Cross-border review of rail network officially launched

riddlinrussell

I would also argue that being in the era of (maybe overly) strict feasibility and planning means that anyone who gets a feasibility study over the line for a new single track to wherever is likely getting a report back saying "In order to make this route viable, dual tracking and signaling improvements would first be required on line x to achieve suitable service patterns on the new route"

The country has built basically no new rail, especially not in the era of heavy scrutiny of plans, so its unlikely proposals to fire lines up to Cavan will take top billing. (Not that Cavan doesn't deserve rail access!)

cgcsb

The Cavan thing is just the wildest part of the strategy. Everything else does make some sense. I'm surprised that the portadown to mullingar thing got included as a brand new line but connecting Cork City to around 50,000 people in nearby towns in West Cork didn't.

riddlinrussell

I'd disagree that it's that wild, Armagh is a pretty big city in NI not to have a railway link, but the line as a whole would provide an entirely separate backbone line to the network rather than having the sole north-south link being the congested coastal route. Adding that line gives options for Derry to Dublin trains via Portadown, alternative route for Belfast trains and just generally not requiring all trains to run via Dublin.

If built as a modern route to modern standards its not going to be a meandering, painfully slow line, couple it with dualling of the Mullingar to Maynooth line and you've got a fairly good option.

Compare that to West Cork, yes there are a decent number of people who could be served, but does it serve a greater purpose in the network? It just adds new lines that will probably not even terminate connected to the rest of the network (without tunneling under Cork). Again, not saying it shouldn't happen!

I think the worst aspect of the AIRR plan is the 'other decarbonised railways', if youre building a new line, electrifying it from the outset is really a drop in the bucket of the total cost, so it would be crazy not to do it. Similarly building new single track lines, modern scoping would probably require you to plan ahead for dualling anyway, so dual sized land take, and dual spaced bridges, if you're going to all that effort (which you should be) then going the whole way, or at least having significant passing loop sections is a no-brainer.

notJoeJoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831689#Comment_121831689

What I find really stupid is that there's a double-tracked electrified line right from Dublin to Derry - great! Awesome! I'd love that! - but then they build a single-tracked unelectrified line to Letterkenny...? So Letterkenny-Dublin/Belfast services can't happen? Unless the electric trains also carry batteries on board, but only for 30 kilometres of track?

riddlinrussell

Battery electric hybrids I'd say will definitely feature fairly heavily in the network, full electrification won't happen overnight.

That line would likely just use spare hybrid stock that will already be available. But yes as a new line from whole cloth, it would be pretty weird not to electrify by default.

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831753#Comment_121831753

Through running of trains via Derry to Letterkenny would be incredibly difficult. Even getting a line from LK to Derry to terminate in the same station would be incredibly difficult!

Really though I imagine they just chose minimum option in the report to try get CBA to get a bit closer to 1. For lines where expected service freq is not that high it's likely harder to justify too

loyatemu

they should have just had these as "proposed future lines" and left out the spec, which will be decided closer to the time anyway, if they're ever actually built.

Consonata

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121833033#Comment_121833033

Really is odd because by the time it would be finished, Derry will likely have a population to warrant a commuter rail network to places like Letterkenny and Coleraine, and would need electrification for that.

The big cost for the line though is getting the line into Letterkenny, as the old alignment is almost entirely gone on both ends. Using Craigavon bridge as would be done before would be impossible, and on the LK side, there is a fairly substantial shopping centre built on the site of the old terminus, and arguably the only real good place for a train station to be given LK's very odd urban landscape.

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121833917#Comment_121833917

Craigavon bridge never carried a line as such, the lower deck was a sort of siding owned by the harbour using to move wagons across the river, the bends on either side were not suitable for a full train.

L1011

Derry-Letterkenny was never well linked from a track layout perspective and, considering that the alignments were narrow gauge anyway, it's probably best to forget they ever existed and plan any future Derry-Letterkenny line completely afresh

notJoeJoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121833033#Comment_121833033

I've thought that it might be worth reviving a second terminating station like Foyle Road. A station on the other side of the river, located just south of the railway museum. It would be a far more convenient location than Waterside, and it could specifically be built to take the Dublin-Derry trains. The main downside though is lack of connectivity between a new Foyle Road station and Waterside station. Perhaps they could be linked by a pedestrian subway.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121833917#Comment_121833917

If I was designing the Letterkenny train station, I'd take the opportunity to knock down the Retail Park and completely redesign the whole area around the station. It'd hopefully be friendlier to pedestrians and cyclists and have all the shops as well as apartments, providing the town with a new neighbourhood. Obviously getting to Sligo would be much more difficult from such a location, but we'll cross that bridge when it comes to it (in 50 years).

OisinCooke

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121889988#Comment_121889988

While I see your point here, and it definitely would be easier, the problem with infrastructure in this country is the way everything has been done up until now has been the cheapest, or the easiest way of building things and personally I think for the recommendations in this Review to work properly, we need to make the big bold moves, in the interest of the future of the country and the environment. Build a direct double track electrified spine through the north midlands from Mullingar to Derry via Monaghan Cavan, turnback at Portadowm, Armagh, and Strabane, demolish the museum and reroute the road over Craigavon bridge to have Waterside station be a huge interchange station, and electrify the lines to Letterkenny, Colraine and Limvady. Build DART Underground, quad track the Northern Line, electrify Dublin to Cork, reconnect the Western Rail Corridor, do all the things that we’ll regret not doing in 30 years time and do them well. Money is definitely a constraint for these kinds of things, but definitely as much as it’s been made out to be in the past with such projects. Do them, and do them well while we have the perfect opportunity to do so. The Rail Review needs to be taken seriously, for everyone’s good.