Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IX *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Real Donald Trump

JeffKenna wrote: »

That's heartbreaking. Try and start from day 1 again tomorrow. You can do it.

This

Don't let the bastards grind you down.

Silentcorner

TheDoctor wrote: »

We really need an Irish variant at this stage.

Foreign variants coming in and stealing fear of variants from a hard working Irish variant

And...we'd have a sporting chance of outsmarting an Irish variant!!!!

ypres5

growleaves wrote: »

It isn't stated anywhere in the constitution. It is a legal precedent in Irish constitutional law that article 40.4 which guarantees the right to liberty and freedom guarantees the right to travel and to have a passport.

ive given up at this point. apparently the citizens advice is wrong and a poster aptly named donald trump is right

Graham

growleaves wrote: »

It isn't stated anywhere in the constitution. It is a legal precedent in Irish constitutional law that article 40.4 which guarantees the right to liberty and freedom guarantees the right to travel and to have a passport.

is there an element in there about public health/common good/discretion of the minister etc.

I suspect yes.

Doctor Jimbob

Real Donald Trump wrote: »

Apparently there's a new variant surfacing in the UK now called the Nigerian variant. Wonder how long it will take Mehole to start banging on about that?

They'll be claiming that one travels through radio waves.

gozunda

Silentcorner wrote: »

Neither do you by the looks of it...

The infection, or case rate is misleading, you know this but you are choosing to ignore it....the infection or case rate for March will be forever unknown.

Our testing back then was erratic all over as you'd expect, as hospitals were probably struggling to get to grips with isolating Covid patients on wards, which you'd expect.

You are not making any point here, you are just barking something about peaking in April nearly one full month after full lock down...which would indicate that full lock downs don't work.

And you think that why?

Btw just repeating what you've already stated with no proof? Not really a proper reply is it?

But yes you're still wrong. Full restrictions only came in at the end of March 2020. The peak of 1,515 occurred on the 10th of April 2020.

Donald Trump

francogarbanzo wrote: »

https://www.dfa.ie/citizenship/

You are on the wrong side of history my man.

You might want to take a slow read of what you posted.


You have a right to carry one. To give you a counter example - a Mossad assassin does not have the right to carry an Irish passport. They could be convicted if caught carrying one.



You do not have a constitutional right to be given one when and where you demand it.

suicide_circus

my once active and outgoing parents will never fully recover from the effects of this lockdown. A spark has been extinguished.

normanoffside

ypres5 wrote: »

since they're taking the scientific approach according to some people on here, can someone please explain the science behind denying people access to a fairly important piece of document which is a constitutional right for you to be allowed possess. i must say I'm slowly learning to hate this country, more so the government

The GNIB office in Burgh Quay is closed too.
I know several students (many under 18) on long term study programmes that were given visas to come here but asked to register with GNIB inside 3 months.
Because they can't register they are stuck here because if they leave they have to apply for a visa again in their home Irish Embassy (which are all closed).

The GNIB has only been open for about 4 weeks in the past 8 months and is not open for postal applications for new residents. These are basic and essential services and are just not open for business.

Donald Trump

growleaves wrote: »

It isn't stated anywhere in the constitution. It is a legal precedent in Irish constitutional law that article 40.4 which guarantees the right to liberty and freedom guarantees the right to travel and to have a passport.

You do know Ireland has a written constitution? No?


You can't just make up any oul' ****e and claim that it is a "fundamental right under the Constitution"


Point me to the article in the Constitution dealing with passports or just shut up about it.


Do you even have a passport?

Silentcorner

gozunda wrote: »

And you think that why?

Btw just repeating what you've already stated with no proof? Not really a proper reply is it?

But yes you're still wrong. Full restrictions only came in at the end of March 2020. The peak of 1,515 occurred on the 10th of April 2020.

How do I prove that we weren't testing all infections back in March...we all just know it.

We didn't have any testing infrastructure in place, every nutjob turned up on day one we were getting something like 99% negatives...so only people with two symptoms were tested for first number of weeks....are you denying that happened?

Why would you deny it? We didn't have teams up and down the country all suited up waiting for the virus to strike...we were going week by week trying to figure it out.

And what is your point about April anyway...why is it so important to you, is it because you believe that it proves seasonality isn't a factor? Has all this been for a stupid point like that?

BigAndy21

Donald Trump wrote: »

How many people do you think would have died from cancer etc. if the hospitals were overflowing with covid patients 24/7


It's hardly a nuanced point now is it? Given that you appear to imply you give a shite about those people, it is strange that you didn't consider that.

No hospital is overflowing from Covid, not in Sweden, Florida or any other country or state that said no to the bull. Our leaders are bought puppets following orders. And check the stats, deaths are the same as 2019.

francogarbanzo

Donald Trump wrote: »

You might want to take a slow read of what you posted.


You have a right to carry one. To give you a counter example - a Mossad assassin does not have the right to carry an Irish passport. They could be convicted if caught carrying one.

You do not have a constitutional right to be given one when and where you demand it.

You are using semantics to justify the violation of rights. Again, you should rethink what you’re doing here.

How can a citizen carry a passport if one is not issued to him?

Real Donald Trump

BigAndy21 wrote: »

No hospital is overflowing from Covid, not in Sweden, Florida or any other country or state that said no to the bull. Our leaders are bought puppets following orders. And check the stats, deaths are the same as 2019.

Sweden still going strong

Donald Trump

francogarbanzo wrote: »

You are using semantics to justify the violation of rights. Again, you should rethink what you’re doing here.

How can a citizen carry a passport if one is not issued to him?

You have the right to apply for a passport. That includes providing the necessary documentation and paying the application fee.



There is no constitutional right for you to be given that passport in any specific timeframe.


No rights are being broken due to passport staff working from home


Now, if someone at the passport office decided that they were not going to give one to you just because they don't like you or your photo, then that would be a different matter.



Do you have a passport?

Donald Trump

BigAndy21 wrote: »

No hospital is overflowing from Covid, not in Sweden, Florida or any other country or state that said no to the bull. Our leaders are bought puppets following orders. And check the stats, deaths are the same as 2019.

How were the wards you were working on in mid-Jan?


Empty?

hynesie08

francogarbanzo wrote: »

You are using semantics to justify the violation of rights. Again, you should rethink what you’re doing here.

How can a citizen carry a passport if one is not issued to him?

When your passport expires, and you apply for a new one, and it takes a few weeks to arrive. Is that a violation of rights?

BigAndy21

Donald Trump wrote: »

How were the wards you were working on in mid-Jan?


Empty?

Positive cases don't end up in hospital so yeah pretty empty

Donald Trump

BigAndy21 wrote: »

Positive cases don't end up in hospital so yeah pretty empty

Just the negative ones then?

Lets hope I don't test negative for covid in case I end up in ICU!

What's the name of your medical practice and are you taking on new patients? I might sign up

growleaves

Graham wrote: »

is there an element in there about public health/common good/discretion of the minister etc.

I suspect yes.

Er well there definitely aren't 'discretion of the minister' exemptions to constitutional freedoms lol.

There are potential limitations to any freedom. It would be a matter for the courts whether the Public Health Act 1947 could be used to restrict your right to a passport. (I'm guessing no, but I don't know)

It hasn't been tested and as you know the G. O'Doherty case was not heard because the judge ruled it was put together incompetently.

RunningFlyer

Back to the topic, the much anticipated week is fast approaching.

Boris and pals are due to announce their plan on Monday (22nd), and ours is to be announced “week of 22nd”.

Based on the events of the last few days, I’ve absolutely no doubt our gang have no plan at the moment than L5 lockdown and are waiting to see the UK’s first, and then amend it as fits on the premise of less vaccinations and more “variants” risk.

I will absolutely keel over if they name the new plan anything remotely like “Living with COVID”.

francogarbanzo

hynesie08 wrote: »

When your passport expires, and you apply for a new one, and it takes a few weeks to arrive. Is that a violation of rights?

You’re right, there is no difference between that scenario and suspending operations of all passport processing except for medical or bereavement purposes.

Donald Trump

growleaves wrote: »

Er well there definitely aren't 'discretion of the minister' exemptions to constitutional freedoms lol.

There are potential limitations to any freedom. It would be a matter for the courts whether the Public Health Act 1947 could be used to restrict your right to a passport. (I'm guessing no, but I don't know)

It hasn't been tested and as you know the G. O'Doherty case was not heard because the judge ruled it was put together incompetently.

Do you have a passport?

Graham

growleaves wrote: »

Er well there definitely aren't 'discretion of the minister' exemptions to constitutional freedoms lol.

Didn't you already say it wasn't in the constitution?

I'll check again...

Here you go

growleaves wrote: »

It isn't stated anywhere in the constitution.

One of us is confused.

It's not me.

ninebeanrows

Hard to believe there are members on here defending the suspension of passport production for citizens for what could well be 4 to 5 months.

I am sorry, be it essential or not, citizens of the state are entitled to a passport.

Bonkers what people are accepting as the norm these days.

hynesie08

ninebeanrows wrote: »

Hard to believe there are members on here defending the suspension of passport production for citizens for what could well be 4 to 5 months.

I am sorry, be it essential or not, citizens of the state are entitled to a passport.

Bonkers what people are accepting as the norm these days.

And they'll get one. Eventually

gozunda

Silentcorner wrote: »

How do I prove that we weren't testing all infections back in March...we all just know it.We didn't have any testing infrastructure in place, every nutjob turned up on day one we were getting something like 99% negatives...so only people with two symptoms were tested for first number of weeks....are you denying that happened?Why would you deny it? We didn't have teams up and down the country all suited up waiting for the virus to strike...we were going week by week trying to figure it out. And what is your point about April anyway...why is it so important to you, is it because you believe that it proves seasonality isn't a factor? Has all this been for a stupid point like that?

Most of that makes any sense whatsoever and Is little more than vague ramblings. On the recorded surge which happened in April - you're the one insisting the surge actually happened in March whilst at the same time claiming there no evidence to prove it. :rolleyes:

And in case you don't remember- the jury is still out on seasonality

https://www.thejournal.ie/is-coronavirus-partially-seasonal-leo-varadkar-5338003-Jan2021/

I'll leave you at it.

gozunda

BigAndy21 wrote: »

No hospital is overflowing from Covid, not in Sweden, Florida or any other country or state that said no to the bull. Our leaders are bought puppets following orders. And check the stats, deaths are the same as 2019.

You really think hospital haven't been brought to their knees during the Pandemic?

How about:

Portugal - https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55902317

Lebanon- https://www.ft.com/content/7c6f7c87-8db4-407c-9ef1-1e55b404c023

Italy - https://www.aa.com.tr/en/europe/italy-reports-38-000-new-infections-as-hospitals-struggle/2041946

growleaves

Donald Trump wrote: »

You do know Ireland has a written constitution? No?


You can't just make up any oul' ****e and claim that it is a "fundamental right under the Constitution"


Point me to the article in the Constitution dealing with passports or just shut up about it.


Do you even have a passport?

You admitted in the travel thread that you don't understand how constitutional law works.

Each article of the constitution is interpreted by the courts. The articles do not interpret themselves, judges rule on what each article broadly means.

For instance I have the right the liberty - what does that mean?

When the courts have ruled that article x means "x, y, z" that is settled constitutional law.

Why are you asking me if I have a passport? I don't want to give information about myself.

Donald Trump

growleaves wrote: »

You admitted in the travel thread that you don't understand how constitutional law works.

Each article of the constitution is interpreted by the courts. The articles do not interpret themselves, judges rule on what each article broadly means.

For instance I have the right the liberty - what does that mean?

When the courts have ruled that article x means "x, y, z" that is settled constitutional law.

Why are you asking me if I have a passport? I don't want to give information about myself.

You don't even have a passport FFS. Never mind spouting on about constitutional law