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Retrofitting

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,376 ✭✭✭BoardsMember


    The OSS seems an absolute joke. 5 providers, is it, for the entire country? For a government funded program of many hundreds of millions of pounds. And those that offer it seem not to want to work with people doing any extension type work. If you can get hold of them to ask that question. Pathetic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭WacoKid


    This is where the problem will lie. The One Stop Shop providers are basically just getting quotes on your behalf. Builders will see who they are quoting for, determine it is grant work, and price accordingly. Yet to go through the whole process myself but already I have a feeling the SEAI grant scheme money may never make to down to benefit the home owner 😕.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,760 ✭✭✭circadian


    Yep it's why I'm getting individual quotes and OSS quotes. I know the OSS will cost more but if it's what I'm willing to pay to not b chasing contractors myself then I will but double the price on everything is too much.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,376 ✭✭✭BoardsMember


    The other curious thing is that there is such a gap between granta available to OSS and to individual grants. Why the latter do not cover doors, floors, windows etc just doesn't make sense. If the aim is to make as many homes energy efficient why not have the same grants apply to both? It's very poorly executed.



  • Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭WacoKid


    You can use the OSS to provide only grant processing and certification services. You can get your own contractor and get them to deal with the OSS. This is how most scenarios will play out I imagine. The OSS will still get their money either way as they will charge you a Project Management fee so no real difference to them.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,376 ✭✭✭BoardsMember


    The OSS that has responded to me has told me that they won't get involved where there's ane extension/builder:

    "we are not in a position to take on board any projects where there is a builder involved or if there is an extension to be built at the same time."



  • Registered Users Posts: 26 Dag12


    Yeah I have sent my technical assessment to another One stop shop today. To be honest I am really sceptical about this process. I feel like these One Stop Shops will add insane amounts for profit. The problem with doing individual upgrades is that you can't qualify for everything like windows for example. I want to put new triple glazed windows. I think you can only quality for grant through One stop shop.


    In terms of works I was recommended:

    1. Triple glazed windows

    2. 8 PV panels 3.5KW

    3. New gas boiler

    4. Attic insulation

    5. Cavity insulation

    Final expected BER: A3


    I wonder what figure they will come up with...



  • Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭WacoKid


    The OSS I am enaging with is more than happy to quote me for additonal non-SEAI grant work, and is also happy to engage with any SEAI registered contractors I put forward. They still get their fees and I spoke at length to them about this. We all understand it is early stages in the process but they were in agreement that this is a scenario that will arise over and over again.

    A large amount of One Stop Shop SEAI grant work being undertaken may be on homes being fully renovated from E up to maybe B rating. You would expect the new house owner to be doing other works to the house at the same time as it makes complete sense. My guess is your OSS will change their approach as they think it through further. Otherwise they may not generate as much business.

    Builders will also need to review how they work and get paid for these type of jobs. They will have to invoice the OSS for the grant work and invoice the homeowner for the non-grant work. I spoke with a potential builder who did a previous extension for me and, although he had not thought it through, he indicated this would not be a problem for him.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,483 ✭✭✭hesker


    I’ve been talking to companies since last Oct and am still trudging along working through the process. It’s a pita.

    I got a quote from one company for €105k for

    EWI

    New WINDOWS

    1 New Door

    attic insulation

    heat pump

    Small section of cavity pumping

    I don’t live in a mansion.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26 Dag12


    I got quoted 50k after the grants for the above work.

    That's overestimation to say the least.

    There's noway those items cost that much.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,760 ✭✭✭circadian


    Aye they're taking the piss €70k after grants from another. Still no PV on these quotes either. €30k for a heat pump/new rads etc. The grant for the rads is small enough that I'd get it done myself and get an individual HP install for less than half that and still come out much better off for it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭WacoKid


    Are these quotes via the One Stop Shop providers?



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,760 ✭✭✭circadian


    Yeah, I've been getting quotes for the work individually too and while there's more headache in dealing with multiple vendors it's significantly cheaper.



  • Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭WacoKid


    I intend to package all the SEAI work into one and look for a single quote, but may end up ultimately dealing with seperate vendors as you say.

    I will obtain quotes from my OSS, through my architect via a tender process, and directly from a couple of builders I know. This should hopefully give me a good breath of costs. To note, I am doing works above the SEAI grant work so have engaged with an architect for this purpose anyway.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26 Dag12


    I got quoted 25K for windows and doors. 12k for Solar panels. 7K for boiler change. I am not convinced it should cost that much



  • Registered Users Posts: 422 ✭✭Nicetrustedcup


    So I got quoted 60k and without grants 82k

    the wrap

    2 doors

    heatpump and rads

    2kw PV system

    project management fee


    i died of laughter going why do I have to pay 7k project management fees. They told me this is for specialist project management work, I went I am a project manager (which I am) I should be able to do this he went nope you have to pay as you need a project manager, As I have a ego I said to myself how hard is this to project manage?,

    the one stop shop also said I have a flute on my house and need attic installation, one there isn’t a flute and two I provided paperwork for my attic insulation and they could see the grade but nope it needs to be redone … 4 years after I got it done ….

    since this quote I am after sorting my wrap, windows and doors, for 14k, getting my PV system quotes next week and on to the heat pump, target for all work is about 30k to 35K, and being honest with myself being a project manager doing my own project work is a walk in the park haha don’t have deadlines to worry about ha,


    but yes these one stop shops are a rip off



  • Registered Users Posts: 26 Dag12


    So I had a chat with OSS that gave me that ridiculous quote. I told them there's noway I am spending that much. They understand their quote is mad, so they offer individual items that I am interested in, which were reasonably priced. I might still to ahead with that and get best price/quality for what I need. Also just to note, instead of 30-40% grant discount it ended up just about 20% or less



  • Registered Users Posts: 26 Dag12


    To be honest after the research I have done, it appears that doing individual upgrades makes more sense. I am not sure what kind of demographic can afford 70-100k on energy upgrade in a context of renovating a home where you already spending large sum.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,376 ✭✭✭BoardsMember


    What I have found after looking into this is that the only One Stop Shop that said they would work alongside extension and renovation works would charge a €8,000 fee to Project Manage even though I would have my own Project Manager, Contractor etc. The 8k is effectively for doing the paperwork on the grant application under the OSS. That pretty much cancels out the additional grants available under OSS versus individual grants - OSS allows for floors, windows, 2 doors, individual do not. Also, doing OSS alongside wider scope of works would make it messy for my contractor, so I just don't think it is going to be worthwhile doing. It's a pretty crap programme, all in all, not even going into the fact that there are only 6 OSS listed on the SEAI for the whole country.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26 Dag12


    Yep, that's basically it. It's just too expensive. I already hired a contractor do do attic insulation and will proceed with individual upgrades. Have a guy coming in to give me a quote for solar PV and new boiler.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭WacoKid


    Quote from OSS in. I'l not go into all of it but I got 2 verbal quotes/indications for external wrap at circa 18k while waiting on the OSS. Line item for external wrap in OSS quote is 31k excl. VAT.



  • Registered Users Posts: 874 ✭✭✭FrankN1


    So is this scheme essentially useless? What is the point of grants if they the increase the prices by double?

    Im a B3 and was considering triple glazed windows, attic insulation, 2 doors and some wall insulation. Assuming I should just do it privately? Or using individual grants?



  • Registered Users Posts: 429 ✭✭WacoKid


    For individual grants I guess if you like the price from a SEAI registered contactor you can give them the work and submit a grant application.



  • Registered Users Posts: 874 ✭✭✭FrankN1


    Has anyone actually used the scheme effectively and saved money?



  • Registered Users Posts: 874 ✭✭✭FrankN1




  • Registered Users Posts: 2 Paul_798



    If starting from a B3 rating OSS probably isn't going to be an option. For OSS you must achieve at least a B2 rating AND improvement of at least 100kWH/M2/Yr. So a B3 (125-150) would have to be in the A2 (25-50 ) band at the end of the process. That is going to need a lot of detailed work to achieve most of which wouldn't be covered by the grants. I would doubt that an OSS would even engage with you.

    Individual measures would still be an option if starting from B3 but you may need to do them at the same time to avoid hitting B2.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,032 ✭✭✭gooner99


    I only managed to get a quote from one company so far. Others said they weren't taking any more for this year or not covering my County. The one that did quote offered a free survey. But when I got a call back they seemed uninterested to come out. Not sure if this was down to the fact I said I wanted to extend the house as well as upgrade the existing or if it was due to the small size of my existing bungalow. He did however offer to send me a quote for individual measures based on details and existing house plans I submitted. Most measures were fairly competitive, but the EWI seems very expensive for the house size. Anyone else feel they would get better value going the individual grant route via a registered contractor, especially if extending and renovating at the same time?

    Total outside wall area in sqm - 85sqm. Area of house in sqm - 44sqm (floor area), 54sqm (outside).
    External Wall Insulation. Insulation to be 100mm EPS thermal conductivity 0.031 w/mk in conjunction with an approved render system installed by registered contractors in line with NSAI certification and Retrofit Code of Practice SR54 – 95sqm.This price also includes: Removal and replacement of 1 satellite dish and 1 outside light, 30sqm of scaffolding and hire of waste removal (1 skip). 17.4m of New guttering, 4.8m of New downpipe including the removal and disposal of old. 2 x Mechanical extract Vents (Including core) € 22,603.72 ex vat. €25655.22 incl vat. (grant - €8,000). Total after grant €17655.22




  • Registered Users Posts: 616 ✭✭✭arch_stanton


    I received a quote back today and I’m still picking my jaw up from the floor. 137k plus unspecified sundries less 27k in grants for a typical 1970 semi-d with extension in good condition. It might be cheaper to knock it and start again :-)

    I’m no expert on costs but they want 8k for 2kW solar. Thanks to the guys over in the renewables forum I know that’s approximately 3 times the market rate. If the one stop shop is gouging on that I assume they’re gouging on the rest



  • Registered Users Posts: 45,677 ✭✭✭✭muffler




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  • Registered Users Posts: 874 ✭✭✭FrankN1




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