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Near misses - mod warning 22/04 - see OP/post 822

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭Chuchote


    Behavioural theory suggests that ads aren't effective because they don't happen at the time you're carrying out a behaviour.

    If you're training a dog, for instance, it is more important to reward "four paws on the floor" the dog is about to leap up on someone - though of course you have to train it beforehand.

    My own feeling would be that random rewards for good driving behaviour would work much better for changing driving behaviour - eg have a bunch of 'good fairies' on bikes or mopeds who'd knock randomly at drivers' windows at lights and hand them a certificate and a token for a meal or a film or a concert, specifically saying "You signalled in good time" or "You gave that cyclist a wide berth" or "You stopped on the orange". (I don't know how this could work for mobile phone use :pac: ) The fact that a nice reward is a possibility often makes for better behaviour than a threat would. (Like the famous Bangalore scheme that ended dodging bus fares by running a lottery on bus tickets.)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,124 ✭✭✭Unknown Soldier


    Moflojo wrote: »
    "Fuuuuuuh....." - my reaction when watching that.

    You know when you've seen so many of these videos and you reckon you know what's going to happen, and then something even more ludicrous happens?! I was watching it with my 'Robocop' vision on, scanning and identifying potential suspects, and then that crazy lethal driver comes out of nowhere. I think I'd have been going for a quick sit down in the grass verge after that one.

    It's not actually that nice when it's not a near miss. Quite sore really.

    I was going around the walkinstown roundabout when the following happened Jan 2015 :(

    That nano-second before impact..
    2efqsgl.jpg

    And then lying on a very busy roundabout...
    21l4k7a.jpg


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭Chuchote


    That roundabout in Walkinstown is absolutely terrifying. Incredibly confusing when you're driving through it, horrible to cycle. Hope you're better.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭amcalester


    I usually give KN Group branded vehicles a wide berth.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,757 ✭✭✭Kaisr Sose


    Hope you are ok. At least you have it recorded front head and rear! Don't be shy going to Crumlin Gda Stn!

    It ironic, on the way home, one of the same liveried vehicles was parked on the cycle lane on Castle Street. Causing chaos for busses unable to pass if there was traffic coming down the hill. The driver was in the shop!


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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,686 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    Kaisr Sose wrote: »
    Hope you are ok. At least you have it recorded front head and rear! Don't be shy going to Crumlin Gda Stn!
    according to unknown soldier, the impact does not happen for another 88 years though.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,170 ✭✭✭✭ED E


    amcalester wrote: »
    I usually give KN Group branded vehicles a wide berth.

    In certain circles they're referred to as Kentucky Fried Networks.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭Chuchote


    according to unknown soldier, the impact does not happen for another 88 years though.
    It's not actually that nice when it's not a near miss. Quite sore really.

    I was going around the walkinstown roundabout when the following happened Jan 2105 :(

    Magicbastarder's point brings up another - if that's a mistake from confusion, get yourself checked for concussion, Unknown Soldier.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,686 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    maybe the impact knocked him into the future.

    Unknown Soldier, are they still using rim brakes in the 22nd century?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,757 ✭✭✭Kaisr Sose


    according to unknown soldier, the impact does not happen for another 88 years though.

    I missed that. Assuming it's 2015, there is little point in going the Gda Route. And knowing you are blitzing it up and down Gunny Hill, you are well mended!


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,801 ✭✭✭✭josip


    maybe the impact knocked him into the future.

    Unknown Soldier, are they still using rim brakes in the 22nd century?

    Did he have to hit 88mph to get there?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,933 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    amcalester wrote: »
    I usually give KN Group branded vehicles a wide berth.

    I've seen their drivers using phones, iPads and in one case, using a laptop while driving.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,917 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    Chuchote wrote: »
    (Like the famous Bangalore scheme that ended dodging bus fares by running a lottery on bus tickets.)

    That's pretty clever.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,021 ✭✭✭Arcade_Tryer


    tomasrojo wrote: »
    No, their effect is small.
    Even if it doesn't result in significant changes to driver behaviour, the campaign could at least create a discourse whereby cyclist safety is at the centre of the discussion. The current debate needs to change drastically from drivers v cyclists, to cyclists being vulnerable road users who are in significantly more danger from drivers than vice versa. At the moment, from reading online comments and listening to certain imbeciles on the radio, you'd swear cyclists are some kind of drones who serve only to cause annoyance to real road users; cars, buses and trucks. The human face needs to be put on cyclists; the head inside the helmet, the body beneath the lycra, the family waiting at home.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭Chuchote


    tomasrojo wrote: »
    That's pretty clever.

    If you liked that, you might try one of my favourite books, Don't Shoot the Dog by Karen Pryor, about training animals (and humans) using positive reinforcement.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,933 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Chuchote wrote: »
    (Like the famous Bangalore scheme that ended dodging bus fares by running a lottery on bus tickets.)
    Was it Stockholm that had a monthly raffle for any driver NOT caught speeding on camera?
    Even if it doesn't result in significant changes to driver behaviour, the campaign could at least create a discourse whereby cyclist safety is at the centre of the discussion. The current debate needs to change drastically from drivers v cyclists, to cyclists being vulnerable road users who are in significantly more danger from drivers than vice versa. At the moment, from reading online comments and listening to certain imbeciles on the radio, you'd swear cyclists are some kind of drones who serve only to cause annoyance to real road users; cars, buses and trucks. The human face needs to be put on cyclists; the head inside the helmet, the body beneath the lycra, the family waiting at home.

    The human face is a good idea, but you could also appear to the selfishness of drivers. Educate them on the idea that in most cases, a cyclist = one less car on the road, so they get to do their journey quicker.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,124 ✭✭✭Unknown Soldier


    maybe the impact knocked him into the future.

    Unknown Soldier, are they still using rim brakes in the 22nd century?

    Yes. Vintage Canyons are much sought after. Worth more than they were in the early part of the century. The common thought that bikes just go down in value was turned on it's head by me in a post in 2020 when I sold a Canyon for more than I paid for it, Ferrari style. :)
    Kaisr Sose wrote: »
    I missed that. Assuming it's 2015, there is little point in going the Gda Route. And knowing you are blitzing it up and down Gunny Hill, you are well mended!

    Yes it was 2015, and I am well mended. What really hurt was lying on the walkinstown roundabout for the guts of 10-15 mins as no one would let me up, half of Dublin must have went past me, and did I get a "man down" thread here? No! Yet some dude a week later fell of his bike in Sligo or somewhere and he got one!

    It did get the "fear" PTSD stylie. That's why I go cycling at stupid O'clock when I can, rather than commute to work, which I did a lot.
    It cause me a huge amount of mental anguish, as I am not prone to be afraid or cowardly. I was gifted with the "stupid" gene which overrides things like that.

    It did however educate me, the farmer culchie type, other ways. If someone got seriously assaulted on a night out, down a dark ally, and developed a fear of going out at night by themselves, you'd get that, or I would anyway. But if someone had their house broken into and then didn't want to live there anymore, the old me would have thought they were going a tad overboard but I get it now. We are just that grey lump in a skull, and that lump can be shock-wired, as well as all the other lovely things.

    Once the insurance stuff and all that was sorted, I kind of did rewire my brain and started commuting again. It was hard going at first but I more or less got there. Just went out early and avoided most of the traffic.

    And then a twat nearly hit me on a roundabout again. Kaiser probably remembers the video. Bar putting a f$$king lighthouse on my head I couldn't be more visible. I'm practically a poster boy for safe cycling! I still use my front and rear light now, during the daylight.

    Anyway, I'm back to ground Zero for commuting but will get back into it, still re-wiring grey matter.

    On a side note, when it comes to insurance companies and what an "accident" costs you, do think carefully. By default of the above mentionings, because I didn't want to think about it or be reminded of it, I spent 18 months not thinking, eh thinking. I started using a company car, for example. BIK was a cost, along with fuel.

    My list of "costs" ended up being quite long but genuine. They don't refund excess smoking and drinking btw.

    Sorry for the long post, but someone, sometime, might benefit from it. Possibly in 2105.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,356 ✭✭✭papu


    -snip

    This was a great post, thank you for taking the time to write it, the repercussions of getting knocked down are rarely talked about.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,757 ✭✭✭Kaisr Sose


    papu wrote: »
    This was a great post, thank you for taking the time to write it, the repercussions of getting knocked down are rarely talked about.

    It was the same for me. Accident last June. Over €2k of Med bills (and not finished), over 6 months of commuting cost and a couple of extra kg (though kept it under 70) . The unquantifiable is the countless 'lost days' feeling spaced out and weeks of dreadful sleep. You can't put a price on quality sleep!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,021 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    Has anybody else noticed pedestrians standing with their feet over the curb? It seems to be something a lot of recent immigrants people do but overall more and more people are doing it. It just seems people are forgetting the basics of crossing roads. I have seen people slip doing it too and it makes me very nervous at certain spots.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,170 ✭✭✭✭ED E


    It did get the "fear" PTSD stylie. That's why I go cycling at stupid O'clock when I can, rather than commute to work, which I did a lot.
    It cause me a huge amount of mental anguish, as I am not prone to be afraid or cowardly. I was gifted with the "stupid" gene which overrides things like that.


    The road I was hit on is near the parents place. Five years later and I still get off onto the footpath rather than await the right turn. Really doesn't leave you.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭Chuchote


    Coming around a corner yesterday (turning right across a T junction. I'd finished the turn and was going straight when a taxi came up behind me, also turning and passed within about 30cm, and onwards to stop in a queue for a red light.

    I went up beside him and knocked gently on the driver's side window, and he wound it down, looking nervous.

    "I'm sure you didn't mean to, but you came awfully close to me back there."

    "Where? I didn't even see you!" He looked genuinely horrified.

    I waved my large and bizarre hi-viz gilet. "Look at all my hi-viz! You didn't see me! Back at the corner there. You came around this close. I'm sure you didn't mean to, but…"

    "I didn't see you at all!"

    We parted friends; he's still trying to puzzle out how Scotty beamed me into the road.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,917 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    Even if it doesn't result in significant changes to driver behaviour, the campaign could at least create a discourse whereby cyclist safety is at the centre of the discussion. The current debate needs to change drastically from drivers v cyclists, to cyclists being vulnerable road users who are in significantly more danger from drivers than vice versa.

    Sorry, Arcade_Tryer, didn't notice your reply till now.

    I think people are quite aware already that cyclists are vulnerable. The hatred directed towards cyclists is mostly a way of rationalising awful behaviour, rather than generating the awful behaviour, which arises really from impatience and a sense of entitlement.

    I'm not saying that no campaign can help with this issue, but a campaign showing cyclists being run over will just result in people giving up cycling.

    Telling people that they'll gradually sink into ill health if they don't eat right doesn't work. Nor do appeals to the young to give up smoking. They lack immediacy and viscerality. But graphically showing cyclists getting butchered will reduce the number of cyclists being killed on the road ... by persuading a large number of cyclists to find an alternative mode of transport.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,942 ✭✭✭Danbo!


    Had some absolute lunatic in a Mercedes Vito tailgate and flash me today while I was driving. I came up behind 3 lads out for a spin. Was waiting to round a slight bend so I could see ahead and give them enough clearance, but the guy in the merc obviously thought different and was gesturing for me to hurry up. He went absolutely berserk when he got alongside me at a roundabout. Said to the wife "how could you get that stressed waiting 20 seconds, especially on a day with weather like this".

    Then some f**k nipped into a parking space I was waiting on and she had to remind me what I had said 10 minutes earlier :D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 919 ✭✭✭Danjamin1


    Cycling to work in Dublin this morning, it's really hard to see how people can have such a blinkered view to rulebreaking on the road when it comes to cyclists. Cars & bikes breaking lights in equal measure.

    Had a very near miss over the weekend, though it was in my car rather than on a bike. Was driving to Mayo and coming up to a blind bend two vehicles behind me came roaring up doing roughly 150kmh at a conservative estimate, the lead vehicle tucked in behind me but the following vehicle overtook us both on a completely blind bend at that speed. He was on the right hand side of the road going round a near 90 degree turn! This is what we share the roads with, it f**king madness!

    I think I've gotten so used to close passes on the bike I don't consider them near misses these days.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,780 ✭✭✭Pinch Flat


    Had to drive to Lough Dan on Sunday top pick up Pinch Flat junior from a cub camp. Beautiful day and roads busy with cyclists. Drove up from Kilmacanogue, heading towards Roundwood. Just after the turn for Sugar Loaf, it's a straight road with solid white lines.

    https://goo.gl/maps/93Dtfb5j5qn

    Girl in front of me in an L-plate passed an elderly cyclist at 80km/hr with literally inches to spare - drove past him as if he wasn't there. A wide open country road with no cars coming the opposite way. He was naturally furious.

    Unreal that someone learning to drive can display that level of ignorance passing a cyclist.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,017 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    Coming through Bray on Friday evening. Sitting at the crossroads, the right filter light goes on and the car beside me starts to move through the junction to go straight on. Not only has she misread the lights, but she has missed the 5 cars turning in front of her. Thankfully the van that was midturn hit the horn and she slammed on the brakes. Then sat there as cars drove around her, Eventually the light goes green but she doesn't move. So while stuck on a junction, she decides, despite her previous error, now is a good time to take out the phone and start texting furiously.

    I let a roar at her to put the phone down, she didn't, she actually just glanced up and put her head down. She eventually moved off and blocked the junction for so long that she had created a traffic jam behind her as only two other vehicles got through on green (and I was one of them).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,757 ✭✭✭Kaisr Sose


    Pinch Flat wrote: »

    Unreal that someone learning to drive can display that level of ignorance passing a cyclist.

    That's part of the problem. Driving like this is not checked early enough and becomes ingrained ...then it's a free for all. The amount of times I have seen an L or N plated car whizzing through red or turning without indication (to name just two issues) is unreal. Due to the age profile, these are a future snap shot of driving behaviour


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,006 ✭✭✭Moflojo


    Kaisr Sose wrote: »
    That's part of the problem. Driving like this is not checked early enough and becomes ingrained ...then it's a free for all. The amount of times I have seen an L or N plated car whizzing through red or turning without indication (to name just two issues) is unreal. Due to the age profile, these are a future snap shot of driving behaviour

    We have fingerprint technology for unlocking our mobile phones and the majority happily uses it for its convenience and security, whatever about the potential infringement of personal privacy.

    The same technology should be mandated for all modern cars with a view to properly regulating things like unaccompanied L and N drivers. The fingerprint of a designated Full License Holder should be required to unlock the car for the L/N driver's use.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,780 ✭✭✭Pinch Flat


    Kaisr Sose wrote: »
    That's part of the problem. Driving like this is not checked early enough and becomes ingrained ...then it's a free for all. The amount of times I have seen an L or N plated car whizzing through red or turning without indication (to name just two issues) is unreal. Due to the age profile, these are a future snap shot of driving behaviour

    Had a L-driver pop out of the traffic lane and into the free bus lane on Thursday last week, he saw the empty bus lane and went for it. Just coming to the lights Merrion Square North. Nearly hit me, as I was travelling up the bus lane. I decided to challenge him at the lights. "So when's your test". Puzzled look with a few ems and errs. Completely clueless.


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