With ESB having plans to charge for using street chargers, is it worth buying EV?

Andy From Sligo · 18-01-2019 10:07pm #1

been toying with getting a Renault Zoe EV but now it just seems a bit less attractive with having to rent the batteries, and still having to pay vehicle tax (although €120 per annul is still attractive) but now I have just read that ESB are going to start charging in 2019 for using street chargers.

with ESB having plans to charge for using street chargers is it still worth buying EV?

footnote: - i dont know how much they are planning to charge to use them ... i am not even sure if they know yet

grudgehugger · 18-01-2019 10:33pm

Depends on your situation.

For me, I only bought my EV (L40) as I knew almost all of my charging would be at home.

I reckon I'm saving close to 2 grand a year with the cheap tax and difference in cost between electricity and diesel (mostly the fuel savings)

Granted I had to pay up for the new car... but I do really like it and the cost savings make it a good deal.

So for me, "charging for charging" is a positive - when I do need a public charger it's less likely someone will be abusing the system and treating the charger as a parking space.

Andy From Sligo · 18-01-2019 11:07pm

grudgehugger wrote: »

Depends on your situation.

For me, I only bought my EV (L40) as I knew almost all of my charging would be at home.

I reckon I'm saving close to 2 grand a year with the cheap tax and difference in cost between electricity and diesel (mostly the fuel savings)

Granted I had to pay up for the new car... but I do really like it and the cost savings make it a good deal.

So for me, "charging for charging" is a positive - when I do need a public charger it's less likely someone will be abusing the system and treating the charger as a parking space.

thanks for that - you saying about most your charging is done at home, you know the granny cable that plugs into a 13a plug socket does it really take something like 3kw ? - so is that like you have to charge all night at 3kw per hour ? - thats quite hefty and if you left a 3kw fan heater on all night you would really bump up the electricity bill .. mind you i suppose it evens out if you save on buying petrol/diesel

Evd-Burner · 18-01-2019 11:10pm

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

thanks for that - you saying about most your charging is done at home, you know the granny cable that plugs into a 13a plug socket does it really take something like 3kw ? - so is that like you have to charge all night at 3kw per hour ? - thats quite hefty and if you left a 3kw fan heater on all night you would really bump up the electricity bill .. mind you i suppose it evens out if you save on buying petrol/diesel

you could get a day night meter and it's half the price to charge at night.

Andy From Sligo · 18-01-2019 11:14pm

Evd-Burner wrote: »

you could get a day night meter and it's half the price to charge at night.

True , bit of an extra standing charge for a night meter but I suppose it still a good idea

nailer54321 · 18-01-2019 11:25pm

I read sometime aho the ESB will be puting a standing charge on the card you use for charging, so you will have an annually fee regardless if you use it or not. Looks like to me hat you will not see any real savings until year fove or six taken in to account of how expensive the EV is compared yo a petrol version. Might br wrong but thibg the customer is getting sxrewed with this change to electric.j

BigAl81 · 18-01-2019 11:33pm

By way of comparison what used to cost me 70 euro of petrol, now costs 5 euro in electricity

Andy From Sligo · 18-01-2019 11:40pm

BigAl81 wrote: »

By way of comparison what used to cost me 70 euro of petrol, now costs 5 euro in electricity

thats good - i'm liking that

JPA · 18-01-2019 11:49pm

Andy, just start a thread 'My electric car questions' and put them all in there.

BigAl81 · 18-01-2019 11:50pm

Andy From Sligo wrote:

thats good - i'm liking that

Should I also mention the tax is 120 a year, tolls are half price, and there is very little maintenance as there is no engine, clutch, gears box, timing belt, DPF etc etc.

If you can find a car that suits your range, charge at home and you'll never need the public network at all!

NIMAN · 18-01-2019 11:58pm

I see the public chargers as an added bonus.

I have the EV now for maybe a year and used public chargers maybe less than 10 times.

ted1 · 19-01-2019 12:04am

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

True , bit of an extra standing charge for a night meter but I suppose it still a good idea

It’s 80 euro to fill car with petroleum that gets you about 800km

You’ll go alot further in ran ev
You also won’t hate to top up th oil , replace a clutch , change a timing belt, worry about DPF, DMF, coil packs, cracked exhausts, brake pads

Cockadoodledoo · 19-01-2019 12:10am

€5 to fully charge? How many km would that take you?

Andy From Sligo · 19-01-2019 12:14am

ted1 wrote: »

It’s 80 euro to fill car with petroleum that gets you about 800km

You’ll go alot further in ran ev
You also won’t hate to top up th oil , replace a clutch , change a timing belt, worry about DPF, DMF, coil packs, cracked exhausts, brake pads

our current Clio seems to be drinking oil and has white gunk in the oil filler cap - its getting on its 2003 , NCT next month. had to get set spark plugs for it the other month which werent that cheap and not sure about TB . so i know what you mean less bits (maintenance bits) to go wrong than a petrol car. Thats what I would look forward to as well.

Having a bit of job convincing my wife though she still thinks she could go out and it run out of juice or turn up at street chargers and them all in use and the Zoe Battery Rental is putting her off

Cockadoodledoo · 19-01-2019 12:16am

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

our current Clio seems to be drinking oil and has white gunk in the oil filler cap - its getting on its 2003 , NCT next month. had to get set spark plugs for it the other month which werent that cheap and not sure about TB . so i know what you mean less bits (maintenance bits) to go wrong than a petrol car. Thats what I would look forward to as well.

Having a bit of job convincing my wife though she still thinks she could go out and it run out of juice or turn up at street chargers and them all in use and the Zoe Battery Rental is putting her off

That would be my concern too lol

Andy From Sligo · 19-01-2019 12:27am

Then I say's ESB are thinking of charging to use the on-street chargers and that put her off again then.

I can see why they would want to I suppose they want to expand the infrastructure and they cannot do that if not charging i suppose. And they want to dissuade people using them willy nilly as well and abusing the system. But I wouldnt like to see them charge too much that it puts off people getting an EV or start off cheap and then keep increasing the price to use them.

If they are not already, I'd like to see the street chargers actively using solar power and wind power - but i suppose even then someone has to pay for all that hardware at the end of the day

Mike9832 · 19-01-2019 12:36am

ted1 wrote: »

It’s 80 euro to fill car with petroleum that gets you about 800km

You’ll go alot further in ran ev
You also won’t hate to top up th oil , replace a clutch , change a timing belt, worry about DPF, DMF, coil packs, cracked exhausts, brake pads

Can you buy a used EV for 1k too?

Brake pads?

Do EVs use something else

All those are covered under warranty, why bring them up anyway ? You have to compare new vs new

If we go down that route

How much is a replacement 64kWh battery, motor, inverter etc in a Hyundai Kona for example?

NIMAN · 19-01-2019 12:47am

IF you need to rely on the public charging network, I'd say an EV isnt for you.

ED E · 19-01-2019 12:49am

Mike9832 wrote: »

Brake pads?

Do EVs use something else

They use theirs far less due to regenerative braking with the motors themselves.

Mike9832 · 19-01-2019 12:56am

ED E wrote: »

They use theirs far less due to regenerative braking with the motors themselves.

We all know that

Still have to change them

Ted was suggesting something different

DM1983 · 19-01-2019 1:08am

It's pretty simple guys. The cost of fuel is the big saving with EVs. The cost per km of electricity is approximately 20% of that for a modern diesel. You have to compare like with like. If you were about to buy a 5 year old petrol or diesel, buy a 5 year old ev and you'll save money in a nicer car. If you were about to buy a new petrol or diesel, buy a new ev and you'll save money in a nicer car. The latter is a possibility for all. The former is a possibility for those that 5 year old electric range suits their usage pattern.

Think of the additional tax and servicing savings as a bonus. They are an insignificant component unless your mileage is less than 10k km per year.

unkel · 19-01-2019 2:05am

Cockadoodledoo wrote: »

€5 to fully charge? How many km would that take you?

€2.50 to charge my car from empty to full. That gives me on average 220km

So a bit more than 1 cent per km. A similar size diesel would cost me about 8-9 cent per km. If you do 20k km per year, the fuel saving alone is €1500 per year

Mike9832 · 19-01-2019 2:11am

unkel wrote: »

€2.50 to charge my car from empty to full. That gives me on average 220km

So a bit more than 1 cent per km. A similar size diesel would cost me about 8-9 cent per km. If you do 20k km per year, the fuel saving alone is €1500 per year

Thats the only saving?

New vs new

NIMAN · 19-01-2019 3:05am

Mike9832 wrote: »

Thats the only saving?

New vs new

Well you'll save a small amount on road tax.

Plus less maintenance costs, servicing costs.
There isn't as many things that need annual servicing like oil changes, filter changes and when the miles build up potential DPF issues, flywheels etc etc.

ted1 · 19-01-2019 8:13am

Mike9832 wrote: »

Can you buy a used EV for 1k too?

Brake pads?

Do EVs use something else

All those are covered under warranty, why bring them up anyway ? You have to compare new vs new

If we go down that route

How much is a replacement 64kWh battery, motor, inverter etc in a Hyundai Kona for example?

No they are not all covered under warranty

Mike9832 · 19-01-2019 10:03am

ted1 wrote: »

No they are not all covered under warranty

The big ones are

Mike9832 · 19-01-2019 10:07am

NIMAN wrote: »

Well you'll save a small amount on road tax.

Plus less maintenance costs, servicing costs.
There isn't as many things that need annual servicing like oil changes, filter changes and when the miles build up potential DPF issues, flywheels etc etc.

Tax I'll give you

Service no

Still have to service EVs, Ioniq has a ridiculous 15k km service schedule

Talking new cars not old bangers, flywheel etc are warranty covered

Andy From Sligo · 19-01-2019 4:22pm

NIMAN wrote: »

Well you'll save a small amount on road tax.

Plus less maintenance costs, servicing costs.
There isn't as many things that need annual servicing like oil changes, filter changes and when the miles build up potential DPF issues, flywheels etc etc.

does DPF stand for Diesel Filter?

unkel · 19-01-2019 5:42pm

Mike9832 wrote: »

Service no

Still have to service EVs

Not really. My Ioniq had an inspection done after 1 year. Cost €0.00

Nearly 2 years old now. I don't expect to pay much if anything for this years service either. 5 years bumper to bumper warranty, everything covered pretty much except tyres. Battery has an 8 year warranty. Almost all new EVs now come with an 8 year battery warranty.

Silent Running · 19-01-2019 5:54pm

Charging fees are already a thing in the UK. Charges are anything from free for domestic customers to 35p per kW on the motorway chargers. Some companies charge a connection fee and then per unit, but they're seen as a rip off.

The ESB could go with a model where they wholesale to electricity retailers like Energia and they would bundle car charging with home electricity supply.

I think that competition in the market will keep the ecars charges at a reasonable level. They'll be competing with Ionity soon, and easygo are rolling out destination chargers too. I can see the charging business opening out once charges are the norm, just like the UK market.

Mike9832 · 19-01-2019 6:11pm

unkel wrote: »

Not really. My Ioniq had an inspection done after 1 year. Cost €0.00

Nearly 2 years old now. I don't expect to pay much if anything for this years service either. 5 years bumper to bumper warranty, everything covered pretty much except tyres. Battery has an 8 year warranty. Almost all new EVs now come with an 8 year battery warranty.

All most all ICE come with free servicing too and 5 year warranties

EVs require servicing, even if it's just for warranty purposes, hate when people say they don't need servicing

With ESB having plans to charge for using street chargers, is it worth buying EV?

Comments