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Teenagers with no value for life and no care for repercussions - **Read OP**

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Comments

  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    We need more prisons.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,177 ✭✭✭Fandymo


    Indeed, if it's one thing that history has taught us over and over again it's that violence is always the solution to society's problems :rolleyes:

    If this thread starts going down a rabbit hole with nonsense like this it'll be closed immediately

    There has to be some form of discipline though. It doesn't have to be into the back of a van and battered. Light slapping should never have been banned. At that age kids NEED to realise right from wrong. There is no fear in kids these days.


  • Registered Users Posts: 50,916 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    bubblypop wrote: »
    I would suggest an overhaul of the juvenile criminal system.
    The age of criminal responsibility should be lowered back to 7, as it was years ago.
    Also, the chances they get to receive cautions should be strictly kept to two.
    Once you have received your cautions, you are then off to the courts for any further crimes committed.

    That won’t work imo.
    Many children amass cautions for offences committed on the same day. Some of them commit a series of offences in a week if there is a family trauma ie marriage break-up, death, addiction problem etc.
    If you were to prosecute then their solicitor could argue that they didn’t have the chance to rehabilitate.
    Maybe prosecute along the three strike rule but over a period of time and involve all services at the same time as the initial caution.
    Also there is a fantastic Crime Awareness Programme in some of the Youthreach centres which could be modified to suit Primary Schools.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,695 ✭✭✭dhaughton99


    WrenBoy wrote: »
    The loss of a sense of community, low self respect and having no positive role models in their lives seems to me to be quite a large driver of these disaffected youths, who then go on to raise disaffected youths.
    How that is remedied is the million Euro question.

    I’m in a school in one of the deprived areas you constantly hear about and for years in one of the rooms, they had a poster up of McGregor kicking someone with blood showing as a positive influence. It’s been changed to Ali this year.


  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    How would this benefit us?

    Well, firstly children don't come into the system until they are 12. Unfortunately, a lot of kids are already offending at this stage and are used to nothing being done.
    They then start to receive cautions.
    I believe the earlier that intervention happens with juvenile offenders the better.


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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    gluppers wrote: »
    Scum. Lock up the parents too. Also why little outrage about this on social media?? The murder of the woman in London (Sarah Everard (RIP)) got much more attention on Irish social media

    Piece of scum perpetrator doesn’t fit the Irish media’s virtue signaling narrative so they choose not to report on it.

    Can be sure if the perpetrator was from the “Leafy suburbs” it’d never be out of the news.

    Politicians and media figures think they’ll be perceived as heartless capitalists if they go after clear problem areas so the issue is allowed to fester to its present state. Gangs of youths roaming the inner city, intimidating and assaulting with impunity.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,442 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    It was just as bad 20 odd years ago by the way, there's something rotten in the state of Ireland


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    From how I see it, Ireland is a very soft touch when it comes to consequences for criminal behaviour.
    The Garda are fighting an uphill battle with very little serious hard line follow through from the courts / prison system when they arrest people.
    The amount of videos out there showing the vicious feral behaviour from young offenders up to adults is horrific and disgusting and no there is no real deterrent for their actions.
    Parent blaming is fair to a point, but still these offenders know themselves what is right from wrong and they themselves should directly suffer the consequences of their own actions.
    As has already been said, Nobody should be getting multiple chances, walking free with 20, 30, 50+ criminal convictions, yet people get locked up for much much less.
    3 Hail Marys, a hug, lollipops and pats on the head "...now be a good little kid and look after yer mammy" hasn't fcukin' worked!
    It's time that someone in the judicial system grew a pair and start playing hard ball with these animals and their scummy behaviour.
    Build more prisons out in the middle of nowhere and start locking people up.
    And before anyone starts their sh!te about prisons don't work, Fcuk them. Come back with that opinion when you have seen people's faces after being slashed wide open, kicked half to death or murdered.
    Get them of the streets!
    Make the country safe for law abiding people to enjoy.
    If they start getting locked up quicker and for longer they might think twice about their behaviour.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 467 ✭✭EddieN75


    These are one of the consequences of becoming a welfare state.

    No push to contribute as the state will house and feed you without question


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,189 ✭✭✭Cilldara_2000


    K.Flyer wrote: »
    From how I see it, Ireland is a very soft touch when it comes to consequences for criminal behaviour.
    The Garda are fighting an uphill battle with very little serious hard line follow through from the courts / prison system when they arrest people.
    The amount of videos out there showing the vicious feral behaviour from young offenders up to adults is horrific and disgusting and no real deterrent for their actions.
    Parent blaming is fair to a point, but still these offenders know themselves right from wrong and they themselves should directly suffer the consequences of their own actions.
    As has already been said, Nobody should be getting multiple chances, walking free with 20, 30, 50+ criminal convictions, yet people get locked up for much much less.
    3 Hail Marys, a hug, lollipops and pats on the head "...now be a good little kid and look after yer mammy" hasn't fcukin' worked!
    It's time that someone in the judicial system grew a pair and start playing hard ball with these animals and their scummy behaviour.
    Build more prisons out in the middle of nowhere and start locking people up.
    And before anyone starts their sh!te about prisons don't work, Fcuk them. Come back with that opinion when you have seen people's faces after being slashed wide open, kicked half to death or murdered.
    Get them of the streets!
    Make the country safe for law abiding people to enjoy.
    If they start getting locked up quicker and for longer they might think twice about their behaviour.

    This tbh. I'm generally a soft left wing pinko and it might well be the case that for an individual prisoner, prison mightn't work in terms of his/her rehabilitation. But it absolutely works for the rest of society if some young psycho isn't out randomly attacking people.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,442 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    EddieN75 wrote: »
    These are one of the consequences of becoming a welfare state.

    No push to contribute as the state will house and feed you without question

    They're not, Sweden is the ultimate welfare state and kids there aren't feral like they are here.
    I don't know what it is but something in our development or lack of development as a society means we have this thuggish class of people that don't exist in other countries in Western Europe except the UK really, not on the same scale.
    I suppose most of the poor in the UK were treated like dirt and it was the same here in Ireland, maybe things were better on the continent.
    It's intergenerational and I'm not sure how it can be got rid of, there are a lot of angry people out there.


  • Registered Users Posts: 164 ✭✭KeepItLight


    K.Flyer wrote: »
    From how I see it, Ireland is a very soft touch when it comes to consequences for criminal behaviour.
    The Garda are fighting an uphill battle with very little serious hard line follow through from the courts / prison system when they arrest people.
    The amount of videos out there showing the vicious feral behaviour from young offenders up to adults is horrific and disgusting and no there is no real deterrent for their actions.
    Parent blaming is fair to a point, but still these offenders know themselves what is right from wrong and they themselves should directly suffer the consequences of their own actions.
    As has already been said, Nobody should be getting multiple chances, walking free with 20, 30, 50+ criminal convictions, yet people get locked up for much much less.
    3 Hail Marys, a hug, lollipops and pats on the head "...now be a good little kid and look after yer mammy" hasn't fcukin' worked!
    It's time that someone in the judicial system grew a pair and start playing hard ball with these animals and their scummy behaviour.
    Build more prisons out in the middle of nowhere and start locking people up.
    And before anyone starts their sh!te about prisons don't work, Fcuk them. Come back with that opinion when you have seen people's faces after being slashed wide open, kicked half to death or murdered.
    Get them of the streets!
    Make the country safe for law abiding people to enjoy.
    If they start getting locked up quicker and for longer they might think twice about their behaviour.

    I think the root of the problem is definitely the legal system and judges.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,522 ✭✭✭Economics101


    Was the law changed a few years ago to allow attachment of earnings/income for non-payers of fines? How well has this change been implemented (I have my doubts)? This is all part of the culture of total immunity from the consequences of wrongdoing foisted on us by "progressive" types. To make things worse, I have heard it said that the attachment orders cannot be made in respect of welfare payments. If so, no wonder people have no respect for rules.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,176 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    They're not, Sweden is the ultimate welfare state and kids there aren't feral like they are here.
    I don't know what it is but something in our development or lack of development as a society means we have this thuggish class of people that don't exist in other countries in Western Europe except the UK really, not on the same scale.
    I suppose most of the poor in the UK were treated like dirt and it was the same here in Ireland, maybe things were better on the continent.
    It's intergenerational and I'm not sure how it can be got rid of, there are a lot of angry people out there.

    Complete nonsense, this goes on in every country.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,501 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    I've had knives pulled by teenagers while in work, they have zero fear.

    What happened to them ?

    Did your employer support the Gardai being called ?

    Any arrests ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,611 ✭✭✭WrenBoy


    They're not, Sweden is the ultimate welfare state and kids there aren't feral like they are here.
    I don't know what it is but something in our development or lack of development as a society means we have this thuggish class of people that don't exist in other countries in Western Europe except the UK really, not on the same scale.
    I suppose most of the poor in the UK were treated like dirt and it was the same here in Ireland, maybe things were better on the continent.
    It's intergenerational and I'm not sure how it can be got rid of, there are a lot of angry people out there.

    ??
    Gangs attack each other with grenades and bombs in Sweden. Its a very large problem there, arguably worse than here.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,442 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    Witcher wrote: »
    Complete nonsense, this goes on in every country.

    It doesn't. I've never been in another city centre were 12 year olds are screaming N*GGER at security guards or running into shops grabbing things and running out again, which I saw just a couple of weeks ago.
    They are far worse here than anywhere I've lived anyway.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    They're not, Sweden is the ultimate welfare state and kids there aren't feral like they are here.
    I don't know what it is but something in our development or lack of development as a society means we have this thuggish class of people that don't exist in other countries in Western Europe except the UK really, not on the same scale.
    I suppose most of the poor in the UK were treated like dirt and it was the same here in Ireland, maybe things were better on the continent.
    It's intergenerational and I'm not sure how it can be got rid of, there are a lot of angry people out there.

    You should visit parts of Malmö.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,176 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    It doesn't. I've never been in another city centre were 12 year olds are screaming N*GGER at security guards or running into shops grabbing things and running out again, which I saw just a couple of weeks ago.
    They are far worse here than anywhere I've lived anyway.

    It does, again...stop talking nonsense.

    'I've never seen it so it doesn't happen'


  • Registered Users Posts: 233 ✭✭andala


    The problem is these days nobody seems to be responsible for anything, even when you fall, you demand (and often get) money from insurance. Unless we, as society, implement a system that will reward good behaviour and force the antisocial behaviour to be re-educated, things will only get worse.

    I'd suggest keeping child benefit in its present form for up to 3 children and in the form of tax credits for 4th child up. This way you can have more children if you can afford them.

    People with criminal record should be on the bottom of housing lists and should have no say in where they get housed.

    If your child commits an offence more than twice, your social welfare payment should be docket to pay the damage and both you and your child should do an obligatory course in what it means to be part of society.

    Long term unemployed should either be involved in full time upskillng courses or given simple jobs.

    Free legal ad should be limited to say 5 times/lifetime.

    If your child is always unsupervised and commits numerous offences, you should have them taken away and put in a foster home. Often children who don't have a role model, grow up to perpetuate the cycle of violence/poverty


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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,442 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    You should visit parts of Malmö.

    I believe there are some rough immigrant areas, I'd say they're a walk in the park compared to some of the kips we have in Dublin though. Certain factions like to blow social problems in Sweden involving immigrants out of proportion to suit their agendas.


  • Registered Users Posts: 164 ✭✭KeepItLight


    I believe there are some rough immigrant areas, I'd say they're a walk in the park compared to some of the kips we have in Dublin though. Certain factions like to blow social problems in Sweden involving immigrants out of proportion to suit their agendas.

    Sweden has a x12 higher rape rate than Ireland


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,442 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    Sweden has a x12 higher rape rate than Ireland

    I wasn't talking about rape, just general thuggery from youth.


  • Posts: 14,344 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    Indeed, if it's one thing that history has taught us over and over again it's that violence is always the solution to society's problems :rolleyes:

    If this thread starts going down a rabbit hole with nonsense like this it'll be closed immediately




    It might not seem popular, but there is some truth to it. My sister would be the stereotype scumbag and also the people she associated with. Nothing tames them quicker than a good hiding.


    The truth is, that the current generation were never touched. It simply never happened to them, as that kind of thing had phased out, so much so that I genuinely do not actually think that the youth of today even consider it as a consequence at all.


    I reckon if you grabbed a teen these days they'd go into shock.


  • Registered Users Posts: 164 ✭✭KeepItLight


    I wasn't talking about rape, just general thuggery from youth.

    surely a x12 higher rate of rape is an indicator of a higher level of thuggery in general?

    I think its fairly obvious that as bad as Ireland is for youth crime, the UK, Belgium, France & Sweden much worse.


  • Registered Users Posts: 78 ✭✭Tommo 76


    Absolutely shocking but not surprised there are some serious amount of evil bastardos among us .

    Dublin city is a cess pool, we need to see Garda presence, rare if none at all on the beat and young gang's everywhere.

    The Gardai’s hands are somewhat tied by the inept judicial system. They get treated as minors and are just given a warning. They don’t fear the system at all that’s the problem, you see these people with multiple convictions and then the “come from a disadvantaged background etc” line is thrown about and away they go again…


  • Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    surely a x12 higher rate of rape is an indicator of a higher level of thuggery in general?

    I think its fairly obvious that as bad as Ireland is for youth crime, the UK, Belgium, France & Sweden much worse.

    No.
    Sexual crimes are not an indicator of thuggery in general.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,678 ✭✭✭mrslancaster


    the lack of a role model is a huge one, ....

    Unfortunately a lot of young thugs have a lot of role models in their communities. Older thugs, drug dealers, those involved in robbery & fraud who they see getting away with crimes & no consequences.

    Edit...or worse, actually profiting from crime.


  • Registered Users Posts: 164 ✭✭KeepItLight


    bubblypop wrote: »
    No.
    Sexual crimes are not an indicator of thuggery in general.

    according to you, but I think that its clearly the opposite.

    anyways, not taking this further off topic


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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,442 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    surely a x12 higher rate of rape is an indicator of a higher level of thuggery in general?

    I think its fairly obvious that as bad as Ireland is for youth crime, the UK, Belgium, France & Sweden much worse.

    Well we're kind of famous for child abuse what does that say about us?


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