EU patent court referendum

PommieBast

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122013372#Comment_122013372

Not just the right who oppose "Europe" (leaving aside the EPO being a separate organisation from the EU). A lot on the left who don't understand IPR and think everything should be "free" will try to vote it down as well. The 2010 EU software patent directive had a lot of the latter.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121996041#Comment_121996041

Just for clarity - who is this 'patent attorney' that you've referred to several times? I've read the thread more than once and maybe I've missed it but I don't see anyone declaring themselves to be a patent attorney. Can you clarify.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122013358#Comment_122013358

I very much hope that you not referring to my good self as a 'bad faith actor'! If so, please note that I absolutely refute this and it'd be decent of you to acknowledge this. The fact that others may allege I've posted in 'bad faith' means nothing at all. It's quite the slur and I resent it.

But to the greater issue: why is it/ will it be deferred/ cancelled? I've heard nothing other than a suggestion on the news. Notable that very little general media interest. What's up, politically?

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122025895#Comment_122025895

##Mod Note##

You've had 2 explicit warnings about this type of post already.

3rd Strike - You're out.

Don't post in this thread again.

HalloweenJack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122025895#Comment_122025895

My guess would be the Government sense pent-up ill will from the populace. The local and European elections will probably be bad news for Government parties, especially FFG. In addition to the defeat of the March referendums, I don't see how this Government is capable of selling this one accurately in the current political climate.

I'd argue that this referendum is more important in practical terms as it's straightforward and affects our relationship with the EU as opposed to the wishy-washy, domestic nature of the March referendums. Therefore, it's essential to run a good, informative campaign and not one that'll be tied up in local/European electioneering and the potential for a No vote because of anti-Government sentiment as opposed to considering the referendum on its merits.

If the referendum is run separately, it'll be a boring and detail-based campaign and there's little room for the emotive campaigning of opponents.

Former Former Former

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122026031#Comment_122026031

 and there's little room for the emotive campaigning of opponents.

I admire your optimism, but here's a few arguments that have nothing to do with patents but will 100% be repeated over and over whenever this referendum does happen;

• giving away more of our sovereignity to unelected Eurocrats
• this will mean job losses in Ireland
• why are we having this vote when we still haven't fixed housing/health/immigration
• this will mean an influx of immigrants
• if you don't know, vote no

This is the reality we live in now. The days of actually discussing things on their merits are behind us.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122026152#Comment_122026152

Yeah, this is the thing. It'll be very easy for bad actors to argue against this referendum and almost impossible for anyone else to argue for it. It's the sort of technical issue that's particularly ill-suited to a binary referendum.

I'm hoping there'll be a strong yes case made but I'm not optimistic.

VinLieger

Yup its being postponed, definitely the right call

https://www.thejournal.ie/patent-referendum-postponed-6356216-Apr2024/

PommieBast

Yep, given the circumstances. What I am unsure is whether right thing is postponing it until another amendment also needs to be voted on.

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122026965#Comment_122026965

Is there anything else on the Referendum backlog?

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122027099#Comment_122027099

Overseas franchise for Presidential elections (e.g. the SF Presidents Forever referendum, due to second/third-gen Bostonians etc), which I suspect is never going to proceed.

reactadabtc

Mod: Please read and abide by the forum charter before deciding to post in the Politics forum again

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122027108#Comment_122027108

I don't believe anybody is arguing that 2nd or third generation emigrants would be getting a vote.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122027108#Comment_122027108

Wouldn't a UK style thing where you have to have been registered to vote in Ireland at some point be enough to stop that? Rather easy way to overcome any major issues.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122026912#Comment_122026912

Kind of hard to know if it is the right call unless we know when it is postponed to.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122027421#Comment_122027421

The broad heads were "citizens", which lots of those are; so that was and is the proposal on the cards currently.

There are >3rd gen cases where the Foreign Births Register was used properly.

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122027438#Comment_122027438

I would hope they are postponing till after the election so whoever forms the government can ride their initial wave to pass this without too much nonsense

ambro25

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122026182#Comment_122026182

It would be easy enough to argue for the UPC referendum (with simple facts) and easier still to counter populist ‘anti’ messaging that is bound to be wholly irrelevant to the issue: the patent profession is expert at simplifying highly-complex and -technical legislation, often as not in multinational contexts, to help its business/lay clients understand enough for reaching decisions, and Ireland’s patent profession is way up there with the best, intimately familiar with the EPC and the UPC itself (-already, irrespective of Ireland’s non-membership), including how little the EU actually has to do with it at all (the UPC -Court- is its own jurisdiction, not an ‘EU’ Court…though very ironically, the UPC Register and UPCoAppeal are based about 200 meters across the road from the CJEU in Luxembourg 😜).

The challenge stems from who would be doing that arguing for Ireland to sign up to the UPCA, namely business interests and the government, maybe with a side helping of STEM academia - and the voting population’s sentiment about these entities and their messaging.

And then…we’ve all witnessed what happened in another binary referendum not so many years ago, wherein arguing for maintaining the status quo, and countering rethoric with facts readily understandable by the general population, should have been a cakewalk and yield a comfortable majority against Brexit.

Whether the decision to postpone the referendum is right or wrong, is moot: factually, that decision postpones the opportunities for Ireland anticipated from, and associated with, accession to the UPCA and, in that respect at least, the ‘anti’ side scored a win by default. A battle, for sure, not the war…but still.