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Will racism ever end?

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Comments

  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    That's just simply untrue and (yet another) attempt to frame people who are against specific gestures or methods as against the cause (in this case, ending racism)

    Nobody is advocating against the cause of ending racism, but people are rightly and justly calling out specific parts of a campaign which they feel is more divisive and actually to more harm than good to the overall cause.

    This thread asks one simple question, will racism ever end. The answer is no. There will always be racists. It's an unfortunate part of life.

    Actual racism is not accepted in society as a whole, and rightly so, but there will always be pockets of genuine racists.

    But when certain groups try to level accusations of racism where it is not warranted, it only cheapens the claims of people who suffer actual racism on a daily basis and initiatives linked to divisive gestures or rhetoric do much more harm than good.

    Being called a racist used to be one of the biggest slurs on a persons character. Now it might simply mean they aren't a fan of illegal immigration.

    Overuse and misuse of the word has made it lose its power.



  • Registered Users Posts: 369 ✭✭sekiro


    I can agree with that. It wasn't my intention to give the guy a free pass. Yes, it is comforting I guess to think "nah, surely nobody can be THAT bad, he must be mentally ill".

    Like I said it can be difficult to get a grasp and understanding of a situation where someone has acted so horribly when personally I can't see any kind of scenario where I would ever behave that way.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,006 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    The threads on multiculturalism, wokeism of the day, anything on Greta, immigration, feminism, homelessness, BLM itself etc are all a case in point. All started from the viewpoint that the advocacy of the topic, or the advocates are a problem or the frustrating element.

    And as for 'accusations of racism where it is not warranted', let's say that that is a problem, or something that is happening (and of course it will in some situations) but not all situations, but to then try and shut down wideranging calls for action on racism on the basis that some of the claims are unwarranted is a curious position to take in my view.

    As I've said before, it might not mean you are a racist, but the racists are on the same side of the argument as you and are pleased to see you taking that position.



  • Registered Users Posts: 369 ✭✭sekiro


    I don't have any issue with footballers taking the knee. Totally fine with it.

    What I would say though is that it seems like a gesture that creates the impression of doing the right thing while actually doing nothing.

    The reality here is that almost any person, any where in the world, can create an account on some of these platforms and then immediately go and abuse people until they are banned. Then they can probably do it again and again and again if they are resourceful enough. They might even reside in a country where this behavior wouldn't even be illegal. The social media platforms know this and so they do nothing. Except, they don't actually do nothing. They facilitate "starting a conversation" about Racism on their same platforms that allow Racism. It's a waste of everybody's time. Spend weeks and weeks supporting players choices, defending players choices online, talking endlessly about how this stuff needs to stop and it's all undone when some little twerp in the middle of nowhere creates another fake account and makes national headlines with racial abuse. Meanwhile the very corporations that allow this abuse to happen stand up and applaud the people calling it out. It's a joke.


    "White Privilege." OK. So what is the definition of Racism?

    I'm visualizing a scenario here where we've agreed that racism should end. I think we can at least agree on that. So we're getting into that conversation. It's horrible and it's disgusting and on every level it's just wrong. OK. "So what about your White Privilege." I'm sorry, what? "You know because you are white you need to..." Wait... what? Can we define racism again? Cos that really feels like I'm about to be criticized based on an immutable characteristic that is outwith my control.

    Surely you are not going to criticize people or judge people based on their race? Will racism ever end? You tell me.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    That's because there are intrinsic problems with all of the topics you mentioned above. I'm more than happy to debate the demerits of feminism, immigration, homelessness BLM and the emergence of people outdoing themselves to be "woke". Because I am not happy with aspects of how some of the current campaigns are handled in the media and in conversation with people who try to out-do themselves to be the most "progressive", doesn't mean that I should shut up because it's a good cause.

    Because I argue my point on such topics, I have been labelled some disgusting and offensive names and even my daughter's parentage was called into question. It seems that unless you wholly accept and go along with what is the current "progressive" view of certain topics, you are vilified. It's a nasty tactic to shut down any opposition by trying to shame people into silence for fear of being called a bigot/phobe/ist. It's pathetic.

    I don't particularly give a flying **** who's on the same side of the argument as me. I get to my opinion based on experience and learning.

    If I happen to be of the opinion that taking the knee is a bad idea because of it's link with BLM & St Floyd making it divisive, my opinion wont change because a member of the KKK also doesn't like the knee.

    If I oppose Antifa because of their actions, it doesn't make a difference if Richard Spencer also hates them

    If I am opposed to third wave feminism because it's steeped in misandry, I don't care if a wife beating misogynist also doesn't like feminism

    I don't lump all vegetarians in with Hitler and Manson. I'm not responsible for other people's beliefs. I can only represent mine. I don't care who is on my "side" as long as my side is reasoned and not coming from a dishonest place.

    I'm not a racist, yet the amount of pussyfooting around calling me one, or trying to "gotcha" me into saying something that can be misconstrued as one is tiring.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,006 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    From one of the players targeted after England lost the Euro final.

    “To the social media platforms @instagram @twitter @facebook I don’t want any child or adult to have to receive the hateful and hurtful messages that me Marcus and Jadon have received this week,” Saka wrote. “I knew instantly the kind of hate that I was about to receive and that is a sad reality that your powerful platforms are not doing enough to stop these messages.”

    We're going deeper off topic on to something which there is another thread on here about but what do you think a footballer should do if they are racially targeted?

    I don't know what point you are making about white privilege. Are you saying the concept that it exists is in itself racist? I don't think so, it doesn't mean every white person has it easy but that they do not have the expectation of being mistreated because of their race in the same way that some others exist. It is generally used when asking people to understand what non-white people experience rather than saying that they have it all so easy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 369 ✭✭sekiro


    Isn't Greta a pretty good example of how messed up a lot of "social justice" stuff really is? So she gets up in front of world leaders and berates them for making a mess of the planet. Not unfair. They, in response, give her a standing ovation. Like... "Yeah, we DID screw up the entire planet for future generations! Woop woop! You go girl! Tell us off! We really ruined the world! Give us what for! So brave!". Next day. Business as usual.

    Is there an argument that advocates are not actually solving the problem but rather are allowing organizations to look like they are solving the problem in exchange for a bit of publicity and a bit of cash. Corporation X supports Social Cause Y just look how we support Celebrity Activist Z! Are they actually getting anything done though?

    Maybe there are more than two sides? Why would racists be upset that twitter users are objecting to the act of throwing each other under the bus over perceived racism? Twitter will let them create an account to racially abuse someone quite openly and they'll even be able to do it again tomorrow. Hell, if they are REALLY lucky a mainstream outlet might even publish the tweet for them and their other little racist buddies to get a good laugh at. Then some dumbass TV presenter or radio host who isn't even racist might even get the sack for "playing down" the tweets. Why would actual racists be anything other that delighted about this state of affairs?

    People will get wound up about the phrase "virtue signaling" but what if there is an element of something true there? That some aren't actually solving problems but rather are just trying to make money and/or gain popularity from presenting their brand in a certain way. Just a thought. Might be nothing to it. Would love to see Facebook and Twitter taking MUCH more of a stand here though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,006 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    So the 'intrinsic problems with all of the above' are the issues rather than the issues themselves? If you think that is the case and that is what needs to be discussed, then that itself is a privilege whether you like to see it as such or not.

    And I'm not saying that suggests your life is wonderful in every way, but when the motivations to take part in such discussions are primarily focused on negating the justification for whatever the 'cause du jour' in the spotlight on that particular day rather than supporting or advocating for something you feel needs attention then is that not telling?

    I've said it before, why don't we see as many threads started by people asking for support or guidance for an issue than we see started by people trying to shut down support for something else?



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    "We're going deeper off topic on to something which there is another thread on here about but what do you think a footballer should do if they are racially targeted?" - Cristal made a statement that some rappers, jay-Z included, thought was racist, so they boycotted it, stopped using it and rapping about it. Clubs and players should be boycotting social media, until they get some assurances that there will be accountability. It's literally that simple. No PL players or clubs tweeting for a week would have the SM giants in a tailspin.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,006 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Of course there's going to be celebrity activism. But, if it is in relation to a topic that needs action/attention, is it better to do nothing?

    If any of us see a problem, do we stay quite about it rather than risk being accused of being an attention seeker? The right to vote, the right to work, the right to safe work environment, the abolition of slavery, the freedom for sexual expression, the right to same sex marriage, the right to have an abortion (to name just a few) all were gained in part by people advocating for the particular cause and in many (if not all cases) faced ridicule and dismissal at the outset that they were doing it for their own selfish reasons.

    As for Governments applauding Greta and then carrying on as normal. Most governments are heavily populated and guided by highly qualified and educated people. For the most part, they probably know the impact the modern economy is having on the environment. But they are in their role because of the whim of the electorate and they know that significant change is easy to lobby against and hard to implement. They didn't bring Greta in to tell them anything they don't know. They brought her in so the electorate could see them 'being informed' about the issue.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    So in other words, if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything at all?

    I have a vested interest in the topic of racism, feminism and immigration and I wish to discuss my opinions on them.

    I have issues with how people who have similar outlooks as me are portrayed by certain sections of the media and in certain conversations. So no, it isn't telling. It's as telling as your constant opposition to my opinions, which I'm sure you feel are righteous and justified.

    As to why you don't see many threads looking for guidance or support? Because it's a discussion board, not an progressive activist hub (although sometimes it's hard to tell)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,006 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    They all went off social media for a weekend and it was completely sideswiped with the news about the European Super League breakaway plans being released.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,006 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Never said 'say nothing at all' just pointing out the reality that the focus of threads is predominantly targeting rather than supporting activist causes (whatever their nature or focus) which actually proves that it most certainly isn't a progressive activist hub.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    It draws attention to the issue of racism in sport.

    You are talking about the gesture so as an action to draw attention it worked.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Negative, divisive attention. Surely a unifying gesture which didn't polarise people would have been much more adventageous.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I don't get behind a lot of activist causes because I wholesale don't believe them worthy of my support or because there is something inherently unpleasant, erroneous or false in the set-up or agenda behind it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    What unifying gesture do you think would bring the racists on board with an anti racism gesture?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,006 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Would that not automatically mean something that can be ignored? You have to ask why is the gesture polarising if it isn't outright supporting of racism, then at least ambivalence or disinterest to the experience of people being targeted in that way.

    The whole thing in spiraled from Kapernick protesting peacefully, at that point there were not street protests or the riots that happened on occasion. But even that wasn't acceptable.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    You aren't going to "bring the racists" on board with any initiative. Racists gonna racist.

    I think therein lies the problem Robbie.

    When I talk of unification, I mean have a campaign that everyone who is not a racist can support. By having a gesture which polarises people who aren't racist, you are automatically pushing people with valid concerns about the gesture (unfairly) into the "racist" camp by default.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    They virtue signalled that they were going off SM for a weekend, but would be right back on it as soon as the weekend was over. Hardly a boycott.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    No but you will highlight the problem by letting them boo a simple gesture like taking the knee. And when it is televised you will bring that highlight to a global audience.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    No it wouldn't automatically mean that at all. The kneeling gesture was front and centre of all newspapers, news reports, political discourse and social media in the aftermath of George Floyd and the ensuing riots and (rightly in my opinion) don't want it as the gesture of choice for a campaign they would otherwise be 100% behind.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    That makes zero sense. That would only give a false impression that those against the knee are racist and that racism is a bigger issue than it already is......

    hmmmm. Perhaps you may be onto something.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    Sorry are you saying there is no racism is soccer and that racism is not directed at black players all across the European Professional leagues?

    Numerous people from English football perspective have clarified this is not about the BLM movement.

    Below is a Gareth Southgate quote directly saying it.

    But Gareth Southgate said the England team's actions were not in support of the Black Lives Matter organisation. He said: "We have got a situation where some people seem to think it is a political stand that they don't agree with. That is not the reason the players are doing it. We are supporting each other."



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Don't be sorry Robbie, at this stage I am used to you misrepresenting what I said.

    There was NO way I said that racism doesn't exist in soccer. Even the least generous interpretation would have to acknowledge that I specifically said that racism was an issue. I did half expect you to wrongly accuse me of downplaying it, but I never thought you would go all the way as to attempt to frame it that I denied it's existence. I'm not sure whether that type of leap is impressive or pathetic. Cathy Newman would be proud.

    What I said was that by highlighting around the globe that people boo the knee, could give a false impression that those who were booing were racist, thus falsely inflating the amount of racism that needed to be tackled by counting non-racists as part of the toxic racist element.

    You are going around in circles here Robbie. I don't care what Gareth Southgate said. Regardless of the best of intentions or the most pure of ideals, because of BLM and George Floyd inspired riots, the gesture of taking the knee will be an offensive and polarising gesture to giant swathes of people because of the link that has already been created (intentional or otherwise).

    At risk of repeating myself, it is the gesture that people take issue with, not the message behind it which makes it such an idiotic gesture to use if your goal was to unify the non racists supporters against vile racism.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 461 ✭✭Dublinandy3


    Hello All,


    Thanks for all the replies so far. I was a little exasperated when I created the thread because the only person I can talk about it openly with is my wife, in a non internet conversation a lot of people, from my own experience anyway, are either of the opinion racism doesn't exist and have tended to downplay the incidents that happen to my wife, as they do tend to happen every month or two, roughly. Or they go the total opposite but when it's in person the conversation tends to just get awkward either way.

    Online the discussion still has the polar opposite views, such has been shown, but generally, except for a few outliers, discussion can happen.


    I mentioned the taking the knee etc because I don't think whatever is done to highlight what happens, it still happens. The people you want to reach don't tend to listen. In my opinion, given the thread has swung that way, taking the knee was an original protest against racism that was taken on by a political movement, but it still does what it's supposed to do as most people just associate it with highlighting racism. I just don't see what that or anything similar can do to have an impact, but I still think those acts need to happen so focus stays on the subject, be it racism or any type of discrimination.


    As for my opinion on can racism ever end? I fear not, but if I'm wrong and it can, probably the only way is education at a young age and continuing.


    I'm not a fan, neither is my wife, of positive discrimination, even though unintentionally she's benefited from it in the past, as you can't force things. But that's a whole other topic for a different thread.


    I have enjoyed reading all responses, I agree with some bits from all and disagree with some bits from all.


    But isn't that the wonderful thing? We as people can only truly understand what we believe in by seeing all points of a discussion and understanding why people have those points, even if you disagree.


    I probably won't comment again on this thread as I just needed to vent, but I will enjoy reading all posts.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I think in all this I forgot to say to you that I genuinely hope your wife is ok. From my own experiences with my family, I know how **** it can be to be racially abused. It's great to see someone who experiences it with a close family member have such a balanced and considered opinion. Fair play op.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    Good luck as someone also married to someone easily identifiable to racist idiots as not Irish. I understand well your pain and frustration at seemingly empty anti racism gestures. But I can also see their role in highlighting racism and trying to make it a more present issue for others.

    But as you also point out too, many of the mindless idiots rather than get behind an obvious anti racism initiative turn their opposition into seeming support for the very racist gestures.

    To those in opposition and supporting booing the knee whatever your reason it will appear as tacit support for the people who perpetuate that racist hatred.

    That makes you a supporter of racism.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I would not expect anything less to come from you Robbie.

    If you don't wholly get behind taking the knee, REGARDLESS OF YOUR REASONING, you are a supporter of racism.

    FFS Robbie, you are a parody at this stage. It's this kind of bollocks that tries to shame people into blindly following any initiative, no matter how flawed.

    Do as we say, clap along, ask no questions or you are no better than the racists.

    Lol.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,006 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    Completely disagree. The reaction to Kapernick taking the knee with people, up to and including the President calling for him or others to be taken off the field and lose their job should they do so showed just how difficult it was for people to acknowledge the issue they were drawing attention to.

    Since day dot, strikes, protests, marches specifically were organised to attract attention and be disruptive or else they were ignored.

    As for the escalation following the events resulting in George Floyds death. I don't think we can understand just how evocative those scenes were for people in black communities who constantly experience the police as an enemy rather than a protective force. That some violence broke out at some protests (is not forgivable, nor have I ever said it is) but it is understandable and does not for a second undermine the call for fair treatment.

    We saw what happened when 2 British paratroopers found themselves in the middle of an IRA funeral of people who had been killed by British forces. Did that violence negate the entire argument or support for the IRA in the North? Should it have done?



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭ Coraline Aggressive Nature


    No. People can be scumbags, and it's not just a tiny minority. When I had a bit of weight on I got the same, random people shouting abuse from passing cars. Some people just have no empathy whatsoever.

    But we can't let up by letting it become acceptable behaviour. I've seen the UK shift its mindset from what looked like one of the least racist countries to somewhere that racism is now openly flaunted, and it's sickening. I've witnessed what appeared to be 50% of the crowd at the San Siro make monkey noises at an opposing back player during a Serie A game. It doesn't help that I just don't get it, I can't see why you would want to judge someone based on the skin colour, sex, etc. it's bizarre.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,006 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    So when they protest, it is said that they should do something different such as focus on Social media. When they do that, they are told that it is virtue signalling and that it wasn't a boycott because they came back.

    So, what you want is for them to protest racism by staying quiet and out of sight?

    Do you realise just how this sounds?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,006 ✭✭✭✭Tell me how


    That's it really. Just because there will always be some inclined to practice racism, doesn't mean we should shrug our shoulders and say there is nothing we can do.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]




  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,173 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    The UK looked like one of the least racist countries? Looked like doesn't even cut it and in the pretty recent past. It was certainly more overt in the past alright, but the undercurrent was there and it wasn't too much under the surface either. The Black and White minstrel show was going into the late 70's, "jokes" against minorities were a staple of Sunday night family viewing on TV and one of their MP's Enoch Powell was raving about dire warnings of blood in the streets because of Black immigrants. There have been more than a few race riots in the place because of how the Black community felt they were being treated. Never mind the dissent all the way up to terrorist actions because of similar felt in the Asian community(IE those from the Indian sub continent). This came out in jokes by more enlightened comedians.


    During the 1980's and beyond there was a concerted effort towards education and legislation, a deep dive through police forces and the like to lessen the overt stuff and more "politically correct" media, but as the recent British BLM marches showed the old attitudes are still very much in play.

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo




  • Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    Some serious twisting going on, as predicted.

    I've never said, or insinuated that "what you(i) want is for them to protest racism by staying quiet and out of sight"

    The Premier League stated that they would be staging a 4 day blackout. That is not a boycott. It is as pointless as taking the knee.

    If you were in your local supermarket, and on a number of occasions you saw different members of staff racially abusing people, do you think that telling the owner that you and your family wouldn't be in for a set 4 day period due to racism, but after that, it'll be business as usual, would really bother the racist members of staff. It'll have zero effect on their profits, it'll have zero effect on them whatsoever.

    Now, if you organised and got the village behind you and actually boycotted the store, management would have to do something. It would hit them in the pocket and force them. Footballers, celebs etc coming out and stating "we will not use this platform until ID requirements are massively improved, and every user/abuser is identifiable by the service, and subsequently by the Gardai/Police/Cops if they break the law", and repeating this while not using the platform, wouldn't be staying quiet or out of sight. It would be the very opposite of staying quiet and out of sight. And within weeks there would be real, viable, changes made to help stamp out a lot of the racial and other abuse received on these platforms.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Except that that wasn't the logic I was referring to. Nice try though.

    I responded to what you wrote.

    As with the the dunne, if you are watching people who are being racially targeted do an act specifically to call attention to them bein targeted in that way, and they are the ones you have the issue with, then there isn't much room for interpreting what that means.

    Except that wasn't what you said earlier. Many of the players and other who took the knee weren't racially targeted, so the previous point stands. But sure, go ahead, and shift the goalposts after people have replied to you... that makes perfect sense.

    Funny how all the threads that are started on such topics are started with a view that those calling for action are SJW's or the likes. Time and again here the focus, and probably most of the individual contributors to threads are of a mindset against a cause rather than calling for support for one.

    The funny thing is that you've just done what you accuse others of doing. Ahh irony.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    The only people unaware of racism in soccer were likely people who are not interested in soccer, and will continue not to be interested in soccer. They'll say "oh that's terrible", and then switch attention to something else.

    Anyone who has been to a soccer match in the UK, Spain or Italy, will be very aware of the sentiments of many "fans" in expressing or acting out racist biases. Same with anyone who simply watches tv and sees the sports commentary... there have been heaps of incidents in soccer for most people to be aware of what's been going on.

    It hasn't "worked". It's still an empty gesture, except for the virtue signalling connections.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I don't think anyone is suggesting that we should. We have laws in society to regulate the behavior of people, along with the conditioning to hopefully reduce such negative behavior. I'd say that aggression and violence is part of being human, but we have many ways of reducing the impact of those human expressions... just as we would with racism. Murder will continue as long as people exist. So too will racism continue to exist. We want to have laws, and conditioning to minimize both from happening.

    The sad thing about racism though is this movement where the people advocating against racism are so intent in excusing their own bigotry, or expressing racism when it suits their agendas.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    What should people opposed to racism in soccer do that is not an empty gesture then?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]



    Honestly, I don't know.

    I think it would be better to bring pressure on the football organisations, and the stadium owners, to supply life-time bans (open to appeals) for those who obviously engage in racist comments/violence. Post up clear guidelines in stadiums showing what is acceptable and unacceptable behavior, and then charge/fine those who break the guidelines.

    I'd say that one of the reasons that so much racism exists among fans, is the way that violence, and loutish behavior has been allowed to continue. One thing feeds into the other. Start weeding out those who cause such trouble, and the remainder will catch on quickly to avoid losing their own access to the games.

    edit: Just to add, I stopped going to matches in the UK a few years ago, because I was sick of all the agro going on. Too many times, I had to duck into a pub, or shop to avoid a mob of supporters hell-bent on causing trouble. It just takes too much away from the sport, and that's what should be tackled first, as these are the people who will feel that they can get away with being racist.. because they've gotten away with being violent for decades.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber



    I agree the clubs and uefa fifa can do so much more but they are corrupt or driven by greed.

    But knowing that and having to operate within that structure what can the players do?

    Do you believe in non violent protest as means to an end?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Educate their children that nobody is better or worse than the other by virtue of their ethnicity.

    Teach them that you shouldn't accept being told your ethnicity gives you an advantage or a disadvantage.

    To ignore bigots and to acknowledge that while some people will insult and disparage them because of something they can't change, society doesn't agree with them.

    Teach children that they are more than their ethnicity and never to play the race card.

    Teach kids that there will be virtue signalling dicks that will try to convince you they are a victim.

    Not assign every negative comment or insult to racism.

    Treat people equally.

    That's just a couple of things off the top of my head. Granted, they are all about teaching children stuff, but that's the majority of my experience in combating racism.


    What's yours? Apart from telling people that by not kneeling or booing kneeling that they are racists.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    Football players should teach their children all these things to stop the racist abuse?



    People like the OP who's wife was subject to racist abuse should teach their children?



    How does that stop the OP's wife from being subject to abuse or the football players being abused?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Oh right, sorry Robbie, what's your idea again?

    Telling people that unless they agree with what you believe, then they are racist?

    I'm all ears Robbie.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    Well that's a silly post isn't it dunne as I have never said such a thing.

    You posted about education. So please enlighten me how does the op teaching his children stop his wife being racially abused?



  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Ah Robbie!

    obviously the OP should teach his wife to stop playing the race card, everyone gets abuse!

    also she should stop complaint and playing the victim, sure everyone gets abuse.

    basically 🙄



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,844 ✭✭✭RobbieTheRobber


    No bubblypop your wrong if Premier league footballers educate their children instead of taking the knee then the OP's wife won't get abused by racists.



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