Vaccine Megathread - See OP for threadbans

And packing out places, I could be just negative but I can't see it[/QUOTE]

Just before the "axe fell" in March 2020 I dropped the youngest fella & his mates off to a massive teenage "disco".....apprx 1500 young uns wearing next to nowt, packed like sardines & they swapping saliva with each other till early hours. I genuinely feel sad thinking of that night....cant see him or his peers doing normal teenage 'coming of age' for next few years

Dressoutlet

hmmm wrote: »

By make it "open access" I mean if we get to a situation where the 60+ group are vaccinated, and we are getting deliveries of AZ vaccine which is going unused. The benefits from my perspective significantly outweigh the miniscule risk, and I'm sure many others would feel the same.

Yes I do think it's good to offer it in this way, but it should be made clear that this is an opt in vaccine, in a sense. And not have people under 60 say no and then get nothing because the criteria is they can have it if they're aware of the risks.

francogarbanzo

Sanjuro wrote: »

Glad to see we're straight off the bat here with the science-backed evidence.

OMG I f*cking love science!! Do you have any science articles I can skim about whether or not I should believe that vaccines will get us back to normal?

rm212

ACitizenErased wrote: »

The advice is for nobody under 60 to get the astrazeneca vaccine

Unless you’ve already got a first dose and you have a medical condition. Otherwise, if you got your first dose and don’t have a medical condition, wait 16 weeks from your first dose so we can make sure the second dose is safe.

Dressoutlet

ACitizenErased wrote: »

???
The National Immunisation Advisory Committee (NIAC) have today revised recommendations for the use of Vaxzevria/AstraZeneca. In line with these recommendations:

• all of those aged 60 years and older can get any authorised COVID-19 vaccine, including Vaxzevria/AstraZeneca
• Vaxzevria/AstraZeneca is not recommended for those aged under 60 years including those with medical conditions with very high or high risk of severe COVID-19 disease

The previous advice was to add it as a side effect to the list and print new brochures, not give a choice

I literally watched the conference, Dr Nolan answered a journalist question about it. She said The advice is it can be given to under 60s so long as they're aware of the side effects.

Parachutes

Parachutes wrote: »

All this talk of masks and distancing forever are very worrying to me as a concerned citizen.

Remember. We are talking about a virus with a 99.7% survival rate and is basically a non-issue to the vast majority of the population.

You can fool some of the people some of the time, but you can’t fool all of the people all of the time. If things don’t return to normality soon, like minded patriots like myself will have no other option but flexing our God given rights.

Eww.

ACitizenErased

Dressoutlet wrote: »

I literally watched the conference, Dr Nolan answered a journalist question about it. She said The advice is it can be given to under 60s so long as they're aware of the side effects.

Are you on a wind up? The advice is literally written out
https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/47463-statement-from-acting-chief-medical-officer-dr-ronan-glynn-monday-12-april-2021/

hmmm

hmmm wrote: »

That's what I don't quite understand about those saying this won't impact on the rollout.

If we are keeping AZ for the 60-70 year old group, isn't that going to delay them getting a vaccine? Will people be happy if (say) the 50 year olds have their vaccinations finished before the 60 year olds.

And if we do use all available vaccines for the 60 year old groups, we're going to be left with deliveries of a vaccine we can't use.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that it won't have any impact, just that the impact is not necessarily as severe as some are claiming.

Let's see what plan the HSE come up with.

By the way we were always going to end up with a surplus of vaccines we can't use, as we ordered more than we need. We did that to mitigate against these kinds of risks.

Dressoutlet

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Are you on a wind up? The advice is literally written out
https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/47463-statement-from-acting-chief-medical-officer-dr-ronan-glynn-monday-12-april-2021/

No I am not on a wind up. Go and watch the conference. She said the words out of her own mouth live on TV

Parachutes

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Eww.

Sorry, I forgot it’s not politically correct to love your country. Wouldn’t stop me though.

Strazdas

Dressoutlet wrote: »

I literally watched the conference, Dr Nolan answered a journalist question about it. She said The advice is it can be given to under 60s so long as they're aware of the side effects.

I heard her say that too - they may need to give further clarification on this just to stop any confusion.

ACitizenErased

Dressoutlet wrote: »

No I am not on a wind up. Go and watch the conference. She said the words out of her own mouth live on TV

It doesn't matter what she said, the advice is in writing

Mrs OBumble

drunkmonkey wrote: »

. Mandatory vaccinations for children will be the final straw for me, we'll be getting the first flight out of here if they try it.

Where do you think will take you?

Parachutes

Parachutes wrote: »

All this talk of masks and distancing forever are very worrying to me as a concerned citizen.

Remember. We are talking about a virus with a 99.7% survival rate and is basically a non-issue to the vast majority of the population.

You can fool some of the people some of the time, but you can’t fool all of the people all of the time. If things don’t return to normality soon, like minded patriots like myself will have no other option but flexing our God given rights.

Death rate will be even lower with the vaccines as well.

Chris_5339762

The problem with this virus is twofold.

1) There is no decent middle ground where you can have an acceptable amount of virus, with an acceptable amount of economic opening. You either have an unacceptably high amount of virus, or an unacceptably low amount of economy due to lockdown.

2) Yes, it has a 99.7% survival rate, or whatever the exact figure is. It's high. But long-covid is a huge issue which means you can't just let it rip and in any case, the bigger issue is a relatively high percentage of people need ICU. ICU capacity is the bottleneck everywhere.

I think the vaccine will help, definitely. It'll certainly help with 1).

I really hope it will end it, but the longer this goes on for, the more I worry about it. Unless we're all like Israel, we'll have to keep with restrictions of some form because of (2), which will mean the death of tourism, aviation and any mass events. People don't want to accept that, but will they just have to? I don't know.

WoollyRedHat

Dressoutlet wrote: »

Yes I do think it's good to offer it in this way, but it should be made clear that this is an opt in vaccine, in a sense. And not have people under 60 say no and then get nothing because the criteria is they can have it if they're aware of the risks.

That's not how it's going to pan out, it's for down the line and presuming recommendation doesn't change. In the short term, under 60s will not be offered AZ vaccine, it will be used only on the Over 60s cohort and they will no longer get offered other two available vaccines, if they have yet to receive first dose.. You may see the possibility of people under 60 down the line getting chance to opt to take AZ one if there was a surplus of that one and shortage of others.

Calahonda52

ACitizenErased wrote: »

The advice is for nobody under 60 to get the astrazeneca vaccine

Based on the expected kill rate from Covid

If you are over 60, she said, then you are 85 times more likely to die from Covid than suffer a clotting event and that is taking the most cautious use of the data.

For people aged 20 to 34, that falls to twice as likely to die from Covid.

Parachutes

Parachutes wrote: »

Sorry, I forgot it’s not politically correct to love your country. Wouldn’t stop me though.

You don't need to explain yourself, I've already seen all that I need to.

Dressoutlet

Strazdas wrote: »

I heard her say that too - they may need to give further clarification on this just to stop any confusion.

Thank you. They seem have left it open for the people who want it can still get it. When the time comes that there's surplus AZ I assume. Jesus Christ I hate being contradicted

Timberrrrrrrr

Parachutes wrote: »

All this talk of masks and distancing forever are very worrying to me as a concerned citizen.

Remember. We are talking about a virus with a 99.7% survival rate and is basically a non-issue to the vast majority of the population.

You can fool some of the people some of the time, but you can’t fool all of the people all of the time. If things don’t return to normality soon, like minded patriots like myself will have no other option but flexing our God given rights.

Oh please do expand on this, what are your "god given rights" and what will you be "flexing"?

Parachutes

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

The problem with this virus is twofold.

1) There is no decent middle ground where you can have an acceptable amount of virus, with an acceptable amount of economic opening. You either have an unacceptably high amount of virus, or an unacceptably low amount of economy due to lockdown.

2) Yes, it has a 99.7% survival rate, or whatever the exact figure is. It's high. But long-covid is a huge issue which means you can't just let it rip and in any case, the bigger issue is a relatively high percentage of people need ICU. ICU capacity is the bottleneck everywhere.

I think the vaccine will help, definitely. It'll certainly help with 1).

I really hope it will end it, but the longer this goes on for, the more I worry about it. Unless we're all like Israel, we'll have to keep with restrictions of some form because of (2), which will mean the death of tourism, aviation and any mass events. People don't want to accept that, but will they just have to? I don't know.

As a nation we have survived famines, wars, disasters. We’ll get through this as well.

francogarbanzo

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Eww.

I know right? Ick!

Can’t wait to get my vaccines!

Turtwig

hmmm wrote: »

By make it "open access" I mean if we get to a situation where the 60+ group are vaccinated, and we are getting deliveries of AZ vaccine which is going unused. The benefits from my perspective significantly outweigh the miniscule risk, and I'm sure many others would feel the same.

To a point. If you're talking about a very low risk group then you need consider the implications of a mass vaccination programme. How likely is everyone in Ireland that is, say, 25 years age to get COVID 19? It's reasonable to assume they wouldn't all get COVID. Only a very small % of those who would get infected would die from the disease. If you did a mass vaccination of the 25 year olds you could end up with more dead from the vaccine than would have died from COVID. Even if to each individual their risk of an adverse reaction from AZ was astronomically low. The population pool of those vaccinated would likely be thousands of times greater than those infected with COVID. It's possible that not everyone should be given the open access choice: the odds would be in the individual's favours but not in the population's.

stephenjmcd

Dressoutlet wrote: »

Thank you. They seem have left it open for the people who want it can still get it. When the time comes that there's surplus AZ I assume. Jesus Christ I hate being contradicted

She may have misspoken perhaps. The statements are out on government websites now etc and it's pretty clear to be honest that nobody under 60 will be offered dose 1 of AZ at the moment.

Perhaps she means at some point in the future or if medical advice for that person dictated they couldn't have mRNA?

Rebelbrowser

The whole thing is so confused. Watched the press conference. Clear priority was reassuring the over 60s that its safe to get. Loads of stats to prove that. But all it did was raise the question of why they were banning it for under 60s then? They didn't seem to get that with every word of reassurance they were completely undermining that decision. On the stats they gave themselves banning it for 55 to 59 cohort is barmy. Only possible explanation is if they think the second jabs and over 60s jabs will use up all the AZ, but is that the case - I thought not?

hmmm

WoollyRedHat wrote: »

That's not how it's going to pan out, it's for down the line and presuming recommendation doesn't change. In the short term, under 60s will not be offered AZ vaccine, it will be used only on the Over 60s cohort. You may see the possibility of people under 60 down the line getting chance to opt to take AZ one down the line, it there was a surplus and shortage of other vaccines.

That sounds very reasonable. A slight delay in vaccinations, we should catch up quickly, and unused vaccines can be made available to those who want to get vaccinated faster and accept the risk.

And over the next few weeks hopefully we'll know more about the risk and the cause of it, and possibly a way to identify who is at risk.

Parachutes

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Oh please do expand on this, what are your "god given rights" and what will you be "flexing"?

Political protest and protest through non-compliance. I make no apology, freedom is a god given right, not something that can be taken away at a whim by the likes of Michael Martin, Varadkar and their cronies.

There definitely was a comment about how AZ could be given to someone under 60 if the balance of benefit to risk warranted it in their individual situation. I'd interpret that as allowing someone at high risk of covid to get AZ if for some reason another vaccine was not available.

stephenjmcd

Flying Fox wrote: »

There definitely was a comment about how AZ could be given to someone under 60 if the balance of benefit to risk warranted it in their individual situation. I'd interpret that as allowing someone at high risk of covid to get AZ if for some reason another vaccine was not available.

That would make sense for allergies etc or if someone is unable to take an mRNA vaccine on medical grounds etc

Timberrrrrrrr

Parachutes wrote: »

Political protest and protest through non-compliance. I make no apology, freedom is a god given right, not something that can be taken away at a whim by the likes of Michael Martin, Varadkar and their cronies.

Ah right, so nothing really? Waving a placard around and then running away when the guards show up :pac:

I thought with the tough talk you were being a bit more serious, ah well.