Waterford GAA thread - mod warning post #1 and #51

tommylad1212

thesaturdayman wrote: »

I would say there definitely is demand there

Where in ballygunner? What other club would have numbers, the junior b and c championship would have a lot of older lads playing on teams

hardybuck

The County Board, and the GAA generally, have a mandate to encourage people to play games which is good for the health and well-being of all our communities. Wouldn't it be great to see a more diverse group of members playing more games more often? I saw an initiative recently called 'GAA Mammies' which was just about getting mothers up once a week to have a kick around which is a great initiative and brings the community into the club.

It strikes me that they're feeling very under pressure to get through their existing workload and facilitate the games that they have - which is understandable if they are trying to control a huge masterplan centrally.

There were proposals a couple of years back to have 7-a-side and 10-a-side tournaments, stuff that the WIT were organising under lights also - I'm not sure where that's at.

Maybe this is something clubs should be looking to organise themselves locally and take the pressure off the master schedule.

Deisegodeo

Jjjjjjjjbarry wrote: »

Thought Dungarvan could have pushed on a bit better in the second half against a weakened Ballygunner side. Not good when Ballygunner were missing about 5 of their usual starting defenders and they still win. Great penalty save by SOK in the first half.

Passage put in a better second half effort against de la Salle but just not good enough on the day.

Ballygunner looked a bit light weight, particularly in defence. Dessie Hutchinson an interesting one, started very brightly showing great pace and touch but faded a bit in second half. Will be interesting to see how he settles back to hurling, was considered a real prospect before going the soccer route.

Sokys save from currans penalty was crucial, dungarvan were on top at the time and missed another good goal chance a minute later, would have been interesting if they had taken their chances.

I thought dls were considerably the better team in the first game, some nice passing moves all over the field. They gave away too many frees which kept passage in the game. Jack Fagan looked good, missed a few frees but got some lovely scores and well able to win his own ball.

hardybuck

tommylad1212 wrote: »

Where in ballygunner? What other club would have numbers, the junior b and c championship would have a lot of older lads playing on teams

Look at the amount of totally knackered guys above 35 playing 5-a-side and 7-a-side football on astro pitches every week.

They just want a weekly game to keep fit and to have a bit of banter. Standard is invariably awful - but they're out exercising and being social.

A lot of those guys wouldn't dream about playing Junior hurling and football because a) there isn't any regular game involved - it's totally sporadic, and b) they don't want to be broken up chasing after 20 year olds on a full sized pitch.

hardybuck

Deisegodeo wrote: »

Ballygunner looked a bit light weight, particularly in defence. Dessie Hutchinson an interesting one, started very brightly showing great pace and touch but faded a bit in second half. Will be interesting to see how he settles back to hurling, was considered a real prospect before going the soccer route.

Sokys save from currans penalty was crucial, dungarvan were on top at the time and missed another good goal chance a minute later, would have been interesting if they had taken their chances.

I thought dls were considerably the better team in the first game, some nice passing moves all over the field. They gave away too many frees which kept passage in the game. Jack Fagan looked good, missed a few frees but got some lovely scores and well able to win his own ball.

Is Jack Fagan someone who should be in the county team at this stage?

Deisegodeo

Deisegodeo wrote: »

Ballygunner looked a bit light weight, particularly in defence. Dessie Hutchinson an interesting one, started very brightly showing great pace and touch but faded a bit in second half. Will be interesting to see how he settles back to hurling, was considered a real prospect before going the soccer route.

Sokys save from currans penalty was crucial, dungarvan were on top at the time and missed another good goal chance a minute later, would have been interesting if they had taken their chances.

I thought dls were considerably the better team in the first game, some nice passing moves all over the field. They gave away too many frees which kept passage in the game. Jack Fagan looked good, missed a few frees but got some lovely scores and well able to win his own ball.

Yeah DLS always seemed in control and had them at arms length. Fagan is probably worth a look at intercounty yeah. Looks big and has a good hand to catch a ball. Could fit into our half forward line well and can also hit frees.

Kiely from Abbeyside is definitely a great prospect too.

thesaturdayman

hardybuck wrote: »

The County Board, and the GAA generally, have a mandate to encourage people to play games which is good for the health and well-being of all our communities. Wouldn't it be great to see a more diverse group of members playing more games more often? I saw an initiative recently called 'GAA Mammies' which was just about getting mothers up once a week to have a kick around which is a great initiative and brings the community into the club.

It strikes me that they're feeling very under pressure to get through their existing workload and facilitate the games that they have - which is understandable if they are trying to control a huge masterplan centrally.

There were proposals a couple of years back to have 7-a-side and 10-a-side tournaments, stuff that the WIT were organising under lights also - I'm not sure where that's at.

Maybe this is something clubs should be looking to organise themselves locally and take the pressure off the master schedule.

cork GAA run a social league during the winter. Also Gaultier run an over 35s comp. of the players we had turned out for us last year, approx 55 were ex players and members of our club who hadnt played in years, of those 55 approx 6-7 were still playing. Of the other teams on the day rathg dungarvan etc a load of their lads werent playing either.

lads are more inclined to come out of retirement to play against lads of similiar physical condition then be chasing after some 22 year old gym bunny. if it was graded correctly i.e. not have the brick eligible for eg it would be a fantastic competition.

KevIRL

Jjjjjjjjbarry wrote: »

Kiely from Abbeyside is definitely a great prospect too.

He was v good for minors last year. Especially in the Tipp game when we had the big comeback to win.

Stopitwillya

thesaturdayman wrote: »

hardybuck wrote: »

The County Board, and the GAA generally, have a mandate to encourage people to play games which is good for the health and well-being of all our communities. Wouldn't it be great to see a more diverse group of members playing more games more often? I saw an initiative recently called 'GAA Mammies' which was just about getting mothers up once a week to have a kick around which is a great initiative and brings the community into the club.

It strikes me that they're feeling very under pressure to get through their existing workload and facilitate the games that they have - which is understandable if they are trying to control a huge masterplan centrally.

There were proposals a couple of years back to have 7-a-side and 10-a-side tournaments, stuff that the WIT were organising under lights also - I'm not sure where that's at.

Maybe this is something clubs should be looking to organise themselves locally and take the pressure off the master schedule.

cork GAA run a social league during the winter. Also Gaultier run an over 35s comp. of the players we had turned out for us last year, approx 55 were ex players and members of our club who hadnt played in years, of those 55 approx 6-7 were still playing. Of the other teams on the day rathg dungarvan etc a load of their lads werent playing either.

lads are more inclined to come out of retirement to play against lads of similiar physical condition then be chasing after some 22 year old gym bunny. if it was graded correctly i.e. not have the brick eligible for eg it would be a fantastic competition.

A competition that would also get many ex players back involved in their clubs, which could eventually lead on to them getting involved in coaching juveniles or maybe the administration side. I have seen it working with the over 35s soccer, where lads in their 50s and 60s are still playing. No reason that can't happen in GAA circles.

carter10

KevIRL wrote: »

He was v good for minors last year. Especially in the Tipp game when we had the big comeback to win.

Is he the lad that moved from half back late in the game and caused havoc in the Tipp full back line?
If it's him, i was very impressed with him that day.

PTH2009

Any news on the senior management team ???

Are they staying on
Are they adding more too the backroom team

Were any of the current setup spotted watching games over the weekend?

carter10

carter10 wrote: »

KevIRL wrote: »

He was v good for minors last year. Especially in the Tipp game when we had the big comeback to win.

Is he the lad that moved from half back late in the game and caused havoc in the Tipp full back line?
If it's him, i was very impressed with him that day.

Yeah that was him. He was the star of that team and was / still is a great ball winner.
Hopefully he’s one who continues to improve. We could do with some good talent coming through.

How old is Fagan?

tommylad1212

PTH2009 wrote: »

Any news on the senior management team ???

Are they staying on
Are they adding more too the backroom team

Two year term

TheScoringGoal

Jjjjjjjjbarry wrote: »

Yeah that was him. He was the star of that team and was / still is a great ball winner.
Hopefully he’s one who continues to improve. We could do with some good talent coming through.

How old is Fagan?

I'd say we could calm down a bit about young Kiely, even though I consider him the best underage prospect in the county. But he's only turning 18 this year and physically he has a lot of developing still to do.

Fagan was a sub on the all ireland winning under 21 team so 24 this year. He's impressed in both games for DLS. While he's not bad in the air, he's not a Séamus Prendergast style ball winner. I'd say he's more rounded than that and more mobile. Strikes me as quite a clever player too, he looks to bring others into the game

tommylad1212

hardybuck wrote: »

Is Jack Fagan someone who should be in the county team at this stage?

Was on the panel under Derek and got injured

TheScoringGoal

TheScoringGoal wrote: »

I'd say we could calm down a bit about young Kiely, even though I consider him the best underage prospect in the county. But he's only turning 18 this year and physically he has a lot of developing still to do.

Fagan was a sub on the all ireland winning under 21 team so 24 this year. He's impressed in both games for DLS. While he's not bad in the air, he's not a Séamus Prendergast style ball winner. I'd say he's more rounded than that and more mobile. Strikes me as quite a clever player too, he looks to bring others into the game

Yeah very true. He's still very young so has a lot of developing to do and may not even want to keep hurling. Who knows. Tough lad though. Took a bad hit against Mount Sion and was down for a few minutes but in fairness, he got up and kept at it. Think it was Aussie who caught him while trying to double on a high ball.

Yeah agree on Fagan. He may not be the answer to our problems either and is probably being built up a little too. He's no Joe Canning but a fine hurler at club level so worth another run if injury free.

EYEBALLSOUT

Wipe the slate clean with all the players and make them start from scratch irrespective of reputations. If we want to go places nxt year they have to get players who can win their own ball and battles because ultimately in the heat of championship hurling all the games are decided ultimately on the which team can do the basics right- tackling, 1st touch, shooting and most importantly our ability to win primary possession.
All the close games take the same route.

mountgomery burns

EYEBALLSOUT wrote: »

Wipe the slate clean with all the players and make them start from scratch irrespective of reputations.

What does this actually mean?

EYEBALLSOUT

mountgomery burns wrote: »

What does this actually mean?

Well it’s fairly straightforward. In order to move forward all players putting themselves forward for selection nxt year need to be at the one level, feel equal and whatever achievements the more experienced players have achieved be it personal or as part of the collective doesn’t come into the reckoning when being selected. This will give younger lads the sense they can break onto the team or panel and it puts the older lads on notice- performance is all that matters not past glories etc etc... hope that helps clarify it for you...

hardybuck

Jjjjjjjjbarry wrote: »

Yeah very true. He's still very young so has a lot of developing to do and may not even want to keep hurling. Who knows. Tough lad though. Took a bad hit against Mount Sion and was down for a few minutes but in fairness, he got up and kept at it. Think it was Aussie who caught him while trying to double on a high ball.

Yeah agree on Fagan. He may not be the answer to our problems either and is probably being built up a little too. He's no Joe Canning but a fine hurler at club level so worth another run if injury free.

It doesn't appear that Fagan is being built up that much as people are still asking about what type of player he is.

Our forward line is so awful we'd hopefully see a few more lads tried out.

Waternut

I don't think we are building Fagan up to be answer to all our forward issues. He's a big man, well able to put himself about, is not easily knocked off the ball and is not that bad a hurler either. Similar in many ways to Seamus Prendergast. Fagan probably has a little more hurling and speed..
Our half and full forward lines lack physicality, presence and ability to catch a ball. Being honest, our forward line, apart from Gleeson, wouldn't catch a cold, and its not as if they're small men. Mahoney, Gleeson and the two Bennetts are at least six foot.
I don't know what it is, poor coaching at underage, lack of competition underage or simple lack of real aggression, which unfotunately can't be coached into a player. I haven't figured it out yet.

Pogue eile

Waternut wrote: »

I don't think we are building Fagan up to be answer to all our forward issues. He's a big man, well able to put himself about, is not easily knocked off the ball and is not that bad a hurler either. Similar in many ways to Seamus Prendergast. Fagan probably has a little more hurling and speed..
Our half and full forward lines lack physicality, presence and ability to catch a ball. Being honest, our forward line, apart from Gleeson, wouldn't catch a cold, and its not as if they're small men. Mahoney, Gleeson and the two Bennetts are at least six foot.
I don't know what it is, poor coaching at underage, lack of competition underage or simple lack of real aggression, which unfotunately can't be coached into a player. I haven't figured it out yet.

Playing Gleeson in the forwards is certainly an experiment that needs to be halted ASAP. Wing Back or no where and when/if he matures and shows the necessary discipline centre back.

Deisegodeo

Yeah I'd agree, don't think Fagan is being built up too much - as stated by someone already he couldn't make the u21 team in 2016, albeit that was a very strong team, so expecting too much from him would be unfair. But he does have something about him that we lack at present - a ball winning forward with size and strength and can score, so he is certainly worth trying in next year's league in my view.

Michael kiely is another one worth trying, but he is a lot younger so unfair expectations shouldn't be placed on him, he woukd need time to settle in and grow into it.

Anyone else who may be could step up for next year? Our forward play was so poor this year, I feel we really need to find some new forwards, maybe some lads can step up, maybe not, but we do need to look at it. I see Billy Nolan played in the forwards for roanmore at the weekend, would he be worth looking at again? He looked a lot fitter this year I thought

The blue blaa

Jack Fagan was a standout player again in round 2 of the championship, in absolute dreadful conditions he got some good scores whilst being man marked by Noel Connors.
He definitely deserves a chance in a team which is crying out for fresh attack minded players.

Lets not get bogged down on the U21 selection, Calum Lyons couldn't get into a mediocre U21 team and look at how he's progressed given the opportunity.

PTH2009

The blue blaa wrote: »

Jack Fagan was a standout player again in round 2 of the championship, in absolute dreadful conditions he got some good scores whilst being man marked by Noel Connors.
He definitely deserves a chance in a team which is crying out for fresh attack minded players.

Lets not get bogged down on the U21 selection, Calum Lyons couldn't get into a mediocre U21 team and look at how he's progressed given the opportunity.

All depends on If Fagan can commit to intercounty

Looks like 2020 will be a write off and will end Fannings term (if he doesn't decide to go this year himself which looks unlikely) and some guys might 'take a year out'. Could be a massively new squad in pre season training come Oct/Nov. We cant afford to lose some quality players over below par management set ups

Mastermcgrath

Fagan came down from Meath with a big enough reputation, at least as someone who was deemed too good for a lower tier county but its been very slow to take off for him. As someone said he couldn't break into that u21 side and didn't exactly shoot the lights out for DLS either. Then a bad injury followed by a couple of summers in the States, I thought he would disappear but seems to be coming into his own at 23/24, still a quality hurler and could be an option for Waterford going forward.

Pogue eile

PTH2009 wrote: »

All depends on If Fagan can commit to intercounty

Looks like 2020 will be a write off and will end Fannings term (if he doesn't decide to go this year himself which looks unlikely) and some guys might 'take a year out'. Could be a massively new squad in pre season training come Oct/Nov. We cant afford to lose some quality players over below par management set ups

Or you cant afford to simply discard every manager because of sub par players?

The truth as always lies somewhere in between.

mountgomery burns

Pogue eile wrote: »

Or you cant afford to simply discard every manager because of sub par players?

The truth as always lies somewhere in between.

Would you give Fanning another year out of interest? I know there's no question he wouldn't get a second year in Tipp, but I imagine that will be qualified to some degree at least by the players at his disposal

blue note

mountgomery burns wrote: »

Would you give Fanning another year out of interest? I know there's no question he wouldn't get a second year in Tipp, but I imagine that will be qualified to some degree at least by the players at his disposal

There's good players at Fannings disposal. They had crazy injuries last year, but it's basically the same panel that got to a final two years ago and semi's both years before that.

Other teams improved, our players should have behaved better. It's not as simple as saying it's all Fannings fault. It's not by a long stretch. But I hate to say it because he looks like a genuine guy who tries his best for the County, but he looks like he's not up to the job at all to be honest. Part of the job is getting the players to believe in you. If you can't, you haven't a hope.

And I don't blame the players fully for that either. They give up their social lives to play County basically. They have a right to get a manager they can get behind.