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BIK on EVs.

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  • 03-11-2017 6:25pm
    #1
    BoatMad
    Registered Users Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭


    I see it's now been extended from 1 to 3-5 years by pascal donoghue

    Also the info graphic from DCCAE also mentions" toll reductions " so we may see something on this !!
    Looks good


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Comments

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    #2
    kop-end
    Registered Users Posts: 227 ✭✭kop-end


    Well that certainly makes the budget announcements seem a littler better....

    https://www.dccae.gov.ie/documents/Electric%20Vehicle%20Incentive%20Infographic.pdf


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    #3
    unkel
    Registered Users Posts: 64,775 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    So it's official now!

    More fast chargers and less tolls. Sweet :)


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    #4
    BoatMad
    Registered Users Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    unkel wrote: »
    So it's official now!

    More fast chargers and less tolls. Sweet :)

    Ive not seen any detail re tolls, the LEV taskforce felt the only one that could be easily reduced was the M50.


  • Options
    #5
    zoom_cool
    Registered Users Posts: 443 ✭✭zoom_cool


    Is there a list of Electric Vehicles covered under the new no BIK charges for example is the BMW I3 Rex a option does anybody know?


  • Options
    #6
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    zoom_cool wrote: »
    Is there a list of Electric Vehicles covered under the new no BIK charges for example is the BMW I3 Rex a option does anybody know?

    Rex is not....electric only...


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    #7
    stesaurus
    Registered Users Posts: 2,888 ✭✭✭stesaurus


    Rex is as it's electrically driven 100%


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    #8
    zoom_cool
    Registered Users Posts: 443 ✭✭zoom_cool


    So there is no official document from Revenue yet? Where are you getting your information from? thanks


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    #9
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 21,373 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    zoom_cool wrote: »
    So there is no official document from Revenue yet? Where are you getting your information from? thanks
    There was a document from the minister posted here not so long ago with the exact text.
    I forget the exact wording but in essence it was that the vehicle must derive its power/propulsion from a 100% electric drivetrain. IE the limiting factor is the the forward motion must not be connected to an ICE. I think the i3 rex meets that definition.


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    #10
    zoom_cool
    Registered Users Posts: 443 ✭✭zoom_cool


    ELM327 wrote: »
    There was a document from the minister posted here not so long ago with the exact text.
    I forget the exact wording but in essence it was that the vehicle must derive its power/propulsion from a 100% electric drivetrain. IE the limiting factor is the the forward motion must not be connected to an ICE. I think the i3 rex meets that definition.

    Thanks ELM327 does anybody have a link to the document .


  • Options
    #11
    KCross
    Registered Users Posts: 12,070 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    zoom_cool wrote: »
    Thanks ELM327 does anybody have a link to the document .

    Maybe read this thread...
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057799304

    And some more stuff in his budget speech if you want to read that
    https://www.dccae.gov.ie/en-ie/news-and-media/speeches/Pages/Minister-Denis-Naughten-announces-details-of-Department's-2018-budget.aspx

    The main bits...
    I have secured a doubling of the budget next year to €10 million to incentivise the use of electric vehicles. New grants to support the installation of home charge points will be available from the 1st of January for new and second-hand electric cars; there will be a 0% rate of benefit in kind for electric vehicles for one year as an interim measure while a review of benefit in kind on vehicles will take place in the meantime.

    Additional funding will be provided to support the provision of public charging with an increase on the number of rapid chargers. I also intend to launch a new Electric Vehicle Public Awareness Campaign to drive uptake.

    It will include an awareness campaign, a public driver experience roadshow, public sector and commercial fleet trials, and an electric car sharing programme.



    The full finance bill is here:
    https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachtas/bill/2017/115/eng@initiated/b11517d.pdf

    The text you are after is this...
    ‘electric vehicle’ means a vehicle that derives its motive power exclusively from an electric motor;”


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    #12
    zoom_cool
    Registered Users Posts: 443 ✭✭zoom_cool


    Thanks there is alot of good information there.


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    #13
    zoom_cool
    Registered Users Posts: 443 ✭✭zoom_cool


    I am now seriously thinking of a BMW i3 Rex 94ah thanks again for your help.


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    #14
    Mc-BigE
    Registered Users Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭Mc-BigE


    "electric vehicle’ means a vehicle that derives its motive power exclusively from an electric motor"

    this guy on youtube is saying the BMW 530e is 0% BIK, surely that is wrong?(hoping its not)

    he does make a valid point about business users not able to claim the vat on Petrol for a company car

    https://youtu.be/cDlglzdDMAo

    fast forward to about 5 minutes in


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    #15
    KCross
    Registered Users Posts: 12,070 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    Mc-BigE wrote: »
    "electric vehicle’ means a vehicle that derives its motive power exclusively from an electric motor"

    this guy on youtube is saying the BMW 530e is 0% BIK, surely that is wrong?(hoping its not)

    he does make a valid point about business users not able to claim the vat on Petrol for a company car

    https://youtu.be/cDlglzdDMAo

    fast forward to about 5 minutes in

    Fairly sure he is wrong. The engine in the 530e is not a range extender like the i3. It is connected to the wheels so it would fail the "exclusively" element of the text.


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    #16
    Mc-BigE
    Registered Users Posts: 1,033 ✭✭✭Mc-BigE


    i'm sure BMW Ireland and every other plug-in hybrid manufacturer in ireland are dissecting the governments document to see if the word "exclusively" means something like "exclusively for 30 miles or more on EV power"

    lol


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    #17
    air
    Registered Users Posts: 2,822 ✭✭✭air


    This could become one like the N1 commercials where loads of people are driving them and paying the "van" rate of BIK.


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    #18
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 21,373 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    My opinion on the wording is regardless of what powers the battery (eg onboard generator included), once the traction is powered exclusively from electric motors then it's eligible
    Once the ICE is not connected to the wheels.


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    #19
    KCross
    Registered Users Posts: 12,070 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    ELM327 wrote: »
    My opinion on the wording is regardless of what powers the battery (eg onboard generator included), once the traction is powered exclusively from electric motors then it's eligible
    Once the ICE is not connected to the wheels.

    I'd agree, so that would rule out nearly all hybrids and PHEV's including the 530e..... yes?

    Basically, series hybrids (i3) would get the 0% BIK but parallel hybrids(530e, Toyota hybrids etc) would not.


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    #20
    zoom_cool
    Registered Users Posts: 443 ✭✭zoom_cool


    Why couldn't the government be more clear on this it's typical :-)


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    #21
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 21,373 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    KCross wrote: »
    I'd agree, so that would rule out nearly all hybrids and PHEV's including the 530e..... yes?

    Basically, series hybrids (i3) would get the 0% BIK but parallel hybrids(530e, Toyota hybrids etc) would not.
    IMO Yes it really only includes real BEV/BEVx and not compliance PHEV.


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    #22
    grogi
    Registered Users Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    Sounds like any full series hybrid qualifies - so e-Power Nissan Hybrid would qualify as well?


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    #23
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 21,373 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    grogi wrote: »
    Sounds like any full series hybrid qualifies - so e-Power Nissan Hybrid would qualify as well?
    Again, and we are only guessing here, yes I would guess it would due to the wording and that it derives its traction 100% from an electric motor.


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    #24
    thierry14
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,480 ✭✭✭thierry14


    grogi wrote: »
    Sounds like any full series hybrid qualifies - so e-Power Nissan Hybrid would qualify as well?

    They would sell a ton of them here

    Drives like an EV With instant power but runs on petrol

    Perfection


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    #25
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Could someone give me the plain English version of this - I am a total novice and glaze over when our accountant talks about BIK (and just about anything else).

    We have a small business and work from home. We don't have a sales fleet or anything so if we bought a car through the company it would be a pure perk - i.e. no particular use to the business. Is that allowed?

    Practically speaking, how does it work? You buy a car through the company and it is treated as an asset - but I suppose when you sell it (in, say, three-to-five years) you have to pay this to the company?


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    #26
    grogi
    Registered Users Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Could someone give me the plain English version of this - I am a total novice and glaze over when our accountant talks about BIK (and just about anything else).

    We have a small business and work from home. We don't have a sales fleet or anything so if we bought a car through the company it would be a pure perk - i.e. no particular use to the business. Is that allowed?

    Yes. That's exactly why BIK was introduced. An asset is given by the company and can be used privately, thus an additional tax is required.
    Practically speaking, how does it work? You buy a car through the company and it is treated as an asset - but I suppose when you sell it (in, say, three-to-five years) you have to pay this to the company?

    Yes. Or first transfer it to the individual and pay income tax on the transferred of asset.


  • Options
    #27
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Thanks a lot grogi.

    Bonus question, if I may: Can you buy a second-hand car or is this an incentive to buy new EVs?


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    #28
    air
    Registered Users Posts: 2,822 ✭✭✭air


    Doesn't need to be new.
    You'll also have to pay corporation tax on any money used to buy the vehicle, but on the plus side you can depreciate it within the company too.


  • Options
    #29
    PickYourName
    Registered Users Posts: 412 ✭✭PickYourName


    zoom_cool wrote: »
    Why couldn't the government be more clear on this it's typical :-)

    As has been quoted already: ""electric vehicle’ means a vehicle that derives its motive power exclusively from an electric motor"

    I think I'd struggle to come up with a form of words that could be clearer: your comment is more than a little unfair.

    "Motive power" is the power that makes the car move. All hybrids and plug-in hybrids can use their ICE engines to move the car when the battery is empty, so are not included according to the definition.

    The range-extender ICE used in the BMW i3 does not use its power to move the car, rather it's used to charge the battery. Hence it is included according to the definition, as motive power is exclusively electric.

    The definition is clear and unambiguous and can be applied easily to every car on the market to determine if it is covered or not.


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    #30
    BoatMad
    Registered Users Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    The clear intention in the BIK concession was it only applies to BEVs and not hybrids , i.e. These cars that " exclusively " derive their motor power from an electric motor. The I3 Rex is a BEV

    The wording is clear and anything else is wishful thinking.

    Supports for hybrids will continue to be scaled back and phased out over the next few years.


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    #31
    BoatMad
    Registered Users Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Could someone give me the plain English version of this - I am a total novice and glaze over when our accountant talks about BIK (and just about anything else).

    We have a small business and work from home. We don't have a sales fleet or anything so if we bought a car through the company it would be a pure perk - i.e. no particular use to the business. Is that allowed?

    Practically speaking, how does it work? You buy a car through the company and it is treated as an asset - but I suppose when you sell it (in, say, three-to-five years) you have to pay this to the company?

    For BIK to apply , the car must be a company asset bought within the company and owned by the company, for sole traders different rules apply . It can be new of 2nd hand

    It is then provided for your use , there is NO requirement for business miles or business use.

    You cannot own the car in your own name, hence "you " cannot sell the car , the company sells th car and recovers any value.

    Note that you cannot have a company pay you to purchase a car in your own name, even by way of salary sacrifice, that's treated as income and taxed Under income tax rules.

    So in your case the BIK concession is an enormous benefit , because it effectively allows you to get the use of a car at gross salary rather then net salary costs.


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