Thinking of Dairying

mf240 · 25-07-2018 10:46am

whelan2 wrote: »

How's your heavy land fairing out this year?

Still green but not growing. Going to have to start feeding silage this week. On 10kgs of a soya Hull dairy nut mix the last few weeks. I found 2012 an awful lot worse.

yewtree · 25-07-2018 10:53am

Panch18 wrote: »

Is it negativity or is it the actual reality?

some fellas are living in dream land - a good dose of reality is needed a lot of the time in farming

From my experience there is endless amounts of negative people willing to tell you all the things that are wrong. The trick is to surround yourself with positive people who lift you up.
You seem to suggest that unless we are unhappy about working in farming we are detached from reality. Which I think is nonsense

We as farmers that need to get over ourselves we are not the only occupation that work long hours and have lots of pressure.

whelan2 · 25-07-2018 10:53am

mf240 wrote: »

Still green but not growing. Going to have to start feeding silage this week. On 10kgs of a soya Hull dairy nut mix the last few weeks. I found 2012 an awful lot worse.

Apparently I'm the only one in the parish not feeding/supplementing the cows. Grass is growing here. Slowly. Definitely getting a response to fertiliser. Just finished spreading cut sward where we cut silage yesterday and the dew was there until about 10 am. Worst fertiliser we ever got. Solid in the bags

Bass Reeves · 25-07-2018 10:57am

Not every lad capable of dairying is capable of graduating to a potential 50K/year job even within 5 years of graduating. Most of those entering state jobs as graduates will be 10-15 years in those jobs before they hit that income limit even with overtime.

For all the talk that graduates enter the economy at 50K it is only a small percentage. Most in the building industry enter it as graduates start at 30ishK, max out at 50-60K unless they become self employed and start there own business. That is different to being a mini subcontractor. Those that are on the 50-60K wage are travelling often either away over night or travelling 2 hours to and from work 12-13 hour days away from home. Maybe away 6 hours on a Saturday.

I am one of those handy 50K+ workers, I am on call this week back into work on Friday evening for 2 hours, 5-6 hours on Saturday 5pm-11pm, Again Sunday 3.30-11pm did not get to see the Kerry match, Monday 7.30 am-6.30pm, yesterday, left home at 6am as loading cattle, into work at 8am until home at 6, left to go back in at 7.30pm and got home again at 3am. You get nothing for nothing in this life.

Yes there are jobs in Dublin earning big money most are leaving for work at before 7am and some an hour earlier and not back home until after 6pm maybe after 7pm. Talking to an Air Con engineer a few weeks ago at present leaves home most morning at 5.30 am and is not home until near 7pm. He is doing a job far side of Cork City from him and lives 60 miles from it. Like myself he is on call.

Yes there is handy jobs with multi-nationals you may start at 30-40K maybe even 50K. It great until you have a family you travel the world. You are in Dublin this week, China next week and off to the States or the Philipines the week after. Home late Friday evening or early Saturday morning. Ya you have the F@@king weekend off. Know one lad that leaves home every Monday at 6am and is home Thursday night at the earliest. Another lads spends 3-4 weeks in California 2-3 times a year staying in a hotel. Wife and kids were out to him 2-3 times over the last 5 years but no longer interested in going there. That si not his only travelling for the year.

It is not just the self employed taxes that are squandered so are a lot of other peoples. It is not just on water charges debacle. Subsidising things low interest loads to selected groups. Directing envoirment money to lads that are intensive farmers rather than those that are actually supposed to get it.

Most farmers make a choice. Over the years I have always said that any lad that is at drystock fulltime is deluded. In General it is possible to run a 100+ acre drystock farm in 20 hours a week especially if you live on it. But most want to spend the week ar5ing around a mart trying to pick up a few cheap cattle. The margin is no longer in it for that. In general most livestock farmer will pay too much for calves.

Dairy farmers in general will not make life style choices. Most will take on work themselves to save 5-10 euro/hour. They will buy machinery rather than put money in a pension fund or pay tax on it. They will drive around in big fuel guzzelers spending 70-80 euro/week on fuel. If you want a lifestyle you have to pay for it one way or another.

vincenzolorenzo · 25-07-2018 11:33am

That is a fantastic post

kowtow · 25-07-2018 12:02pm

Panch18 wrote: »

I suppose the question is Kowtow - were you being rewarded financially for having the laptop on your knee at weekends? (if there is a Swiss finance link then I'm going to hazard a safe guess and say yes!!)

And do you think you are being similarly rewarded now for working at weekends farming?

Yes and Yes, but in totally different ways. Although to be honest it would have been there whether I was or not.

Apart from anything else attitudes to children change, neither the OH or I were ever particularly keen on hands-on childcare, we ended up raising two infuriatingly independent free-range children... but one way or another children grow up, in spite of their parents and not because of them.

Spending more time working is a choice, if we are honest, much of the time - as is spending more time with the kids. It is a better choice if it is not made out of social expectation, or financial necessity, or guilt - and if time spent really is valued. Children don't much care whether the time they are on their father's knee in front of a bank of trading screens, or in a tractor seat, or taking them to school - once they know that he is enjoying having them there... I'd have thought farming was a pretty good way to raise children on balance and one of the few careers where time spent with children is not economically wasted... if that time has to be concentrated more in the years after they are big enough to block a gap then what odds?

Others will think differently and that's as it should be.

20silkcut · 25-07-2018 12:08pm

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Not every lad capable of dairying is capable of graduating to a potential 50K/year job even within 5 years of graduating. Most of those entering state jobs as graduates will be 10-15 years in those jobs before they hit that income limit even with overtime.

For all the talk that graduates enter the economy at 50K it is only a small percentage. Most in the building industry enter it as graduates start at 30ishK, max out at 50-60K unless they become self employed and start there own business. That is different to being a mini subcontractor. Those that are on the 50-60K wage are travelling often either away over night or travelling 2 hours to and from work 12-13 hour days away from home. Maybe away 6 hours on a Saturday.

I am one of those handy 50K+ workers, I am on call this week back into work on Friday evening for 2 hours, 5-6 hours on Saturday 5pm-11pm, Again Sunday 3.30-11pm did not get to see the Kerry match, Monday 7.30 am-6.30pm, yesterday, left home at 6am as loading cattle, into work at 8am until home at 6, left to go back in at 7.30pm and got home again at 3am. You get nothing for nothing in this life.

Yes there are jobs in Dublin earning big money most are leaving for work at before 7am and some an hour earlier and not back home until after 6pm maybe after 7pm. Talking to an Air Con engineer a few weeks ago at present leaves home most morning at 5.30 am and is not home until near 7pm. He is doing a job far side of Cork City from him and lives 60 miles from it. Like myself he is on call.

Yes there is handy jobs with multi-nationals you may start at 30-40K maybe even 50K. It great until you have a family you travel the world. You are in Dublin this week, China next week and off to the States or the Philipines the week after. Home late Friday evening or early Saturday morning. Ya you have the F@@king weekend off. Know one lad that leaves home every Monday at 6am and is home Thursday night at the earliest. Another lads spends 3-4 weeks in California 2-3 times a year staying in a hotel. Wife and kids were out to him 2-3 times over the last 5 years but no longer interested in going there. That si not his only travelling for the year.

It is not just the self employed taxes that are squandered so are a lot of other peoples. It is not just on water charges debacle. Subsidising things low interest loads to selected groups. Directing envoirment money to lads that are intensive farmers rather than those that are actually supposed to get it.

Most farmers make a choice. Over the years I have always said that any lad that is at drystock fulltime is deluded. In General it is possible to run a 100+ acre drystock farm in 20 hours a week especially if you live on it. But most want to spend the week ar5ing around a mart trying to pick up a few cheap cattle. The margin is no longer in it for that. In general most livestock farmer will pay too much for calves.

Dairy farmers in general will not make life style choices. Most will take on work themselves to save 5-10 euro/hour. They will buy machinery rather than put money in a pension fund or pay tax on it. They will drive around in big fuel guzzelers spending 70-80 euro/week on fuel. If you want a lifestyle you have to pay for it one way or another.

Great post your hours are hectic are you a workaholic??

I agree anyone on 50K a year after tax will really earn it. Bar maybe someone fiddling the system or maybe the higher echelons of the public service.

I would argue that it would be an easier life to make 50k into the hand out of dairy farming than it would in a private sector job. Whoever is giving you that 50K is going to get their pound of flesh and your ass belongs to them.

If you can let live with the **** and the muck and being tied down to milk tad and don’t overstock then dairy farming wins hands down. Especially if your a more introverted person and don’t like working in a team or serving a master.

Although you will always be serving a master.
Just in dairying he might not be in your face all day.

Bass Reeves · 25-07-2018 7:23pm

20silkcut wrote: »

Great post your hours are hectic are you a workaholic??

I agree anyone on 50K a year after tax will really earn it. Bar maybe someone fiddling the system or maybe the higher echelons of the public service.

I would argue that it would be an easier life to make 50k into the hand out of dairy farming than it would in a private sector job. Whoever is giving you that 50K is going to get their pound of flesh and your ass belongs to them.

If you can let live with the **** and the muck and being tied down to milk tad and don’t overstock then dairy farming wins hands down. Especially if your a more introverted person and don’t like working in a team or serving a master.

Although you will always be serving a master.
Just in dairying he might not be in your face all day.

No but busier than usual at the moment. Some lads on holidays the show must go on. I earn a good living. The week I am on call often I try to line up out of hour jobs. This week is hectic the, jobs this Monday and Tuesday were supposed to be done last week contractor cancelled at the last moment. The night job was scheduled for a few week.

But when it happen I get on with it and look at the positive side.........the pay check in a few week time:D. Having said that there are too many good pay checks at present. When you earn more than 50K you have to work to earn it one way or another they get there pound of flesh.

The problem with dairying is some lads are not capable of running the operation they have. When you are running a larger operation everything must be just right. It is way easier to run something at 80% effeciency than 90%. But tring to get 100% out of man, land and beast is a tough ask. you need to be on your toes all the time. A lad milking 8K+ litres of milk/cow in an 70-100 cow operation may not have the skills to run multiple operations with 150 cows/ unit and vica versa.

But for a lad that has limited academic skill but a good worker is it better to be driving a milk or lorry or supplying it???

mf240 · 25-07-2018 9:30pm

whelan2 wrote: »

Apparently I'm the only one in the parish not feeding/supplementing the cows. Grass is growing here. Slowly. Definitely getting a response to fertiliser. Just finished spreading cut sward where we cut silage yesterday and the dew was there until about 10 am. Worst fertiliser we ever got. Solid in the bags

Id say your very much in the minority nationwide. Ya may post a pic of a green cow dung. This so long since I seen one I can't picture it.

farawaygrass · 25-07-2018 9:53pm

whelan2 wrote: »

Apparently I'm the only one in the parish not feeding/supplementing the cows. Grass is growing here. Slowly. Definitely getting a response to fertiliser. Just finished spreading cut sward where we cut silage yesterday and the dew was there until about 10 am. Worst fertiliser we ever got. Solid in the bags

If it’s big bags, when you start lifting it on the loader, give it 2 or 3 bangs off the ground, should sort out that problem

whelan2 · 25-07-2018 9:56pm

farawaygrass wrote: »

If it’s big bags, when you start lifting it on the loader, give it 2 or 3 bangs off the ground, should sort out that problem

Would it be that there wasn't as big a run on fertiliser this year and they were in merchant's yard a long time. Never had that trouble with big bags before.

Mooooo · 25-07-2018 10:11pm

Be careful when opening, use a long handled blade as fert can come out in one block and catch you if stuck together. I tend to left the bags a foot or so and drop on to the pallet again to help break them.

davidk1394 · 07-08-2018 7:48am

Sorry with the late reply. Busy with the Galway races :P yeah meeting went well. Decided to hold off 2 years in setting up the partnership. Still getting out of sheep and parents are going to do calf to beef for a year or 2. Got grass seed in including Italian rye grass so should be baling it in 7 weeks and sell it.
I am thinking of heading to Saudi for 2 years. A friend is doing it and loves it. Good way to put money together for myself.

Reggie. · 07-08-2018 8:42am

davidk1394 wrote: »

Sorry with the late reply. Busy with the Galway races :P yeah meeting went well. Decided to hold off 2 years in setting up the partnership. Still getting out of sheep and parents are going to do calf to beef for a year or 2. Got grass seed in including Italian rye grass so should be baling it in 7 weeks and sell it.
I am thinking of heading to Saudi for 2 years. A friend is doing it and loves it. Good way to put money together for myself.

Going to give up the contracting?

kk.man · 07-08-2018 9:27am

Mooooo wrote: »

Be careful when opening, use a long handled blade as fert can come out in one block and catch you if stuck together. I tend to left the bags a foot or so and drop on to the pallet again to help break them.

Did you see last week's journal? An absolute disgrace the pic showing guy cutting the bag! A national newspaper promoting health and safety on farms !

I am not a holy Joe when it comes to safety but you don't let a picture like that out.

Water John · 07-08-2018 10:49am

In 2 years, Brexit will be settled, one way or another. Might be a less volatile time to start. Any chance the parents might start rearing heifer calves esp the second year?

Buford T. Justice XIX · 07-08-2018 11:41am

Water John wrote: »

In 2 years, Brexit will be settled, one way or another. Might be a less volatile time to start. Any chance the parents might start rearing heifer calves esp the second year?

I was thinking along the same lines. Next year would be a great opportunity to start milking.

Buy weanlings and in calf heifers/cows this winter to the level you have fodder for.

It will be a while again before they are better value than this winter.

Timmaay · 07-08-2018 12:47pm

+1 buford, I was talking to a neighbour who is starting milking in the spring, he has his heifers already but said he might snap up even more now that they are looking cheap, he nearly had me convinced by the end of the conversation to drive on and snap up another 20 myself ha.

cjpm · 07-08-2018 3:40pm

Timmaay wrote: »

+1 buford, I was talking to a neighbour who is starting milking in the spring, he has his heifers already but said he might snap up even more now that they are looking cheap, he nearly had me convinced by the end of the conversation to drive on and snap up another 20 myself ha.

You'll have to start going back to the monthly meetings Timmay, it's your only chance of beating your addiction....

"My name is Tim and I first started milking cows when I was 16......."

blue5000 · 07-08-2018 5:48pm

cjpm wrote: »

You'll have to start going back to the monthly meetings Timmay, it's your only chance of beating your addiction....

"My name is Tim and I first started milking cows when I was 16......."

Tim was lucky, he escaped to 16:pac:

Timmaay · 07-08-2018 6:34pm

blue5000 wrote: »

Tim was lucky, he escaped to 16:pac:

I was gonna say, I remember being dumped into the parlour for 4or 5days while my folks were on holidays when I was 13 ha (the frs milkers the previous holiday was less than useless ha). I am looking at everything with rose tinted glasses at the min, only in the pit 5 or 6 milkings a week, I could be utterly cursing another 20 heifers next March in snow etc ha.

Snowfire · 07-08-2018 6:37pm

blue5000 wrote: »

Tim was lucky, he escaped to 16:pac:

Was just thinking the same myself, I was bringing in the cows and small jobs aged 7 and milking on my own at 12

longgonesilver · 08-08-2018 12:57am

And in some jobs you can retire after 40 years service but in farming you could double that.

davidk1394 · 08-08-2018 7:09am

Reggie. wrote: »

Going to give up the contracting?

Probably will if I head out there. I enjoy it but meet repayments and getting paid this year won’t be easy. Everyone is under financial pressure. I was talking with the parents and we discussed selling off all the sheep and lambs and buy cattle during the winter. Should pick them up right but then we were thinking is their any out there with grass for sheep ?
Maybe in a years time I might buy dairy heifer calves and ask the parents to rear them.

Reggie. · 08-08-2018 7:35am

davidk1394 wrote: »

Probably will if I head out there. I enjoy it but meet repayments and getting paid this year won’t be easy. Everyone is under financial pressure. I was talking with the parents and we discussed selling off all the sheep and lambs and buy cattle during the winter. Should pick them up right but then we were thinking is their any out there with grass for sheep ?
Maybe in a years time I might buy dairy heifer calves and ask the parents to rear them.

Yeah the repayments are the thing alright. Bit heart stopping once you do the sums and your coming up short when a payment is coming up. Somehow it just works out here

davidk1394 · 08-08-2018 7:38am

Reggie. wrote: »

Yeah the repayments are the thing alright. Bit heart stopping once you do the sums and your coming up short when a payment is coming up. Somehow it just works out here

It’s crazy if you think about it. By the time you have a machine paid for it nearly has to be replaced again.

Reggie. · 08-08-2018 8:28am

davidk1394 wrote: »

It’s crazy if you think about it. By the time you have a machine paid for it nearly has to be replaced again.

Not being smart but thats why only lads with a true love for the machines will stick at it.

carrollsno1 · 08-08-2018 11:11am

Reggie. wrote: »

Yeah the repayments are the thing alright. Bit heart stopping once you do the sums and your coming up short when a payment is coming up. Somehow it just works out here

A lad told me out here that you dont know how to work until you start losing money.

davidk1394 · 08-08-2018 12:01pm

Reggie. wrote: »

Not being smart but thats why only lads with a true love for the machines will stick at it.

Exactly I think I’ll just do my own work and a few handy local jobs during the summer

davidk1394 · 30-11-2018 8:05pm

Hello everyone. I saw a few dairy threads and decided I’d update on the year so far. The dry summer put a spanner in the works and the plan has changed a bit. Sold some sheep but the demand and price was poor. So we have decided to lamb down 400 in the spring and sell them at foot if we can. Also I decided to stay in Ireland. I don’t regret the decision and to be honest I’m happy out here.
I got a job offer on the dairy farms in Saudi but I sat down with my parents to discuss the options. I decided to stay here and get into cows.I had a man out talking about the layout of the yard and the farm to get a few ideas.
Rough figures going on milk prices, drawings and inputs. 100 cows will need to be milked on the farm. Getting quotes off different companies on cubicles, water tanks, slats, parlor, meal bin,fencing, concrete. It will cost €200-220k to convert the farmyard, sheds and fields from drystock to cows. That includes a grant on a parlor. I’ll go through figures in more detail next week.
But at the moment my main focus at the moment is to source good quality stock. I am undecided on whether to buy calves, heifers or lease cows. There’s pro’s and cons with both. What’s people’s thoughts ?

Mooooo · 30-11-2018 8:27pm

What are current facilities, how long till a parlour will be in place? Once the parlour is in I'd be of the opinion of get milk going out the gate so buying cow's would be my preference in that regard.

wrangler · 30-11-2018 9:19pm

davidk1394 wrote: »

Hello everyone. I saw a few dairy threads and decided I’d update on the year so far. The dry summer put a spanner in the works and the plan has changed a bit. Sold some sheep but the demand and price was poor. So we have decided to lamb down 400 in the spring and sell them at foot if we can. Also I decided to stay in Ireland. I don’t regret the decision and to be honest I’m happy out here.
I got a job offer on the dairy farms in Saudi but I sat down with my parents to discuss the options. I decided to stay here and get into cows.I had a man out talking about the layout of the yard and the farm to get a few ideas.
Rough figures going on milk prices, drawings and inputs. 100 cows will need to be milked on the farm. Getting quotes off different companies on cubicles, water tanks, slats, parlor, meal bin,fencing, concrete. It will cost €200-220k to convert the farmyard, sheds and fields from drystock to cows. That includes a grant on a parlor. I’ll go through figures in more detail next week.
But at the moment my main focus at the moment is to source good quality stock. I am undecided on whether to buy calves, heifers or lease cows. There’s pro’s and cons with both. What’s people’s thoughts ?

A friend has got similar figures for his development too and to expect a time frame of starting milking 2021, planning is notoriously slow and he's using a well known advisory crowd so they're probably very experienced.
He's early fifties and has told his son he'll only work for ten more years, he hopes to travel

GrasstoMilk · 30-11-2018 10:03pm

Mooooo wrote: »

What are current facilities, how long till a parlour will be in place? Once the parlour is in I'd be of the opinion of get milk going out the gate so buying cow's would be my preference in that regard.

I would agree. Get your parlour and paddocks/roadways right and the rest will come. Work with what you have till you cant any longer We only got cubicles in here this year, everything was kept on slats or straw until this year. It did the job . We converted existing sheds to cubicles this year and built a new tank..easily half the cost of going complete new build

yewtree · 30-11-2018 10:11pm

davidk1394 wrote: »

Hello everyone. I saw a few dairy threads and decided I’d update on the year so far. The dry summer put a spanner in the works and the plan has changed a bit. Sold some sheep but the demand and price was poor. So we have decided to lamb down 400 in the spring and sell them at foot if we can. Also I decided to stay in Ireland. I don’t regret the decision and to be honest I’m happy out here.
I got a job offer on the dairy farms in Saudi but I sat down with my parents to discuss the options. I decided to stay here and get into cows.I had a man out talking about the layout of the yard and the farm to get a few ideas.
Rough figures going on milk prices, drawings and inputs. 100 cows will need to be milked on the farm. Getting quotes off different companies on cubicles, water tanks, slats, parlor, meal bin,fencing, concrete. It will cost €200-220k to convert the farmyard, sheds and fields from drystock to cows. That includes a grant on a parlor. I’ll go through figures in more detail next week.
But at the moment my main focus at the moment is to source good quality stock. I am undecided on whether to buy calves, heifers or lease cows. There’s pro’s and cons with both. What’s people’s thoughts ?

I know new entrants getting in for a lot less than that. Is the 220 including stock? As other posters have said use what you have, you can save series money by converting what you have.

davidk1394 · 30-11-2018 10:17pm

That’s including stock. 3 straw bedded sheds and that’s its. All the old stone buildings will be knocked. Fencing, roadways, and digging tanks can be done by ourselves with very little cost. Adding an extra 2 spans onto a hay barn with a lean too either side. That will house 100 cubicles and an L shaped feed barrier on a slatted tank. Looking at putting in a 16 unit parlor

Dakota Dan · 01-12-2018 9:05am

carrollsno1 wrote: »

A lad told me out here that you dont know how to work until you start losing money.

So that lad works harder when he loses money, I think he’s going the wrong way about it.

Dakota Dan · 01-12-2018 9:10am

wrangler wrote: »

A friend has got similar figures for his development too and to expect a time frame of starting milking 2021, planning is notoriously slow and he's using a well known advisory crowd so they're probably very experienced.
He's early fifties and has told his son he'll only work for ten more years, he hopes to travel

Will his son be taking over in 10 years?

wrangler · 01-12-2018 9:32am

Dakota Dan wrote: »

Will his son be taking over in 10 years?

Father and son working together for next ten years and then father says he'll be gone......might come back for the spring is the plan but intends to travel, the father would be a top farmer

davidk1394 · 01-12-2018 9:36am

wrangler wrote: »

Father and son working together for next ten years and then father says he'll be gone......might come back for the spring is the plan but intends to travel, the father would be a top farmer

If they get on and work well together it can be a very enjoyable 10 years. Going setting up a 5 year partnership here. Luckily both parents are excited about the new venture.

Buford T. Justice XIX · 01-12-2018 9:41am

davidk1394 wrote: »

That’s including stock. 3 straw bedded sheds and that’s its. All the old stone buildings will be knocked. Fencing, roadways, and digging tanks can be done by ourselves with very little cost. Adding an extra 2 spans onto a hay barn with a lean too either side. That will house 100 cubicles and an L shaped feed barrier on a slatted tank. Looking at putting in a 16 unit parlor

If you can, leave a bit of room for a few more units at the back. It might never happen but, if it does, the hassle of doing it will be very small.

wrangler · 01-12-2018 10:45am

davidk1394 wrote: »

If they get on and work well together it can be a very enjoyable 10 years. Going setting up a 5 year partnership here. Luckily both parents are excited about the new venture.

Very true, I know another case where the father won't let go even though they're in a partnership, father has loads money so it's not as if the son will leave him broke if he makes a costly error, I also hate hearing fathers complaining about their sons/daughters on the farm

carrollsno1 · 01-12-2018 12:02pm

Dakota Dan wrote: »

So that lad works harder when he loses money, I think he’s going the wrong way about it.

Works smarter and more efficient was what i gathered.

Dakota Dan · 01-12-2018 2:45pm

wrangler wrote: »

I also hate hearing fathers complaining about their sons/daughters on the farm

I don’t have that problem as I have a son and daughter that have zero interest in farming.

Buford T. Justice XIX · 01-12-2018 3:11pm

Dakota Dan wrote: »

I don’t have that problem as I have a son and daughter that have zero interest in farming.

You could go again, Dan, third times a charm:D

wrangler · 01-12-2018 3:14pm

carrollsno1 wrote: »

Works smarter and more efficient was what i gathered.

Losing money concentrates the mind and that's for sure

Mooooo · 01-12-2018 5:21pm

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

You could go again, Dan, third times a charm:D

Land with twins who both want it then lol

Dakota Dan · 01-12-2018 6:21pm

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

You could go again, Dan, third times a charm:D

I’d have to trade in the wife to do that which would cost half the farm ðŸ˜€

Water John · 01-12-2018 8:01pm

Dakota, with modern tech almost anything is possible. Just make sure a 'farm' gene is included this time.

carrollsno1 · 01-12-2018 10:16pm

wrangler wrote: »

Losing money concentrates the mind and that's for sure

He was the worst person ive ever worked for, in terms of safety, wages (mediocre hourly rate and low hours) and everything was rushed but the job was still drawn out.

wrangler · 01-12-2018 10:21pm

carrollsno1 wrote: »

He was the worst person ive ever worked for, in terms of safety, wages (mediocre hourly rate and low hours) and everything was rushed but the job was still drawn out.

Who you talking about or have you quoted the wrong post

Thinking of Dairying

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