Increase in road deaths - questions need to be asked

SuperBowserWorld

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121800750#Comment_121800750

People need to grow up and follow the rules of the road otherwise they will kill or horribly injure themselves and others. And take responsibility for themselves.

The amount of money burned on policing, justice, health/hospital care, insurance, ... because people can't take responsibility is sickening. It's like we are babies.

And lack of public transport and personal responsibility is another reason people get behind the wheel when drunk/drugged. I'm not condoning it. I'm saying it happens. That's why you'll see deaths with young adults on country roads. In Dublin you've got buses, night buses, Luas, trains, taxies to get you home. Of course public transport like that is not feasible in rural areas.

SEPT 23 1989

The basically put young people off the road with needing an accompanying driver massive insurance and very new cars

I thought the accidents and fatalities would have declined significantly if it was their fault in the first place

maybe it’s just this thread gave me temporary heightened awareness but

this morning on my way to and from the school run I came across:

cars going through a roundabout (driving directly through the centre to their exit.. not always going straight ahead sometimes cutting across the middle to take the 3rd exit)

Stopping behind cars in traffic on a pedestrian crossing as opposed to keeping back so children and parents etc can get across the road safely..

running stop signs

bursting across the crossing moments before anyone makes it onto it cos god forbid you had to wait a min..

no indicating at junctions, stopping dead in the road and taking off without an indicator

mobile phone use

and my favourite one a fella driving around in an 05 shitbox that was pissing plumes of smoke from the exhaust and generally sounded very unhealthy. I’m surprised the car even drove and tbh at one stage I had to just make sure he didn’t cut a hole in the floor to Fred Flinstone around.

oh yeah and a few cars who’s reg plate was black with dirt and therefore impossible to read.

SharkMX

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801257#Comment_121801257

I would say until I was about 30 I thought I was invincible. The risks I would take I look at know and think "What the hell was going through your mind?". Not just motor related. There is something in people that causes them to be totally oblivious to any harm that might come to them or others when they are young. Its like there is no such thing as your brain telling you there might be consequences of a risk going wrong .

magicbastarder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801697#Comment_121801697

But we know people won't grow up. Appealing to that - which is basically what RSA ads do, asking drivers to be nice - demonstrably does not work. We need to police the roads.

Fabio

I've loads to say on this but one thing that always hits people is this....

There is no emergency brake test in the driving test. People think that once they pass their driving test they're grand, they know it all, they don't attempt to improve their driving into the future.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801718#Comment_121801718

They put young people off the road?? Every day I pass at least 5-6 learner drivers all young ones and young lads.

the three killed in Carlow were middle age were they? The grad students last year? Come on.

Some learners shouldn’t be on the road without their ADI not to mention a sponsor.

rob316

There is a huge number of people still driving under the influence, still a culture "i'll have 2 or 3 I'm just over the road"

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801697#Comment_121801697

That’s like saying people need to grow up and follow the law. Most of us do but the Gardai exist because there’s a lot who won’t.

There’s also plenty of people who are happy to break the law if they think they’ll get away with it, traffic law included. Not condoning speeding or dangerous driving in any capacity, but at the end of the day, if you can get away with paying no tax or driving unaccompanied as a learner why wouldn’t you?

we have road policing for a reason!

boardlady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801741#Comment_121801741

This is so true. Young people, both male and female - but particularly male - are hardwired to think they are invincible. It is a developmental leftover from primitive times when that was what was needed to stay alive and attract a mate to reproduce. It has even been proven that the male brain is not fully developed until approaching 30 years of age, as opposed to the female brain which has usually developed by 16. Having said that, being a female, I also remember my invincibility when I was younger. It is what propels most of us out into the world with a can-do attitude. I agree that the stark realities of what actually happens in these fatal RTAs is a great deterrent. I work in the personal injuries industry and my god has it tempered my driving. I am privy to details that nobody really wants to know. But it has given me the awareness of what lies around the corner for all of us every time we get into our cars. Which is incidentally, the most dangerous thing most of us will ever do - and we do it daily! I think perhaps education in schools - and when I say education, I mean the gory details. Where they are being given this information within their peer groups. Where they can be told just how much a privilege it is to be able to get into your car and travel, but equally, just how mind bogglingly and life-alteringly dangerous it has the capacity to be.

Be right back

I have heard of a case where a passenger was killed. Apparently the victim and the driver were extremely drunk leaving the pub. For the sake of a taxi fare, 2 children are orphaned as the victim's other half died several years ago.

monkeybutter

in reality, ireland has become a much safer place to drive in the last 20 years and its night and day when you go back to 40 years

despite all the phones and the coke heads and there being many more people driving in general and massive increase in population

whats caused this, upgrades to roads, less drink driving and well safer cars

what has not done this, enforcement, road policing etc and its never going to make a dent

zell12

Newstalk bulletin this morning referred to "dangerous roads" describing the slaughter. 🙄 Much like we used to say "killer junctions" in the past

sligopaul

Does enforcement not look like a one sided instrument , speed, speed , speed. If we follow that route then we try to automate ( speed cameras ) and outsource ( speed vans ) . I understand the numbers of traffic police are at a 10 year low . We have all driven the roads of Ireland and seen terrible driving that is not necessarily speeding related but the likelihood of being pulled is close to zero . We also see multiple offenders without tax and insurance ignoring bans and continuing to drive .

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801758#Comment_121801758

there is on the motorbike test, what difference it makes? F all

they will deffo fail you on speeding no observation and dangerous overtaking

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801828#Comment_121801828

A huge amount of the media coverage of the recent Carlow crash was about how dangerous the road is. There were very few suggestions that drivers who know that the road is dangerous should slow down and take care.

Oh, and there was loads of "sure they were mad about their cars" too, highlighting how they parked the Lexus belonging to one of the victims outside the church for his funeral.

Some people seem to have difficulty making connections.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801888#Comment_121801888

The “mad about their cars” Schtick during some obituaries might better read “they were mad in their cars”.

FazyLucker

So many issues, in order of importance.

1. Phone use : Out of control. From all road users. I saw it yesterday as I was cycling to work, van driver on the phone veering across the road not concentrating. Ridiculous. It needs to be about 6 penalty points and a €1k fine for using a mobile phone while driving. Saw another cyclist almost getting mowed down as he was looking at his phone another day this week. Crazy stuff. Pull in and take your fng call on the side of the road no matter what you are driving if you don't have a hands free.
2. Speed. Not much more to say than speed, speed, speed. Especially on bad roads and powerful cars in the wrong hands. But no age group is immune here, from the boy racer to the middle aged Audi/BMW driver.
3. Enforcement : zero. For anything on the roads, no matter what you are driving it is like the wild west. Do what you can get away with without crashing and you are A-OK. If there are 600 Gardai charged with road policing, then surely they can produce statistics of what they are policing every day? The number needs to be bigger, but at least tell us what the current ones are doing with their time. Its still up to 20 per county. They can't police the whole country but they can tell us what they are at.
4. Safety : NCT cert is one thing but the removal of free pumping of tyres in petrol stations is putting a barrier to safety and many people don't pump their tyres as often as a result. The contact between the vehicle and the ground is the fundamental of every type of vehicle.
5. Driving standards : There is no world in which you should be passing a driving test at 18 and never having to do another one. You should have to do a driving test every 20 years.
6. Taxis in rural parts : Not having Uber type services is disastrous for rural parts. Scenario - 4-5 young lads come out of a pub or house, want to go to the local town. Can't get a taxi because there are none. One decides "I'll drive sure". If they could ring an Uber, agree a fare, what is the problem if the place is not served by a taxi company anyway? The Uber driver gets his fare, the passengers get where they want to go. Who cares if the taxi driving unions are annoyed, they don't serve 2/3 of the land mass of this country effectively anyway.
7. Go-Safe vans : Sitting on the safest roads in the country (I'm looking at you 80km/h Lucan Road) while speed on dangerous roads kills people. A revenue generating exercise.

I also think it is a matter of time before insurance companies offer reduced premiums for people who are willing to have a "black box" style device installed in your car to prove you are obeying speed limits.

Topgear on Dave

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801741#Comment_121801741

Same here, I thought I was invincible as a young lad.

But thinking back now I knew 4 lads killed in separate crashes, and one girl with lifelong injuries she will never recover from, all entirely avoidable, by the time I was 30.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801907#Comment_121801907

Where does this gross entitlement of many motorists who expect others to pay for their activities come from.

If you want air in your tyres, then pay the feckin €1 or €2 to use the feckin pump, or buy your own pump. Stop expecting other people to pay the costs of your driving.

Uber = unregulated and untrained taxi drivers. It's exactly what we should NOT be doing if we have the slightest concern for safety of people on the roads and people using taxi services.

Go Safe vans don't generate revenue. They cost us about €10 million a year, so that's two schools not getting built every year because drivers won't obey speed limits

SharkMX

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801918#Comment_121801918

Same here. 3 friends killed in the one crash (driver (always a maniac behind the wheel) and one passenger survived).

Yet we all still thought we were invincible. Its funny though after about 30 I am always looking at the risk to me or anyone of everything now. Even that gobsh1te last night I stopped the GF well back from the path because i could see he was being dangerous.

magicbastarder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801907#Comment_121801907

Go-Safe vans : Sitting on the safest roads in the country (I'm looking at you 80km/h Lucan Road) while speed on dangerous roads kills people. A revenue generating exercise.

the go-safe contract costs more than go-safe vans collect in fines. so yes, it's revenue generating, but only for go-safe.

NIMAN

If a road itself was dangerous, then a lot more people would be crashing on it. How come thousands are on a road every single day, yet only one person puts their car into a wall on it?

I appreciate some roads aren't great in this country, but the vast vast majority are perfectly safe if you drive within the speed limit.

fabvinny

Phones are a huge problem! The amount of people i see every day looking down at their laps or phone in hand is crazy,it actually scares the shite out of me,and its not just young people.

Regarding younger drivers,I think there should be a limit on the CC of a car you drive when starting out.A son of one of my neighbours is only on the road a few months and he is driving a 5 series BMW!! serious power there! Limit new drivers to 1.3/1.4 cars until the age of maybe 23? gain some experience on the roads for a few years. There are always going to be lads and girls showing off with a bit of speed(most of us did it!)

Anyone caught texting while driving should be put off the road,end of! Drink and Drugs are still a huge problem too. Deaths on the roads will never be eliminated unfortunately.

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801925#Comment_121801925

they only made them pay per go because of all the scanty cyclists using them and not even buying something in the shop 🤣

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801952#Comment_121801952

your sensible approach will be ignored in favour of histrionics

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801223#Comment_121801223

There is a fundamental hypocrisy from those who tell us that road deaths are inevitable, but not for their family, only for other families.

Almost all road deaths are avoidable. True 'accidents' are very rare, but we continue to refer to road deaths and injuries as accidents, not crashes, because we don't want to risk actually pinning responsibility on anyone.

The actual causes of road deaths and injuries are well established - speeding; mobile phone use; no seatbelts; drink/drug driving; fatigue driving. These are the same pretty much all over the world.

The proportionality argument doesn't stand up. We were doing well on reducing deaths and injuries before Covid, even with substantial growth on population and driver numbers. 

Enforcement levels here are negligible, with the chances of being caught for speeding or phone use very very low.

There is one thing that we can ALL do from today, to reduce deaths and injuries. We can make it socially unacceptable to for drivers to use their phones while driving. Every time we see a driver using their phone, we can tell the driver to put the feckin thing away, where there is a safe opportunity to do so. When we're on foot, we can use our phone to record the many drivers using their phones at the wheel, and report them using the Garda TrafficWatch phone line. We can tell the Gardai that yes, we DO want to take it to Court, knowing that it is very unlikely that a driver is going to risk doubling their fine and penalty points when we have video evidence.

Imagine if drivers had to actually think twice about using their phones?

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121801999#Comment_121801999

Most bicycle tubes are Presta valves, and won't work at these pumps.