The case against average speed cameras

twinytwo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122665852#Comment_122665852

Dealing with lane 2 issues, requires teaching a lot people how to actually drive on a motorway correctly, including but not limited to cars joining the motorway/lane 1 doing half the speed of the traffic currently in lane 1.

tommythecat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122679603#Comment_122679603

Here's my little tip. Lane 1 is always faster on the M50 in heavy traffic. The amount of lane hopping going on between lane 2 and lane 3 is crazy and I just sail past them all in lane 1. Without fail.

tabby aspreme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122679443#Comment_122679443

Are you talking about merging onto motorways or secondary roads, in which countries, has merging traffic have the right of way

Seth Brundle

Testing for new average speed cameras is now underway, gardaí have said, with the locations for two of the cameras now confirmed.

The infrastructure and technology for two of these cameras have been set up on the N3 between Kilduff and Billis in Co Cavan, and on the N5 between Lislackagh and Cuilmore in Swinford, Co Mayo.

The third average speed camera is to be placed on the N2 at Slane. The route goes from Dublin to the Border, near Aughnacloy in Co Tyrone.

It is expected the nine new static speed cameras will be operational by the end of this year. The locations were announced in May:

The N59 in Galway between Maigh Cuilinn and Galway ity
The N25 in Waterford between Glenmore and Luffany
The R772 Arklow Road in Wicklow
The N14 in Donegal east of Letterkenny
The N80 in Carlow between Barristown and Levitstown
The Crumlin Road/Parnell Road/Dolphin Road/Dolphin's Barn Junction in Dublin
The N17 in Mayo northeast of Claremorris
The N22 in Cork east of Lissarda and west of Ovens
The N69 in Limerick east of Askeaton
Gardaí chose these locations based on fatal and serious injury collision data from the last seven years, speed data and feedback from stakeholders.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/locations-confirmed-for-new-average-speed-cameras-on-two-high-collision-roads/a271586269.html

Sam Russell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122679467#Comment_122679467

Google maps can calculate the time to get from A to B wherever those two places actually are.

So, put in all the max speeds between A and B and calculate the time to travel between the two, and any vehicle arriving before that time has been speeding.

So, the Av speed cameras can be calculated between ANY pair of ANPR cameras, so speeding cars are easily detected. The idea having the cameras in pairs is unnecessary, and wasteful, and limits the possible power of the system.

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122679443#Comment_122679443

They don't have to let you out, it's your responsibility to get up to speed and merge into space. Traffic on the carriageway have right of way, not those on the merging lane.

mikeecho

A lot of people don't know road craft, let alone car craft.

And a lot of them are on here.

Macy0161

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122679467#Comment_122679467

I get why they say it, I just disagree with the logic. There's rural roads around me that in theory people may avoid the second camera - the majority aren't going to be arsed as it would be slower than sticking the speed limit on the regional road.

GreeBo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122660961#Comment_122660961

You do know that this completely negates the whole point of speeding right?

Your average speed would be the same if you just obeyed the speed limit.

GreeBo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122660969#Comment_122660969

Its really not. The reason it doesnt work well in heavy traffic is exactly because everyone decides its too busy to driver properly.

If everyone kept left unless overtaking the road would work much better than it does today.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122680469#Comment_122680469

Studies have show it makes little difference to throughput.

The only way to improve the M50 is stay off it as much as possible. Less traffic.

If the people advocating others to stay left, stayed left themselves, they wouldn't need to use the 2 lane and then wouldn't get so worked about it.

I dunno what the fuss is about. I just overtake them. End of.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122680358#Comment_122680358

"...They don't HAVE to let People out…"

Echoes the lack of courtesy on the road these days.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122679746#Comment_122679746

I think it depends on the day and which direction, probably certain sections too.

mikeecho

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122680743#Comment_122680743

Are you endorsing or disagreeing with these study's, cos in the past you have quoted studies, and when challenged, you distance yourself.

Me careful you don't hurt yourself when you fall off the fence.

creedp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122679746#Comment_122679746

Be careful because admitting on here that you undertake rather than driving across Lane 2 & 3 and back again before rinse and repeating as nauseum could result in you being led to the proverbial gallows

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122680786#Comment_122680786

Lol. I'm neutral on it because I don't have problem overtaking them. I'm not really frustrated by them. It's just traffic.

But I'm rarely on two lane motorways with someone blocking the overtaking lane. I'm mostly on three+ lane roads in heavy traffic.

I look to the studies to remove my bias. I like looking at the data of things. Too many have confirmation bias. They are also following the rules without considering can they be improved. Many rules are very old.

The studies are interesting. For example some states in the US allow undertaking, which we don't and assume it's dangerous without actually looking to see is it statistically dangerous. Bit like left turning on red.

...And I'm not distancing myself. I'm just not giving a personal opinion. Certain posters are waaay to eager to use that to make personal attacks. Forum rage. I can only imagine what they are like on road.

It's got nothing to do with average speed cameras. So I'm not sure people keep associating them. Speed?

creedp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122679633#Comment_122679633

Can, could and should but rarely do

tommythecat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122680782#Comment_122680782

When it gets down to the 30km-80km crawl is what I mean.

Flinty997

As someone else said ACC is the business for average speed cameras.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122680891#Comment_122680891

I've seen it also I agree with you. Just not everytime is all.

tommythecat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122680974#Comment_122680974

I've never seen it not happen! The mergers go straight out into lane 2 and 3 with all the other lane hoppers and just causing a bigger jam in those lanes. Meanwhile lane 1 moves along.

kirving

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122675925#Comment_122675925

You obviously haven't driven in Italy, or France.

Italy. 2 random examples.

You have a grand total of 34m before the merge lane narrows. Notice how everyone moves left?

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.0927379,16.8428985,3a,24.8y,281.31h,84.14t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sRwMH466PAzDiu8PhNqiq6Q!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI0MTAwMS4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D

In this next example, you get a solid 18m between the solid white line ending, and hitting a crash barrier.

You better believe people move left to let you out, because even though the road is only 90km/h, traffic at 90km/h will travel 18m in 0.72 seconds.

France.

Priorite a Droite is very common. Not on motorways specifaically, but plenty of fast roads and dual carraigways.

https://www.reallyfrench.com/2012/04/priority-to-the-right-2/

And good look to anyone joining the 120km/h M18, with around 50m to get up to speed, when you have people like this Hyundai driver who don't move right in good time (forgivable, the exit is unsighted), and arseholes like the Audi driver who see a situation developing and still don't like the Hyundai out.

So, with evidence of actual roads which have been built, I think your post is "absolute rubbish".

tabby aspreme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122681166#Comment_122681166

Your examples from France and Italy are rubbish, in the diagram from France the red car has passed a yield sign so it has to give way to oncoming traffic, if you look behind the black Peugeot driving in Italy, you can see it has driven past a road sign with an upside down triangle, which is a yield sign in Italy.

I've just spent the past two weeks in Italy and drove over 1200 Kms in the fortnight, it's a pleasure to drive on the Autostrada there, drivers keep to the right irrespective of how fast they are going and will move left if possible to allow traffic to merge, and they will not tolerate lane hogging at all

StudentDad

New static speed safety cameras for N5 in Mayo | Connaught Telegraph (con-telegraph.ie)

Let the fun begin.

Flinty997

Italian driving…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XO09VEsi7NY

amacca

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122679513#Comment_122679513

Not what I've witnessed at busy times tbh....similar numbers in both or all lanes just different rates of progress with some switching between lanes going on

You can say what should happen all you want ....it just won't actually happen most of the time

chicorytip

Speedometers are not all accurate and can give a reading of maybe -5 to +5 mph difference to the speed the vehicle is actually traveling at and the speed which the cameras detect. So, some drivers get caught whilst driving under or at the limit. Check your Speedo when you next pass one of those flashing speed warning signs and see does the speed displayed on your dash correspond exactly with that of the beacon. In my experience, it never does.

phog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122681684#Comment_122681684

I've never seen those warnings signs give a reading faster than my speedo. So if your speedo is at max of the speed limit then you won't be breaking the speed limit.

The only issue I have with average speed cameras are that there's a start and end point and speed merchants can continue on their recklessness outside of those zones

StudentDad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122681779#Comment_122681779

With camera technology in cars, in phones etc., if the govt. was serious about wanting to slow down traffic. one of these cameras could be put at the entrance and exit to every motorway and at the entrance and exit to every lay by and plaza along these motorways. With technology going the way it is, in time the car you're driving could self report you for speeding. Cars could be equipped with black boxes that could upload their data on a regular basis. Nevermind the Guards, your wife or husband could track you with it. You were at work in Cork on Tuesday? Were you really?

The way things are going, the train or bus or bicycle is beginning to sound more appealing.

con___manx1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122675925#Comment_122675925

Ysadly people merge at very slow speeds which is quite Dangerous especially on the m50. I stick to the fast lane or middle lane for this reason.