Terrorist Attack in Manchester (Read MOD WARNING in OP Updated 24/05/2017))

munsterlegend · 23-05-2017 02:30PM

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Ive been able to listen to some of the continuous coverage on BBC radio 5 live and some of the stories of bravery by people both young and old would warm your heart.

Even the presenters who are normally very professional are chocking up. I think it's because five live is based in Manchester is the reason.

Every parents worst nightmare losing a child in such a barbaric way. Your child is supposed to go to a concert have fun and come home alive.

Pretzill · 23-05-2017 02:30PM

Shurimgreat wrote: »

I'm not buying "Muslim is the religion of peace" thing. Its not. From the off it was drenched in the blood of innocent unarmed civilians who refused to convert.

I think muslims in general need to take a good hard look at their religion, its blood soaked history, and question whether its something that needs reform or whose significance should be relegated to the fringes of their life as has happened with Christianity in modern Europe.

Its long past time for a Muslim enlightenment.

There was a very good documentary on last week on C4 about ISIS and how they are interpreting their version of Islam - blood thirsty ****ers - reigniting hate from centuries ago.

Awful atrocity in Manchester last night. I don't know what can be done to stop this sort of terrorist. People draw conclusion with IRA atrocities and any terrorist attack is unforgivable but that's over now - how long will this sh*t continue for and where will the next ****er strike?

Captain Obvious · 23-05-2017 02:30PM

Oh right. So we will leave them be and when the next attack occurs we will hear that line again "the attacker was on our terrorist watch list"

That's just going between two extremes and ignoring all the middleground

Podge_irl · 23-05-2017 02:31PM

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

Oh right. So we will leave them be and when the next attack occurs we will hear that line again "the attacker was on our terrorist watch list"

For all you know there are thousands upon thousands of people on the watchlist who never do anything.

Clearly more can be done, but mass imprisonment without trial does not exactly have a great track record of being useful for anything.

iLikeWaffles · 23-05-2017 02:32PM

Shurimgreat wrote: »

I'm not buying "Muslim is the religion of peace" thing. Its not. From the off it was drenched in the blood of innocent unarmed civilians who refused to convert.

I think muslims in general need to take a good hard look at their religion, its blood soaked history, and question whether its something that needs reform or whose significance should be relegated to the fringes of their life as has happened with Christianity in modern Europe.

Its long past time for a Muslim enlightenment.

You're absolutely kidding yourself if you think Christianity is not "blood soaked". We're still all human, it is down to the individual and the op as an individual has just said what he/she believes.

end of the road · 23-05-2017 02:32PM

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Liberal lefties would be outraged at that and it would become their latest cause to protest and fight for.

by "liberal lefties" you mean "people who believe in actual law and order and justice"
damn right i would fight against people being jailed just because. if you need to jail people for commiting a crime, you do it properly. you gather the evidence and you bring it before the courts where one is tried via a judge and jury.

Shurimgreat wrote: »

You can mass murder all you like, but you can't infringe the rights of terrorists.

no, you can't mass murder. it is illegal thankfully. correct you can't infringe people's rights, as once you start on people you don't like such as suspected terrorists, that eventually extends to you and me. i can tell you, i am not having my rights infringed to protect me from a nut who might want to blow up wherever.

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Another reason why the UK are leaving Europe I suggest, so they can strip many of the rights of would be terrorists and their sympathisers.

and the british people as a whole in some cases. the extreme element of those who voted for brexit wouldn't exactly be in favour of human rights for anyone bar themselves, with calls to kill the people who don't agree with them for apparently being a "traitor" being quite common.
sadly for them, and thankfully for everyone else, leaving the EU won't allow that to happen. if they do a trade deal with europe, they will have to abide by the rules of the EU regardless of whether they are in it or not.

Somedude9 wrote: »

Innocent my ****

that's not an answer. what if an innocent person is added to the list?

SkepticQuark · 23-05-2017 02:32PM

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

Oh right. So we will leave them be and when the next attack occurs we will hear that line again "the attacker was on our terrorist watch list"

Can you and some other people stop doing that? Advocating executing people on a watch list then when people say that's a bad idea the response is "Oh you don't want to do anything so!!!" Where did he say that?

Somedude9 · 23-05-2017 02:35PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Please, don't be.

You are not responsible for what other people do.
Anymore than those who died or were injured last night were responsible for whatever grievance/perceived grievance the attacker was responding to.(Since none of us know yet why exactly he carried out the attack. We may have a broad idea, but we do not know his precise personal thoughts on the issue).

Grievance? Would you feck off! I find your post offensive. Spare your sympathy for the murdered innocents.

Shurimgreat · 23-05-2017 02:37PM

iLikeWaffles wrote: »

You're absolutely kidding yourself if you think Christianity is not "blood soaked". We're still all human, it is down to the individual and the op as an individual has just said what he believes.

I never said Christianity wasn't blood soaked. Thankfully the west has moved on and religion is no longer the prime mover in the majority of people's lives. Until the same happens for Islam, the cycle of violence and death will continue endlessly, with each faction trying to impose its own twisted version on the other.

23-05-2017 02:39PM

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

I don't think people get added to these things for running red lights.

In saying that I'd accept a very low rate of casualty due to people being innocent on the list.

I'd tolerate this over bombers targeting children at mass gatherings.

Your name was enough to get you watched back then, and it would be the same now if we were to go "all out", if not worse, with trees coming from all communications accounts.

munsterlegend · 23-05-2017 02:39PM

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

Oh right. So we will leave them be and when the next attack occurs we will hear that line again "the attacker was on our terrorist watch list"

There is no 100% solution to extremism but that does not mean you make things worse with failed policies from the past. intelligence usually works and that is not leaving them be but monitoring their activity including online, travel etc

alchemist33 · 23-05-2017 02:41PM

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

There was security outside the concert hall but none at the front door. People (including waiting parents and the killer) were free to go into the lobby which was where the bomb went off.

MayoSalmon · 23-05-2017 02:46PM

Billy86 wrote: »

You do realise the attacker was apparently born and raised in Britain, right?

Link?

FAILSAFE 00 · 23-05-2017 02:47PM

munsterlegend wrote: »

There is no 100% solution to extremism but that does not mean you make things worse with failed policies from the past. intelligence usually works and that is not leaving them be but monitoring their activity including online, travel etc

Intelligence didn't work last night.

You cannot beat extremists any other way unfortunately. Imprisoning them just invites more acts of terror from other extremists.

To be clear I am talking about people the police know to be terrorists but cannot prove it in a court of law.

jmayo · 23-05-2017 02:48PM

seamus wrote: »

This. The Sun and the Daily Mail and all the other rags have played a huge part in stoking up these attacks. Between their constant anti-immigrant hate and their 50-page pullouts profiling every terrorist or potential terrorist, all they're doing is lining up 100 other young men who now idolise and seek to emulate the attackers.

So you are blaming the Sun and the Mail for some ar**hole deciding to slaughter a bunch of concert goers, some of which were young kids.

You really are a prime example of how fooked up one side of this debate is.
You appear to think if we all play nicely nicely and god forbid say anything bad against one section of the community who believe in one sky fairy then everything will be alright.

Tell you what lets change the freedom of speech laws, lets not allow political or religious satire, lets not even allow anyone tell a joke that lampoons anyone.

Sure why stop there, lets ban anything they might disagree with.
Lets ban women doing stuff, lets ban women wearing provocative clothes, lets ban alcohol.
Fook it lets all convert to their brand of sky fairy and they will then leave us alone.

seamus wrote: »

In the same way that excessive reporting on suicides leads to more suicides, excessive reporting on terror attacks inspires more terror attacks.

Did you ever live in Rotterham ?
Lets not mention the muslim pakistani rape gangs because it might encourage others to join ehhh.

seamus wrote: »

If the media went down the route of factual reporting on the incident rather than wallowing in the misery porn, "BREAKING" nonsense and reporting every bit of idle gossip, then they would be doing a valuable service in reducing the likelihood of these attacks.

As it stands, the British tabloids are complicit in these attacks, practically willing them on in order to sell more papers.

Talk about a distorted view of the world.
Blame everyone bar the scum that did it.

FrancieBrady wrote: »

There are a lot of people mixing up 'revenge' with 'a solution'.

There will be no solution to this until we remove or dilute the motivations to attack.
We the Irish should know this, THIS is what we have learned. Remove or dilute the cause of conflict and you can build peace.
The shame is that western governments, (those actively engaged and with the power) will again not realise this until many many people are needlessly dead.

And in the meantime what would you do with the thousands of would be mass murderers that are "known to authorities" throughout Europe ?

So far we have dozens of victims to terrorists which had already appeared on the radar of the security services.

Interment is the solution to that and some day you will realise it.

neverever1 wrote: »

But what have Sweden got to do with it? You don't know where this bomber is from or his motives remember?

neverever1 wrote: »

The problem is that Britain has not just bombed one country, it's many!

Pointing out why this attack happened is not an agenda!

An again we will ask who exactly did Sweden bomb to justify the attack they had in Stockholm.
You do remember the young biy that was slaughtered there ?

RockSalto · 23-05-2017 02:49PM

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

Intelligence didn't work last night.

You cannot beat extremists any other way unfortunately. Imprisoning them just invites more acts of terror from other extremists.

To be clear I am talking about people the police know to be terrorists but cannot prove it in a court of law.

So you'd be happy to be executed for the greater good if you were on it?

Captain Obvious · 23-05-2017 02:49PM

To be clear I am talking about people the police know to be terrorists but cannot prove it in a court of law.

Because police never make a mistake.

FAILSAFE 00 · 23-05-2017 02:50PM

RockSalto wrote: »

So you'd be happy to be executed for the greater good if you were on it?

I wouldn't be on it.

pjohnson · 23-05-2017 02:52PM

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

Intelligence didn't work last night.

You cannot beat extremists any other way unfortunately. Imprisoning them just invites more acts of terror from other extremists.

To be clear I am talking about people the police know to be terrorists but cannot prove it in a court of law.

Yes but if it cant be proved in court you'll have people claiming it infringes these innocent peoples human rights. These people are only allowed be called guilty after they are dead. Until then they are innocent.

Captain Obvious · 23-05-2017 02:52PM

I wouldn't be on it.

You've advocated the murder of innocent people. Of course you'd be on it.

RockSalto · 23-05-2017 02:53PM

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

I don't think people get added to these things for running red lights.

In saying that I'd accept a very low rate of casualty due to people being innocent on the list.

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

I wouldn't be on it.

Does this ring any bells for you?

So you've just said you'd accept a low rate of casualties due to innocent people finding themselves on this list.

So, assuming you were one, from what you've just said and what I've now pointed out to you, you would be OK being executed for your cause.

HigginsJ · 23-05-2017 02:53PM

Sky News are reporting that IS are claiming responsibility for the attack and that the terrorist who carried it out was one of their members. Hope they and all their kind are pleased that they managed to kill 22 people including an 8 year old girl, I'm sure she was a real affront to their ****ing beliefs.

The authorities need to be given carte blanche and **** due process for anyone who is on any of these lists or known to them, **** whatever rights they might think they have.

I am so angry :mad: There is no reason, cause, justification, excuse or whatever for acts like this, these people don't give a ****.

DrumSteve · 23-05-2017 02:54PM

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

I wouldn't be on it.

How are you so sure?

sjb25 · 23-05-2017 02:54PM

Yeah no what all our petty squabbling here doesn't matter a sh1t no matter which side of the argument you are on this is what matters absolutely terrible and anybody who had anything to do with it needs to be hunted down

munsterlegend · 23-05-2017 02:55PM

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

I wouldn't be on it.

Police could have suspicions because your friends with someone on Facebook or social media. That doesn't make everyone a terrorist has connections with is also a terrorist.

LincolnsBeard · 23-05-2017 02:56PM

Western Europe is finished.

This problem is going to be exacerbated over the coming generations.

I feel like the majority of people in this thread have absolutely no idea what the reality of the situation is. Everybody seems completely ignorant to it.

I would love to hear your advice on how we get more integration in areas like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zD4mZyEoePo

Take a walk around parts of the UK and there's no way you can be surprised that every once in a while you get a Jihadist that tries to mass murder people.

Every week on the news there is a story about some plot to murder people that is foiled by Mi5. This is one of the ones that seems to have succeeded because, despite being identified as a threat, the individual in question was no longer being monitored by the security services. It's literally impossible to monitor all threats.

Eventually they will begin to succeed because we will become demoralised. As this demographic grows, people will flee.

Captain Obvious · 23-05-2017 02:58PM

IS would claim responsibility for the weather if it killed enough people. They are a symptom of Islamic extremism, not the cause.

FAILSAFE 00 · 23-05-2017 02:58PM

RockSalto wrote: »

Does this ring any bells for you?

So you've just said you'd accept a low rate of casualties due to innocent people finding themselves on this list.

So, assuming you were one, from what you've just said and what I've now pointed out to you, you would be OK being executed for your cause.

I wouldn't be on it.

Innocent people could be unfortunately caught in the crossfire or be on list due to having associated with known terrorists.

I am simply being a realist. You'll always unfortunately have civilian casualties however I accept that rather than having children killed due to terror watch list suspects falling though the cracks.

Quazzie · 23-05-2017 03:00PM

LincolnsBeard wrote: »

Western Europe is finished.

This problem is going to be exacerbated over the coming generations.

I feel like the majority of people in this thread have absolutely no idea what the reality of the situation is. Everybody seems completely ignorant to it.

I would love to hear your advice on how we get more integration in areas like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zD4mZyEoePo

Take a walk around parts of the UK and there's no way you can be surprised that every once in a while you get a Jihadist that tries to mass murder people.

Every week on the news there is a story about some plot to murder people that is foiled by Mi5. This is one of the ones that seems to have succeeded because, despite being identified as a threat, the individual in question was no longer being monitored by the security services. It's literally impossible to monitor all threats.

Eventually they will begin to succeed because we will become demoralised. As this demographic grows, people will flee.

Sure there is marching like that up the north fairly regularly. Why is it different because muslims did it one 2 years ago?

El Weirdo · 23-05-2017 03:00PM

FAILSAFE 00 wrote: »

I wouldn't be on it.

How do you know you wouldn't be on it?

Terrorist Attack in Manchester (Read MOD WARNING in OP Updated 24/05/2017))

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