Brexit: The Last Stand (No name calling)

Fratton Fred wrote: »

The thing is, it isn't criticism, it's childish finger-pointing. You seem to think that the eu is beyond reproach and any idea that us has its faults is just stupid colonialism.

The eu is a great idea, but badly executed and has left a lot of people all over Europe feeling alienated. The eu is just as much to blame for Brexit as Nigel Farage and unless it changes, Britain will be the first of many.

I have said several times that the EU is not perfect.
We are discussing Britain exiting the EU not the EU per se.

If you think Brexit (which is voluntary) will have negative effects then it would be sensible to assume that you would be critical of those who choose to do it.

But not in Fred's world it seems, so there must be another reason.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

I am critical of a lot of people who voted to leave, for sure. But let's be honest here, you're not critical of the people who voted to leave, your only reason for posting on this thread is to constantly belittle Britain and the British.

I posted a link on the last thread about self employed people in the UK earning the lowest they have done since 1995. A significant reason for this is an influx of cheap labour (Polish Plumbers syndrome) from eastern Europe. If you were a self employed builder and you'd seen your earning potential decline significantly over the years and you were given an opportunity to change it, what would you do? Is that being a little Englander (a term you love throwing around) or is it just self preservation?

Can you try and answer this question without trying to claim the UK is going bust, isn't one of the world's biggest economies, that the Royal Navy is useless and that the Falklands belongs to Argentina?

Can you stop exaggerating in your overweening defence? (Do you seriously think that nobody has noticed how you operate on the site? You haven't criticised a British action since 1066 and like Mary constantly demean Ireland in your defence)
1. Nobody anywhere on the thread has claimed Britain is going bust.
2. Little Englanders exist in large numbers, you only have to look at Question Time last week to see a BBC studio full of them.
3. The Royal Navy is seriously depleted from what it was, is seriously underfunded and no amount of huffing is going to change that. It's future ability to maintain British power is a factor in the decision they are making.

To answer your question, the unemployed builder's lot is not going to change by Brexiting and will likely get worse.
They were lied to and a Tory government and establishment was too busy trying to survive politically to disabuse anybody of that notion.

My beef/reason for posting is with British governments and their influence on us. I don't 'hate' anyone.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Further proof that shinners should not attempt economics.

Poor ol' Fred finds it difficult to take that Britain is no longer one of the big boys.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

So no then, you can't answer the question without slipping in to little irelander mode.

I told you why giving the 'unemployed builder' a free pass for a xenophobic act (blaming Polish workers for his plight) was wrong. And why that builder was decieved.

What is Little Irelander about that? Are 'wrong' unemployed builders automatically right now?

Fratton Fred wrote: »

http://www.europeangeostrategy.org/2014/01/european-geostrategy-audit-major-powers-worlds-fifteen-most-powerful-countries-2014/

It must be hard for a Little Irelander to read that.

The comments are hilarious, they are trying to figure out ways to make the British a Super Power.
Is that you asking about aircraft carriers Fred?

Even the BBC are questioning the role and position of Britain, talking about the exact same things (That Fred likes to call 'Little Irelander' in the same way) But let an Irish person do it in the context of a debate on Brexit which affects us all... :eek:

Is the UK's role on the world stage a decades-long story of managed decline, including the orderly withdrawal from a once vast empire?
Or is it the story of a medium-sized power whose standing in the world reflects the new global reality?

Those on this side of the argument - let's call them the foreign policy activists - believe this strength is now slowly eroding and that we are witnessing a clear decline in the UK's standing, a nation, they say, ghosting into the shadows.
Everywhere across the globe, as the crises and wars multiply, the UK is reduced to being a bit-part player.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-32317703

A Little Pony wrote: »

I actually thank Hitler for being possibly the most incompetent military leader in history.

There were a couple of British generals in WWI who'd give him a run for his money.

Fratton Fred wrote:

I know the little irelanders .

Wtf is this sh1te?

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

There were a couple of British generals in WWI who'd give him a run for his money.

This is the kind of remark that I'd say Fred was referring to.
Why reference WW1?
Or British generals, specifically?
The thread title is there, at the top of each page.
References to colonial and imperial history, military might, or the lack therof, have little direct bearing on Brexit.

maryishere wrote: »

Correct. The solution was for the paramilitaries to stop bombing and shooting, and to have their arms and semtex put beyond their use. Only the state retained their arms, as in all other democratic countries.


Elections were held in the seventies and eighties too, but Sinn Fein could not even get an MP elected until the eighties, such was their lack of support. When it abandoned its support for the "armed struggle" , it main electoral gains north and south. Parties that do not support paramilitaries are welcomed to share power in N.I., even if some southern parties would still refuse to share power with S.F.

Paramilitaries are a symptom of the problem Mary.
The solution was power-sharing. The problem was a one sided sectarian state.

It's basic stuff really.