Luas Cross City (Line BX/D) [now open]

LXFlyer · 20-06-2017 10:12pm

They are talking about the aisle area alongside the two bays of four seats on each side facing each other that are to the ends of each tram and repeated through them.

Short of hanging straps which many people don't like it's not easy to provide any form of support that would not cause an obstruction for people getting in and out of the seats.

Chivito550 · 20-06-2017 11:21pm

lxflyer wrote: »

They are talking about the aisle area alongside the two bays of four seats on each side facing each other that are to the ends of each tram and repeated through them.

Short of hanging straps which many people don't like it's not easy to provide any form of support that would not cause an obstruction for people getting in and out of the seats.

Hanging straps are a very simple solution. There's no need to be having gaps like that with nobody standing in that space.

spacetweek · 21-06-2017 3:10pm

Chivito550 wrote: »

Hanging straps are a very simple solution. There's no need to be having gaps like that with nobody standing in that space.

The straps would be in the way of people getting up out of seats.

Chivito550 · 21-06-2017 3:19pm

spacetweek wrote: »

The straps would be in the way of people getting up out of seats.

Really? How low do straps really have to be? Most people have to raise their arm to grab onto them. How many people are over 6 and a half foot tall that they are going to clatter into a strap getting off their seat? Ridiculous reason to leave 2 spaces free per carriage.

KCAccidental · 21-06-2017 3:40pm

I wonder if the red line trams could be refurbished in future in a higher capacity mode with the groups of 4 seats removed and seat placed along the sides in a more metro style

Jamie2k9 · 21-06-2017 3:59pm

The space people are talking about is regularly filled with people.

Chivito550 · 21-06-2017 4:01pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

The space people are talking about is regularly filled with people.

No it is not. People constantly ask people to push down further into the aisle, and nobody does because there is nothing to grab hold of in the centre of the aisle. So the aisle is only ever around 70% occupied.

Chivito550 · 22-06-2017 9:01am

On the LUAS here, absolutely rammed, yet that area is still empty. You could fit 2 extra people in there by adding hanging straps. A woman just walked on and asked people to move down, yet the people on the aisle didn't budge into this empty area as there's nothing to hold onto. How has such an oversight never been picked up?

LXFlyer · 22-06-2017 9:07am

Why don't you contact the LUAS directly with that suggestion?

Dardania · 22-06-2017 9:44am

Any chance of a pic of what you're discussing? I have a guess but not sure

LXFlyer · 22-06-2017 10:17am

Dardania wrote: »

Any chance of a pic of what you're discussing? I have a guess but not sure

It is the aisle area near the end of each tram where there are two seats facing another two seats on either side of the aisle. It's also repeated several times through the tram where that seating layout is replicated.

People stand alongside the seats where there are grab rails, but not in the aisle area where you get in/out of the seats as there is nothing to hold onto.

Personally I'm not sure that having standees there would be such a good idea as it would make it more difficult to get in/out of the seats, but it might be worth a go!

LXFlyer · 22-06-2017 10:19am

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

The space people are talking about is regularly filled with people.

No it isn't - there's always a gap in the people standing in the aisle alongside the entrance to the seating areas (where the seats directly face one another) as there is nothing to hold onto.

CramCycle · 22-06-2017 10:33am

Chivito550 wrote: »

On the LUAS here, absolutely rammed, yet that area is still empty. You could fit 2 extra people in there by adding hanging straps. A woman just walked on and asked people to move down, yet the people on the aisle didn't budge into this empty area as there's nothing to hold onto. How has such an oversight never been picked up?

Are you talking about the part of the LUAS where it facilitates turning. I presume it was a safety idea but there are yellow polls close to that.

Chivito550 · 22-06-2017 10:48am

CramCycle wrote: »

Are you talking about the part of the LUAS where it facilitates turning. I presume it was a safety idea but there are yellow polls close to that.

It seems like lxflyer is the only person who can follow what I'm saying. Obviously I'm not explaining it clearly enough.

Dardania · 22-06-2017 11:14am

Is it up in the air to the left of where this photo is?:

taken from: http://ktransit.com/transit/Europe/Ireland/dublin/luas/dub-lr-misc.htm

Chivito550 · 22-06-2017 11:37am

Dardania wrote: »

Is it up in the air to the left of where this photo is?:

taken from: http://ktransit.com/transit/Europe/Ireland/dublin/luas/dub-lr-misc.htm

See the skinny aisle between the main seating area in that picture? Half way down that aisle, where the seats face each other, it is impossible to stand as there is nothing to hold onto.

LXFlyer · 22-06-2017 11:41am

CramCycle wrote: »

Are you talking about the part of the LUAS where it facilitates turning. I presume it was a safety idea but there are yellow polls close to that.

It is the narrow aisle section in between where there are two bays of four seats either side of the aisle facing one another.

I'm not sure how else to explain it!!

LXFlyer · 22-06-2017 11:42am

Chivito550 wrote: »

It seems like lxflyer is the only person who can follow what I'm saying. Obviously I'm not explaining it clearly enough.

It has always struck me as a gap too, but it's tricky as many people detest holding onto straps.

LuckyLloyd · 22-06-2017 1:01pm

Hold onto the back of the seats?

Chivito550 · 22-06-2017 1:17pm

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Hold onto the back of the seats?

Unless you have arms the size of rowing oars then that's impossible to do from the area we are referring to.

mrsdewinter · 22-06-2017 1:33pm

For heaven's sake: why aren't there more hand straps? I'm not mad about them myself but they're unobtrusive and if there was a choice between showcasing my unshaved oxter and waiting for momentum to fling me onto another passenger, I know which I'd go for.

Idbatterim · 22-06-2017 1:35pm

looking at that photo. Just remove one bank of seating, end of...

LXFlyer · 22-06-2017 1:35pm

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Hold onto the back of the seats?

There is a massive gap between the seat backs - the seats are facing one another, plus there is room for people to sit opposite one another.

They are talking about the area in the aisle between the seat backs of the two seats facing one another in this photo - there is nothing to hold onto hence it is generally left clear.

http://briansolomon.com/trackingthelight/2015/09/24/luas-at-dusk-silvery-trams-in-silhouette/luas_interior_p1320114/

LXFlyer · 22-06-2017 1:37pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

looking at that photo. Just remove one bank of seating, end of...

The facing seats are repeated throughout the tram - they're not just at one location. There still needs to be some seating provided.

Idbatterim · 22-06-2017 1:39pm

The facing seats are repeated throughout the tram - they're not just at one location. There still needs to be some seating provided.

I appreciate that, I am just saying take out one bank of them. I wonder what that would increase the tram capacity by?

LXFlyer · 22-06-2017 1:43pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

I appreciate that, I am just saying take out one bank of them. I wonder what that would increase the tram capacity by?

TBH the capacity issue (on the Green Line at least) is overstated - the Sandyford starters (at least every second tram) do always clear the numbers waiting.

People may have to wait for a second tram to come, but that's pretty normal.

PhoenixParker · 22-06-2017 1:49pm

There may be operational and safety reasons for the lack of hand straps in the area. The space prevents (even more) overcrowding, allows people to exit more easily, allows ticket inspectors to pass through a crowded tram.

If a little less density in the middle shortens stop dwell time by ten seconds, the gain in capacity there would outweigh the two extra people who could fit on board.

CramCycle · 22-06-2017 3:47pm

Chivito550 wrote: »

It seems like lxflyer is the only person who can follow what I'm saying. Obviously I'm not explaining it clearly enough.

lxflyer wrote: »

It is the narrow aisle section in between where there are two bays of four seats either side of the aisle facing one another.

I'm not sure how else to explain it!!

i get it now, it was not clear until this point, it just sounded like the turning part as everyone seemed to refer to it as a clear area.

PhoenixParker wrote: »

There may be operational and safety reasons for the lack of hand straps in the area. The space prevents (even more) overcrowding, allows people to exit more easily, allows ticket inspectors to pass through a crowded tram.

If a little less density in the middle shortens stop dwell time by ten seconds, the gain in capacity there would outweigh the two extra people who could fit on board.

I presume this was the original thinking, I don't think it would add a huge amount to the operational space unless they just took out most of the seating for the rush hour trams.

MJohnston · 22-06-2017 4:34pm

All this explaining, does nobody have an app that can annotate photos??

Stephen15 · 22-06-2017 8:05pm

Just asking what are the plans for when the Luas CC opens wil, there be direct trams all the way from Bride's Glen to Broombridge or will Broombridge only go from Sandyford or SSG and Bride's Glen services only go to SSG or Parnell St.

Luas Cross City (Line BX/D) [now open]

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