Bank of Ireland shares

Gatoh · 02-08-2018 12:20pm

Oh no, I did not break even at all, still lost more or less 5k - my break even point (was) 9.30
However I realized since dividend pay out that this share will not exceed 7.50 for a while - and road ahead is still quite rough, Brexit outcome, U.S. market settling, etc.
Just was happy to take monies out and invest funds elsewhere with minimal possible loss.. Sometimes you just need to swallow a bitter bill and move on.
I did well when shares traded 8c to 26c , made a nice profit back then but went too greedy and when Brexit happened all my investment went straight to south.. was waiting recovery since but never happened.

Happy to be out..

very happy indeed..

p to the e · 26-09-2018 3:45pm

Gatoh wrote: »

Oh no, I did not break even at all, still lost more or less 5k - my break even point (was) 9.30
However I realized since dividend pay out that this share will not exceed 7.50 for a while - and road ahead is still quite rough, Brexit outcome, U.S. market settling, etc.
Just was happy to take monies out and invest funds elsewhere with minimal possible loss.. Sometimes you just need to swallow a bitter bill and move on.
I did well when shares traded 8c to 26c , made a nice profit back then but went too greedy and when Brexit happened all my investment went straight to south.. was waiting recovery since but never happened.

Happy to be out..

very happy indeed..

Weren't far off the mark. 7.57 at start of August and down to roughly 7 today.

Gatoh · 26-09-2018 3:56pm

Sad innit?

Shauny2010 · 26-09-2018 6:49pm

I don't really see a pile of downside from here. The long term trend is positive, I see this a buying opportunity. At 7 euros and a dividend of ~20c gives a yield of 3%.
Forecast dividends are predicted to rise close to 50c over the next few years so buying at 7 euro would end up yielding up to 7%. (And if you were to compound the interest over the next 5 years it would leave a handsome low risk return)

Gatoh · 26-09-2018 7:48pm

:D:D
Sure thing, BOI share always been and will be a buying opportunity and nothing more I'm afraid

howiya · 26-09-2018 7:57pm

Shauny2010 wrote: »

I don't really see a pile of downside from here. The long term trend is positive, I see this a buying opportunity. At 7 euros and a dividend of ~20c gives a yield of 3%.
Forecast dividends are predicted to rise close to 50c over the next few years so buying at 7 euro would end up yielding up to 7%. (And if you were to compound the interest over the next 5 years it would leave a handsome low risk return)

I see it as a buying opportunity but I don't see it as a buy and hold. Share price has yo-yoed between €6.50 and €7.50 this year. Money to be made but wouldn't sit on it.

Shauny2010 · 28-09-2018 2:54pm

You may be right, I'm really surprised it is heading down but I am hoping to add more at these prices. Question is what am I missing here? Why am I the only one who thinks its a great buy at 6.60?

littlevillage · 28-09-2018 4:08pm

Shauny2010 wrote: »

You may be right, I'm really surprised it is heading down but I am hoping to add more at these prices. Question is what am I missing here? Why am I the only one who thinks its a great buy at 6.60?

Of the same opinion, I was tempted to add a bit more today but got a sinking feeling that I was missing something, so decided not to pull the trigger til I read up a bit over the weekend.

The An Post entry into Mortgagaes anad SME loans, is all I can think of that is pushing the banks down and BOI is not doing particularly brillantly in the UK with its link up with the AA.

daheff · 28-09-2018 4:41pm

Shauny2010 wrote: »

You may be right, I'm really surprised it is heading down but I am hoping to add more at these prices. Question is what am I missing here? Why am I the only one who thinks its a great buy at 6.60?

I do too.

I think its way undervalued since they did the reverse share split.

I think the pre split price would be up around the 10EUR mark now.

throw in divs soon and i think theres road to run on this stock still. Bank sentiment across the board has been hit in the last year or so, but from what i read the sentiment is changing back to bank stocks.

Gatoh · 19-10-2018 7:02am

How's that buying opportunity going, boys?

howiya · 19-10-2018 10:32am

Gatoh wrote: »

How's that buying opportunity going, boys?

Thankfully I was away so I didn't get in. I see it went below €6 around 11:00

drunkmonkey · 19-10-2018 11:04am

Davy got this one all wrong, that €9.50 price target a few weeks ago was well off. I wonder will the revise it or still think it's good.

howiya · 19-10-2018 11:29am

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Davy got this one all wrong, that €9.50 price target a few weeks ago was well off. I wonder will the revise it or still think it's good.

I'd say the answer to that depends on how many of their clients hold BOI :pac:

Shauny2010 · 19-10-2018 5:29pm

Gatoh wrote: »

How's that buying opportunity going, boys?

Been buying over the last 3 days, paid 6.38 then 6.34 and got some today for 6.15.
I missed the drop down to 6 euro but afaik degiro didn't drop the ask that far down.
Anyways I know its falling but I believe this share still trading on a channel over the last 18 month. If I am right it should head north again in a few weeks.
I have a large enough holding, certainly much more than the board of directors but that wouldn't be hard.
Not much love for banks over the last few weeks but I'd rather be buying now and selling when everyone else is raving about them

q85dw7osi4lebg · 19-10-2018 8:24pm

Watching the past couple of months, jumped in today. Did well in 2014/15, on a break from BOI since then.

Gatoh · 19-10-2018 8:33pm

Good luck lads!

Thargor · 19-10-2018 10:35pm

Shauny2010 wrote: »

Been buying over the last 3 days, paid 6.38 then 6.34 and got some today for 6.15.
I missed the drop down to 6 euro but afaik degiro didn't drop the ask that far down.
Anyways I know its falling but I believe this share still trading on a channel over the last 18 month. If I am right it should head north again in a few weeks.
I have a large enough holding, certainly much more than the board of directors but that wouldn't be hard.
Not much love for banks over the last few weeks but I'd rather be buying now and selling when everyone else is raving about them

Even if Degiro doesnt show the drop your order might still fill, happens all the time with ASX shares.

Spirogyra · 20-10-2018 1:29pm

The worst decision I ever made was to buy BOI shares, would need them to reach E8 to break evens. Was distracted this year when they were that price.

hog_farmer · 20-10-2018 7:45pm

Spirogyra wrote: »

The worst decision I ever made was to buy BOI shares, would need them to reach E8 to break evens. Was distracted this year when they were that price.

most people never make that much more on shares than they would do by having the money in a savings account as its only a small minority of companies that drive gains in the overall market and unfortunatley in ireland we are taxed incredibly heavily for owning ETF,s so it puts more pressure on to pick individual winners .

i had 14 k in CRH at the beginning of the year , within a few month my 14 k was worth nearly 18 k as i bought at 27 and it rose to nearly 32 , i decided to stick another 20 k in off the back of goodbodies article about a " blue sky " price of 40 euro within a few years , the stock is now 30% below its peak at 24 euro and issued a profit warning last week .

bar kerry , most of the largest publically traded stocks on the iseq have performed horribly this past few years.

unless you have enormous capital to begin with , investing in shares is not going to deliver that much for the majority , most of us are simply not smart enough to anticipate market moves , we will either sell winners too early or buy a stock which is dropping too early and then have to wait years for it to get back to where it was .

Shauny2010 · 21-10-2018 11:36am

Thargor wrote: »

Even if Degiro doesnt show the drop your order might still fill, happens all the time with ASX shares.

No it didn't fill, I have buy orders set at €6 and more orders right down to €5.
I doubt we will get anywhere near the 5 year lows of €5.10
The bank is sound, well run and paying a growing dividend
At the current price of €6.20 and an estimated dividend of €0.17 per share gives a yield of 2.72%.
The future dividends predicted to rise to €0.25 then €0.35 in 2019 and 2020 this would increase the yield to nearly 6%.
Tell me any bank account that pays more than 2%?
Tell me of any Treasury bonds and municipal bonds that will pay more?
And remember this bank will not have to pay tax on profits for at least another 15 years.

drunkmonkey · 21-10-2018 1:53pm

What good is a 2 or event 10% dividend when the share price is falling by more. That's crazy talk.
Sometimes you have to admit to yourself you made a bad call, buying all the dips here is madness.
All the big rollers are announcing this week, plenty of room for 2% returns on day trades this week rather than messing around loosing money on this pile of ****e.

littlevillage · 21-10-2018 10:46pm

hog_farmer wrote: »

most people never make that much more on shares than they would do by having the money in a savings account

I agree. My Share portfolio is down about 10% since the start of the year. I think its probabaly true of lots of peoples portfolios, when things get volatile ...the average Joes with no insider knowledge get to carry the bag

i had 14 k in CRH at the beginning of the year , within a few month my 14 k was worth nearly 18 k as i bought at 27 and it rose to nearly 32 , i decided to stick another 20 k in off the back of goodbodies article about a " blue sky " price of 40 euro within a few years , the stock is now 30% below its peak at 24 euro and issued a profit warning last week

I know this is the Bank Of Ireland Shares thread, soo I won't elaborate about CRH too much, but it was Heidelberg Cement issued a profit warning and its Share price fell about 12% the other cement producers and construction companies (CRH included) Share prices fell in line with this. I currently think CRH is at a nice investment price and bought some more myself last Thursday on the dip :-)

But getting back to your situation, you really made a cardinal error investing such a large chunk of change in one companies Shares...and by the sounds of it in two large single buys.

Diversify, diversify, diversify and if you can't diversify, at least buy the one company of your choice in small-ish batches soo as to even out short term price fluctuations

Shauny2010 · 30-10-2018 4:09pm

Looks like we have seen the last of the €6 shares, not that degiro filled any of my orders at that level. The lowest I got was €6.10 and that only partially filled. I'm slowly beginning to dislike Degiro.

scheister · 01-11-2018 9:00am

Shauny2010 wrote: »

Looks like we have seen the last of the €6 shares, not that degiro filled any of my orders at that level. The lowest I got was €6.10 and that only partially filled. I'm slowly beginning to dislike Degiro.

got some shares at €6.30 this morning not as low as i would have liked but brings my break even point down to €7. At the stage once i can get to that point i will be getting out.

Shauny2010 · 04-11-2018 3:58pm

scheister wrote: »

got some shares at €6.30 this morning not as low as i would have liked but brings my break even point down to €7. At the stage once i can get to that point i will be getting out.

Why sell at break even, if it gets back to €7 then put in a stop loss at €6.90, then if it retests the yearly high of €8.20 you can sell at or close to that level.
Worse case then is it looses you 10c per share. Best case you make €1.20/share.
(Btw this is known as gaming the market)

beaner92 · 05-11-2018 1:56am

I would recommend staying out. I see boi hitting 4 by March

beaner92 · 05-11-2018 1:59am

beaner92 wrote: »

I would recommend staying out. I see boi hitting 4 by March

In fact I will see tomorrow if I can get put options with a 6 strike and August 19 expiry. Such an illiquid stock !

daheff · 05-11-2018 4:13pm

beaner92 wrote: »

I would recommend staying out. I see boi hitting 4 by March

on what basis?

edit: don't want me post to sound rude/argumentative or otherwise. I'm genuinely interested in why you think this?

beaner92 · 06-11-2018 5:56pm

daheff wrote: »

on what basis?

edit: don't want me post to sound rude/argumentative or otherwise. I'm genuinely interested in why you think this?

No worries.
volume on the weekly to monthly show there is no one buying significantly.

And insiders are highly prone to dump in the months of dec-feb.

Beyond that, i see personally zero value in BOI stock or any irish banking stock.
With many bank stocks (citi, barc) trending down as well. Makes no sense any traders with size will pump these shares at all.

And I think there is a general "distrust" of bank shares in.

No volatility.

daheff · 07-11-2018 9:53pm

what about the profitability & dividends of BOI (+barc & citi)?

Same div on a much lower sp would give a hell of a return for a shareholder!

beaner92 · 09-11-2018 4:24pm

daheff wrote: »

what about the profitability & dividends of BOI (+barc & citi)?

Same div on a much lower sp would give a hell of a return for a shareholder!

Youre right dividends is really the only thing that makes it attractive. I dont trade stocks only options. but will the dividend make up for the loss in share price?

daheff · 11-11-2018 8:59pm

beaner92 wrote: »

Youre right dividends is really the only thing that makes it attractive. I dont trade stocks only options. but will the dividend make up for the loss in share price?

depends when you get in as to whether theres a loss in share price or not?

All things being equal, if its got a higher dividend return than the market average, share price will rise to bring the return in line with the market. If the return is lower, share price will drop.

If profits are bad, they can't pay a dividend (or only a lower one)...so sp drops. If profits are good and they can increase dividend sp increases. If profits are up and dividends dont increase, then you need to find out why not. What are they doing with the extra cash?

beaner92 · 21-12-2018 5:36pm

beaner92 wrote: »

I would recommend staying out. I see boi hitting 4 by March

Since this post .... down 22 percent.

current price 4.93.

Still bearish...

All financials stock are getting pummelled... will continue ..

Gatoh · 21-12-2018 8:02pm

"handsome low risk return" ..hmm.. Shauny2010 ?

beaner92 · 21-12-2018 9:17pm

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Davy got this one all wrong, that €9.50 price target a few weeks ago was well off. I wonder will the revise it or still think it's good.

Do not for any reason take any advise from a stock broker. 9/10 they are only looking to dump their losing positions on you .

Picture this, I am a boi exec whose stock options vest . I have 100000 shares to sell. I sell them at market to davy stock broketrs. For such an illiquid stock this is heavy selling pressure.

Do you think davy will hold this and take the loss... nope.... jack up targets and fob them off to unsuspecting clients...

littlevillage · 21-12-2018 9:29pm

beaner92 wrote: »

Do not for any reason take any advise from a stock broker. 9/10 they are only looking to dump their losing positions on you .

Picture this, I am a boi exec whose stock options vest . I have 100000 shares to sell. I sell them at market to davy stock broketrs. For such an illiquid stock this is heavy selling pressure.

Do you think davy will hold this and take the loss... nope.... jack up targets and fob them off to unsuspecting clients...

Won't comment on your 'scenario' above :rolleyes: but Bank of Ireland is one of the most liquid shares on the ISEQ. 100000 shares wouldn't cause too much of a ripple.

Today 3,995024 shares changed hands.

Markets all over the world just getting hammered. ISEQ no different. (in fact most ISEQ companies have big exposure to UK, so have the double whammy of Brexit as well) I am actually surprised how well the ISEQ is holding up.

beaner92 · 21-12-2018 9:45pm

littlevillage wrote: »

Won't comment on your 'scenario' above :rolleyes: but Bank of Ireland is one of the most liquid shares on the ISEQ. 100000 shares wouldn't cause too much of a ripple.

Today 3,995024 shares changed hands.

Markets all over the world just getting hammered. ISEQ no different. (in fact most ISEQ companies have big exposure to UK, so have the double whammy of Brexit as well) I am actually surprised how well the ISEQ is holding up.

i dont trade on the ISEQ which is why i used the word illiquid for me 4m is not that much. Anyway 100000 was just an example , I see this "scenario" happen on a daily basis.

I dont think the iseq is "holding up" we havent seen the worst yet. Plus you dont have the same type of trading on larger markets at the iseq.

coolshannagh28 · 21-12-2018 9:47pm

littlevillage wrote: »

Won't comment on your 'scenario' above :rolleyes: but Bank of Ireland is one of the most liquid shares on the ISEQ. 100000 shares wouldn't cause too much of a ripple.

Today 3,995024 shares changed hands.

Markets all over the world just getting hammered. ISEQ no different. (in fact most ISEQ companies have big exposure to UK, so have the double whammy of Brexit as well) I am actually surprised how well the ISEQ is holding up.

QE chickens coming home to roost! what did Sonny boy Williamson say ?

Islander13 · 22-12-2018 11:13am

beaner92 wrote: »

Do not for any reason take any advise from a stock broker. 9/10 they are only looking to dump their losing positions on you .

Picture this, I am a boi exec whose stock options vest . I have 100000 shares to sell. I sell them at market to davy stock broketrs. For such an illiquid stock this is heavy selling pressure.

Do you think davy will hold this and take the loss... nope.... jack up targets and fob them off to unsuspecting clients...

You do realise BOI exec have no stock options right?

Spirogyra · 22-12-2018 1:34pm

I've lost about 40% of what I spent on them about 5 years ago. Thinking now of just getting out and cutting my losses. I don't like the uncertainty of shares. I can sustain the loss,it won't change my life any time soon. But unless there is sudden good news on Brexit,it could be a long time before I come close to even getting most of my money back. Seriously tempted to take a loss and run. No more shares,ever.

beaner92 · 22-12-2018 5:02pm

Islander13 wrote: »

You do realise BOI exec have no stock options right?

Its an EXAMPLE. It could be anyone, with a large position to offload.

Facebook exec, google, apple, red hat, whatever. but this type of client dumping happens everyday is my point. All im saying is dont take trading advice from a broker

littlevillage · 22-12-2018 5:39pm

beaner92 wrote: »

dont take trading advice from a broker

Well.... If the broker is not connected to the company being reviewed....then there might be some objectivity in the advice ... but the example of Davy and Bank of Ireland is a situation where you completely ignore the brokers advice. Davy used to be owned by BOI (maybe still are) and they certainly work for BOI as Brokers/Market makers etc. so their advice is not objective in any way.

Jim2007 · 22-12-2018 7:28pm

littlevillage wrote: »

Well.... If the broker is not connected to the company being reviewed....then there might be some objectivity in the advice ... but the example of Davy and Bank of Ireland is a situation where you completely ignore the brokers advice. Davy used to be owned by BOI (maybe still are) and they certainly work for BOI as Brokers/Market makers etc. so their advice is not objective in any way.

To but it simply this is a load of nonsense, that is of course unless you can produce actual documented evidence to support your assertions. This is not investing it's just dumb speculation.

Mad_maxx · 23-12-2018 12:00pm

Spirogyra wrote: »

I've lost about 40% of what I spent on them about 5 years ago. Thinking now of just getting out and cutting my losses. I don't like the uncertainty of shares. I can sustain the loss,it won't change my life any time soon. But unless there is sudden good news on Brexit,it could be a long time before I come close to even getting most of my money back. Seriously tempted to take a loss and run. No more shares,ever.

I wouldn't sell unless you need the money, the reality is that stocks have no mind of their own, irrespective of brexit, European financial stocks have been in a bear market now for several years, it's often said that stocks were too high but the American Market is too often used to describe the performance of all markets, Europe last saw an all time high on the stoxx 600 in May of 2015, it then fell about 30% until bottoming the day after the brexit vote but as it has never regained that may 2015 high, its technically in a bear market this past three years almost.

Bank of Ireland is well capitalised, if European markets recover, it will recover too so dumping it and replacing it with something else is likely to be difficult in determining which companies will recover what you lost, were I to do this, I would spread your boi sale across smurfit kappa, crh and glanbia, all three companies are cheap right now and have less baggage than a bank but be warned, if the global bear market lasts another year or two, everything will go down.

Most people make modest amounts of money on stocks as if you are a buy and hold investor, you will witness your position take 40% drops every few years, alternative is to trade but who has the time fjr that?

Stock market is boring if you are going about it the safe and sensible way but over twenty years, you should double in return what bonds or savings earn you, no ten baggers for the vast majority of people though.

littlevillage · 23-12-2018 1:50pm

Jim2007 wrote: »

To but it simply this is a load of nonsense, that is of course unless you can produce actual documented evidence to support your assertions. This is not investing it's just dumb speculation.

What now ???

Dinarius · 18-01-2019 9:50am

Annoyed with myself about this one. Had my eye on it and been distracted. Up another 4% this morning. Would take years to earn that on deposit at current rates!

Had been way oversold, but any chance of a buying-opp pullback?

Views?

Thanks.

D.

q85dw7osi4lebg · 18-01-2019 9:55am

Dinarius wrote: »

Annoyed with myself about this one. Had my eye on it and been distracted. Up another 4% this morning. Would take years to earn that on deposit at current rates!

Had been way oversold, but any chance of a buying-opp pullback?

Views?

Thanks.

D.

I see it been back in the 4.00s in no time personally. Brexit hasn't been remotely sorted. Mega UK exposure on the books still afaik.

Dinarius · 18-01-2019 12:30pm

I’m hoping there’s a lot of short covering going on and that there may be a pull-back.

I will buy on weakness.

D.

drunkmonkey · 18-01-2019 1:03pm

Ahh here there's plenty of way safer stocks which could give you that return before end of February if the cards fall your way.

Probably just Davy doing some pumping wait for the dump.

Jim2007 · 20-01-2019 12:57am

Dinarius wrote: »

Had been way oversold, but any chance of a buying-opp pullback?

Why is it over sold and why would you even want to own this bank considering there are better banks out there?

Bank of Ireland shares

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