The social housing list in Dublin

Lmkrnr

Can you criticize this even though Irish people have been using social housing ect in other countries on a grand scale? Uk in the 70/80s. United States since the famine ect.

I would rather a foreign Bosnian/Nigerian next door to me then an Irish Gangster type, layabout family or a member of a certain Irish Community.

Hamachi

Lmkrnr wrote: »

Can you criticize this even though Irish people have been using social housing ect in other countries on a grand scale? Uk in the 70/80s. United States since the famine ect.

I would rather a foreign Bosnian/Nigerian next door to me then an Irish Gangster type, layabout family or a member of a certain Irish Community.

Have you data suggesting that Irish people have availed of social housing in the UK and the US on an industrial scale? How many are we talking about? Thousands, tens of thousands? Given the focus on metrics, please provide that stat.

Personally, I would rather a Bosnian and Nigerian was not in Ireland at all unless they arrived here legally, via a demonstrable skillset that ensures that they are employable and do not become a burden on the state.

BobbyBolivia

Lmkrnr wrote: »

Can you criticize this even though Irish people have been using social housing ect in other countries on a grand scale? Uk in the 70/80s. United States since the famine ect.

I would rather a foreign Bosnian/Nigerian next door to me then an Irish Gangster type, layabout family or a member of a certain Irish Community.

When did we go to other countries and abuse their welfare systems? The Irish who immigrated to these places worked. They did not leech. Please provide the statistics on that nonsense claim.

There is no reason for us to have swathes of Nigerians etc. According to EU law asylum seekers are to be processed at the first EU country they meet. There are no direct flights here from Nigeria. Rinse and repeat for the other countries where the majority of our claims are coming from. The vast majority of asylum seekers would enter another country before here. There is a reason they come this far and it is because of the fact they tie the system up in knots with appeal after appeal, then get access to one of the most generous welfare systems in the world.

We have enough scroungers, we do not need to import more!

I don't know if you noticed but we have a housing crisis at the moment and the vast majority of 20 something year olds in Ireland have no prospect at home ownership until well into their 30's, and that's usually if they manage to find a partner.

We should under absolutely zero f*cking circumstances be allowing people to come into this country and house them when normal working contributing people cannot get housing. It's an absolute f*cking disgrace.

ThunbergsAreGo

Lmkrnr wrote: »

Can you criticize this even though Irish people have been using social housing ect in other countries on a grand scale? Uk in the 70/80s. United States since the famine ect.

I would rather a foreign Bosnian/Nigerian next door to me then an Irish Gangster type, layabout family or a member of a certain Irish Community.

What about a foreign Nigerian gangster type or a member of a certain Roma community?

Wed all like nice tenants beside us regardless of nationality, however the more requesting state accommodation, the more it costs. And it's going to grow and grow

Graces7

BobbyBolivia wrote: »

I don't know if you noticed but we have a housing crisis at the moment and the vast majority of 20 something year olds in Ireland have no prospect at home ownership until well into their 30's, and that's usually if they manage to find a partner.

.

In my lifetime we basically never owned a house unless we married. Or were left one. I was in rented accommodation until my mother's death when I was nearly 40 years old.

And that was the norm.

Is the idea of universal home ownership in 20s the norm here?

Hamachi

Graces7 wrote: »

Is the idea of universal home ownership in 20s the norm here?

Surely if you’ve lived in Ireland for some time, you’ve understood that home ownership is a massive priority for a huge amount of people by their late 20s / early 30s?

That’s the age of family formation when people settle down and start having children. It’s not an unrealistic expectation that somebody working full time should be able to get on the housing ladder to provide a permanent abode for their families.

tommybrees

oceanman wrote: »

how do you know many of those people dont have jobs? people in low paid jobs qualify for social housing too.

They ain't working mate trust me

Mimon

Idbatterim wrote: »

Absolutely, they thought this was the path of least resistance, they are terrified of rte and the leftist media.... open door for a party to form and start with welfare reform. Abolish lpt or start charging it at a proper rate ...

Definitely, and we are not talking about some sort of abhorrent hardcore Tory agenda that we see from across the water.

A party that had some common sense policy where people who are getting up in the morning whatever the level their earnings are rewarded would have a very solid voting base.

Strange that the people who call themselves the left here actually advocate more for people who do **** all to contribute to society instead of the working people who they should be looking after.

Mimon

Hamachi wrote: »

Thanks for posting that stat. Now that is infuriating.

Have no issue with hard working people on a low wage availing of social housing. Similarly, when somebody is physically or cognitively incapable of work, they should have all the resources they require at their disposal.

However, people who simply opt not to work should not have the option of living on the largesse of the Irish taxpayer. It really makes of mockery of trying to live your life the right way.

Nailed it here with this post.

Dublin especially is so expensive for accommodation that working people who cannot afford to buy themselves should be at the top of the list i.e. people who are contributing to the city and society but happen to be in lower paying jobs.

Bonkers that this doesn't happen.

Cilldara_2000

Mimon wrote: »

Definitely, and we are not talking about some sort of abhorrent hardcore Tory agenda that we see from across the water.

A party that had some common sense policy where people who are getting up in the morning whatever the level their earnings see a decent benefit for doing that are rewarded would have a very solid voting base.

Strange that the people who call themselves the left here actually advocate more for people who do **** all to contribute to society instead of the working people who they should be looking after.

What would be the specifics of this non-Tory hardcore social welfare reform?

Murph_D

BobbyBolivia wrote: »

According to EU law asylum seekers are to be processed at the first EU country they meet.

This is a bit of a myth, as is the notion that Ireland is particularly attractive to asylum seekers and other immigrants.

Some clarification here on the 'first country' myth. You're thinking of the 'Dublin Regulations', but the issue is not as straightforward as you suggest.

https://www.amnesty.org.uk/truth-about-refugees

More bull****-busting info here: https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php?title=Asylum_statistics#Main_countries_of_destination:_Germany.2C_Spain_and_France

Mimon

Cilldara_2000 wrote: »

What would be the specifics of this non-Tory hardcore social welfare reform?

For a start able bodied people who get off their arses and work for a living need to be at the top of the social housing queue. Anyone not working needs to be behind these people.

For me it is fairer than the system we employ now and I would vote for anyone who implemented this.

goose2005

Idbatterim wrote: »

Just sign up as soon as you can, a mate was telling me that in London, they used to rent out their social house and pocket the rent...

Many of the flats in Grenfell Tower were illegally sublet in that manner, with the result that no-one really knows how many people died because so many of them were off the books

Topgear on Dave

JimmyVik wrote: »

I shared a bedsit with a friend of mine from school in Rathmines right after we left school.
We were there about 2 years and I moved abroad to get a job.
He stayed and never worked a day in his life.
About 15 years later, he was given 1 bed apartment in Rathmines.
I was in it last year and its fantastic. It must be worth €500k at this point.
Nice to see my tax money has been well spent.

I find this an extremely tall story to believe. A single man about 35/40, prime working age, seeking his own apartment from the council?

Surely he would be laughed out the door of the council office.

20/20

Here is another example of luxury social housing. These are on the Howth Road in Raheny with stunning views over Dublin Bay when the sun is out. This promo video on a foggy day does not show the area at its best. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_CscqEYFwA . Two family's are interviewed about their new homes. You can decide where they are from.

There are 40 Apts in the scheme http://assigned.ie/project/blankbanks-apartments-raheny-dublin-5/ and all gone to social housing. Five are three bedroom units , would love to know the rent paid for these. Here is a different Apt scheme on the same road only 180 meters away charging €2775 per month (furnished). https://www.daft.ie/for-rent/apartment-3-bedroom-apartment-occu-strand-view-howth-road-raheny-dublin-5/3196903 .

The majority of the homes nearby on the Howth Road are worth in excess of €800,000 with some over a million, so I guess there will not be much social inclusion.

clytemnestra

20/20 wrote: »

Here is another example of luxury social housing. These are on the Howth Road in Raheny with stunning views over Dublin Bay when the sun is out. This promo video on a foggy day does not show the area at its best. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_CscqEYFwA . Two family's are interviewed about their new homes. You can decide where they are from.

There are 40 Apts in the scheme http://assigned.ie/project/blankbanks-apartments-raheny-dublin-5/ and all gone to social housing. Five are three bedroom units , would love to know the rent paid for these. Here is a different Apt scheme on the same road only 180 meters away charging €2775 per month (furnished). https://www.daft.ie/for-rent/apartment-3-bedroom-apartment-occu-strand-view-howth-road-raheny-dublin-5/3196903 .

The majority of the homes nearby on the Howth Road are worth in excess of €800,000 with some over a million, so I guess there will not be much social inclusion.

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/news/its-like-a-dream-come-true-mother-of-three-receives-key-to-new-home-after-13-year-wait-on-housing-list-37604917.html

https://www.constructionbusiness.ie/opening-of-e11-million-social-housing-development-in-dublin/

https://www.broadsheet.ie/2017/11/20/meanwhile-in-clongriffin/

Bit of a theme here all right. The high allocation of social housing to non Irish people is already causing division and anger within comnunities and we will be feeling the social fallout from this for many years to come.

Patrick2010

Murph_D wrote: »

This is a bit of a myth, as is the notion that Ireland is particularly attractive to asylum seekers and other immigrants.

Some clarification here on the 'first country' myth. You're thinking of the 'Dublin Regulations', but the issue is not as straightforward as you suggest.

https://www.amnesty.org.uk/truth-about-refugees

More bull****-busting info here: https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php?title=Asylum_statistics#Main_countries_of_destination:_Germany.2C_Spain_and_France

Ireland will become very attractive as a destination once the word spreads that you are guaranteed your own accommodation after only 4 months in the country at the expense of the locals

EddieN75

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

I find this an extremely tall story to believe. A single man about 35/40, prime working age, seeking his own apartment from the council?

Surely he would be laughed out the door of the council office.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/social-tenants-in-rathgar-complex-excluded-from-certain-facilities-1.4415042

This guy managed to get one worth 700k to 900k

Ramasun

Most people on the social housing list don't want to live next to people on the social housing list.

Could there be grades on the social housing list?

IngazZagni

20/20 wrote: »

Here is another example of luxury social housing. These are on the Howth Road in Raheny with stunning views over Dublin Bay when the sun is out. This promo video on a foggy day does not show the area at its best. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_CscqEYFwA . Two family's are interviewed about their new homes. You can decide where they are from.

There are 40 Apts in the scheme http://assigned.ie/project/blankbanks-apartments-raheny-dublin-5/ and all gone to social housing. Five are three bedroom units , would love to know the rent paid for these. Here is a different Apt scheme on the same road only 180 meters away charging €2775 per month (furnished). https://www.daft.ie/for-rent/apartment-3-bedroom-apartment-occu-strand-view-howth-road-raheny-dublin-5/3196903 .

The majority of the homes nearby on the Howth Road are worth in excess of €800,000 with some over a million, so I guess there will not be much social inclusion.

This is infuriating to see. I want to know why is it when the general public are blocked out from buying or renting these properties it is okay because it will become social housing? This is a lovely development. I passed it before and I knew I couldn't afford to get one. I'll have to go elsewhere and I certainly won't have sea views all because I had the audacity to earn a bit more than the threshold for social housing!

Murph_D

Patrick2010 wrote: »

Ireland will become very attractive as a destination once the word spreads that you are guaranteed your own accommodation after only 4 months in the country at the expense of the locals

This is simply not true.

20/20

Murph_D wrote: »

This is simply not true.

What is not true. How do you know.

EddieN75

Murph_D wrote: »

This is simply not true.

It is true actually.

Cal4567

Hamachi wrote: »

Have you data suggesting that Irish people have availed of social housing in the UK and the US on an industrial scale? How many are we talking about? Thousands, tens of thousands? Given the focus on metrics, please provide that stat.

Personally, I would rather a Bosnian and Nigerian was not in Ireland at all unless they arrived here legally, via a demonstrable skillset that ensures that they are employable and do not become a burden on the state.

The 1950s generation who emigrated in their thousands to the UK, year on year, and into the 1960s. Most of them started in poor private rented accommodation. A very small number aspired into home ownership. Most moved into council accommodation in the 1960s when they started to raise families. Just a personal experience of visiting cousins in the 1970s onwards in both Birmingham and London. Most of their children are now in their 50s and 60s themselves and started to get in adulthood in the 1980s. They ended up being better educated than their parents, and were able to use that education to get better higher paid employment. They bought their own homes. A fairly typical 2nd generation immigrant experience.

When I first went to the UK in the 1970s to work I lived in council estates in both Birmingham and London which seemed to be full of the Irish.

Jane98

There has been a lot of negative press aimed at investment funds in the last few days, buying up whole housing developments.

The reality is that they wouldn't be doing it, if County Councils weren't willing to enter into 25 year leases with them. I'd love to see a copy of the leases to see how much exactly it is costing CCs (but really the taxpayer). Somehow I don't think they will be sticking to the HAP limits.

Also, if someone gets social housing, do they ever have to give it back or is it their 'forever home'? If we take the extreme example, if someone wins the lotto and has a social house, do they have to give it back?

OneEightSeven

Murph_D wrote: »

This is simply not true.

It will be under Roderic O'Gorman's proposal to reform Direct Provision.

oceanman

Jane98 wrote: »

There has been a lot of negative press aimed at investment funds in the last few days, buying up whole housing developments.

The reality is that they wouldn't be doing it, if County Councils weren't willing to enter into 25 year leases with them. I'd love to see a copy of the leases to see how much exactly it is costing CCs (but really the taxpayer). Somehow I don't think they will be sticking to the HAP limits.

Also, if someone gets social housing, do they ever have to give it back or is it their 'forever home'? If we take the extreme example, if someone wins the lotto and has a social house, do they have to give it back?

probably not.... but how many people win the lotto?

Jane98

oceanman wrote: »

probably not.... but how many people win the lotto?

I did say it was an extreme example but what about those whose income increases at least paying market rent? Why does the taxpayer have to subsidise social housing tenants for the rest of their lives?

oceanman

Jane98 wrote: »

I did say it was an extreme example but what about those whose income increases at least paying market rent? Why does the taxpayer have to subsidise social housing tenants for the rest of their lives?

if your income increases you rent increases also..

Jizique

Jane98 wrote: »

There has been a lot of negative press aimed at investment funds in the last few days, buying up whole housing developments.

The reality is that they wouldn't be doing it, if County Councils weren't willing to enter into 25 year leases with them. I'd love to see a copy of the leases to see how much exactly it is costing CCs (but really the taxpayer). Somehow I don't think they will be sticking to the HAP limits.

This is the big issue which is being ignored; the commentary is that these properties will be rented - they may be, but they will be rented to the councils at exorbitant guaranteed rates with inflation-proofing for 25 years