Do affordable EVs exist in Ireland

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This discussion was created from comments split from: Unhappy with owning an EV in Ireland.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118657217#Comment_118657217

Where can you get an EV for mid 20's with 400 Km range ? or luxury EV for mid 30's ?

We are 2 car household and in fairness what would be the point of replacing the Diesel Outlander with a EV when the missus works from home it would be a waste.

There's plenty of 2 car households who wouldn't benefit from changing to EV and there still isn't a lot of choice for those who want a larger car at reasonable cost and not likely to be for years.

unkel

@[Deleted User] - "Where can you get an EV for mid 20's with 400 Km range ? or luxury EV for mid 30's ?"

Kona 64kWh for around €25k-30k. Tesla Model S from about €33-35k

AnF Chuckie egg

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119614694#Comment_119614694

New KONA Electric 64 is €39,995 + delivery and including Government grant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119614694#Comment_119614694

mid 30's and probably massive mileage ? fine if you got warranty, you were lucky but a lot of people can't and probably won't take that risk, you know what I mean, I'm not running it down, I wouldn't buy one with high mileage with the mileage I'm doing and then what range will a 2nd hand 85 Kwh MS have in 4 or 5 years at decent speeds ?

Well see a lot of People would argue with you about the range of 400 Kms on a 2nd hand Kona.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119614821#Comment_119614821

Do you think 40K car is affordable for the masses ?

Cheapest Kona I see is 33K on carzone. and they're all the 39 Kwh hardly a 400 Km car at 25-35k.

Here we are in 2022 nearly 2023 and still no proper affordable electrics and not likely to be.

I don't consider a 35-40 K car affordable for those on lower incomes which is a lot of people.

unkel

Not sure what your point is. This has always been the same. Nothing to do with EVs. 10 years ago if you had €25k, you could buy a boggo Toyota Corolla brand new. With warranty. Or a 5-6 year old Mercedes S-class. With no warranty and eye watering bills if something serious would go wrong and you'd go to the Mercedes main dealer to have it fixed. Some people prefer the Corolla, some people prefer the S-class. It won't surprise you I'm in the latter group ;-)

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119614913#Comment_119614913

I'd go further and say we don't have affordable cars. The choices are a Dacia Sandero or walking

Look at the sales stats, highest selling cars are expensive CUVs and luxury cars. No dealership wants to sell you a bog standard car and will probably tell you to p!ss off if you came looking for one

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119614955#Comment_119614955

That seems to have always been a feature of the Irish market, I've always thought that outside of Micra's and Yaris's the small affordable cars are missing, and end up coming in as 2nd hand imports instead.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119614925#Comment_119614925

When I got my Leaf back in 2015 it cost 28.5 K for top SVE Spec ( if I remember that right ) and 6.6 Kw charger and it cost 28.5K, granted the battery was 24 Kwh 21 usable but still, that was 7.5 years ago. I suppose you could argue that the Kwh is more now in most electrics but the cost of batteries has come down but the point being is that the Leaf at that price was a lot more affordable.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119614821#Comment_119614821

Secondhand prices are being quoted not new.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119614870#Comment_119614870

Currently realistic range of the P85 is about 300km on motorway at 100-110.

Maybe the S85 would be better as it’s less powerful?

I'm actually surprised to see the ID4 7th place and the id3 so far down at 29th and ioniq 5 at 21st, I thought at that price it would be further down.

I think I'm more surprised to see the Model 3 at 54th.

Interesting stats all the same.

VW Passat at 83 outsold by id4 an EV, never ? lol where did the love for the Passat go ? probably no one buys saloon cars now, estates are hard to find.

Tucson starts at 36,345 probably diesel.

Ioniq 5 starts at 40K for 58 Kwh and 77 Kwh starts at 48K and goes up to ridiculous money.

mc2022B2TF

Expect the model 3 to jump up near the top 20 when September registrations are in

slave1

2019 Kona (the one I was actually referring to) has 3% degradation so easily 400km+ this time of the year and getting a brand new battery also due to recall. Our one has 420km range last week and we will wait until the last minute before getting the battery replaced.

Model S was the luxury I was referring to also and the post was early Feb before things went loopy but having said that there was a 2014 S posted last month in that price bracket with 2 yr warranty

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615485#Comment_119615485

Exactly the same cars as I gave the price examples for when @[Deleted User] asked

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615103#Comment_119615103

But he got it wrong, the 39 Kwh kona is 39.5 K not the 64 Kwh.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615485#Comment_119615485

400 Km, really depends on how you drive and speed.

slave1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615943#Comment_119615943

I paid €26k for a 2019 64kWh Kona with 27k kms on the ODO and a brand new battery in waiting. Range varies with driving style for sure, the Kona has a great rep for being a range EV, 64kWh usable in such a compact presentation leads to long range...

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615943#Comment_119615943

64 kWh Konas can be got second hand for that price.

unkel

€25k asking price Kona 64kWh, no doubt you'll get it for €24k, that's a serious bargain. WLTP range 480km

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/hyundai-kona-2020/31951418

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119614913#Comment_119614913

Lower income people don't buy new cars.

Lower income people require higher earners to buy new cars so that the national fleet is renewed and lower income people can buy them on the 2nd hand market at a more affordable price

The Toyota corolla, is 30k in Ireland. You can't get more 'affordable family car' than the corolla (although I'm sure people will say the Dacia duster us the real definition of an affordable car

I'm not saying that all lower income people can afford a brand new corolla, but they tend to pick them up in the 2nd hand market when they're a few years old.

The MG4 is due to launch in Ireland in a few months. The pricing isn't announced yet but it is likely to be similar to the cost of a Corolla in Ireland. Possibly cheaper

So how many 60 odd Kwh ( at least when new ) electric cars are available for 25 K right now ?

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119617019#Comment_119617019

Did you not read any of my recent posts on this thread? The last one even had a good value car currently for sale, that's lucky, normally you would have to be a lot more patient than that. If you are in the market for a bargain, any bargain, you need to check often. And be ready to buy immediately when one comes up.

Gee, only 1 ? that will convert the masses for sure.......

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119616299#Comment_119616299

Yeah there's plenty of choice for ICE cars, that's the real issue, it will be along time before electrics with good range become in the 15-20 K territory, older ICE are affordable and provide plenty of range even a 8-10 year old car will still provide plenty of range.

They can't make enough electrics as it is anyway.

slave1

We're in a unique situation of an energy crisis and production bottleneck so pricing now is not "normal", used EV's were heading into the price range you indicated and would have been there by now but the worm has turned.

Anyone who bought a well priced EV in 2019-2021 and sold it this year made a profit or at the very least close to breakeven.

A 2019 Kona 64 would likely be around the €20k mark now had it not been for the first sentence, nothing we can do about it unfortunately

unkel

Gonna get a lot worse before it will get better. We will not see more than a handful sub €10k EVs until the market gets flooded with cheap Chinese EVs that will cost €15-20k brand new. That's a good 4-5 years away

In the meantime, mark my words. Those €5k Leafs you see now and then (these were €4k last year and sometimes close to €3k the year before), will soon be €6-7k cars. And probably more like €8k this time next year. Negative depreciation...

You could be right there Unkel, flood us with Chinese cars when the E.U car makers go bust because they can't get energy or afford it.

I saw there on the id3 thread where handpref posted this.

"T5 in for 2.4 today

id4 loaner which is great

174bhp feels very very underpowered

No blind spot monitoring

No travel assist

No rear or area view camera

No led matrix or welcome light

No comfort entry

No privacy glass

These new ‘dx’ versions really are badly spec’d for a €53k car-"

Shocking prices for such minimal kit and even turning the power down is shameful. Bad times ahead for electrics at that rate. People will just go back to diesel at that rate.

Casati

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119618665#Comment_119618665

Imagine what price they will be when VRT is increased to equal petrol/ diesels and the grants disappear?? Maybe 70k?? If you looks at the ex VRT / Grant prices its amazing how expensive these EV's are - the Chinese are coming fast and will take over the market

creedp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119617766#Comment_119617766

Which is why, despite the increasingly popular view that ICEs are the devils spawn and should be crushed on sight, the majority of people will have no choice but to drive ICEs for a number of years to come yet. As you say roll on the cheap Chinese EVs, the Japanese cars of the 2020s. Still remember my Aunts new Toyota 20 back in the 70s and my father mangling the name.. Tot.. Y.. Ota.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119618754#Comment_119618754

That's if you can get any Chinese cars here, if there's a dealer network, etc etc.

People may just go back to diesel.

But, the Irish taxpayer can't continue to subsidise foreign car companies when People are struggling to pay bills and feed their families , it's just not right.

Grumpypants

I got a ZS in July for 36k brand new. (21k cash with my Outlander trade in). It's regularly doing 400+ km on a charge. That's the big battery top spec model with all the extras MG pilot, blind spot warnings, 360 cameras, glass roof and leather.

If you get the smaller battery standard spec one you are still getting over 300km and it's in the low 30's price wise.

MG 4 will likely be in coming in around 29k.

mc2022B2TF

Imagine that the likes of the skoda enyak and id4 don't come with a reversing camera as standard

Like wtf.

No electricity adjustable seats etc. etc.

Mad stuff Ted

To be honest I'd rather a High Spec Diesel than a poverty spec EV especially a poverty spec slow EV.

SuperBowserWorld

The Luas ?

That's affordable and electric.

But range is very very limited.

Electric Bike ?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119619184#Comment_119619184

Electric bikes are cool, if you have a diy built one, the legal ones are too restricted which is ridiculous considering there are electric scooters all over the place going faster and having throttles which is against regulation on ebikes.

Luas is ok if you live near it but it's not really a suitable commuter transport in my opinion, it's too slow. I've taken it a few times into town and it's a bit crap really. A DART type service would be better, Dublin needs a Subway system and a proper fast western rail system that goes to the airport.

Public transport is shocking really, all the People in Nass, Johnstown and Kill no way except road to get to Dublin.

I've no way to get to work except car.

bridgerock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119617766#Comment_119617766

Do you really think the market will be flooded with €15-20k Chinese EVs in the next 4-5 years?? I hear people saying this but I haven't really see any evidence of it. Seems to be a lot of luxury Chinese EVs out there that I can't imagine will be cheap...

unkel

Yes I do expect that to happen. The new Dacia Sandero from the far east. Obviously a cheap and cheerful econobox is not for everyone, most people will still buy something a bit bigger and / or upmarket, but the Dacia Sandero was a big sales success here in Ireland (and in many other EU countries), so I expect the Chinese to take over that segment entirely. When is hard to say, but I think a 4-5 year period from now is a half decent guess. Could be earlier, could be later. But it is near certain to happen. I don't think the incumbent manufacturers will be able to compete with the new Chinese manufacturers at the bottom end of the market even if they wanted to.

I just checked and the Dacia Sandero currently costs from €15k. Damn, I could have sworn that was under €10k when it was first launched. Is it still the cheapest car in Ireland?

Buddy Bubs

Can't the EU effectively keep the Chinese out of the market by taxing them if they are a legitimate threat? Up to the price of the indigenous brands? There must be a reason there's very few if any Chinese brands here now

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119619667#Comment_119619667

It would have severe repercussions and protectionism wouldn't do anyone any favours long term. And yes they are coming, but RHD markets are not the first target. Plenty of Chinese EVs already for sale in Norway and the Netherlands from the likes of Nio, Xpeng and BYD. And of course we have pure Chinese EVs already here in Ireland too, like Polestar and MG

thebourke

are electric cars more expensive in price than petrol or diesel cars?

podge1979

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615186#Comment_119615186

You can't get an ioniq 5 since march this year as there was a massive issue with a chip supplier they basically lost 3 months of stock due to quality issue so manufacturing pretty much stopped.

On the model they normally deliver in Quarters but this year looks like two big shipments I. march and also September this year. Expect them to jump the list a bit next month. Looks like more cars than normal will be delivered in September a lot of inventory stock was available. Maybe because the grant will be totally gone in all specs soon and UK demand could have dropped they have sold a lot there maybe saturated market and dip in demand.

AMKC

Nissan Leaf relatively affordable, Renault Zoe affordable but small, new MG 4 coming and the Citroen Ami too if you do not need to travel far and live in a city or a town.

MakersMark

The issue is that by the time an EV becomes affordable in our welfare paradise country, its already perceived to be obsolete or perceived to have a knackered battery.

I'd love an EV. But I would not, and will never, spend €40K on a car.

I currently drive a micra, worth about €13k. I'll wait for one of those new chinese EVs, or a good used Leaf.

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119623570#Comment_119623570

You could sell your Micra and get a decent Leaf and keep thousands in the bank. And then enjoy big savings on running costs.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119623664#Comment_119623664

Thinking about it. But don't know enough about the ins and outs of EV's yet, and worried I'd make a huge mistake - hence why I'm reading EV threads!

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119623686#Comment_119623686

Feel free to start your own thread "should I buy an EV", giving your budget, your reasons why you are considering it, and most importantly, your driving pattern, what's your commute, what sort of trips do you make, what's the longest trip you'd do and how often, etc. The good folk in here will give you honest advice. They won't recommend you an EV if it is not suitable for you and they will give you the pros and cons.