Brexit Impact on Northern Ireland

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120454903#Comment_120454903

Of course. Once you share some aspects of rich unionist culture.

downcow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120454838#Comment_120454838

from memory there has only been one attempt since gfa to hold a unionist parade in Dublin and it resulted in O’Connell street being trashed by nationalists and the guards getting the unionists back on their buses for safety, only to have their busses attacked in Dundalk. Pretend if you like, but I hope you don’t really believe that unionist culture is welcome in roi.

Rossnowlagh is an exception as the community know it is by a very long distance their biggest payday of the year. Turkeys don’t vote for Xmas

downcow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120454912#Comment_120454912

I think I asked first. Over to you.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120454918#Comment_120454918

Nope. I've asked you this repeatedly in the past. Not once have you answered.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120454890#Comment_120454890

There was violence and bloodshed from both sides. I think if you look, you'll also see that there was violence and bloodshed from government agencies.

However, as those who sought an end to the carnage 25 years ago will tell you, you need to stop looking back at what happened and blaming others for their wrongdoings without being mindful of your own. Everyone needs to remember the past but not live in it.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120454913#Comment_120454913

A parade whose organiser trolled the citizens beforehand about the man who was allegedly involved in bombing their city and who was involved in the Glennane gang himself. An unrepentant bigot in other words.

P.S. Unionism and even the Orange is a part of my heritage and culture. I have no issue with it as long as it isn't belligerent, bigoted and sectarian. We live and let live here.

FrancieBrady

Unionist representives calling it out.

As a former councillor and MLA I am embarrassed by the current political situation and as a unionist I cannot sit idly by and not comment on the current situation. The mantra of Never Never Never or No No No is destroying unionism and faith in unionist politicians. When we hear that children that depend on free school meals are being denied this service, businesses which would benefit from rates reductions are being denied, working parents which could benefit from additional payments for nursery care, health service deteriorating day by day and schools that cannot afford to turn the heating on or pay for teaching assistants, you wonder what planet Sir Jeffrey Donaldson has moved to. This is just the tip of the iceberg and we are already in danger of sinking with no lifeboat in sight.

The Conservatives, the Labour Party, the Social Democrats and others voted by 515 votes to 29 to accept the Windsor Framework. Unionism has no friends left in Westminster and at some point Sir Jeffrey will be summoned by the prime minister to be told: “That’s it, we have had enough! From tomorrow Stormont is abolished, we will introduce direct rule, we will devolve as much as we can to councils, we will retain Health, Education, Infrastructure and Finance together with Justice and Policing. By the way we will listen to concerns from the Irish government and possibly the next Irish government will be a Sinn Fein coalition so they will have a say and you won’t. Close the door on your way out.”

The DUP have failed unionism, they have failed Northern Ireland and it is no wonder young people cannot be bothered to vote or wont vote Unionist.

I am, and always will be an Ulster Unionist, I’m a devolutionist but the day is fast approaching when the ship will sink and the DUP will have pushed us into an all Ireland state. Get off your hands Sir Jeffrey and get the assembly back up and running before its too late.

Robb Hussey.

downcow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120454991#Comment_120454991

I have never heard of robb hussey but I assume he must be under pressure in the coming elections. I can listen and even agree with the stuff about some unionist leaders digging a massive hole and being dinassaurs etc, but this nonsense that unionists collapse stormont for a year, and if only they hadn’t stormont would have solved all the issues it hasn’t solved in 25 years. If I am not mistaken the dup are in a very low 3rd place in the length of time parties have collapsed stormont for.

downcow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120454943#Comment_120454943

Look at the parades going through our towns today and even more tomorrow. Do you know what these guys have done to our communities? It would make your toes curl if you had the detail. I don’t see any unionist out blocking them. I guess our band community enjoy the comedy factor of viewing this bit of ‘nationalist culture’

https://twitter.com/r4fcmuk7k8ihukz/status/1644708171942965250?s=46&t=JHpzF9bR5RO_sC_CwOiaJw

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455053#Comment_120455053

What has that (which is wrong) got to do with a bigot organising a parade to troll the people of Dublin?

You know the one you were playing the victim card about?

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455033#Comment_120455033

He doesn't say that.

He is also a former MLA and councillor.

And it is not about the lenght of time, it is about the fact they are holding the people to ransom for something that cannot be solved at Stormont.

515 -29 was the result in Westminster. Unionism has achieved nothing by ending powersharing.

votecounts

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120454656#Comment_120454656

What culture do you speak of? Marching where you are not wanted, putting flags up to antagonize the nationalist community, burning effigies of nationalists and our flag. Saying no to everything. Truth is ye have none just bigotry and hatred towatds anything irish

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120454838#Comment_120454838

It was not even a unionist event, but it is a commemoration for the police force of this country before independence, many of whose members were decent, law abiding Catholics. The proposed state commemoration of the RIC police force that was scheduled to be held in Dublin in January 2020 had to be abandoned after major pressure from Republicans and Nationalists.

Even a victims parade ( for victims of the paramilitaries ) for Dublin had to be abandoned because most of the marchers were Protestant. Charlie Bird (the RTE journalist) was punched and kicked,all the while being called an "Orange bastard" ( what Republicans sometimes call Protestants they do not like)......until he was rescued by the Gardai.  

There were plenty of Republican parades in Dublin back in the day - they were tolerated as long as they were Republican. Naming sports grounds after paramilitaries is ok (according to Republicans) as long as they are Republican paramilitaries. Unionists do not do that, as far as I know.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455217#Comment_120455217

You haven't answered my questions, just diverted to some other stuff. Try again please.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455258#Comment_120455258

I wrote "if there was a United Ireland it is quite clear that unionists and their culture would be out like a shot, and that Republicans only allow their own culture. Assimilate or leave." What question do you want answered about that? As Republicans do not even allow a State RIC commemoration, never mind a victims parade in Dublin, so do you really expect Northern Unionists to trust that they would feel welcome in a UI? Especially when, for example, the ladies Irish NATIONAL foot team chant "Uh Ah Up the RA", having been brainwashed by the state education system? And that was the Irish national ladies soccer team : the GAA tends to be even more Republican in that it sometime names grounds after PIRA members etc ( soccer clubs do not).

When train stations in the Republic stop being named after IRA men, when Republicans stop brainwashing everyone, when there is parity of esteem and when compromise would be reached about a new flag, new anthem etc - then I would think they may be a chance of an inclusive, peaceful UI.

.

downcow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455209#Comment_120455209

You need to take the blinkers off. It’s not me has any problem recognising sectarianism in my community. You seem to struggle with this.

give me a straight answer to this. Republicans have put a big tricolour at the end of my road just in the last days. My road is 80% nationalist/republican backgrounds (we know that doesn’t mean they would vote for a Ui). Do you regard this as “putting flags up to antagonize the unionist community,”? Do you think they or the Psni should remove them?

by a huge coincidence dozens of flags went up in the area on the very same night as the election SF posters went up. Same height, same cable ties. I am sure shinners wouldn’t be involved in putting flags up to antagonize the unionist community. Or maybe these are fluffy cuddly flags?

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455306#Comment_120455306

As I thought, you're posting nonsense again to reassure your staunch anti-[Nationalist, SF, Republican, Irish, choose as appropriate] bias.

Incidentally, if you look at what I asked, I quoted you before you changed it. So you had said: "if there was a United Ireland it is quite clear that unionists and their culture would be out like a shot, and that Republicans only allow their own culture.". (If I'm not mistaken, the forum software still incorrectly displays the edit time to be an hour earlier than it was).

You still can't or rather won't show us how "Republicans only allow their own culture" because it would show the holes in your bias.

Edit: as for this tripe: "Especially when, for example, the ladies Irish NATIONAL foot team chant "Uh Ah Up the RA", having been brainwashed by the state education system? And that was the Irish national ladies soccer team : the GAA tends to be even more Republican in that it sometime names grounds after PIRA members etc ( soccer clubs do not)." you are commenting on something you clearly know absolutely nothing about so stop it!

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455402#Comment_120455402

I beg your pardon, I most certainly did not change the post . Post no. 2486 was not edited. I wrote (in reply to someone else) :

" Interesting you claim "There is no such thing as unionist culture". and that "Nationalists can draw upon a rich cultural heritage".Many would disagree with you. In any case, if there was a United Ireland it is quite clear that unionists and their culture would be out like a shot, and that Republicans only allow their own culture. Assimilate or leave." End of quote.

I do not have an anti Irish bias. I am Irish myself. Born, bred, live in Ireland. Irish passport. I call out extremists on both sides. However nobody on this forum would condone the loyalist paramilitaries for example - if they did I would argue with them and condemn those loyalist para-militaries. There are some Republicans though who would not condemn the actions of their own para-militiaries.

You write " you are commenting on something you clearly know absolutely nothing so stop it!". That is a good example of the thin edge of the wedge, of the bias I am talking about. I am sure if there was a united Ireland many unionists would also be told in no uncertain terms they " clearly know absolutely nothing so stop it ". You have proved my point, thank you. With all due respect, over many many decades of living in this state ( Ireland) I have probably heard more Uh Ah Up the Ra chants, heard others calling people "west Brits", and heard more subtle republican propaganda than you have had hot breakfasts.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455457#Comment_120455457

Sigh. Ok let's go through this then.

I beg your pardon, I most certainly did not change the post . Post no. 2486 was not edited. I wrote (in reply to someone else) :

Firstly post numbers aren't shown on the phone version of the site, only desktop. However, at 3:35 pm I asked you some questions in response to your post at 3:09...

That 3:09 post was, despite your above denial, in fact edited (it even says so)...

...however, it was edited after my 3:35 post which leads me to assume that the issue with the incorrect editing time still exists in the desktop version of boards.ie.

I do not have an anti Irish bias. I am Irish myself. Born, bred, live in Ireland. Irish passport. I call out extremists on both sides. However nobody on this forum would condone the loyalist paramilitaries for example - if they did I would argue with them and condemn those loyalist para-militaries. There are some Republicans though who would not condemn the actions of their own para-militiaries.

Erm, you do although you may not realise it. However, your persistent posting of any kind of anti-SF or anti-nationalist crap has made me even issue you with a warning yesterday (the boundaries of which I'm quite aware you've been pushing as much as you can). So taking you on your word in the above, can you show us one example of where you criticised loyalism e.g. the DUP currently being a mouthpiece for loyalist terrorists (and stoking tensions within loyalism)?

FrancieBrady

Still waiting for this 'rich Unionist culture' which is distinct from Irish culture.

Maybe they do it in secret?

downcow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455591#Comment_120455591

It’s very simple francie. I asked the question first. Experience tells me that whatever I say is unionist culture, our inclusive, non-sectarian, liberal republican posters will say ‘that’s not culture’. So as soon as my question on what this rich nationalist culture is answered I promise you I will respond with what I regard as rich unionist culture (although I say again that’s not the language I would choose) and I’ll add some rich OWC culture for your pleasure.

waiting on the rich nationalist culture? Maybe you could help francie cause others seem to be struggling!

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455684#Comment_120455684

I don't remember you ever saying what unionist culture is? Can you provide a link to these prior times?

downcow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455402#Comment_120455402

I’m not sure what the tripe is. The GAA are up to their necks in it. Every day more evidence that the GAA have massive work to do to catch up with every other sport. Here is the GAA activity tomorrow on the parades commission website and a wee snippet of the inclusive band that is leading their political event

https://www.paradescommission.org/viewparade.aspx?id=78744

I suppose we should all be reassured that they can only muster up 50 spectators in the republican heartland. Seems their people may be ahead of them. Hopefully they will wise up soon

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455684#Comment_120455684

Every thing that happens in Ireland is a part of our culture downcow. It’s a hugely rich tapestry.

Unionism doesn’t engage in a different culture. They may have different songs but that isn't a cultural difference. The Beatles have different songs to The Kinks, but they are both a part of British culture and ours, as we share many cultural similarities.

We have marching bands throughout Ireland so STILL waiting to hear what this distinct Unionist cultural practice is.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455684#Comment_120455684

I've asked you multiple times and all your responses have done is to strengthen my belief that there is no such thing as unionist culture.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455733#Comment_120455733

That's a GAA club and not "the GAA". I'm a member of a club and never once have unheard any sectarian discussion or indeed anything to do with politics in NI, a united Ireland or any such topic.

Why that club are choosing to host a flute band, I don't know. Nor do I know anyone who would be interested in watching ot listening to such an event. In my own opinion, a flute band wouldn't interest me one little bit. Should those playing with their flutes be wearing military style clothing like in the video posted earlier, then I'd be 100% opposed to it.

But whatever it is, there is obviously some that like it but it wrong to tar a huge organisation because of what is happening in a particular club.

I'm also fairly sure that the GAA prohibit political events happening on club grounds.

Still doesn't address the on going question for examples of "unionist culture" that have been asked by a number of us here.

L1011

Considering the only regularly known "unionist culture" is drum bands, complaining about a different niche instrument on the other side is rather odd.

downcow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455883#Comment_120455883

…and me you. So seems neither unionists or nationalists have a rich. culture. You are the one saying nationalist has richer culture that unionism, so it really is up to you to show us how. I am inclined to believe all peoples of the world have a rich culture

downcow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455928#Comment_120455928

Fair enough. I apologise if you thought I was suggesting every member was supportive of such events. There is an onus on members though (imho) to ask the GAA why it is happening. If a football club was engaging in such activity I am fairly sure they would be disciplined by the ifa

downcow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455933#Comment_120455933

I certainly wasn’t complaining about any musical instrument. As for you culture question, I have been very clear - a poster has said nationalists have a rich culture and unionists don’t. I asked for a few examples and I’ve got didly squat. I am actually closer to francies thinking on this one and that all of us on the British isles share huge aspects of culture although I think their are significant nuances pertain to nationalists and also to the ulster-British community living in ni