Westmeath school gets temporary injunction banning a suspended teacher from it's premises

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547172#Comment_119547172

So do you think a girl can become a boy?

And is this as much an obvious and incontrovertible fact as the efficacy of the Comirnaty vaccine in preventing severe hospitalisation of covid patients?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547077#Comment_119547077

I don't know what "frothing rage" you are referring to. I roll my eyes at all this woke nonsense, as I imagine most do.

Any professional who recommends a teenager should act like a cat is a quack. Men identifying as women, children identifying as cats and other such nonsense is a direct result of woke ideology, trigger culture, pandering to nonsense etc. Pandering to nonsense is the cause, not the cure. If you encourage nonsense in society then you get more nonsense, it is common sense.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119546208#Comment_119546208

And both sides have been acknowledged - on this thread and by the school. If a teacher takes issue with referring to one pupil by they/them when not referring to them in the second person, that teacher needs to take it up with the school in an adult, appropriate manner.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547196#Comment_119547196

No one can change their biological sex.

How someone chooses to identify themselves, providing it does not harm anyone, including themselves, should be of no consequence to anyone.

And even in the case where someone cannot accept that someone may choose to identify as a different gender, they can still acknowledge their change of identity. You may be uncomfortable with Mark becoming Mary but there is no reason not to respect their right to identify as Mary. It does not require you to even acknowledge that they may want to be referred to as She instead of He. Just show respect to the individual by calling them by their new chosen name when referring to them.

Instinctively when an individual who identifies as a different gender to their birth sex is being discussed I would tend to automatically use neutral pronouns. I would acknowledge their chosen identity by referring to their chosen name, but also tend to use the gender neutral pronouns. This would, in some peoples opinion, be considered transphobic. 

There is a warranted discussion on the increased occurrence of gender identity issues. Undoubtedly it was under counted in the past. Now I feel there is certain a level of people opting to change their identity rather than deal with their issues. Choosing to change something as fundamental as gender is not a decision people take lightly, but I would feel quite sure there is a element of people choosing this option rather than face other issues in their lives. Does not mean you have to be a dick when talking about them though

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547225#Comment_119547225

The only people who refer to "woke ideology" are those whipping themselves up into to a frothing rage.

And who said a professional recommended a teenager acted like a cat. Maybe, just maybe a professional recognised that they needed professional help, but while continuing education, as a human child, and made allowances to allow that to happen while issues were being dealt with. Or maybe everyone here knows more about the case and "woke ideology"

francois

Oh goody another Trans thread for the permanently outraged to froth over.

Burke's are a bunch of far right attention seeking Catholic grifters, anything to stir up some crap and the clapping seals fall for it.

francois

Good thread on this

https://twitter.com/deanjohnsonuk/status/1564917522704568321?t=yLc1CsgOJ6keXLnKbZG9gw&s=19

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547357#Comment_119547357

I would not encourage someone in their 'change' and if I did and then later heard they had mutilated their genitalia or sterilised themselves I would feel guilty about playing a small part in that.

They say that a friend is someone who tells you the truth. So be a friend to confused young people and don't lie to them. Years later if they come to regret it they might ask "Why did no one talk me out of it?"

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547716#Comment_119547716

Of course, you have the inside track on the full story, not just the frothing from the permanently outraged.

I fail to see how anyone cannot see the coverage of that particular case is missing any context whatsoever. And it is missing context as it would be way beyond acceptable fro the school to have any comment on the matter other than:

The statement added the institution takes into account professional advice as well as the well-being of their student

The parents in the school who reported it to the papers likely have no context either, just froth froth froth

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119545106#Comment_119545106

No, he's not "right".

His suspension is directly linked to his disruptive behaviours and not his objections about pro-nouns.

He was at a formal celebration dinner with a large number of people in attendance and interrupted the proceedings to have a rant. He was asked to stop and was told that he could have the conversation at a more appropriate time and place.

He refused and continued to be a d!ck , including following the Principal around the room shouting the odds at them.

The nature of his objection is utterly irrelevant to his current employment status.

If he was complaining about a leaky toilet in the staff bathroom and did what he did , he'd still be suspended and rightly so.

Seeing the usual correlation between some people claiming to be religious also believing conspiracy theories appearing in the thread.

Important to give some context re the case in question on this thread

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547801#Comment_119547801

What conspiracy theories?

Psychedelic Hedgehog

The lesson here is, if you're thinking of employing a Burke from Castlebar, for the love of god, don't.

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547617#Comment_119547617

Actually - Not Catholic , they are some flavour of Protestant , hence the "Westboro Baptist Church" comparisons.

The school in question is a Church of Ireland Boarding school.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547767#Comment_119547767

You seem to think by using a pronoun to refer someone who has made a decision that is absolutely nothing to do with you and doesn't involve you whatsoever, that it would somehow encourage them one way or another?

And as you say yourself, use of said pronoun would only be when referring to someone in the third person and not speaking directly to them.

Your default assumption is that people who have made such a choice have not considered it. Some may well not have, but who are you to make that judgement without doing anything in any way to seek a further understanding of them as an individual?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547857#Comment_119547857

Yet more discrimination! There are lots of normal Burkes from Castlebar. Some of my best friends are Burkes from Castlebar, just not these Burkes from Castlebar

Psychedelic Hedgehog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547934#Comment_119547934

I obviously should have suffixed my post with /s, but thought the implication was enough :)

Sultan of Bling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547293#Comment_119547293

Exactly.

What If someone else in the school identifies as a dog and sees her in the yard and attacks her?

What if this dog attacks a student who identifies as a human.

Will the dog have to be put asleep?

WH BONNEY

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547995#Comment_119547995

Would the parents need a dog license or would they be exempt ?

foxsake

It's mental so many here cant see the issue at hand and want to just jump around like gombeens crying "de burkes..." ,"religion" and "aren't I great I laugh at the Burkes". morons.

this compelled speech is utter bullsh1t as is transgenderism to be fair. Sure as an adult do what you will but don't expect me to believe in your make believe,

compelled speech is a form of brainwashing or torture.

sure call somebody by their name even if it's fcukface but for the sake of your sanity don't deny what is on front of your eyes - the sex of the person. my job has such inclusive policies and I will refuse to comply if I'm compelled to address somebody by a gender my brain says they are not. name sure. pronoun fcuk off.

ohnonotgmail

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119548436#Comment_119548436

he was suspended for being an arsehole at a public event. try to read past the thread title.

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119548436#Comment_119548436

But they aren't being asked to refer to them as another gender , they were being asked to use their preferred name and to use "they/them" in instances when the name wasn't being used.

Given that the school in question is co-ed we have no idea if it's John who is now Mary or vice versa. But for arguments sake lets say that John is now Mary.

So , as a teacher the scenarios might be

Instead of saying "John , please read page 4 of the history book for the class" , the teacher is being asked to say "Mary , please read page 4 of the history book for the class".

You've agreed that this is ok - Lots of people have a preferred name that is different to what might currently be on their birth cert so this really isn't a big deal.

The other scenario might be this.

Instead of saying "David , you are going to work with Mary on this project , he will be your partner" the teacher is being asked to say "David , you are going to work with Mary on this project , they will be your partner".

That's hardly some assault on the morals of the Nation now is it?

The Burkes have an extensive history of loud and public histrionics in their efforts to defend what they believe are their religious rights.

In all cases thus far it is the manner of their objections that gets them into trouble and not the objections themselves.

foxsake

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119548512#Comment_119548512

I kinda agree but it does stem from his refusal to comply . it's naïve to think otherwise

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119548516#Comment_119548516

what is

 "they/them" instances when the name wasn't being used

if not referring to them as another gender. unless you want to go down the road of pronouns <> gender.....i'm not tbh

it's an assault on a person to compel them to use "they" or any of the 65 (maybe more) pronouns...instead of what they see on front of them.

the problem stems from the fact the dept. of education (and schools) have decided to indulge in this nonsense.

Sadly this type of confrontation isn't new , I know in north county dublin - primary school kids were lectured for misgendering a classmate at age 9.

Age fcuking 9 and they must conform to this sh1te. Educate Together so probably to be expected.

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119547801#Comment_119547801

What is the fascination with crow barring conspiracy theories into every conversation these days?

ohnonotgmail

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119548575#Comment_119548575

well he wasn't suspended for refusing to use a pronoun or a different name. he was suspended because he is an arsehole with no idea of how to behave in public. and as for it being assault to compel them, JFC.

Formosa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119548436#Comment_119548436

"don't expect me to believe in your make believe"....yet Mr. Burke objects on the basis of his religion, surely as "make-believe" a concept as exists on the planet...

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119548618#Comment_119548618

"My make believe Sky Fairy can beat up your make believe Sky Fairy , so there!!"

Mrs OBumble

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119546601#Comment_119546601

Perhaps the government should fund doggie day-cares on the same basis as schools, if their enrolles identify as human, eg have human names like Max, Duke, Pheobe, Fifi, etc

TaurenDruid

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058261073/interesting-must-be-a-first-in-ireland-teacher-suspended-for-refusing-to-use-preferred-pronoun

"Interesting: Must be a first in Ireland. Teacher suspended for refusing to use preferred pronoun"

Nope. Not the case.

He absolutely was not suspended for not using someone's preferred pronoun.

"Teacher suspended for disrupting school event and threatening/abusive behaviour"

There you go.