Terrorist Attack in Manchester (Read MOD WARNING in OP Updated 24/05/2017))

Noveight · 24-05-2017 12:48AM

When I read that a person was "known to MI5 / FBI / whoever" before they carry out these attacks I always wonder to what extent did their knowledge or research reach.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 24-05-2017 12:48AM

The attitude surrounding these topics is something I find very bizarre. Today social media was rife with posts. I noticed one post from a Muslim man asking what could he do? He lived his life to the best of his ability, he goes to work, goes to the gym and comes home to his family. What more can he do?

Much like the rest of us - not much. It's not his fault, or people like hims fault but the comments underneath it was frankly insane. People apologising to this man. One woman in particular said "it's the white ones that are dangerous".

I'm sorry but no. The majority of muslims are good people but we have this weird attitude that if we question what's happening out loud we're racist, islamaphobic and far right white culturists. The only attitude that seems acceptable to have in these all too frequent occurrences resemble a battered wife, hoping that things might get better if we just love them more and make ourselves better.

We are not the ones that need to change. That 8 year old child they identified today was not the one who needed to change.

DERICKOO · 24-05-2017 12:49AM

what a lot of bollox just return to original country drop them offf . we know how don't we

Hector Bellend · 24-05-2017 12:49AM

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Since 20 pages of the 9/11 Commission Report were expunged because they implicated senior members of the House of Saud in that attack, the public has become more au fait with the Saudi funding of terror.

Selling arms to those that funded an attack on your soil, makes people start to think a little.

and the irony is that they are selling the saudis aircraft

SkepticQuark · 24-05-2017 12:50AM

DERICKOO wrote: »

what a lot of bollox just return to original country drop them offf . we know how don't we

England then?

Junkyard Tom · 24-05-2017 12:51AM

Deleted User wrote: »

Tou seem more than a bit half-hearted about it when it comes to specifics.

Forgive me. I haven't written a paper on how to tackle Islamic extremism but if I did its first paragraphs would recommend that we (the West) stop fucking shit up in the Middle East and stop siding with head-chopping, hate-spreading, Jihadi supporting regimes like Saudi Arabia.

gitzy16v · 24-05-2017 12:55AM

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Forgive me. I haven't written a paper on how to tackle Islamic extremism but if I did its first paragraphs would recommend that we (the West) stop fucking shit up in the Middle East and stop siding with head-chopping, hate-spreading, Jihadi supporting regimes like Saudi Arabia.

Sounds like a totally reasonable place to begin.
Then add in find the Saudi funded mosques and watch them like hawks.
Any sniff of extremism out of them arrest,jail or deport the culprits.

end of the road · 24-05-2017 12:56AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

we have this weird attitude that if we question what's happening out loud we're racist, islamaphobic and far right white culturists.

some of you have that attitude but many of us don't. there is nothing wrong with questioning something and you are very unlikely to be called whatever for doing so (apart from by the odd extremist) . however, when people start having a go at muslims because muslim, or start claiming about stuff being written in the quran when they haven't read it, then that sort of guff has to be challenged hard.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 24-05-2017 01:00AM

roddy15 wrote: »

England then?

Does he identify himself as British though? Don't agree pawning him off elsewhere but we're all splitting hairs pointing out he's British when there was a Lybian flag flying over the house and he's made many trips back and forth

Call Me Jimmy · 24-05-2017 01:01AM

wonderfullife wrote: »

Who is "we"?

How do "we" live our lives?

Are you talking about 'our' culture? What's our culture?

We live our lives in largely free and peaceful societies.

There's millions of Muslims in the UK born-and-bred who love their country, play sport for their country, fight and bleed for their country. Just like there's millions of Christians and millions of atheists.

No ****. That's some great info.

Who's this "we" you speak of that Radical Islamists seek to undermine the way "we" live?

Oh I see you're beginning to build up an idea that I think this is about white people verson brown people.

What I believe in is giving the threat a name (Radical Islamic Terror) and giving the threat full perspective.

Agreed.

The full perspective for the people of the UK is that over 120,000 people have died from suicide, murder, drowning, car accidents in the last 15 years. In the same period less than 80 have died at the hands of Islamic terrorists.

80 too many for sure, but get a grip on the actual perspective of the "threat they pose" to life and way of life.

The psychological affect of a car accident etc. on the population is very different to people being blown up at arbitrary places and times. It isn't just the number of people killed, hint is in the name 'terror'.

The hyperbole is nauseating and constantly used as a euphemism for people who simply want a "white country".

of course yea, your brain-cooling mechanism in action. Good luck

SkepticQuark · 24-05-2017 01:03AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Does he identify himself as British though? Don't agree pawning him off elsewhere but we're all splitting hairs pointing out he's British when there was a Lybian flag flying over the house and he's made many trips back and forth

Doesn't matter what he identifies himself as the poster said "original country", that's Manchester, UK. Whether he himself "identified" as something is irrelevant in this case, if the poster wanted to talk about people's "preferred nationality" maybe they should state as such? He was born and raised in the UK, we don't need people trying to say he could have been deported to Libya when that's not the case. How do frequent trips to your parent's place of birth suddenly change your nationality?

wonderfullife · 24-05-2017 01:10AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Does he identify himself as British though? Don't agree pawning him off elsewhere but we're all splitting hairs pointing out he's British when there was a Lybian flag flying over the house and he's made many trips back and forth

What are you suggesting?

If I put the flag of Jamaica above my house and listen to Bob Marley that I really identify as Jamaican not Irish? If I commit a crime, the Guards should deport me to Jamaica?

The reason people are pointing out he was born-and-raised in England is that there's nowhere to deport them to.

He can identify as a Klingon from Star Trek for all he wants but you can't deport him anywhere.

paleoperson · 24-05-2017 01:11AM

I don't like how the media keep referring to Ariana Grande's fans as kids and teens. Ariana is a great artist with a lot of talent, not vacuous auto-tune pop. I love some of them and they are played everywhere, she obviously has a wide appeal.

I wouldn't really go to a concert of hers, but she's definitely an amazingly talented singer up with the likes of Barbra Streisand, Celine Dion and Whitney Houston.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 24-05-2017 01:13AM

roddy15 wrote: »

Doesn't matter what he identifies himself as the poster said "original country", that's Manchester, UK. Whether he himself "identified" as something is irrelevant in this case, if the poster wanted to talk about people's "preferred nationality" maybe they should state as such? He was born and raised in the UK, we don't need people trying to say he could have been deported to Libya when that's not the case. How do frequent trips to your parent's place of birth suddenly change your nationality?

He's a citizen of the uk aka the uks problem, I'm not calling for him or anyone like him to be deported anywhere, but he didn't seem to consider himself British. There's the problem

kopite386 · 24-05-2017 01:15AM

I'm seeing on twitter that the 4th victim was 15 year old Megan Hurley and the 5th victim was 32 year old Kelly Brewster who died while shielding her niece

bodhrandude · 24-05-2017 01:16AM

What I want to note and a few posters have noted is that we have the identity of maybe two or three victims, why no more names, I understand about 59 are injured surely some more names should emerge from hospital lists.

SkepticQuark · 24-05-2017 01:18AM

bodhrandude wrote: »

What I want to note and a few posters have noted is that we have the identity of maybe two or three victims, why no more names, I understand about 59 are injured surely some more names should emerge from hospital lists.

People already noted why that could be... Protecting and respecting the privacy of victims and their families or maybe they don't have any identification yet due to injuries. Isn't really that hard to find reasons why they aren't just going "here's a list of who died".

wonderfullife · 24-05-2017 01:29AM

Call Me Jimmy wrote: »

We live our lives in largely free and peaceful societies.

The psychological affect of a car accident etc. on the population is very different to people being blown up at arbitrary places and times. It isn't just the number of people killed, hint is in the name 'terror'.

Yeah and there's over 3 million Muslims in the largely free and peaceful UK.

What effect did the terror attacks committed in the UK by Derrick Byrd, Michael Ryan and Thomas Hamilton (44 dead between the 3 of them, including 17 children) have then? I didn't see calls to lock up everyone having a mid-life crisis after Byrd snapped in 2010.

What's the difference between what Thomas Hamilton did and what Salman Abedi did?

They both targeted defenceless children and massacred them.

The only difference is one seemingly did so in the name of a religion and the other we have no clue what his problem was, other than being a fruitcake.

wonderfullife · 24-05-2017 01:36AM

bodhrandude wrote: »

What I want to note and a few posters have noted is that we have the identity of maybe two or three victims, why no more names, I understand about 59 are injured surely some more names should emerge from hospital lists.

The police will only inform family members when they are absolutely certain. It's likely most have been informed by now in private but the ones who haven't might be because the remains are too gruesome to identify and dental records and DNA profiles might be needed.

The guy from here who works in the Infirmary could speak more to it but I imagine they saw some horrific sights. I hope they get the support they need.

MontoAddict · 24-05-2017 01:41AM

wonderfullife wrote: »

The police will only inform family members when they are absolutely certain. It's likely most have been informed by now in private but the ones who haven't might be because the remains are too gruesome to identify and dental records and DNA profiles might be needed.

The guy from here who works in the Infirmary could speak more to it but I imagine they saw some horrific sights. I hope they get the support they need.

You care more about certain ethnic groups not being offended than you'll ever care about the victims.

You are part of the problem.

bodhrandude · 24-05-2017 01:48AM

MontoAddict wrote: »

You care more about certain ethnic groups not being offended than you'll ever care about the victims.

You are part of the problem.

What are you talking about, he was answering me about the victims identities and just explaining about the delay and the need for privacy for the families concerned.

wonderfullife · 24-05-2017 01:50AM

MontoAddict wrote: »

You care more about certain ethnic groups not being offended than you'll ever care about the victims.

You are part of the problem.

Yeah, I'm part of the reason why a random nutjob killed 22 young people for writing my opinion on a message board.....

I'm not going to justify that post by responding on how I feel for those kids.

As for the rest of your drivel - We've never been safer as a species. In our part of the world Ireland & the UK, terrorist attacks account for a miniscule, microscopic amount of deaths annually.

Judging by your posts you think the big bad Radical Muslims are to blame for everything.

They're not.

I also don't believe in knee-jerk hyberbolic reactions like "deport them all", "throw them all in jail" or "ban Islam".

If offering a measured opinion is part of the problem then fine.

BalcombeSt4 · 24-05-2017 01:50AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Does he identify himself as British though? Don't agree pawning him off elsewhere but we're all splitting hairs pointing out he's British when there was a Lybian flag flying over the house and he's made many trips back and forth

Yeah Lybia, a country thats been almost wiped of the map thanks to the West.

kopite386 · 24-05-2017 01:54AM

Olivia Campbell who was 15 years old confirmed dead by her mother, she was one of the missing girls, her mother had appealed for information on BBC earlier today.
I believe this takes the death toll now to 23 but I'm not sure

BalcombeSt4 · 24-05-2017 01:55AM

MontoAddict wrote: »

You care more about certain ethnic groups not being offended than you'll ever care about the victims.

You are part of the problem.

It's because of right-wing nutters like you these people get the support they need to carry out terrorist acts.

retro:electro · 24-05-2017 01:59AM

paleoperson wrote: »

I don't like how the media keep referring to Ariana Grande's fans as kids and teens. Ariana is a great artist with a lot of talent, not vacuous auto-tune pop. I love some of them and they are played everywhere, she obviously has a wide appeal.

I wouldn't really go to a concert of hers, but she's definitely an amazingly talented singer up with the likes of Barbra Streisand, Celine Dion and Whitney Houston.

Yes you're right. This is the real issue that the media needs to be addressing. Shame on them.

bodhrandude · 24-05-2017 02:00AM

Fourth victim identified 32 year Kelly Brewster, died shielding her 11 year old niece from the blast, god rest her soul. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3633408/manchester-arena-bomb-victims-aunt/

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 24-05-2017 02:04AM

BalcombeSt4 wrote: »

Yeah Lybia, a country thats been almost wiped of the map thanks to the West.

I'm sure that's a great comfort to 22 families, that their child's life was taken because lybia feels like the west should pay. Nice victim blaming there

kopite386 · 24-05-2017 02:04AM

Alison Howe another who was missing has been confirmed as dead by her step-daughter. She was just there to pick her kids up from the concert

**I'm finding all this information on twitter if people would rather I didn't post this then please let me know and I won't post any more

BalcombeSt4 · 24-05-2017 02:18AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

I'm sure that's a great comfort to 22 families, that their child's life was taken because lybia feels like the west should pay. Nice victim blaming there

Yeah I'm victiming blaming because I really believe it was little small kids in Manchester fault that Hilary Clinton was a bloody thirsty maniac who wanted to blow up some other small kids in another part of the world. :rolleyes:

And unlike you I'm not trying to get on my high horse, pretending to comfort people (who obviously wont be reading this thread anyway) I want to find actual solutions to problems so we can solve this mess and stop it from happening over & over & over again once and for all.

Maybe if you chancers were able to shed your crocodile tears for some brown skined children as well.

Terrorist Attack in Manchester (Read MOD WARNING in OP Updated 24/05/2017))

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