Waterford GAA thread - mod warning post #1 and #51

puzl · 16-06-2019 08:23AM

Whatever new team we end up with next year will need to rebuild and will need consistency to do so. If fanning is the man for that job then give him 3-4 years to do it. If he isn't the man for that job then he should go right now so we can get down to the business of rebuilding properly. We've no time for "a shur give him another lash at it".

willbeuptuesday · 16-06-2019 09:03AM

Lads took this off the RTÉ article on Gaa funding, we need more GDA’s in our schools to develop the games in Waterford, currently we have 3.

“Ballyboden GAA, with more than 3000 members and 140 teams between juvenile and adult ranks, has two full-time coaches.”

In terms of monies received from Gaa central council we are nowhere! Money makes big difference just look at the Dublin hurling team yesterday. Ask yourself honestly who will win an all Ireland sooner Waterford or Dublin. They started by redrawing their structures 15 years ago as did Limerick, what are we doing? To paraphrase our county board officers “nothing to see here, we are grand”.

hurler on de ditch · 16-06-2019 09:03AM

puzl wrote: »

Whatever new team we end up with next year will need to rebuild and will need consistency to do so. If fanning is the man for that job then give him 3-4 years to do it. If he isn't the man for that job then he should go right now so we can get down to the business of rebuilding properly. We've no time for "a shur give him another lash at it".

Wtf

Mastermcgrath · 16-06-2019 09:47AM

puzl wrote: »

Whatever new team we end up with next year will need to rebuild and will need consistency to do so. If fanning is the man for that job then give him 3-4 years to do it. If he isn't the man for that job then he should go right now so we can get down to the business of rebuilding properly. We've no time for "a shur give him another lash at it".

He needs to go now. Could not contemplate him getting 3/4 years. Yes the players downed tools for him but don’t forget tactically it was a complete shambles, Ken McGrath was 100% right we looked clueless and rudderless. It’s been a disastrous call by the co board to appoint him and if he’s not going to step aside they need to man up and admit that it was an error and go get the right man this time.
I don’t buy into the view that there’s this big rebuilding job needed, the best players are there now. Bar one or 2 to move on the nucleus of the side for the next 3/4 years is there. But who can make a team out of them is the question.

Deise Gael · 16-06-2019 03:27PM

https://twitter.com/kenmcgrath78?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Stacksofwacks · 16-06-2019 03:38PM

Deise Gael wrote: »

https://twitter.com/kenmcgrath78?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Stop this fight ref he's gonna break every bone in his body!

willbeuptuesday · 16-06-2019 04:33PM

U17 Hurling Celtic Challenge: Kerry 2-19 Waterford 3-12

Road-Hog · 16-06-2019 05:02PM

willbeuptuesday wrote: »

U17 Hurling Celtic Challenge: Kerry 2-19 Waterford 3-12

Never hear of this competition.......are you sure it’s not football......did Kerry u17’s play in the Munster championship games...??

willbeuptuesday · 16-06-2019 05:19PM

It’s hurling alright, next years minors I assume. Photo of the winning Kerry team on Radio Kerry sport twitter feed.

Road-Hog wrote: »

Never hear of this competition.......are you sure it’s not football......did Kerry u17’s play in the Munster championship games...??

upthedeise16 · 16-06-2019 05:33PM

willbeuptuesday wrote: »

It’s hurling alright, next years minors I assume. Photo of the winning Kerry team on Radio Kerry sport twitter feed.

It’s this years minor b team basically, a team made up of players not picked for the minor panel

Deisefacts · 16-06-2019 05:49PM

upthedeise16 wrote: »

It’s this years minor b team basically, a team made up of players not picked for the minor panel

It’s a worrying fact. The Kerry team was made up of 12 players from the causeway school who beat blackwater community school in the u-16 1/2 Munster “c” schools final. Blackwater had 3 county minors playing and 4 Celtic cup players playing on the day.

Also just another few bits from the weekend, Waterford were the only county with no participant in the Munster senior long puc. This isn’t the most shameful thing from the weekend thought. Our u-20 footballers were beaten 7-18 to 1-7 by Laois in the new u-20 league. This on top of earlier defeats to Tipperary(6-22 to 01), Wexford (5-24 to 2-4) and Carlow( 5-15 to 1-7). Also our u-20 hurlers we’re beaten by Wexford last week by either 11/12 pts.

I haven’t been on in awhile as I’m still trying to digest all that has happened over the last few months with hurling and football. I predicted last November that things would unravel but I never expected to see the hammerings our senior teams would get. ðŸ˜¢ðŸ˜¢ðŸ˜¢

Alf Tupper · 16-06-2019 07:00PM

Deise Gael wrote: »

https://twitter.com/kenmcgrath78?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Ah Boy Ken no harm to call out the bluffer. Watched him today on the SG and the gasbag was still talking about systems. F**ing systems. He managed to bring his son into the analaysis too waffling about seamie callinan. Ive been watching different analysts for years on the tele and not one of them has manged that feat. F8cking narcissist if he was a bar of chocolate he would eat himself

puzl · 16-06-2019 07:24PM

Mastermcgrath wrote: »

He needs to go now. Could not contemplate him getting 3/4 years. Yes the players downed tools for him but don’t forget tactically it was a complete shambles, Ken McGrath was 100% right we looked clueless and rudderless. It’s been a disastrous call by the co board to appoint him and if he’s not going to step aside they need to man up and admit that it was an error and go get the right man this time.
I don’t buy into the view that there’s this big rebuilding job needed, the best players are there now. Bar one or 2 to move on the nucleus of the side for the next 3/4 years is there. But who can make a team out of them is the question.

That's what I'm saying. The right man for the job needs to be given 4 years. If it's not PF then thank him and get the man who is right for the job. He's either right for the job or he's not, I don't understand the "give him another year" people...

JeffKenna · 16-06-2019 09:43PM

Alf Tupper wrote: »

Deise Gael wrote: »

https://twitter.com/kenmcgrath78?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Ah Boy Ken no harm to call out the bluffer. Watched him today on the SG and the gasbag was still talking about systems. F**ing systems. He managed to bring his son into the analaysis too waffling about seamie callinan. Ive been watching different analysts for years on the tele and not one of them has manged that feat. F8cking narcissist if he was a bar of chocolate he would eat himself

I was listening to him on RTE radio yesterday evening and when he started discussing Ken and tactics he began saying that the game and players have changed so much in the last 15 years. 14 out of 15 lads would now have gone to college. I was really gobsmacked at the insinuation he was making.

Mastermcgrath · 16-06-2019 09:50PM

Alf Tupper wrote: »

Ah Boy Ken no harm to call out the bluffer. Watched him today on the SG and the gasbag was still talking about systems. F**ing systems. He managed to bring his son into the analaysis too waffling about seamie callinan. Ive been watching different analysts for years on the tele and not one of them has manged that feat. F8cking narcissist if he was a bar of chocolate he would eat himself

The 2 lads sniping at each other is helping no one not least Waterford hurling. We are the laughing stock of the hurling world once again. A lot of players on the panel would be close to both these men in some shape or form so all they’re doing is driving a wedge in an already divided camp. If they really want to help Waterford hurling then they should bring some positive solutions to the table.
Like I said in a previous post D MCG is in the media now, let him off if people see Shakespearean quotes a breath of ‘fresh air’ added to hurling analysis then so be it. but if you’re like me and cringe everytime the guy opens his mouth then dont read it or switch off, simple.

Waternut · 16-06-2019 10:50PM

It's embarrassing, two forty year old men acting like school children over the media.

I had a lot of time for Derek. I always thought his intentions were right albeit his methods never sat easy with me.

He has however seriously let himself down. He has come across as bitter, vindictive and honestly I can't see any county, including Waterford, wanting to have anything to do with him in future.

hardybuck · 16-06-2019 10:52PM

Any self respecting county would be up in arms after two years without a championship win, and going from All Ireland finalists to way off the pace.

If you were in Tipp, Kilkenny, Cork, Kerry etc. the public and past players would all be lining up to have a go. A friend on mine who played with Kerry recalls being literally spat on in the street after losing a crucial game to inferior opposition.

Derek makes some very valid points, particularly about mental health and the criticism players are expected to absorb. However, I feel sorry for him that he still feels so bitter a year after leaving the role.

Derek is a self described management addict, and also did this role as a full time gig for a number of years. I hope for his sake that he can move on and set the record straight on the field rather than writing about it.

Mastermcgrath · 17-06-2019 01:56AM

hardybuck wrote: »

. A friend on mine who played with Kerry recalls being literally spat on in the street after losing a crucial game to inferior opposition.
.

And your using that in support of your argument???..

Waternut · 17-06-2019 03:59AM

hardybuck wrote: »

Any self respecting county would be up in arms after two years without a championship win, and going from All Ireland finalists to way off the pace.

If you were in Tipp, Kilkenny, Cork, Kerry etc. the public and past players would all be lining up to have a go. A friend on mine who played with Kerry recalls being literally spat on in the street after losing a crucial game to inferior opposition.

Derek makes some very valid points, particularly about mental health and the criticism players are expected to absorb. However, I feel sorry for him that he still feels so bitter a year after leaving the role.

Derek is a self described management addict, and also did this role as a full time gig for a number of years. I hope for his sake that he can move on and set the record straight on the field rather than writing about it.

I agree with most of what you say, but I'm still really confused as to where Derek's chip on the shoulder is coming from.

He had his time. He had five years. He had the support of the board, the players and the majority of the fans.

It didn't work, simple as. He tried his way, and fair fu(ks to him for trying a different way, I'll always commend him for it, but it simply didn't work. We won a league but never really looked like winning a Munster or All Ireland. Galway were six or seven points better than us on the day and their forwards gave an exhibition.

I don't think anyone who played the game of hurling really believed we could win an All Ireland with one, maybe two forwards positioned inside the opposing half, but look as I said, he tried, it was something different, but it didn't work.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result, so of course Fanning come in and changed things about.

The last few days has been embarressing and the cheap shots flying over and back between men who should know better, is ridiculous.

hardybuck · 17-06-2019 07:00AM

Mastermcgrath wrote: »

And your using that in support of your argument???..

Some people are suggesting that we're a soap opera that the country are laughing at. I'm saying that every county with any sort of ambition would have this sort of response and probably a lot worse.

PTH2009 · 17-06-2019 11:47AM

Doesn't look great for under 20s in both codes going by the scores reported from challenge games a few posts back

Any news on Fanning staying for 2020 ???. Believe he has every intention of doing so but with the toxic atmosphere reported from the camp its hard too knw what players will want to come back for next season. The Coutny Board should look into it and ignore what the clown PJR said

shockframe · 17-06-2019 06:16PM

The article was all over the place but given the critics of him that existed he was always going to fire back.

From the outside I would say Derek Mcgrath did the best with what he had. 2 league and Munster finals with 3 All Ireland semi final appearances and 1 final is a respectable return.

I remember Ken Mcgrath had a tweet during the 2016 league final saying something like hurling was ruined. I get the impression that there was bad blood between himself and Derek after how it ended up with Michael Ryan.

I can understand where Derek is coming from. Comparisons to Jim Mcguinness and Donegal (which is also drastictically unfair in its criticism for both). Non stop digs at his style of play and how hurling should be played and then when he goes and with an underwhelming follow on season the same people talking about how the game should be played point to something else and how they don't have the players. It's hard to blame Derek for hitting back.

Strangely I’d say he’s glad to be gone from the setup. He’s established himself on TV and the journalism/vlog scene. Talks of him going back in would be fanciful. Would say he has no notion of doing so or a good couple of years.

Mastermcgrath · 18-06-2019 12:03AM

How are the u20's shaping up? Any challenge games? From what I remember the minor group from 2 years ago were annihilated in every game in the Munster Championship, so its safe not to expect much from this group?

Mastermcgrath · 18-06-2019 02:54AM

shockframe wrote: »

Talks of him going back in would be fanciful. Would say he has no notion of doing so or a good couple of years.

I don't understand all this talk of him going back in a 'couple of years', like its some sort of inevitability. Its been spoken about constantly from the very day he stepped aside, and was the first person to mention it himself that he'd love to go back in a few years when 'the lads are 27 or 8'. Why did he ever step down then in the first place if its his destiny to return 'a few years down the line'?

As far as I'm concerned the ship has well and truly sailed and we shouldn't even be entertaining the idea. Too much water under the bridge.
Its not like JBM or Liam Sheedy who earned the right to get a second shot at it due to the legendary status in their own counties

cul beag · 18-06-2019 05:42AM

Mastermcgrath wrote: »

I don't understand all this talk of him going back in a 'couple of years', like its some sort of inevitability. Its been spoken about constantly from the very day he stepped aside, and was the first person to mention it himself that he'd love to go back in a few years when 'the lads are 27 or 8'. Why did he ever step down then in the first place if its his destiny to return 'a few years down the line'?

As far as I'm concerned the ship has well and truly sailed and we shouldn't even be entertaining the idea. Too much water under the bridge.
Its not like JBM or Liam Sheedy who earned the right to get a second shot at it due to the legendary status in their own counties

But in his own mind he believes he is deserving of legendary status. Unfortunately some players/supporters seem to think the same thing. He’s like the jilted ex boyfriend that can’t accept he has been blown out! Unfortunately for him there aren’t too many more fish in the sea though team wise! Wexford maybe but that’s all I’d imagine.

hardybuck · 18-06-2019 08:29AM

There is far too much talk about a guy who hasn't been involved in Waterford teams for a year.

Get used to the idea that he'll be our very own Ger Loughnane or Babs Keating, writing about Waterford long into the future for whoever is bothered reading their articles.

The key difference between Loughnane, Babs and Derek is that the other two lads won All Irelands and have maybe earned their right to talk nonsense from time to time.

Road-Hog · 18-06-2019 09:42AM

hardybuck wrote: »

There is far too much talk about a guy who hasn't been involved in Waterford teams for a year.

Get used to the idea that he'll be our very own Ger Loughnane or Babs Keating, writing about Waterford long into the future for whoever is bothered reading their articles.

The key difference between Loughnane, Babs and Derek is that the other two lads won All Irelands and have maybe earned their right to talk nonsense from time to time.

There are plenty of sports journalists eg vincent Hogan, Sean Moran etc who never even coached a team who write articles like mcgrath particularly hogan so don’t be going over the top on criticism of mcgrath. Yes he uses Shakespeare quotes and ‘big words’ but so did guys like yer man cashman (Kevin I think it was) who used to write years ago....

hardybuck · 18-06-2019 10:07AM

Road-Hog wrote: »

There are plenty of sports journalists eg vincent Hogan, Sean Moran etc who never even coached a team who write articles like mcgrath particularly hogan so don’t be going over the top on criticism of mcgrath. Yes he uses Shakespeare quotes and ‘big words’ but so did guys like yer man cashman (Kevin I think it was) who used to write years ago....

Yes but these guys are journalists, not secondary school teachers.

None of them (I don't think) were involved with intercounty teams and used their profile to settle past scores and attempt to develop/maintain their legacy status.

I'd be delighted to see Derek go back into managing and direct his focus there - do the talking on the field.

mountgomery burns · 18-06-2019 11:21AM

If you really wanted to move on Hardybuck, was there a need to throw a couple more digs in?

Anyway, since we're moving on could we request a MOD do to a poll on whether people think Fanning should stay or go, or is that against charter rules? Would be interested to see what the consensus is.

hardybuck · 18-06-2019 11:36AM

mountgomery burns wrote: »

If you really wanted to move on Hardybuck, was there a need to throw a couple more digs in?

Anyway, since we're moving on could we request a MOD do to a poll on whether people think Fanning should stay or go, or is that against charter rules? Would be interested to see what the consensus is.

I don't think I got any real digs in - more of a factual response in my opinion.

If a poll was put up, I think people would need to be clear on what viable alternatives might be available.

Waterford GAA thread - mod warning post #1 and #51

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