Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread XII (The Byrne Supremacy)

arsebiscuits1

FellasFellas wrote: »

Signing on Healy, Earls, Sexton and Pom early on only to lose Furlong at the final hurdle would be peak IRFU.

I also hate whatever establishment is currently in place fellow like minded free thinker :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Honestly - people don't have to like it but the IRFU have been incredibly shrewd with their decisions in the last few years and have managed to keep their top players in Ireland.

Bringing in Nucifora (a wildly unpopular man because of the decisions he has to make but someone actually adept at their job) was a great step because previously all pro game matters were decided by the IRFU committee and an older director who were all by products of the amateur game without a proper grasp on the modern pro game.

They were the ones who initially didn't think Sexton would leave.

Since they learnt and adapted from that Ireland has actually been in a pretty good place.

I know people love hating on establishments because their need to serve everyone doesn't necessarily fall in line with peoples exact desires but as far as compromises that need to be made for everyone by a governing body - the IRFU do a very good job

Squidgy Black

FrannoFan wrote: »

would he though?
two years still 30 and able to negotiate another big deal as you'd imagine he will still be top of his game.
like longer contract doesn't necessarily suit the player.

This is probably his twilight zone in terms of money, you're right in that a longer contract doesn't necessarily suit most players but there's a strong chance this is his peak earning years so if he can get a longer contract at a big figure now it's less of a gamble than going back in two years time and his value dropping.

hahashake

His reported previous contract isn't particularly high in the grand scheme of things and I doubt the IRFU is in the position to radically increase it. Could be close to doubling his money, which would be enough for anyone to have second thoughts.

Yeah_Right

FrannoFan wrote: »

would he though?
two years still 30 and able to negotiate another big deal as you'd imagine he will still be top of his game.
like longer contract doesn't necessarily suit the player.

I'm wondering if the IRFU are pushing for a 3 year contract to tie him down through the next RWC. Then they can negotiate a shorter deal with the expectation that he won't be the top TH for 2027 RWC. If Furlong only signs a 2 year deal now, then he holds all the cards negotiating a contract just before the 2023 RWC.

cameramonkey

Yeah_Right wrote: »

I'm wondering if the IRFU are pushing for a 3 year contract to tie him down through the next RWC. Then they can negotiate a shorter deal with the expectation that he won't be the top TH for 2027 RWC. If Furlong only signs a 2 year deal now, then he holds all the cards negotiating a contract just before the 2023 RWC.

I would not say all the cards. If he does not sign to an Irish club he does not play at the WC. That is a pretty strong card for the IRFU.

Dubinusa

I hope he stays, but his financial future should be his priority. I wouldn't be surprised if he did leave. The question would be how much is he worth? Will Porter be as good? From what I think, he should be the cornerstone of the team. So, he should be paid accordingly. Unless, he was to move to Munster and learn Afikaan.

FellasFellas

sydthebeat wrote: »

??

the IRFU are incredibly good with their business negotiations

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

I also hate whatever establishment is currently in place fellow like minded free thinker :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Honestly - people don't have to like it but the IRFU have been incredibly shrewd with their decisions in the last few years and have managed to keep their top players in Ireland.

Bringing in Nucifora (a wildly unpopular man because of the decisions he has to make but someone actually adept at their job) was a great step because previously all pro game matters were decided by the IRFU committee and an older director who were all by products of the amateur game without a proper grasp on the modern pro game.

They were the ones who initially didn't think Sexton would leave.

Since they learnt and adapted from that Ireland has actually been in a pretty good place.

I know people love hating on establishments because their need to serve everyone doesn't necessarily fall in line with peoples exact desires but as far as compromises that need to be made for everyone by a governing body - the IRFU do a very good job

The same Nucifora who potentially is going to lose out on the starting Lions tighthead because he's sanctioned central deals for aging players who may or may not feature for Ireland in the coming years regardless of form? The same Nucifora who has been the head of performance in the IRFU who has abjectly failed at two, and realistically three RWC's if he's still in the job in 2023? The same Nucifora who albeit a few years after a family tragedy, left Ireland to return to Australia during the Six Nations, and the main contract negotiation phase despite that being his number one job?

They blocked Munster from signing Oz captain Stephen Moore so that the following players could get game time: Mike Sherry, Duncan Casey, Niall Scannell and Kevin O’Byrne. None of these players are pushing for the Ireland squad, so surely it would be good for Moore to come and help bring these guys through and be a big name signing for the club to compete in Europe?

They told Ruan Pienaar to leave so that they could bring through more Irish 9's. In Ulster now, it's John Cooney and yet they sanction Alby Mathewson to move to Munster and Ulster to block Dave Shanahan? I know that Shanahan isn't at the races but it's just hypocrisy abound.

They let Munster sign Jason Jenkins instead of promoting Fineen Wycherly and maybe signing an Irish player or promoting Tom Ahern.

It's an IRFU issue in my opinion and not a Leinster one so I won't pursue it further but it's just pointless to bring up any sort of view on this site when the 'experienced' posters just all jump down your throats because you dare to have a differing opinion. It really puts off people posting, especially new users.

molloyjh

FellasFellas wrote: »

The same Nucifora who potentially is going to lose out on the starting Lions tighthead because he's sanctioned central deals for aging players who may or may not feature for Ireland in the coming years regardless of form? The same Nucifora who has been the head of performance in the IRFU who has abjectly failed at two, and realistically three RWC's if he's still in the job in 2023? The same Nucifora who albeit a few years after a family tragedy, left Ireland to return to Australia during the Six Nations, and the main contract negotiation phase despite that being his number one job?

They blocked Munster from signing Oz captain Stephen Moore so that the following players could get game time: Mike Sherry, Duncan Casey, Niall Scannell and Kevin O’Byrne. None of these players are pushing for the Ireland squad, so surely it would be good for Moore to come and help bring these guys through and be a big name signing for the club to compete in Europe?

They told Ruan Pienaar to leave so that they could bring through more Irish 9's. In Ulster now, it's John Cooney and yet they sanction Alby Mathewson to move to Munster and Ulster to block Dave Shanahan? I know that Shanahan isn't at the races but it's just hypocrisy abound.

They let Munster sign Jason Jenkins instead of promoting Fineen Wycherly and maybe signing an Irish player or promoting Tom Ahern.

It's an IRFU issue in my opinion and not a Leinster one so I won't pursue it further but it's just pointless to bring up any sort of view on this site when the 'experienced' posters just all jump down your throats because you dare to have a differing opinion. It really puts off people posting, especially new users.

The other deals are irrelevant in terms of the Furlong deal. You're mad keen to be outraged, but have really just invented something to be outraged about.

Buer

FellasFellas wrote: »

They blocked Munster from signing Oz captain Stephen Moore

Anthony Foley publicly confirmed that there was no truth in that. The lie was halfway around the world before the truth had gotten out of bed.

FellasFellas

FellasFellas wrote: »

.. The same Nucifora who albeit a few years after a family tragedy, left Ireland to return to Australia during the Six Nations, and the main contract negotiation phase despite that being his number one job?
..

It's only a game.

Worth remembering those four words when you're on a deranged rant on the internet.

FellasFellas

molloyjh wrote: »

The other deals are irrelevant in terms of the Furlong deal. You're mad keen to be outraged, but have really just invented something to be outraged about.

What I was outraged at was the fact that by signing aging Irish players who may or may not be in the side, we run the risk of losing the best tighthead in the world.

Which is what I originally said, but then the previous posters brought up Nucifora being good at his job, which is what I replied to. So just to clarify that for you there.

arsebiscuits1

FellasFellas wrote: »

The same Nucifora who potentially is going to lose out on the starting Lions tighthead because he's sanctioned central deals for aging players who may or may not feature for Ireland in the coming years regardless of form? The same Nucifora who has been the head of performance in the IRFU who has abjectly failed at two, and realistically three RWC's if he's still in the job in 2023? The same Nucifora who albeit a few years after a family tragedy, left Ireland to return to Australia during the Six Nations, and the main contract negotiation phase despite that being his number one job?

They blocked Munster from signing Oz captain Stephen Moore so that the following players could get game time: Mike Sherry, Duncan Casey, Niall Scannell and Kevin O’Byrne. None of these players are pushing for the Ireland squad, so surely it would be good for Moore to come and help bring these guys through and be a big name signing for the club to compete in Europe?

They told Ruan Pienaar to leave so that they could bring through more Irish 9's. In Ulster now, it's John Cooney and yet they sanction Alby Mathewson to move to Munster and Ulster to block Dave Shanahan? I know that Shanahan isn't at the races but it's just hypocrisy abound.

They let Munster sign Jason Jenkins instead of promoting Fineen Wycherly and maybe signing an Irish player or promoting Tom Ahern.

It's an IRFU issue in my opinion and not a Leinster one so I won't pursue it further but it's just pointless to bring up any sort of view on this site when the 'experienced' posters just all jump down your throats because you dare to have a differing opinion. It really puts off people posting, especially new users.

Wow. You're so determined to be outraged you're actually holding something that not only hasn't happened - is actually very unlikely to happen as a stick to beat the man with.

That's impressive even for Boards standard.

And I don't really know what your point of Pienaar and Mathewson is? Cooney got game time and international caps on the back of Pienaar being moved on.

Where is this whole Shanahan thing coming from?

But let's just put it down to this. Nucifora and the IRFU haven't done a perfect job. Show me an example of any entity that has.

But this notion that they're the big bad wolf out to **** over the little guy is just nonsense. The IRFU as an entity is incredibly successful compared to their peers, has actively developed the elite player pathway in the last 6 years and has managed to keep their best players on the Isle while overseeing it's indigenous performing to a consistently good standard.

If you're metric for not being pissed off at something is that they have never made a mistake then you're setting yourself up to have a very sad life

It's mad that the IRFU only seems to go after people who have chips on their shoulder isn't it?

arsebiscuits1

FellasFellas wrote: »

What I was outraged at was the fact that by signing aging Irish players who may or may not be in the side, we run the risk of losing the best tighthead in the world.

Which is what I originally said, but then the previous posters brought up Nucifora being good at his job, which is what I replied to. So just to clarify that for you there.

I'll say this slowly

THERE. IS. NO. POINT. BEING. OUTRAGED. AT. SOMETHING. THAT. HASN'T. HAPPENED.

Honestly mate. Why bother. Life is too short and **** enough as it is without adding these things in

sydthebeat

FellasFellas wrote: »

The same Nucifora who potentially is going to lose out on the starting Lions tighthead because he's sanctioned central deals for aging players who may or may not feature for Ireland in the coming years regardless of form? The same Nucifora who has been the head of performance in the IRFU who has abjectly failed at two, and realistically three RWC's if he's still in the job in 2023? The same Nucifora who albeit a few years after a family tragedy, left Ireland to return to Australia during the Six Nations, and the main contract negotiation phase despite that being his number one job?

They blocked Munster from signing Oz captain Stephen Moore so that the following players could get game time: Mike Sherry, Duncan Casey, Niall Scannell and Kevin O’Byrne. None of these players are pushing for the Ireland squad, so surely it would be good for Moore to come and help bring these guys through and be a big name signing for the club to compete in Europe?

They told Ruan Pienaar to leave so that they could bring through more Irish 9's. In Ulster now, it's John Cooney and yet they sanction Alby Mathewson to move to Munster and Ulster to block Dave Shanahan? I know that Shanahan isn't at the races but it's just hypocrisy abound.

They let Munster sign Jason Jenkins instead of promoting Fineen Wycherly and maybe signing an Irish player or promoting Tom Ahern.

It's an IRFU issue in my opinion and not a Leinster one so I won't pursue it further but it's just pointless to bring up any sort of view on this site when the 'experienced' posters just all jump down your throats because you dare to have a differing opinion. It really puts off people posting, especially new users.

phew.... do you need a hand carrying that chip ?

thomond2006

If Furlong leaves, it's definitely POM's fault.

aloooof

FellasFellas wrote: »

The same Nucifora who potentially is going to lose out on the starting Lions tighthead because he's sanctioned central deals for aging players who may or may not feature for Ireland in the coming years regardless of form? The same Nucifora who has been the head of performance in the IRFU who has abjectly failed at two, and realistically three RWC's if he's still in the job in 2023? The same Nucifora who albeit a few years after a family tragedy, left Ireland to return to Australia during the Six Nations, and the main contract negotiation phase despite that being his number one job?

They blocked Munster from signing Oz captain Stephen Moore so that the following players could get game time: Mike Sherry, Duncan Casey, Niall Scannell and Kevin O’Byrne. None of these players are pushing for the Ireland squad, so surely it would be good for Moore to come and help bring these guys through and be a big name signing for the club to compete in Europe?

They told Ruan Pienaar to leave so that they could bring through more Irish 9's. In Ulster now, it's John Cooney and yet they sanction Alby Mathewson to move to Munster and Ulster to block Dave Shanahan? I know that Shanahan isn't at the races but it's just hypocrisy abound.

They let Munster sign Jason Jenkins instead of promoting Fineen Wycherly and maybe signing an Irish player or promoting Tom Ahern.

It's an IRFU issue in my opinion and not a Leinster one so I won't pursue it further but it's just pointless to bring up any sort of view on this site when the 'experienced' posters just all jump down your throats because you dare to have a differing opinion. It really puts off people posting, especially new users.

Just for starters:

1) Nothing has been announced for Furlong yet.
2) Stephen Moore wasn't blocked.
3) Fineen Wycherly has already been promoted to the senior team.

You're absolutely entitled to your own opinion, but having factual inaccuracies like these to back up your opinion isn't gonna help your case.

Podge_irl

If Furlong leaves it will have nothing whatsoever to do with the other central contracts signed.

gameoverdude

thomond2006 wrote:

If Furlong leaves, it's definitely POM's fault.

Bring back the bull.

sebdavis

If Furlong signs then the IRFU have done excellent business and fair play to them for keeping everyone
If Furlong goes then the IRFU are incompetent and couldn't get drunk in a brewery

That the World we live in....

salmocab

In a less than surprising turn of events we won’t be playing a Saffer team in the rainbow cup as they can’t travel.

Clegg

Scott Penny was involved in the pre-match press conference. I know that's not always indicative that a player will actually take part in that game. But there must be a good chance that he'll be in the 23 at least.

errlloyd

salmocab wrote: »

In a less than surprising turn of events we won’t be playing a Saffer team in the rainbow cup as they can’t travel.

What are you talking about, we're playing against a Saffer team this Saturday.

thomond2006

Clegg wrote: »

Scott Penny was involved in the pre-match press conference. I know that's not always indicative that a player will actually take part in that game. But there must be a good chance that he'll be in the 23 at least.

thegreycity

thomond2006 wrote: »

Sad noises

Garda Kenny

Clegg wrote: »

Scott Penny was involved in the pre-match press conference. I know that's not always indicative that a player will actually take part in that game. But there must be a good chance that he'll be in the 23 at least.

Whilst it’s always good to expose young players to leadership duties and the press etc I take this exposure with a bit of salt. Put simply he might not be physically big enough to ever play top end rugby no matter how professional his work ethic might be.

All the bells and whistles Cullen hangs on Scott for pushing himself in training and pushing himself into the first team picture are just that - congratulatory show.

I don’t for a second believe Scott will be afforded a European place over the bigger and slower Connors who hasn’t as professional a work ethic. VDF is another kettle of fish - harder worker but again possibly not as big physically as Connors. It’s a shame to see brute force win out over honest hard work sometimes but hey - that’s rugby!

Interested Observer

Garda Kenny wrote: »

Whilst it’s always good to expose young players to leadership duties and the press etc I take this exposure with a bit of salt. Put simply he might not be physically big enough to ever play top end rugby no matter how professional his work ethic might be.

All the bells and whistles Cullen hangs on Scott for pushing himself in training and pushing himself into the first team picture are just that - congratulatory show.

I don’t for a second believe Scott will be afforded a European place over the bigger and slower Connors who hasn’t as professional a work ethic. VDF is another kettle of fish - harder worker but again possibly not as big physically as Connors. It’s a shame to see brute force win out over honest hard work sometimes but hey - that’s rugby!

This post started out badly and only got worse and worse. 0/10, would not read again.

salmocab

Interested Observer wrote: »

This post started out badly and only got worse and worse. 0/10, would not read again.

Remember someone else used to rag on Connors constantly, wonder where he went.

theVersatile

Yeah Connors is only a lazy unprofessional oversized lump like Zebo :pac:

Clegg

Connors went to the wrong school.

Teferi

If only Joe Schmidt hadn't ruined his confidence.