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Group of men in Dublin cause outrage by wearing blackface

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Comments

  • #92
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    Irish people consume(d) English media, do you really need a link to be provided for that? There was even a bloody Lyons tea advert.

    What does 'our history of black face' even mean? That for someone to feel offended (or something to be deemed racist) that the nation must have had some documented past relating to it?

    So that's a no to providing a history of black face grand so.

    Grand so, we can all be as racist as we like because no link was provided!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoYOraDt1_k

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gF1tWzItnvM


  • #93
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    Irish people consume(d) English media, do you really need a link to be provided for that? There was even a bloody Lyons tea advert.

    What does 'our history of black face' even mean? That for someone to feel offended (or something to be deemed racist) that the nation must have had some documented past relating to it?


    the lady who posted on twitter has the right to take offence. Just like the people who read that post have the right to think thats its all nonsense.

    I don't disagree.


  • #94
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,963 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    Both. I don't think I'd take kindly to something telling me I shouldn't feel offended by something.

    Feel free to be offended. Nobody is telling you what you should feel.
    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    And blackface is racist.

    you think its racist. you dont get to make that decision for everybody else.


  • #95
    pq0n1ct4ve8zf5
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,070 ✭✭✭✭pq0n1ct4ve8zf5


    The_Valeyard wrote: »
    Nothing racist or wrong with people dressing up as characters from a film, show, etc.


    Otherwise I will be outraged and triggered when a black person dresses up as Albert Einstein or Captain Kirk, bla, bla, bla.

    People just look for reasons to be offended the get attention online.
    riffmongous wrote: »
    But you can see some lads clearly didn't dress up beyond the blackface

    Yeah see, if a black person dressed up as Albert Einstein, they'd probably go for his mad hair, a lab coat, the stache, individual distinctive features and we'd all understand the costume fine. But when a white person goes to dress up as a specific black person and just goes "what's this individual's distinguishing features...oh I know, their funny black skin, that'll do, costume complete". It's perfectly possible to dress up as a person of a different race and leave your damn skin alone, if not, your costume skills are shít.

    Hilarious jokes about the film White Girls incoming in 3,2,1...


  • #96
    aaron77a
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 44 ✭aaron77a


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    I don't think blackface stops being offensive when you leave the USofA.

    Well the US had slavery and oppressed black people for years what has the Irish ever done to anybody? I think most black people know the difference, they don’t need upper class snobs telling them when they should be offended.


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  • #97
    Me_Grapes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 350 ✭✭Me_Grapes


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    And blackface is racist.

    It is, is it?

    Are people who dress up as Spiderman arachnophobic as well?


  • #98
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/creepypasta/images/7/7d/Blackface.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20120115051854

    Must have missed them in the picture.
    What's your point?


  • #99
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    aaron77a wrote: »
    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    I don't think blackface stops being offensive when you leave the USofA.

    Well the US had slavery and oppressed black people for years what has the Irish ever done to anybody? I think most black people know the difference, they don t need upper class snobs telling them when they should be offended.

    "A 2008 EU-MIDIS survey of attitudes to minorities in the 27 EU States found that Ireland had the most racist attitudes to Afro-Europeans in the entire EU" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_Europe#Ireland

    You are able to think for most 'black people'?

    And while we're throwing ad-hominem classist slurs "we don't need lower class illiterates being racist" etc.


  • #100
    old_aussie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,409 ✭✭✭old_aussie


    Was one the blokes doing the blackface named Al?

    Al Jolson that is.


  • #101
    Samaris
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,544 ✭✭✭Samaris


    If it was just the guys dressing up as the Jamaican bobsled team (and leaving why the hell were they dressing up as the JBT anyway?), yeah, fine, it's a bit daft to get too wound up over it.

    A number of the group weren't, they were just in blackface. And one can argue that well, we don't have the shared American history of treating black people poorly (barring the first generation Irish-American police over there back in that period), so we shouldn't import their sensibilities.

    Except blackface as a thing is also American. So we can import a dumbass (and yes, pretty racist) American joke here and use it, but the connotations should stay put because we're not American? I hate to Godwin here, but you wouldn't get away with wandering around with a swastika on your back ("but I'm not German so it's not a statement! I just wanted to wear a swastika!") using that excuse.

    Yeah, PC can go too far, but people can also be twaddocks. Absolutely do not care if they get called out for being idiots. They are idiots.

    I suppose at least they weren't dressed as ******-minstrels (the old term for blackface, which tended to also have exaggerated lipstick).


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  • #102
    aaron77a
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 44 ✭aaron77a


    Samaris wrote: »
    If it was just the guys dressing up as the Jamaican bobsled team (and leaving why the hell were they dressing up as the JBT anyway?), yeah, fine, it's a bit daft to get too wound up over it.

    A number of the group weren't, they were just in blackface. And one can argue that well, we don't have the shared American history of treating black people poorly (barring the first generation Irish-American police over there back in that period), so we shouldn't import their sensibilities.

    Except blackface as a thing is also American. So we can import a dumbass (and yes, pretty racist) American joke here and use it, but the connotations should stay put because we're not American? I hate to Godwin here, but you wouldn't get away with wandering around with a swastika on your back ("but I'm not German so it's not a statement! I just wanted to wear a swastika!") using that excuse.

    Yeah, PC can go too far, but people can also be twaddocks. Absolutely do not care if they get called out for being idiots. They are idiots.

    I suppose at least they weren't dressed as ******-minstrels (the old term for blackface, which tended to also have exaggerated lipstick).

    It's what the swastika stands for its completely different.


  • #103
    aaron77a
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 44 ✭aaron77a


    When did I say I can think for black people what are you talking about? That link means nothing to what I was talking about


  • #104
    The Backwards Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,299 ✭✭✭✭The Backwards Man


    aaron77a wrote: »
    It's what the swastika stands for its completely different.

    It's what it's associated with that causes problems, not what it stands for.


  • #105
    Samaris
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,544 ✭✭✭Samaris


    aaron77a wrote: »
    It's what the swastika stands for its completely different.

    Yeees, useful that, isn't it?

    So, the swastika stands for the denigration of the lesser races (primarily Jews, but also applied to non-Aryans), the upholding of the Great White Race, and approval of the methods used to eliminate the undesirables, and those connotations hold true whether the wearer is German or Irish, that about sum it up?*

    Blackface, however, despite being traditionally used to mock and denigrate second-class citizens (well, barely citizens at all, one fifth of a citizen to be precise), to exaggerate their features to caricatures and then to dance around acting the moron "because black people are funny, lol!" has no connotations whatsoever nowadays, because we're Irish.

    It's not quite as bad as the old traditional blackface as they don't appear to have been hooting like monkeys at least, but it's a nasty little callback to history and I can only assume it must be rather uncomfortable to many black people walking past who have no idea if these guys are just having a laugh with no offense meant, or if this is a new paradigm here, that they are a target for mockery.

    In short, they're still idiots, and it was an incredibly childish activity.

    *To anyone considering the eejit card; no, I am not calling these guys Nazis. Try to keep up.


  • #106
    Hans Bricks
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 850 ✭✭✭Hans Bricks


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    "A 2008 EU-MIDIS survey of attitudes to minorities in the 27 EU States found that Ireland had the most racist attitudes to Afro-Europeans in the entire EU" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_Europe#Ireland

    You are able to think for most 'black people'?

    And while we're throwing ad-hominem classist slurs "we don't need lower class illiterates being racist" etc.

    Yawn.

    Some of you would make a hobby from crying on behalf of black people. Between this and the BLM thread. Jesus


  • #107
    pq0n1ct4ve8zf5
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,070 ✭✭✭✭pq0n1ct4ve8zf5


    aaron77a wrote: »
    It's what the swastika stands for its completely different.

    Blackface was used as a tool and a medium of systemic racism, and it outlasted the third reich by some margin, how is it completely different?

    Look at how it's used here, in a film the then President called 'terribly true', I think this was actually the first film to be screened at the White House (heh). Bunch of black maniacs getting all rapey to the white women, like they do, til the Klu Klux Klan rides in to save the day.



  • #108
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    aaron77a wrote: »
    When did I say I can think for black people what are you talking about? That link means nothing to what I was talking about

    You said that you think most 'black people' know the difference. I was wondering whether you thought you were able to think for most 'black people'?

    The link was to demonstrate that the Irish are in fact the most racist in the EU, and that having men blackface-ing in public, in Ireland, could be understood by 'black people' to be offensive/racist/threatening (etc) and that just because we have direct documented history to a person donning a face of black paint and comically(!) portraying the stereotypes of 'black people', it can still be offensive/racist/threatening.


  • #109
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    Hans Bricks wrote: »
    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    "A 2008 EU-MIDIS survey of attitudes to minorities in the 27 EU States found that Ireland had the most racist attitudes to Afro-Europeans in the entire EU" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_Europe#Ireland

    You are able to think for most 'black people'?

    And while we're throwing ad-hominem classist slurs "we don't need lower class illiterates being racist" etc.

    Yawn.

    Some of you would make a hobby from crying on behalf of black people. Between this and the BLM thread. Jesus

    "...on behalf of black people"?


  • #110
    Samaris
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,544 ✭✭✭Samaris


    Hans Bricks wrote: »
    Yawn.

    Some of you would make a hobby from crying on behalf of black people. Between this and the BLM thread. Jesus

    There's also a systemic and nasty strain of xenophobia creeping in. I know, I know, I'm a horrible PC person trying to cut down your rights to be a dick when you feel like it. But it was visible in the BLM thread too.

    It's funny, really. In a "sigh" way rather than a lol way. Started with the Muslims, and a certain sector thinking "hm, how much can I get away with here.." and now it's moving onto black people. I put it down primarily to a swing towards hard-right politics* brought on by the migrant situation and the recession. It will swing back again in another generation or so, it just sucks for people nowadays who get to see this ****.

    *NOT right-wing, HARD-right, there's a difference.


    But in short, one has the right to be a dick to whoever they like. Anyone else has the right to call them on it. And frankly, I'd prefer to be judged as too liberal than a bigot.

    Also, who the hell NEEDS to dress in blackface anyway? I mean, what possible benefit does it bring them?


  • #111
    Your Face
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,275 ✭✭✭Your Face


    Did anyone talk to Joe?


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  • #112
    Maximus Alexander
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,080 ✭✭✭✭Maximus Alexander


    Your Face wrote: »
    Did anyone talk to Joe?

    The story came from Joe.


  • #113
    pq0n1ct4ve8zf5
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,070 ✭✭✭✭pq0n1ct4ve8zf5


    Samaris wrote: »

    Also, who the hell NEEDS to dress in blackface anyway? I mean, what possible benefit does it bring them?

    You know when children are very small and you're supposed to praise them for good behaviour, make sure they get enough attention in general and not reinforce bad behaviour like swearing with freaking out about it? If you don't do that, they grow up unable to properly distinguish between good attention and bad attention, they think getting any attention means they're doing something right. Pretty high risk they'll spend their school years sitting down the back making fart noises and calling the girls they fancy sluts and pushing them over, and their adulthood thinking those glances they get when they're roaring and necking pints at 12 in the day means people think they're #madbastards and the reaction they get to going about in blackface means they're well edgy and sticking it to the PC brigade.

    That's my theory anyways


  • #114
    Happyilylost
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,893 ✭✭✭Happyilylost


    What's the rule on Black People dressing as white people for a costume? Can I dress up as a Fly without upsetting the fly population? Is it possible to do anything on this planet without offending someone? I would think not. I think everything would be better off if we go chase Pokemon in the sun..... hmm maybe the Pokemon don't like being chased. I wonder has a study being done to consider the Pokemon feelings on this situation. I must post a "rant" on Facebook to see what the world thinks.


  • #115
    Dyr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    Aye, those Leprechauns really suffered under the oppressive fist of the white man.

    Do you seen any leprechauns around now?

    Anyway the point being the whole leprachaun thing is actually based on an irish stereotype and the irish suffered a plenty under the english

    But you know, it's just a costume usually, not really a big deal.


  • #116
    Venom
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,984 ✭✭✭Venom


    HensVassal wrote: »
    A white and a black guy could don suits and wigs and toy guns and go to a dress up party as Vince and Jules from Pulp Fiction, but if a white guy tried to black up and imporsonate Jules he'd look ridiculous.

    Robert Downey Jr in Tropic Thunder invalidates that statement.



  • #117
    Venom
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,984 ✭✭✭Venom


    Happyilylost wrote: »
    What's the rule on Black People dressing as white people for a costume? Can I dress up as a Fly without upsetting the fly population? Is it possible to do anything on this planet without offending someone? I would think not. I think everything would be better off if we go chase Pokemon in the sun..... hmm maybe the Pokemon don't like being chased. I wonder has a study being done to consider the Pokemon feelings on this situation. I must post a "rant" on Facebook to see what the world thinks.

    Anita Sarkeesian’s gob****e ex-botfriend has already likened Pokemon Go to dog fighting! Not saying its the usual SWJ's being offended by everything under the sun but yeah it is :rolleyes:

    https://heatst.com/tech/5-reasons-why-pokemon-go-must-be-stopped/


  • #118
    Hans Bricks
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 850 ✭✭✭Hans Bricks


    Samaris wrote: »
    There's also a systemic and nasty strain of xenophobia creeping in. I know, I know, I'm a horrible PC person trying to cut down your rights to be a dick when you feel like it. But it was visible in the BLM thread too.

    It's funny, really. In a "sigh" way rather than a lol way. Started with the Muslims, and a certain sector thinking "hm, how much can I get away with here.." and now it's moving onto black people. I put it down primarily to a swing towards hard-right politics* brought on by the migrant situation and the recession. It will swing back again in another generation or so, it just sucks for people nowadays who get to see this ****.

    *NOT right-wing, HARD-right, there's a difference.


    But in short, one has the right to be a dick to whoever they like. Anyone else has the right to call them on it. And frankly, I'd prefer to be judged as too liberal than a bigot.

    Also, who the hell NEEDS to dress in blackface anyway? I mean, what possible benefit does it bring them?

    I can't imagine there's any political or deep philosophical statement behind why they dressed up as a Jamaican bob sleighing team. A group of lads picking a theme of dress for a session in town. A non issue and a non story really. Just another attention seeking, gutter trash paragraph passed off as journalism to get a few likes and mouths frothing on social media.


  • #119
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Hans Bricks wrote: »
    I can't imagine there's any political or deep philosophical statement behind why they dressed up as a Jamaican bob sleighing team. A group of lads picking a theme of dress for a session in town. A non issue and a non story really. Just another attention seeking, gutter trash paragraph passed off as journalism to get a few likes and mouths frothing on social media.

    Yawn, did you even look at the photos? Only two or 3 dressed up as the cool runnings guys


  • #120
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    Hans Bricks wrote: »
    Samaris wrote: »
    There's also a systemic and nasty strain of xenophobia creeping in. I know, I know, I'm a horrible PC person trying to cut down your rights to be a dick when you feel like it. But it was visible in the BLM thread too.

    It's funny, really. In a "sigh" way rather than a lol way. Started with the Muslims, and a certain sector thinking "hm, how much can I get away with here.." and now it's moving onto black people. I put it down primarily to a swing towards hard-right politics* brought on by the migrant situation and the recession. It will swing back again in another generation or so, it just sucks for people nowadays who get to see this ****.

    *NOT right-wing, HARD-right, there's a difference.


    But in short, one has the right to be a dick to whoever they like. Anyone else has the right to call them on it. And frankly, I'd prefer to be judged as too liberal than a bigot.

    Also, who the hell NEEDS to dress in blackface anyway? I mean, what possible benefit does it bring them?

    I can't imagine there's any political or deep philosophical statement behind why they dressed up as a Jamaican bob sleighing team. A group of lads picking a theme of dress for a session in town. A non issue and a non story really. Just another attention seeking, gutter trash paragraph passed off as journalism to get a few likes and mouths frothing on social media.

    Sure why not call them 'n*****s' while they're at it, just having the #banter on a session, right?


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  • #121
    ScumLord
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,788 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    Sunny Future Hyena wrote: »
    I don't think blackface is harmless, or funny, or right, in any context, I cringe so hard when I see it I nearly hurt myself. But it's hard to pick who's annoying me more here....
    I don't think blackface should automatically be considered racist. It's only racist in the context of Americans using minstrels to steal black culture without having to deal with black people. But if a white person likes mike tyson and wants to dress up as their hero at a fancy dress, it's not racist, it was done out of respect and admiration, so it's not racist. People will get upset of course, some people will see the guy in blackface and just jump to the conclusion that rather than that person being a fan they really wore the costume to upset other people and be racist. That's as much that persons fault as the person wearing blackface. Some humans are black, we have to pussy foot around that fact still.


    I'd never do it, it's bound to get the attention of every PC warrior in the city.


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