getting a little bit more time at that pace with less stress while also adding a bit more mileage.

For the two sessions above, you're looking to gradually increase the pace of the jog in between the work portions as you get fitter. Obviously, the intervals in the race pace session will get closer to your 5-minute mile race pace target but you don't get to rest every 40 seconds in a race so an increase in the pace of the recovery bits actually tells you more about your shape.

If you have to do time trials, do shorter ones. There's no point trying a mile at 5-minute pace if you can't do 1000m-1200m at that pace. 1200m is a classic time-trial distance for a miler (but very few people would even attempt to do 800m at mile pace in training - save that for the races). I don't think they're a good idea and I don't think I would be able to run within 15s of my race times on my own but if it's one of those things that gets you out running, then fair enough. I think it's a bit of a waste of a session though.

Do 50-60 minutes easy when you can. Mileage is important. You can train for the 10k and still run a decent mile but there are plenty of very, very good 800m runners who can't (relatively speaking).

Finally, whatever the training theory/philosophy, consistency is the single most important attribute for any athlete. Middle-distance training can be hard on the body (especially if you're straining to hit paces in training), so be patient and try and not get injured!

Best of luck!

Dubh Geannain · 29-01-2019 2:42pm

IvoryTower wrote: »

are you following a plan? if this - 4.65 km - 17:21 is accurate then you're in pretty good nick for someone just starting off

you have a long run there as 6k, I reckon you should build this up slowly, to about 8-10 miles. I'm sure more experienced guys here will be able to advise you on this.

I've no set plan as such. The core of what I'm doing on a weekly basis is the following:

1 workout with sprints
1-2 workouts with tempos (increase the duration of these over the weeks)
1-2 middle distance runs

I've been finding excuses to not run further such as time and straining old injuries from running longer. I never had a problem with endurance really, but was never satisfied with my speed.

That 4.65 km, is from the driveway in work up a country road and back. I've run that regularly enough over the last 6 years, mostly outside of the GAA season. Way back in 2013 I initially had times recorded of 19.5 minutes but I was properly ill that year and didn't do anything for a few months beforehand.

Dubh Geannain · 29-01-2019 2:57pm

Thanks for the input Sacksian and fair play on that 4:37. There's some good stuff in there that I'll try and take heed of.

I enjoyed this video of a guy who tried to take on a 5 minute mile in 8 weeks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpClwXjDqro

I didn't take much input from it into my own plan as he was coming from a lower base to begin, including bad footwear and running style. However, it gave me an appreciation for the difficulty in achieving improvements in time quickly, especially when I'm further along that decaying exponential curve to begin with.

Dubh Geannain · 30-01-2019 3:23pm

And in a nutshell this is why I started the thread. I hope it'll keep me honest.

30 Jan - 1 mile - 05:23

I didn't enjoy this run at all but really wanted to post a time before January was out. 3 Degrees air temp didn't help nor the head-breeze in my face for 90 % of the route. My 10 minute warm-up clearly wasn't enough either as I just wasn't feeling it from the very start.

The week didn't go to plan with the kids being sick so I've missed training and getting enough sleep.

Since the time is improved at least, what I can say I guess is the training has worked so far \o/ but obviously not effectively enough. I'm going to have to start putting in some longer runs to improve my endurance (as Sacksian suggested) which I was hoping to avoid. Hopefully the pins and needles subsides over the next couple of weeks though as they are bit of a nuisance.

RayCun · 31-01-2019 10:51am

Dubh Geannain wrote: »

My 10 minute warm-up clearly wasn't enough either

What was your ten minute warmup- a ten minute jog?

Dubh Geannain · 31-01-2019 9:52pm

RayCun wrote: »

What was your ten minute warmup- a ten minute jog?

5 minutes jog. With 5 minutes dynamic stretching.

Dubh Geannain · 11-02-2019 12:07pm

Looks like I miscounted my weeks and added my week 9 runs in twice. So it's nice to gain a week back.

After my latest mile attempt in the middle of Week 11 I tried to take some of Sacksian's advice on board and (1) increase my weekly distances and (2) increase my hill leangths.

I also did one set of 40 seconds hard followed by 30 seconds jog, which I hope I'll be doing more freqeuctly

Week 11 (again)

30 Jan - Mile attempt at 05:23
31 Jan - 6.5 km moderate run
02 Feb - 2 sets of 5 x 225m hills (hard). 7.5 km total running
03 Feb - 12 x 40 seconds hard, 30 seconds recovery jog. Plus 4 km additional running

Week 12
Got a head cold all week. Very hard to get motivated to go out but once going I wasn't too bad.

05 Feb - 4.75 km easy - 17:56 mins
06 Feb - 3 x 4 minute tempos. 5 km total run in 19:26 mins
07 Feb - 9.3 km easy run (5.5 km on grass) - 44 minutes
09 Feb - 4 sets of 3 x 225m hills (a set = 1 easy (58 secs), 1 medium (54 secs), 1 hard (48 secs). No additional recovery between sets. 8.4 km total running

On 09 Feb I got a cramp (I hope it was just a cramp) on my way home so had to walk the last 1/2 km or so.

Almost through the cold now which threatened to go into my chest but looks to have abated so we'll see how the next week goes and if the cramp has recovered alright.

The hills are not exactly the 40 seconds hard followed by 30 seconds recovery which I said I'll be trying more frequently from now on. Obviously I don't cover as much distance running up hills either but I'm hoping from an endurance perspective they will still help a bit, since each of them are at least 45 seconds. The jog back for me to re-start is 1:20 so not hitting them as frequently as just a 30 second rest.

Dubh Geannain · 18-02-2019 3:53pm

So I tried to ramp it up last week and although yesterday was supposed to be a rest day I'm still still feeling it a bit in the legs today. A long long walk with the family involving piggy-backs, carrying bikes (small bikes), pushing bikes etc. probably didn't help. It was such a nice day we were in no rush to head home.

Week 13

11 Feb - 4.75 km steady finishing hard - 17:06 mins .
It looks like I might be on course to at least hit an intermediate goal here. That was to hit sub 17 minutes for my good old work lunchtime run, which I mentioned in my first post.
12 Feb - 12 x (40 seconds hard, 30 seconds jog, 3.3 km approx covered). On grass. 3 km additional running. Found these tougher than the last set of these that I did. Although the last time was on a path and not grass which might explain it a little.
13 Feb - 9.3 km (5.5 km on grass) medium run - 41:30 minutes
14 Feb - Rest
15 Feb - 4 x 400 m (74, 76, 76, 75 secs), 6 x 100 m strides, 1 X 800 m (85 secs/lap), 4 x 100 m strides
I visited a track for this (Claremount stadium in Navan.) Hadn't run on a track since my secondary school days so it was a nice novelty. Plus it was great to get some accurate distances and times for some of the sets that I did.
The 400s were at my 5 minute mile pace. I feel I was at my current limit with those times in terms of speed but was happy with the consistency in the times.
The strides were messy enough TBH and I wasn't completing the full 100 m on the latter ones due to fatigue.
Determined to put another marker down on my track visit though I decided to follow up with an 800 m which wasn't entirely planned. I set my target at 10 seconds more per lap and managed to hit them albeit with a hard last 30 m on the last lap.
16 Feb - 25 minutes easy run (4.5 km approx)
17 Feb - Unplanned 2.5 hour trek with family.

I'm probably going to go back to playing a bit of football this week so I'm not sure what sort of structure the training will take. We shall see.

Sacksian · 18-02-2019 5:33pm

Dubh Geannain wrote: »

So I tried to ramp it up last week and although yesterday was supposed to be a rest day I'm still still feeling it a bit in the legs today. A long long walk with the family involving piggy-backs, carrying bikes (small bikes), pushing bikes etc. probably didn't help. It was such a nice day we were in no rush to head home.

Week 13
11 Feb - 4.75 km steady finishing hard - 17:06 mins .
It looks like I might be on course to at least hit an intermediate goal here. That was to hit sub 17 minutes for my good old work lunchtime run, which I mentioned in my first post.

12 Feb - 12 x (40 seconds hard, 30 seconds jog, 3.3 km approx covered). On grass. 3 km additional running. Found these tougher than the last set of these that I did. Although the last time was on a path and not grass which might explain it a little.

13 Feb - 9.3 km (5.5 km on grass) medium run - 41:30 minutes

14 Feb - Rest

15 Feb - 4 x 400 m (74, 76, 76, 75 secs), 6 x 100 m strides, 1 X 800 m (85 secs/lap), 4 x 100 m strides
I visited a track for this (Claremount stadium in Navan.) Hadn't run on a track since my secondary school days so it was a nice novelty. Plus it was great to get some accurate distances and times for some of the sets that I did.
The 400s were at my 5 minute mile pace. I feel I was at my current limit with those times in terms of speed but was happy with the consistency in the times.
The strides were messy enough TBH and I wasn't completing the full 100 m on the latter ones due to fatigue.
Determined to put another marker down on my track visit though I decided to follow up with an 800 m which wasn't entirely planned. I set my target at 10 seconds more per lap and managed to hit them albeit with a hard last 30 m on the last lap.

16 Feb - 25 minutes easy run (4.5 km approx)

17 Feb - Unplanned 2.5 hour trek with family.

I'm probably going to go back to playing a bit of football this week so I'm not sure what sort of structure the training will take. We shall see.

That seems like a lot for one week - but running the 400s on a track gives you the most accurate idea of what a sub-5 minute mile entails. I actually don't think you're that far away from it.

If you can get back to the track, take the opportunity. 10 x 400m off 90s -60s standing rest would be a classic (but challenging) mile prediction workout.

Dubh Geannain · 19-02-2019 12:09pm

It might have been a little too much, although I do like to feel like I've given myself a good workout when I head to bed of an evening. I always struggled to take the easy runs easy but that wasn't a problem last week. I think I got a bit excited with the milder weather too.

Is that 10 x 400m @ 90 seconds with 60 seconds rest? Can you predict an actual mile time off the back of that if it's completed successfully?

Sacksian · 19-02-2019 1:05pm

Dubh Geannain wrote: »

It might have been a little too much, although I do like to feel like I've given myself a good workout when I head to bed of an evening. I always struggled to take the easy runs easy but that wasn't a problem last week. I think I got a bit excited with the milder weather too.

Is that 10 x 400m @ 90 seconds with 60 seconds rest? Can you predict an actual mile time off the back of that if it's completed successfully?

I'd have been the same with the easy running, but I naturally slowed down on easy runs when I was doing more in the rest of the week.

The session is 10 x 400m @ your goal time (75s) and I'd start with 90s standing recovery in between. If you're still hitting 75s for 400m halfway through, then you can cut the recovery or go harder but don't bank of being able to do that.

The classic predictor workout has just 60s rest in between the 400s but I think that's very, very hard (I'd find it as hard as a race to be honest) so you should see how you get on with 90s and, for a first go, I'd recommend going out with the intention of doing 8. Even better if you start with a couple of 76s and finish with a couple of faster 400s (that'll tell you something about where you are in terms of strength to hold that pace over a mile).

You obviously have the base speed to run a 5-minute mile but having the strength to hold it for 4 laps of the track is what the other stuff during the week will help with. And, if you wanted to set yourself longer term goals in the mile or middle distance, you'd be looking at more of that stuff than lots more 400m or 800m intervals.

Even if you struggle with the 10 x 400s, I wouldn't worry too much about it. I don't think I ever managed 10 x 400s off 60s at my mile pace - the predictor suggested a slower time than I actually ran. I found 6 x 600s at mile pace off 2mins standing rest easier - less volume and more rest. You'll figure out what works best for you after a few more sessions (and races).

Dubh Geannain · 27-02-2019 4:25pm

So I went back to the old football last week and I didn't manage any long runs unfortunately but here's what I did -

Week 14

18 Feb - 15 x 40 seconds hard, 30 seconds easy on grass. Covered 4 km during this exercise plus 2.5 km additional running.
19 Feb - Football training As luck would have it, I arrived back in time for a team "fitness test". I wouldn't class it as a proper test from a footballing perspective as it was really just a constant running exercise. The goal was to run as far as you could in 12 minutes. I'd no timekeeper until I was told there was 30 seconds left so was holding back. Anyway, fully togged on a heavy pitch I covered exactly 3 kms in 12 minutes. I reckon I'd have been at least another 200 m further on if I had an idea of the time. Anyway as was it worked out at 4 mins/km. After training I did 8x100 m strides.
21 Feb - 3.5 km run moderate - 13:24
The day before a match but I thought I'd better keep up a little bit of running.
22 Feb - Reserve Match
Glad I went for the run the night before as the manager rewarded those that had been training for the last couple of months. A couple of us older lads were left on the bench. 3 of us came on with 20 minutes left. We went from 6 points down to winning by 10 in those 20 minutes. We all made an impact. Can't beat the reserve leagues
23 Feb - 12 x 225 m hills (41 - 44 secs per hill. 1:30 recovery). 8.5 km total running

Not counting the match or training aside from the fitness test, I did around 22 total kms (I think) for the week. I'm hoping the longer hills and hard intervals will still stand to me though.

Into this week (Week 15) and I've visited the track again to try those 10 x 400s, so I'll post how they went next week.

Sacksian · 28-02-2019 1:34pm

Some mile options in the next few months:

Indoor mile next Tuesday in Abbotstown. You may even be the fastest person in the race! Great venue and open to all:

https://www.nationalsportscampus.ie/nialive - Mile, March 5th

If you can, have a go. I don't think there's a better motivation for training than the exhilaration of a track race - mainly because you'll want to go faster next time! You'll know what you need to improve and how much you want to. You can even have a pop at an 800 while you're down there.

ALSAA out by the airport have an open mile on the 9th April at 7:30pm - €5 - not sure if they get many sub-5 miles though.

And there's an Open Track & Field meet in Cushinstown in early summer too.

Dubh Geannain · 01-03-2019 11:47am

Sacksian wrote: »

Some mile options in the next few months:

Don't tempt me Frodo. :pac:

I've usually got football training on Tuesday nights but... Are those indoor events in Abbotstown running every two weeks or are they ending soon?

Looking at the results there looks to be an obvious difference in the standard between the 1,500 and the mile races. No one ran under 5 minutes in the last two 1 mile races so there wouldn't be anyone I could try and hang on to (even though I don't think I'm there yet myself either). But the thought of having an actual race again is very tempting at this stage.

Might as well post this now as I was pretty chuffed afterwards. I was back at the track on Wednesday gone to try those 10 x 400s. Here's how it went (rounding up to the nearest second):
74, 90 rest
75, 90 rest
74, 90 rest
75, 90 rest
74, 90 rest
74, 90 rest
75, 60 rest (feeling like my heart rate was settling quicker than the 90 seconds I decided to shorten the recovery from here on to just 60)
74, 60 rest
75, 60 rest
72, Finish

So I hit my times thankfully. I find these type of runs certainly take me out of my comfort zone particularly the last 150 m. For example I don't think I could run 10 x 400s at 73 secs with 90 rest yet because of the extra degree of effort required. I can feel I'm almost at my current limit.

Sacksian · 01-03-2019 4:02pm

That's really great going - very impressive, and you should find an extra few seconds when it comes to a race. But, you'll never know until you do...

I think next week is the last one in the current series until they start again towards the end of the year. You could always run a 1500m. 4:39 is a sub-5 equivalent and there'll be plenty faster than that!

Dubh Geannain · 04-03-2019 1:38pm

Right, I'm going to register for the NIA mile race tomorrow seeing as its the last one for a while and I haven't run my own mile route for February so am overdue a guage of where I'm at.

I've had the perfect prep too - a family reunion on Saturday night/Sunday morning means I am now into day 2 of a hangover :rolleyes:

I'll have to drag myself out for a light jog later just to do something. I'm just hoping the immune system didn't take too much of a bashing that I don't pick up a cold before tomorrow night.

Last week was not as intense as the previous, that's for sure
Week 15

26 Feb 2019 - Football training A disappointing training it has to be said. More talking done than actual effort. Training day wasted.
27 Feb 2019 - 10 x 400s (75 second target) at the track. Finished with 6x60 m strides Times for the 400s posted already
28 Feb 2019 - 9.5 km easy run (7.5 km on grass) - 47:20 mins
02 Mar 2019 - 3 sets of 10 x 30m hill sprints - 6.5-7 secs per sprint, 20 secs recovery. 3 minute jog between sets Hadn't done any sprint work in a while so wanted to put some in. I'd like to keep a bit of zip for football purposes too.

Dubh Geannain · 06-03-2019 11:06am

So I rang to book a slot for the mile race. The nice lady on the phone said "oh very good. There's a world record attempt in that race too". I was having visions of being lapped a couple of times. And that wasn't going to be much benefit for my time with having to get out of the way to let others pass through.

I felt I made the right decision and went off to training instead last night. When I came home I decided to look up how the record attempt went. Getting a bit of a surprise.

It was Shane Healy going for the M50 mile record which is 4:23. He didn't make the record but I should have asked a few more questions on the phone instead of running a mile in the opposite direction :pac: The race might not have been as chastising as I first feared.

I definitely regret not going now but there'll be other chances again I suppose. It would have been an honour to have shared a track with him too. The Irish Examiner had a nice article on him last month-

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/the-big-interview-shane-healy--from-an-orphanage-to-greatest-show-on-earth-904867.html

IvoryTower · 06-03-2019 11:46am

i think there was a lot of traffic in the race, we will likely have a mile race in Drogheda during the graded series and then the Dublin graded as well may have one. Timetables still to be confirmed for both

Dubh Geannain · 27-05-2019 3:05pm

I'm still here after a couple of set backs. I'm pointing to this as the point where things started to go awry

I've had the perfect prep too - a family reunion on Saturday night/Sunday morning means I am now into day 2 of a hangover :rolleyes:

If I go into a little more detail on that entry, on the day

This was my log entry on the day

02 Mar 2019 - 3 sets of 10 x 30m hill sprints - 6.5-7 secs per sprint, 20 secs recovery. 3 minute jog between sets Hadn't done any sprint work in a while so wanted to put some in. I'd like to keep a bit of zip for football purposes too.

I was up at 7 am that morning and got my run in early. Spent the day doing chores around the house and town before setting off for the reunion at 7 pm that evening. On the hour drive down I was feeling fit for the bed but fought through. Head didn't touch a pillow until 5:30 am and even then only manged 3 hours sleep.

The week of March 4th I could feel a cold coming on but tried to run through it. It didn't help and I was wiped out shortly after as it got into my chest. This was followed up with a spell of ill health. I alluded to a previous condition it in my OP. Un-diagnosed to this day despite scans, medicals etc. I wasn't expecting a recurrence but it looks like the trigger was stressing my body too much. I'm blaming not giving myself time to recover as opposed to training too hard. Not to detract from the main point of the thread, I'm okay again and had been logging away regardless of how little I did, even during blank weeks.

So anyway, will update the log with a bit of back fill at some stage this week. I'm not yet back to where I was I'd say and it was a struggle to get going again but I'm finding the enthusiasm returning. I'd like to fit in the more runs but football still dictates otherwise for now.

My mile target is taking a backseat for a couple of weeks as I'm going to focus in doing the Braveheart run in Trim first in a couple of weeks. My first race since 2007, health permitting.

Dubh Geannain · 28-05-2019 2:30pm

28 May '19 - 1 mile - 05:15

All has not been lost in the interim at least. I'd a niggle to at least go out and set a time to see where I'm at so feeling happy with that.

The trend (if you'd call it that) is in the right direction

25 Nov '18- 1 mile - 05:31
17 Dec '18 - 1 mile - 05:29
30 Jan '19 - 1 mile - 05:23
28 May '19 - 1 mile - 05:15

I reckon if I'd managed to get out around the end of February before my set back I'd have set a lower PB by now but it is what it is.

Dubh Geannain · 28-05-2019 3:23pm

Long post warning. Just a log of what I've been doing. I'll keep the moaning to a minimum.

Summary:

Week 17 - 21 were 4 bad weeks
Week 22 - 23 Not fit for a lot but try to get back at it.
Week 24 (Apr 29th) onwards. Starting to feel myslef again

Week 16

04 Mar 2019 - 5.5 km easy (3.5 km on grass) - 25 minutes
05 Mar 2019 - 8 x 400s cross country (approx 1.5 to 2 min recovery). Followed by 6 x 100 m hill sprints. No mile race at NIA. This was football training that was moved to the fields because of weather. Felt washed out after this; weekend catching up.
08 Mar 2019 - 4.65 km moderate/hard last 200 m - 17:09. Needed the couple of days recovery beforehand and felt as though a cold was coming on yesterday, luckily it looks now like I was just a little run down after the weekend.
09 Mar 2019 - Footbal game. Dying afterwards

Week 17
Blank week

Week 18

19 Mar 2019 - Football training. First Exercise in a while
22 Mar 2019 - 5.75 km on grass. Easy to Moderate
24 Mar 2019 - Football training Followed by a head cold

Week 19
Blank week

Week 20

02 April 2019 - Football training Dizziness subsides when up and going
04 April 2019 - 3.5 km un-timed. Very easy
07 April 2019 - 2 x 1 kms at 4 min/km on grass with 5 minute recovery. 6.5 km total running

Week 21

09 April 2019 - 2 x 1 kms at 4 min/km on grass. 6.5 km total running
Run at lunchtime. Football training in the evening
11 April 2019 - 5 km easy 20:40
13 April 2019 - 4.65 km very easy 20:00

Week 22

15 April 2019 - 4.65 km moderate 18:08
16 April 2019 - Football training
18 April 2019 - Football training
20 April 2019 - Football match

Week 23

28 April 2019 - 3 kms on grass moderate (4:17, 4:25, 3:56). 5.5 kms total Over a week since last exercise

Week 24

29 April 2019 - 6.5 km on grass. Moderate.
30 April 2019 - Football training
02 May 2019 - Football match
04 May 2019 - Intervals. 14 x 40 secs hard with 30 seconds recovery

Week 25

07 May 2019 - Football training
08 May 2019 - Football match
10 May 2019 - 6.5 km steady on grass - 28 mins
12 May 2019 - Intervals. 12 x 40 secs hard with 30 seconds recovery

Week 26

14 May 2019 - Football training
15 May 2019 - Long run. 9 kms - 37:40
17 May 2019 - Football match

Week 27

20 May 2019 - 3.6 km moderate - 13:43
22 May 2019 - 10 x 236 m hills (43-45 sec per hill. 1:20 recovery)
23 May 2019 - Long run. 9 kms - 36:24
25 May 2019 - 3 x 1 km moderate/hard on grass. 3:56/km, 2 min rest. Total distance 6.5 km

Murph_D · 28-05-2019 7:08pm

This is interesting. I really think you should try a race or two just to get some experience before you really go for the attempt. It takes a little while to get used to the track and the atmosphere. That 10x400 a while back was very impressive, maybe should have pressed the race button around that time.

Dubh Geannain · 28-05-2019 10:29pm

Yep. Nail on the head there. I'm trying not to be too harsh on myself for not seizing the day when I was in better shape but really should have. Wasn't expecting to hit a wall back then but the same can be said of injuries.

I'll check out of there are any mile races over the coming weeks. I understand I need to be a club member for some.

5k in Trim first. As 5ks go I believe it's not one for posting a good time. But a good few of the football team are doing too so I might as well.

Dubh Geannain · 06-06-2019 12:00pm

Week 28

26 May 2019 - 4.35 km easy. 18:15
27 May 2019 - 1 mile trial. 05:15. 4 kms total running
28 May 2019 - 9 km Long run 35:34. Easy with last 1.5 km moderate
30 May 2019 - 14 x (40 secs hard, 30 seconds recovery jog) 6.5 km total
02 June 2019 - Football training

Dubh Geannain · 11-06-2019 9:02pm

Week 29

04 June 2019 - 5.5 kms easy on grass . 23 minutes
05 June 2019 - 10 x 270 m hills at moderate effort. 1 minute per hill. 1:15 back down. Total distance over workout - 9 km. Workout time - 40 minutes
07 June 2019 - 9 km Long run moderate - 35:09 mins. Wanted a relatively hard run the week before Braveheart run. Went out swiftly enough but found the sun a bit more draining. No kick to finish the last km.

I'm finding the energy levels still aren't quite back to where they were in March just yet. Even doing the hills I only felt up for moderate effort as opposed to hard, so I just lengthened the hills but happy to complete the set in consistent times.

Braveheart 5k run this week. I haven't run a race since 2007 and before that 1999 so I've no pre-race week plan or routine.

Dubh Geannain · 16-06-2019 6:59pm

Friday 14 June 2019

So I did my first race in 12 years. Might as well report how it went. Went into this with a head cold that I couldn't shake over the previous few days. Damn Irish Summer with the kids sniffing too it's almost unavoidable.

Earlier in the day I wasn't sure I'd bother due to the way I was feeling but I figured I needed to get that race monkey off my back one way or the other. No previous times to set it against, I was looking to see how my teammates did last year and gauge myself off that. I wasn't going to take it too serious and I'd be happy with a sub 20 time.

An hour and a half before the start time I had a can of red bull, something I've done for football matches when trying to play through a cold. Jogged down to the event from home as part of my warm up. No strides or sprints, just a gentle jog. Didn't feel much energy but knew once I was up and running I'd be grand at least.

So the goal was simple, without taxing my brain too much, if I could run every km under 4 minutes then I'd be under 20 at the finish.

The race
Took my place at the back of the sub 20 group which was the first graded group.
1st km - The race starts on an uphill section of field. I had started in the middle at the back of the sub 20 group and found myself drifting right to the outside as I passed between 1-2 dozen other runners. I didn't feel I was running to fast and felt comfortable. The uphill lasts about 150 m before it becomes downhill for the rest of the 1st km. After the first bend I tucked in behind an energetic looking lady and kept pace with her all the way down to the river.

2nd km - From the river heading back up the field the course turned to track and grass. Some chose to stay on the grass and I slowly passed them out before they realised they'd be better on the track too. I was starting to let the lady fried go at this stage. As I crested the hill halfway through this km I had a look up into the distance to see the lead runners astonished at the size of a gap that they could open up in just 1.5 kms. I was feeling good enough myself with the assured footing of the track underneath my feet.

Remembered my watch and clocked in the first 2 kms in 7:16. Sounded go to me anyway.

3rd and 4th km - Not too much jostling for places here. There was a group of about 8 of us running in almost single file for most of km 3. I noted local politician Ronan Moore passing me at this stage. He was shorter and much leaner than I expected and seemed to be very comfortable as he eased passed a few of us. The track turned back to grass during this stretch and becomes a long drag. Not knowing the course wasn't continuing as track I'd just made a burst to squeeze by a couple of lads who were slowing me down slightly. Then almost immediately hit the soft grass again and could instantly feel the energy in my legs dwindle. I started cussing my headcold as I didn't feel I'd been tipping along too fast beforehand but maybe I was - it was my first race in a while. I contemplated dropping out as I wasn't feeling too good. (I'd been researching racing with a cold earlier with one article saying "don't be disappointed if you don't finish). I decided instead to take the foot off a bit and see how I get on. I think around 5 or so passed me by. I was just thinking I want something in me for a good finish.

Before complete the 4th km it finishes with a long uphill section and more solid ground. I manged to close up again on the people in front. We were also coming back into the crowds which gave me a little lift.

Incidentally - km 3 was 3:33. I missed km 4.

5th km - Zig-zag through the field. Downhill and then uphill again. I got into a good rhythm though and passed one guy. The field was fairly spread out by now. Made a burst uphill for the finish and closed a 10-15 m gap on a pair in front of me but they both held on in a 3 way sprint.

kms 4 and 5 were done in 7:57 So avg of 3:58 but I suspect the 4th kms was 4:20s with the last km in around 3:40.

Final chip time was 18:47 so more than happy with that and now have an official 5 km PB.

Now back to my mile, although I might throw a Parkrun somewhere along the way to try and better that 5 km time.

IvoryTower · 16-06-2019 10:38pm

Nice racing, sounded like tough enough course as well. Have you picked out any mile races yet?

Dubh Geannain · 17-06-2019 9:54am

IvoryTower wrote: »

Nice racing, sounded like tough enough course as well. Have you picked out any mile races yet?

Thanks. If I'm not away at the time and have no match I'm aiming for the day of Irish PBs on July 14th. I'm not aware of any other races that might suit.

I've registered for it anyway and will try and squeeze in a bit more tempo work in the next 3 or so weeks.

Anyway, the week that was -

Week 30

11 June - 4.65 km moderateEnergy levels still not back to early March levels but still much improved on April where I'd struggle to run this comfortably under 18 mins
12 June - Football match
13 June - Pre-race shake out - 22 minute3 jog. Covered around 4.5 km
14 June - 5 km trail Race - hard - 18:47

Dubh Geannain · 28-06-2019 2:41pm

Bruised (don't think I fractured) my ribs playing a football match last week. It knocked me for six initally but I played on and wasn't too bad until the following day really. Can't lie on that side now and it hurts when I laugh/sneeze/cough or do any body movements in the wrong direction.

It also hurts when I run initially also but is not noticeable after the two or so minutes so I intend to train through. Recovery time is typically 3-6 weeks apparently but it looks like I'll be able to train through. It might work out as it means I'll have to take a step back from the football due to the impact and upper body aspect of that.

Anyway:

Week 31

18 June - Football training - Along with a proper gym session with the team. A bit of a gap since the Braveheart run but I was giving myself a few days rest to recover properly from the head cold.
19 June - Intervals - 14 x 40/45 secs Hard with 30 sec recovery. I did the first 4 @40 secs hard then acidently did the 5th at 45 secs so decided to stick with that for teh remainder
21 June - Football match - Bruised ribs from collision. Ouch

I'm away next week so I'll update this now

Week 32

25 June - 6.7 km Long run on track and grass - Another gap here as I wasn't fit to run with my ribs for a few days.
26 June - 4.65 km moderate - 17:40. Was hoping for low 17s here but this was less than 24 hours after my run the night before. I appreciate the effects of a poor nights sleep and not giving myself a sufficient rest time but still feel I'm playing catch-up to get back to where I was a couple of months back.
28 June - Tempos. 2 x 5 minutes @ 3:35/km pace with 3 minute recovery - Ran these tempos by feel so didn't know the actual pacing until I checked google maps afterwards. I was basically covering 1.4 kms in the 5 minutes. Now if I could just cover 209 metres further in that time :pac:
29 or 30 June - 6.7 km Long run or a hill session

Dubh Geannain · 08-07-2019 4:47pm

A productive weeks holidays. Despite having a drink most days with a couple of quite late nights I felt great, even in the mornings.

Week 33

01 July - 10.3 km easy - 42 minutes My right calf started cramping around 25 minutes in so had to ease back a little more at that stage. This was the longest distance I covered in a straight run since 2007.
03 July - Intervals - 14 x 45 seconds hard w / 30 seconds recovery
06 July - 12 x Hills - 39 seconds with 1:10 recovery/rest. 34 secs for last 2
07 July - 6.7 km easy - 31 mins. On track/grass Home again in the late evening. Very tired in the head but I knew the legs could take the run.

Sacksian · 08-07-2019 9:47pm

As well as the Day of PBs, there are paced miles at the Drogheda Irish Milers Meet on Saturday in Lourdes Stadium. The fastest is for runners targeting 5-6 minutes. If there isn't a pacer for these (there will be in all of the other middle-distance races), I'm sure they'd have no trouble finding one! €5 to enter, entries close midnight tomorrow.

It's also an opportunity to see some good middle distance running in the 'a' races.

Not sure what the standard will be at either but you might be able to run on Saturday and Sunday without too much problem if you fancy a couple of shots at it.

After that, there'll be a good field at the final Dublin graded meet (probably Tallaght) 7th August. B & C races will probably finish around 5 mins. You might need to be a member of a club for them but I think they have guests too.

Try and get back to the track when you can as Google Maps isn't ideal for calculating pace! But the 30s-40s hard/easy sessions you've been doing are very good for the mile.

Murph_D · 09-07-2019 9:11am

Pretty sure you need to be a club member for Dublin Gradeds, for insurance reasons. Think Ray posted this earlier on this, or another, thread.

IvoryTower · 09-07-2019 9:28am

they're pretty lax about everything, you walk in, give them your name and tell them what club you run for....

Dubh Geannain · 09-07-2019 10:02am

Thanks Sacksian. I don't have a club yet.

The plan is still for this Sunday but I may look at others if I fall just short. If I'm well off the pace then I'll have to try and get some more track work in somehow. It's more awkward these days to fit that in.

I think once the football finishes this year though I'm done with the weekly commitment to it. I think I'll look at joining the local AC. One of the lads off the team expressed a similar interest so it'd be nice if we joined up together.

Dubh Geannain · 09-07-2019 10:04am

IvoryTower wrote: »

they're pretty lax about everything, you walk in, give them your name and tell them what club you run for....

Good to know. Thanks. Is there a link to where/when these meets happen?

IvoryTower · 09-07-2019 10:05am

https://www.dublinathletics.com/

website is a bit messy

Dubh Geannain · 15-07-2019 11:02am

What a lovely day and a very well organised event. I'd liked to have spent more time hanging around but I ended up coming without the kids so flew in 10 minutes before the close of registration (40 mins before the race) and tipped off post race fairly sharpish too to get home again.

I did a 2 km warmup, followed by a few strides and dynamic stretches. The sweat was rolling off me the minute I stopped moving.

At the start line before heading off the pacer said he'd be aiming at 75 second laps and would look to make up the shortfall of 9 metres in the first lap so it'd be a little quicker than the others.

Lap 1 - I set off, keeping with the pacemaker. One guys blazed ahead of the rest of us. The initial 200 metres were comfortable but I was thinking it was feeling a little too fast for me so I let two guys pass me to take up position on the shoulder of the pacer. As we crossed the line the MC said the pacer was 3 seconds up on target. The board showed 1:12 from what I could see. I was still just behind the pacer. Lap 1 - 1:13:xx.
Lap 2 - I didn't look at my watch to check my Lap 1 split but assumed I was already 3 seconds up and probably moving too fast so let the pacer move a little further off. As I completed the lap I didn't look at the clock as I'd no idea in my head of what time I was looking to hit here (I should have and it should have been 2:30) but still felt okay as I passed and was only a couple of seconds behind the pacer I thought. Lap 2 - 1:17:xx.
Lap 3 - Hard to explain what happened here exactly. I probably should have checked my watch to see what my pace was after lap 2 but I was too focussed on running. Within the first 100 m of this lap I was passed by a guy in an Edenderry AC singlet. I was finding the going a little tougher here but in my head I was thinking I've less than 2 laps to go and to hang in. The Edenderry runner closed quickly on the leading group (he'd obviously paced his run very well). I let the gap open a little more here as I didn't want to fade badly on the last lap. As I finished the lap I glanced at the clock. 3:50. I was thinking, "so I need a 70 second final lap, can I do that?" Lap 3 - 1:20:xx (Feic)
Lap 4 - I gave it a go anyway and kicked hard from the start of the lap. There was a nice lad from Raheny who I was chatting to after the race. He was probably a few seconds ahead of me. He was also passed by the Edenderry lad who then went on to also pass the pacer and another. Great run by him. I was closing the gap all the time right through the line to finish just behind him. Lap 4 - 1:14:xx

Final time: 5:06 PB

It's a PB and 9 seconds up on my road time. I don't know how comparable they are.

I've a bit to chew on. Is sub 5 achievable this year? Did the heat have an affect? Should I have drivin on more on Lap 3; but then would I have been able to close as quickly as I did? Does the pacer shoulder some of the blame for taking us out too quick or should I have known my pace better and not gone with him at the start? Each photo I saw of the race of myself tells me I was not as comfortable as I thought but at least I know I gave it a good belt :pac:

I'm also not as cock sure as I was last November, before I did any research or practiced any training, that I'll manage sub 5 this year. We'll see though.

IvoryTower · 15-07-2019 1:42pm

Would love to crack the 5min myself, tried a few years ago and got it down to 5.05. Have you heard of any other mile races other than the Dublin Graded? Would like to go hard at this once my seasons over

Dubh Geannain · 15-07-2019 1:57pm

IvoryTower wrote: »

Would love to crack the 5min myself, tried a few years ago and got it down to 5.05. Have you heard of any other mile races other than the Dublin Graded? Would like to go hard at this once my seasons over

Not myself but then I've been using boards as my main source of info. I'm not on FB.

There's a couple of mile events listed here as far away as Kerry:
https://www.athleticsireland.ie/runzone/fixtures/

Then there's one hosted by Marino AC in October, I've no idea if it's on a track or not but it might be far enough off for you. My next attempt will probably be back on the road in about a month as I don't think running another race so soon will gain me those 7 seconds.

Sacksian · 15-07-2019 5:30pm

Dubh Geannain wrote: »

What a lovely day and a very well organised event. I'd liked to have spent more time hanging around but I ended up coming without the kids so flew in 10 minutes before the close of registration (40 mins before the race) and tipped off post race fairly sharpish too to get home again.

I did a 2 km warmup, followed by a few strides and dynamic stretches. The sweat was rolling off me the minute I stopped moving.

At the start line before heading off the pacer said he'd be aiming at 75 second laps and would look to make up the shortfall of 9 metres in the first lap so it'd be a little quicker than the others.
Lap 1 - I set off, keeping with the pacemaker. One guys blazed ahead of the rest of us. The initial 200 metres were comfortable but I was thinking it was feeling a little too fast for me so I let two guys pass me to take up position on the shoulder of the pacer. As we crossed the line the MC said the pacer was 3 seconds up on target. The board showed 1:12 from what I could see. I was still just behind the pacer. Lap 1 - 1:13:xx.

Lap 2 - I didn't look at my watch to check my Lap 1 split but assumed I was already 3 seconds up and probably moving too fast so let the pacer move a little further off. As I completed the lap I didn't look at the clock as I'd no idea in my head of what time I was looking to hit here (I should have and it should have been 2:30) but still felt okay as I passed and was only a couple of seconds behind the pacer I thought. Lap 2 - 1:17:xx.

Lap 3 - Hard to explain what happened here exactly. I probably should have checked my watch to see what my pace was after lap 2 but I was too focussed on running. Within the first 100 m of this lap I was passed by a guy in an Edenderry AC singlet. I was finding the going a little tougher here but in my head I was thinking I've less than 2 laps to go and to hang in. The Edenderry runner closed quickly on the leading group (he'd obviously paced his run very well). I let the gap open a little more here as I didn't want to fade badly on the last lap. As I finished the lap I glanced at the clock. 3:50. I was thinking, "so I need a 70 second final lap, can I do that?" Lap 3 - 1:20:xx (Feic)

Lap 4 - I gave it a go anyway and kicked hard from the start of the lap. There was a nice lad from Raheny who I was chatting to after the race. He was probably a few seconds ahead of me. He was also passed by the Edenderry lad who then went on to also pass the pacer and another. Great run by him. I was closing the gap all the time right through the line to finish just behind him. Lap 4 - 1:14:xx

Final time: 5:06 PB

It's a PB and 9 seconds up on my road time. I don't know how comparable they are.

I've a bit to chew on. Is sub 5 achievable this year? Did the heat have an affect? Should I have drivin on more on Lap 3; but then would I have been able to close as quickly as I did? Does the pacer shoulder some of the blame for taking us out too quick or should I have known my pace better and not gone with him at the start? Each photo I saw of the race of myself tells me I was not as comfortable as I thought but at least I know I gave it a good belt :pac:

I'm also not as cock sure as I was last November, before I did any research or practiced any training, that I'll manage sub 5 this year. We'll see though.

Well done, that's a great first go at it and I think there's a chance you could do it in your next race. You *should* see a good improvement from your first go to your second. Forget about the road time. But do have a think about running the 'b' race in the mile in the last Dublin graded meet.

Looking at the splits, you might have lost some time between the 2nd half of the first lap and half-way point. The start is always hot so your first lap is often your fastest and you weren't off the pace at the end of the first lap but if you do consciously ease off, that's hard to manage at mile pace. Generally, the third is the slowest with a bit of a pick-up at the end.

Sub 5 minute mile

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