Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Is this Dublin team the greatest in Gaelic football history

Options
13567…12

Comments

  • Options
    #62
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    legendary.xix wrote: »

    Vienna is one of 9 provinces in Austria.

    No prizes for guessing who was in Vienna recently.


  • Options
    #63
    invicta
    Registered Users Posts: 281 ✭✭invicta


    BonnieSituation wrote: »
    Well it's nice now to see the goalposts have now moved on to something else.

    I was worried that winning all before us actually would have contributed to the fact of this team being great.

    Apparently not.

    Your missing the point. No doubt about Dublinwinning all before them...but they have a third of the population,and home advantage 99%of the time. My point is the Kerry team of the early 80’s, tried Fellas in the league(s), and came back to the same TEAM!


  • Options
    #64
    The_Honeybadger
    Registered Users Posts: 4,155 ✭✭✭The_Honeybadger


    Water John wrote: »
    The Dublin team are a great team, no doubt on that. It is I asked the question of the T/O in the team and squad. This was not a slight, just asking to help in the comparison.
    The Kerry team had one real change on the starting 15 when Eoin Liston was brought in by Micko in 1978.
    Both are/were supreme, of their time.

    It’s really an impossible question to answer, two great great teams that set the bar in their respective times. It’s a different game now. Obviously teams are fitter and faster than ever before, there are more matches and the game is more technical now with multiple gameplans and more substitutions allowed etc. A lot of this plays in to Dublins hands tbh with their huge depth at the minute.

    The change in personnel is interesting. If you had said to most people in 2015 that Dublin would be without Flynn, Connolly, Brogan and O’Carroll in three years time you’d say they’d be done. I don’t think the team that started yesterday are as good individually as the 14/15 team, but they are quite possibly a better team. It’s remarkable really. The 5 in a row looks inevitable as I just don’t see a team that can touch them, all the chasing pack have significant issues to address and probably don’t have the players to do so.

    Once the five in a row is done I think we’ll see several retirements in Dublin and the wheel might start to turn a bit.


  • Options
    #65
    Bonniedog
    Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    Pointless really comparing teams of different eras. Dublin are obviously a great team given their achievements but there is no real basis for deciding who was greatest team of all time unless Crokes can organise a tournament using one of those Star Trek thingamybobs to bring Wexford of 1915-1918, Down of the 60s, the Galway 3 - in - a row teem, Micko's Kerry, Heffo's Dubs, Tyrone of noughties and Dublin's four in a row side together as they were when in their prime.

    On other note, and hopefully this will not annoy anyone! But Dublin also broke another record yesterday for greatest number of successive championship wins - 28.

    Including league, they have only lost I think 4 games since 2014? That's about 4%!


  • Options
    #66
    TrueGael
    Registered Users Posts: 294 ✭✭TrueGael


    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DmLcA63W4AMyK8o.jpg

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DmLe6FMVsAQasSl.jpg


    One is a true 'Once in a Lifetime' as evidenced by what happened post 86' the other is the product of a mass production line churning out player after player


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #67
    EICVD
    Registered Users Posts: 1,005 ✭✭✭EICVD


    Yes, yes they are, goodbye


  • Options
    #68
    invicta
    Registered Users Posts: 281 ✭✭invicta


    TrueGael wrote: »
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DmLcA63W4AMyK8o.jpg

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DmLe6FMVsAQasSl.jpg


    One is a true 'Once in a Lifetime' as evidenced by what happened post 86' the other is the product of a mass production line churning out player after player

    I rest my case!


  • Options
    #69
    Bonniedog
    Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    The Kerry team of the 70s and 80s never trained, Never handpassed. Never took opposition players out of games. Stood back and applauded when opposition player fielded a high ball and then stood back to allow him to give it an almighty boot down the pitch. They also drank 4 pints at half time if they were too far ahead. True sportsmen not like these sly jackeens and their training and al that nonsense.


  • Options
    #70
    dubrov
    Registered Users Posts: 3,549 ✭✭✭dubrov


    TrueGael wrote:
    One is a true 'Once in a Lifetime' as evidenced by what happened post 86' the other is the product of a mass production line churning out player after player

    Try redoing the spreadsheets with just the four in a row wins sorting it by most medals.

    It's not as different as you think


  • Options
    #71
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users Posts: 18,921 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    invicta wrote: »
    Your missing the point. No doubt about Dublinwinning all before them...but they have a third of the population,and home advantage 99%of the time. My point is the Kerry team of the early 80’s, tried Fellas in the league(s), and came back to the same TEAM!

    The points are nonsense though. So I'm glad they're whooshing over my head.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #72
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    Pointless really comparing teams of different eras. Dublin are obviously a great team given their achievements but there is no real basis for deciding who was greatest team of all time unless Crokes can organise a tournament using one of those Star Trek thingamybobs to bring Wexford of 1915-1918, Down of the 60s, the Galway 3 - in - a row teem, Micko's Kerry, Heffo's Dubs, Tyrone of noughties and Dublin's four in a row side together as they were when in their prime.

    On other note, and hopefully this will not annoy anyone! But Dublin also broke another record yesterday for greatest number of successive championship wins - 28.

    Including league, they have only lost I think 4 games since 2014? That's about 4%!
    The current Dublin team would run all of those off the park in the first 5 minutes. It's silly to say you can't compare. Of course you can the current Dublin team are fitter and better organised than any of those teams. Now then it comes to skill that's a matter of opinion.


  • Options
    #73
    legendary.xix
    Registered Users Posts: 1,363 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    LeinsterDub wrote: »
    It wasn't worth 5 points from 95 to 11. Odd that. By your terrible logic New Zealand are at best a middling rugby team as 2 of their world cups where won at home.

    It was worth 5 points in 95 to 11 too. Just as Dublin deserve credit for winning twice In Omagh this year, the teams that came to Croke Park and won in those years deserve full credit too.

    Kerry wanted a toss of a coin for home advantage in the 2001 quarter-final v Dublin. Dublin declined this offer. Both the quarter-final and replay were played in Thurles.


  • Options
    #74
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    legendary.xix wrote: »
    It was worth 5 points in 95 to 11 too. Just as Dublin deserve credit for winning twice In Omagh this year, the teams that came to Croke Park and won in those years deserve full credit too.

    Kerry wanted a toss of a coin for home advantage in the 2001 quarter-final v Dublin. Dublin declined this offer. Both the quarter-final and replay were played in Thurles.
    What does deserve full credit mean? Are you attempting to claim Dublin's home advantage was the only reason they won 5 out of their last 6?
    I'm not sure how the 2001 quarter final is reliant more than 15 years later?


  • Options
    #75
    dirtyden
    Registered Users Posts: 1,730 ✭✭✭dirtyden


    They are a great team and if they win next year I would think potentially the greatest ever. It won’t last forever though, they will come back to the pack, or the pack will improve. Kerry just won 5 minors in a row, that is unprecedented. Give it a few years we may see some Kerry dominance again.

    I can never understand the attitude of we have to do something about Dublin when they win. Just admire the team they have built and enjoy what they are doing now. What other counties should be doing is improving their own setups rather than worrying about what Dublin have.


  • Options
    #76
    legendary.xix
    Registered Users Posts: 1,363 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    LeinsterDub wrote: »
    What does deserve full credit mean? Are you attempting to claim Dublin's home advantage was the only reason they won 5 out of their last 6?
    I'm not sure how the 2001 quarter final is reliant more than 15 years later?

    It is a massive advantage. There's no doubt about that. When such a big game is in the melting pot and you've got the home end of Hill 16 behind you, you are more familiar with the surroundings than your rural opponent etc. It's a massive advantage.


  • Options
    #77
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    LeinsterDub wrote: »
    The current Dublin team would run all of those off the park in the first 5 minutes. It's silly to say you can't compare. Of course you can the current Dublin team are fitter and better organised than any of those teams. Now then it comes to skill that's a matter of opinion.

    You can’t compare.......with credibility. You are assuming that a notional game between Dublin and a team from 50 years ago would take place on Dublin’s terms i.e. with their fitness regime as the benchmark, while assuming that the other team is not allowed to reach that. Why? Fitness is achievable and measurable. Presumably in a Harry Potter type world where such matches could take place the first issue the old time team would address would be the fitness deficit. Yet the first thing mentioned by the if-it-happened-five-minutes-ago-it’s-the-best-of-all-time is fitness. That’s one of the reason such discussions are ludicrous.


  • Options
    #78
    legendary.xix
    Registered Users Posts: 1,363 ✭✭✭legendary.xix


    dirtyden wrote: »
    I can never understand the attitude of we have to do something about Dublin when they win. Just admire the team they have built and enjoy what they are doing now. What other counties should be doing is improving their own setups rather than worrying about what Dublin have.

    Dublin have built an incredible group of athletes. Their footballing tactical knowledge has raised standards as well.

    Dublin have all the advantages as well and are rightly making full use of them. If Mayo had gotten a replay in Castlebar for example, that would have been a massive advantage for them. Kildare fought tooth and nail to hold onto home advantage over Mayo this year. The 5 points it can be worth are crucial. Especially when a game is in the melting pot then as well.


  • Options
    #79
    DJIMI TRARORE
    Registered Users Posts: 3,558 ✭✭✭DJIMI TRARORE


    By the time they are finished they will have records set that might never be broken. In my opinion there is at least 2 more AIs and as many leinster and National leagues as they want. It will be indisputable by the end of 2020 GOAT


  • Options
    #80
    Dannyriver
    Registered Users Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭Dannyriver


    Speakerboxx wrote: »
    Multiple teams have done 4 in a row. No team in senior hurling or football have done 5 in a row. That will define if they are the greatest team of all time. Until Dublin achieve this they will be considered as just a good team for now.

    Not fair they are a great team to do what they ve done, the one and one = 2 approach you ve taken to the argument doesn t work.


  • Options
    #81
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    mickeyk wrote: »
    It’s really an impossible question to answer, two great great teams that set the bar in their respective times. It’s a different game now. Obviously teams are fitter and faster than ever before, there are more matches and the game is more technical now with multiple gameplans and more substitutions allowed etc. A lot of this plays in to Dublins hands tbh with their huge depth at the minute.

    The change in personnel is interesting. If you had said to most people in 2015 that Dublin would be without Flynn, Connolly, Brogan and O’Carroll in three years time you’d say they’d be done. I don’t think the team that started yesterday are as good individually as the 14/15 team, but they are quite possibly a better team. It’s remarkable really. The 5 in a row looks inevitable as I just don’t see a team that can touch them, all the chasing pack have significant issues to address and probably don’t have the players to do so.

    Once the five in a row is done I think we’ll see several retirements in Dublin and the wheel might start to turn a bit.

    But you are contradicting yourself when you say that several retirements will affect Dublin while using the “if you had said to most people in 2015.....” about other players. I would also suggest that it is quite possible that many Dublin players will not see themselves as being defined by the five in a row. I’d be surprised if they were as hung up on who has the biggest mickey as people in other counties. They strike me as a group which thinks differently and you might be surprised what players might not be there next year or who might be there even a year later.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #82
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,208 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    TrueGael wrote: »
    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DmLcA63W4AMyK8o.jpg

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DmLe6FMVsAQasSl.jpg


    One is a true 'Once in a Lifetime' as evidenced by what happened post 86' the other is the product of a mass production line churning out player after player


    There are two things that have changed since the Kerry 4-in-a-row.

    Firstly, it is not possible for any team, even Kerry, to win the All-Ireland playing just three games, or sometimes four. Every team now has to play at least 7. That means you cannot rely on just 15 players as knocks and bruises will see you short.

    Secondly, it has become a match of 21 players rather than 15, with every team needing 26 available to pick from.

    When you adjust for that and look at the 21/26 that Dublin have used since 2015, there have only really been four changes with Alan Brogan, Connolly, O'Carroll and Bastick replaced by Scully, O'Callaghan, Murchan and Howard. All of the others have been there all the time, and the competition for places has seen the changes.


  • Options
    #83
    nice_guy80
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,723 ✭✭✭nice_guy80


    System funded by every other county
    Getting to use the national gaa stadium
    And huge income from sponsorship

    How much fundraising do Dublin have to do with draws etc to run their county teams?
    Very little.


  • Options
    #84
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 27,933 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    legendary.xix wrote: »
    It is a massive advantage. There's no doubt about that. When such a big game is in the melting pot and you've got the home end of Hill 16 behind you, you are more familiar with the surroundings than your rural opponent etc. It's a massive advantage.

    Rural opponent? You make it sound like they come up only on 8th December once a year to shop.
    Tyrone played in Croke Park on 12th August 2018.

    It's not like going to play Red Star Belgrade behind the Iron Curtain in 1980.

    The ticket allocations for the final reflect that. Compare with a real home team in the Premier League or Champions League who get 90% of the tickets.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Options
    #85
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,208 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Powerhouse wrote: »
    Not sure this is really a valid comparison. While Dublin do play more games there are still few where they are under a real threat. Having to play three games in Leinster - next year without a Division 1 National League team other than Dublin - is hardly the measure of all time greatness. Or would Dublin be even greater if they had to play Wexford and Louth? By this logic they would. Kerry could have played seven or eight games in their time too and, assuming a level playing field with all others, would still have won those All Irelands.


    Kerry had even less to play against. There was nobody in Munster giving them a game, and Monaghan put up probably the worst ever performance in a semi-final in 1979 and Connacht teams were equally a joke. They just had to beat the best team in Leinster.


  • Options
    #86
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    legendary.xix wrote: »

    1) If Mayo had gotten a replay in Castlebar for example, that would have been a massive advantage for them.

    2) Kildare fought tooth and nail to hold on to home advantage.

    3) The 5 points it can be worth are crucial.

    1) What massive advantage? The last two times Mayo played Galway in the championship in Castlebar they lost. And Dublin are better than Galway.

    2) Yes, they did but they lost at home to Galway in the super 8. When you’re not good enough you’re not good enough.

    3) This 5 points thing is completely arbitrary. Just made up. There were 17 qualifiers played in the 2018 All Ireland championship and only four were won by the home team.


  • Options
    #87
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 27,933 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Just as impressive as winning 4 in a row is, like Kerry, winning it without losing a game i.e. Dublin didn't have to use the 'playoff' route which would not have been available to Kerry back in the day.

    Had Dublin used the back door, I am sure that would have been used as ammunition...

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Options
    #88
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Kerry had even less to play against. There was nobody in Munster giving them a game, and Monaghan put up probably the worst ever performance in a semi-final in 1979 and Connacht teams were equally a joke. They just had to beat the best team in Leinster.

    Precisely my point. So it wouldn’t have mattered whether Kerry played three games or ten games. They’d have won anyway. It is a weak reason to try to differentiate between Kerry’s and Dublin’ achievements.


  • Options
    #89
    Powerhouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,428 ✭✭✭Powerhouse


    odyssey06 wrote: »

    Had Dublin used the back door, I am sure that would have been used as ammunition...

    That is for sure. Any angle.....!!!


  • Options
    #90
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 27,933 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Kerry had even less to play against. There was nobody in Munster giving them a game, and Monaghan put up probably the worst ever performance in a semi-final in 1979 and Connacht teams were equally a joke. They just had to beat the best team in Leinster.

    Yep and then this is Kerry's record in 1980 and 1981...

    1980 Three games won by 10 points, 5 points and 3 points
    1981 Four games won by 23 points, 11 points, 16 points and 7 points

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #91
    eagle eye
    Registered Users Posts: 37,527 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    blanch152 wrote: »
    don't let the facts get in the way. The myth of the ever-changing Dublin team is just that. 23 players with four All-Ireland medals.
    Four in a row?


Advertisement