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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭ tudderone


    Feisar wrote: »
    I honestly don't know how to start shaking off the perception that a person with a gun must be doing something wrong until proven otherwise. I remember being out with my Dad when I was a little lad, back when one could shoot outside of a range. On my uncle's land minding our own business doing nothing wrong and the Gardaí rocked up! Called by a walker. Keeping in mind this was pre mobile phones so that person had to get home and then call. Anyway it was a shooting buddy of Dad's so a chat was had about the new rifle.

    I'll wager that was back when the other lunatics were running amok in the North and England ? Something else that casts a very long shadow across our sport, sadly.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,225 ✭✭✭ Feisar


    Yeah that's a really good idea, there's definitely strength in numbers and is something we should persue.

    It's funny, for all the anti bloodsport noise the Hunt Ball attracts the who's who of the locality.

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 545 ✭✭✭ berettaman


    I think this is one of the most important threads I have ever read on this forum.


    There are so many tangents to this and there is loads I would like to add. There are a few incidents that stand out for me:

    I was trying to source a card reader for the club to take memberships. When the provider heard it was XXX GPA he asked what we do? "hunting and conservation" We were met with refusal.:rolleyes:

    I rang a politician running for a County Councillor position, she had anti's praising her for her anti blood sport stance.
    I asked her was she against farmers protecting crops from crows or lambs from foxes? she said no.
    I asked her was she against lads shooting a rabbit or a duck for the pot, she said no.
    I asked her why she was against hunting and she said she didn't want to hear of it as a "sport.":eek:
    I could go on but the biggest damage comes from our fellow sports men and women and we are constantly having to fight our own as well as those who want hunting and fishing to end.
    The apathy will kill us..


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭ tudderone


    berettaman wrote: »
    I think this is one of the most important threads I have ever read on this forum.


    There are so many tangents to this and there is loads I would like to add. There are a few incidents that stand out for me:

    I was trying to source a card reader for the club to take memberships. When the provider heard it was XXX GPA he asked what we do? "hunting and conservation" We were met with refusal.:rolleyes:

    I rang a politician running for a County Councillor position, she had anti's praising her for her anti blood sport stance.
    I asked her was she against farmers protecting crops from crows or lambs from foxes? she said no.
    I asked her was she against lads shooting a rabbit or a duck for the pot, she said no.
    I asked her why she was against hunting and she said she didn't want to hear of it as a "sport.":eek:
    I could go on but the biggest damage comes from our fellow sports men and women and we are constantly having to fight our own as well as those who want hunting and fishing to end.
    The apathy will kill us..

    Isn't that discrimination ? You might have a case there ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,225 ✭✭✭ Feisar


    tudderone wrote: »
    Isn't that discrimination ? You might have a case there ?

    It was on a thread here about paypal freezing an account due to it being used for firearms sale. The banks came up and someone mentioned it being against terms and conditions. Discrimination is fine these days as long as it's of the "right on" variety. Same with FB clamping down on hunting pages.

    First they came for the socialists...



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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,225 ✭✭✭ Feisar


    A friends husband expressed an interest in going for a shot, another friend was on to me pre Covid about getting into the sport in some capacity. As it stands I cannot legally bring them out to where I have permission and do a bit of shooting with a 22. One I can't shoot outside of a range and two it's illegal to shoot a gun one doesn't have a licence for. So IMHO that's the first thing that we'd need to tackle. Plus it'd be a small first bite. The first time they see Cass he'll be in looking for something so reasonable it'd be petty to refuse. We can go after bigger stuff later. Did I mention Cass for President!?!
    Post Covid committee meeting in Gunnings

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 35 kjl412


    Feisar wrote: »
    A friends husband expressed an interest in going for a shot, another friend was on to me pre Covid about getting into the sport in some capacity. As it stands I cannot legally bring them out to where I have permission and do a bit of shooting with a 22. One I can't shoot outside of a range and two it's illegal to shoot a gun one doesn't have a licence for. So IMHO that's the first thing that we'd need to tackle. Plus it'd be a small first bite. The first time they see Cass he'll be in looking for something so reasonable it'd be petty to refuse. We can go after bigger stuff later. Did I mention Cass for President!?!
    Post Covid committee meeting in Gunnings


    I think that’s a great idea I’m 21 and have lots of friends who would love to go out shooting, but if I take them out there really isn’t much excitement in it for them just to watch me. If a law was passed that any other adult could shoot under the supervision of the licensed gun owner. Even just with .22 and shotguns or something I think that would be great. Also I know at least in my family some of them think they could die just from being near a firearm, they are terrified. If the general population could see that when used responsibly firearms are safe and fun that would be great.


  • Registered Users Posts: 545 ✭✭✭ berettaman


    kjl412 wrote: »
    I think that’s a great idea I’m 21 and have lots of friends who would love to go out shooting, but if I take them out there really isn’t much excitement in it for them just to watch me. If a law was passed that any other adult could shoot under the supervision of the licensed gun owner. Even just with .22 and shotguns or something I think that would be great. Also I know at least in my family some of them think they could die just from being near a firearm, they are terrified. If the general population could see that when used responsibly firearms are safe and fun that would be great.


    I remember talking to an NARGC youth development guy. they ran the proficiency course for Transition years. Teachers and all. It took like Islam in the desert.
    The feed back was great and to see young teachers getting a buzz out of punching paper at a range for the first time was cool.


    Has to be part of the solution.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,431 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    berettaman wrote: »
    I think this is one of the most important threads I have ever read on this forum.


    There are so many tangents to this and there is loads I would like to add. There are a few incidents that stand out for me:

    I was trying to source a card reader for the club to take memberships. When the provider heard it was XXX GPA he asked what we do? "hunting and conservation" We were met with refusal.:rolleyes:

    I rang a politician running for a County Councillor position, she had anti's praising her for her anti blood sport stance.
    I asked her was she against farmers protecting crops from crows or lambs from foxes? she said no.
    I asked her was she against lads shooting a rabbit or a duck for the pot, she said no.
    I asked her why she was against hunting and she said she didn't want to hear of it as a "sport.":eek:
    I could go on but the biggest damage comes from our fellow sports men and women and we are constantly having to fight our own as well as those who want hunting and fishing to end.
    The apathy will kill us..

    How quaint...A card reader.Folks have a look at REVOLUT for credit card transactions in the future.Its cyber and you can dispense entirely with machine providers and their policies.

    Reckon also we will also have to see about getting political too.On our local levels.A long term infiltration of the GP by pro fieldsports people is what we should look at too.

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Registered Users Posts: 545 ✭✭✭ berettaman


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    How quaint...A card reader.Folks have a look at REVOLUT for credit card transactions in the future.Its cyber and you can dispense entirely with machine providers and their policies.

    Reckon also we will also have to see about getting political too.On our local levels.A long term infiltration of the GP by pro fieldsports people is what we should look at too.

    Okay, showing my age, Revolut is a good shout.:p

    Infiltration of GP is a must because they are driving policy and it would not take much to turn them around to see sense. 100k people hunt and fish at least and there are 3k GP members.



    Also, at county council level. start there and put pro hunt and shoot people in there.


    Met someone recently that thought gun ownership and hunting was illegal in Ireland. She was a teacher.

    We have to step up to make sure that doesn't become the case.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 545 ✭✭✭ berettaman


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    Need to start with ourselves as well. We need to start "coming out of the closet" and point out this is a lifestyle choice and not a "hobby" and we have nothing to be ashamed of or owe anyone an explanation as to why we are this way, and We'd appreciate some "Tolerance and respect "as we are demanded to show others of alt lifestyles and multi genders.
    Start learning from our enemies tactics as well to fight them with their own weapons too.
    This is spot on.

    Sorry if I am going back and forth but it is a great thread and the death by a thousand cuts bit at the start got me. We are on borrowed time.

    We do need to start with ourselves. We do need to come out of the closet or the gun safe or wherever.:D
    I was listening to a podcast recently (Was it the 2 Johnnies ? can't remember ) and yer man mentioned going shooting. It was refreshing to hear someone talk about going out after rabbits.

    I hear nothing but green sh1te on the media all the time and we get a fair bashing.. Here is the thing. I have been in business nearly 15 years. I have met 1000's of people over the years in my line of work and I only remember 2 or 3 people saying they were against hunting or shooting. We need to remember that we are not the minority that we think we are.We are just silent.

    Also, some of our members need a kick in the arse.
    kick 1

    They are not involved and will not do anything to help but they are quick out of the traps to run down those that are involved on committees and so on when something happens. If you have better ideas, volunteer and help.
    Kick 2

    FFS stop putting pictures of half decapitated foxes or car bonnets filled with woodcock on Facebook and so on, as it reinforces the stereotype and provides ammo to the enemies.
    I am all for controlling foxes but FFS some of the pics are ridiculous.
    Some people do not have a brain cell to spare.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,628 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    Feisar wrote: »
    One I can't shoot outside of a range and two it's illegal to shoot a gun one doesn't have a licence for. So IMHO that's the first thing that we'd need to tackle. Plus it'd be a small first bite.
    kjl412 wrote: »
    I think that’s a great idea I’m 21 and have lots of friends who would love to go out shooting, but if I take them out there really isn’t much excitement in it for them just to watch me.
    Going to tackle these two together as they're linked.

    This thread is for ideas and brainstorming, but don't take offence when (like i'm going to) a rebuttal is thrown up.

    We absolutely have to take small steps and get going however we need to pick our battles. not only for the ones we can win but also the ones that make sense to fight in the first place. I'm talking about bringing someone out for a shot.

    The first reply i would get from any Garda, TD, Minister or official of any sort is "that is what licenses are for" and they wouldn't be wrong. A training license costs €40 for three years and can be gotten at any age. If someone you know wants to dip their toes into the shooting waters then go for the training license. I recommend the training license over the full license for a couple of reasons:
    1. They don't have to get or meet storage requirements
    2. They don't need to pay for a gun (they'll use yours)
    3. They will be under supervision at all times learning as well as getting some trigger time in
    4. If they don't like it they are out €40 (over three years) and nothing more.
    5. If they want to go for a full license the training license serves as their competence

    If any group or interested body were to try and make a case for someone to be able to shoot on another persons' gun without some sort of authorisation or license it would be dismissed immediately so for that reason i'd leave that "wish list" item alone.


    As for the plinking outside a range, definitely one to tackle and sooner rather than later. There are a host of reasons for this such as:
    • Safety, first and foremost. Lads not access to someone to zero a rifle.
    • Not requiring everyone to join a range for the above
    • Not requiring everyone to visit a range and break the law (day membership is illegal)
    • Preventing fraudulent applications (having to join a range, putting this on your FCA1 just to zero when you've no intention of using a range)

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  • Registered Users Posts: 500 ✭✭✭ Munsterlad102


    Cass wrote: »
    Going to tackle these two together as they're linked.

    This thread is for ideas and brainstorming, but don't take offence when (like i'm going to) a rebuttal is thrown up.

    We absolutely have to take small steps and get going however we need to pick our battles. not only for the ones we can win but also the ones that make sense to fight in the first place. I'm talking about bringing someone out for a shot.

    The first reply i would get from any Garda, TD, Minister or official of any sort is "that is what licenses are for" and they wouldn't be wrong. A training license costs €40 for three years and can be gotten at any age. If someone you know wants to dip their toes into the shooting waters then go for the training license. I recommend the training license over the full license for a couple of reasons:
    1. They don't have to get or meet storage requirements
    2. They don't need to pay for a gun (they'll use yours)
    3. They will be under supervision at all times learning as well as getting some trigger time in
    4. If they don't like it they are out €40 (over three years) and nothing more.
    5. If they want to go for a full license the training license serves as their competence

    If any group or interested body were to try and make a case for someone to be able to shoot on another persons' gun without some sort of authorisation or license it would be dismissed immediately so for that reason i'd leave that "wish list" item alone.


    As for the plinking outside a range, definitely one to tackle and sooner rather than later. There are a host of reasons for this such as:
    • Safety, first and foremost. Lads not access to someone to zero a rifle.
    • Not requiring everyone to join a range for the above
    • Not requiring everyone to visit a range and break the law (day membership is illegal)
    • Preventing fraudulent applications (having to join a range, putting this on your FCA1 just to zero when you've no intention of using a range)

    Yeah I agree, it's definitely best to take small steps. If we pushed home the limited number of ranges, like in some areas it's a 1.5/2 hour round trip to a range and then what happens if you drop the rifle or mess up the zeroing. Even if we just get zeroing to be allowed outside of ranges, it's a gain we can further build on, "a stepping stone towards further independence", to quote the Big Fella. We shouldn't proceed with any plans unless we have a definitive course of action, we can't expect the government to completely overhaul the firearms legislation. I do think zeroing should be in that first push, but what do ye think should be in it too? Centrefire handguns or is that a step too far?


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,628 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    We shouldn't proceed with any plans unless we have a definitive course of action,
    Agreed, and also a consensus of members, groups, associations and shooting bodies. Like them or not they're involved and it's silly to proceed alone when they are established and can provide the very unity we are seeking.
    we can't expect the government to completely overhaul the firearms legislation.
    That is simply not going to happen. The broken system still works so they'll ignore, as they have done, the pleas for a restatement of the acts.
    I do think zeroing should be in that first push, but what do ye think should be in it too?
    Whatever we think off it needs to be "innocent". Zeroing is a good starter because it was never meant to be so can be argued we only want what the Minister said was a mistake.

    However pushing for say reloading and other firearm specific stuff is too much to start with because it requires not only an SI/Act amendment/repeal (IOW work), it will seen to lessen the restrictive nature of gun licensing will be met with serious opposition or outright dismissal.

    Start small, baby steps that are easy to implement, require no money or action (really) on the part of the PTB, and won't be seen as "gun nuts seeking further proliferation of guns".

    Alot of the other changes can be on club, range and association level without the need for Governmental/Garda interaction. Membership, PR, Lobbying (local to start with), open days, guest days, charity events, flyers, etc.
    Centrefire handguns or is that a step too far?
    Perhaps, but only from the point of view of the above.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,814 ✭✭✭ Tea drinker


    Strength thru unity... I am not a fan of the foxhunting but is a country sport and not disconnected from us.
    Sure if you are a target only shooter what do you care... what do you care if Farmers can't keep a shotgun.
    If we don't care for others sports then as individuals even as as our small divided groups we have no power.
    When the FAI started getting involved in shooting affairs the politicians backed way off. That's the kind of clout we need to cultivate.
    Stupid rows between the groups are not what we need, I more than have enough stress in the job, have no interest in adding to it in a "sport"
    Why can't we all just get along ;-)


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Feisar wrote: »
    To be fair lads on horses with dogs has nothing to do with shooting.

    You are right, but whether you like it or not it is tied to the shooting community. PR has been mentioned a few times on this thread and for the shooting community to be allied to hunting foxes with dogs is like tying ourselves to a sinking ship. NEVER will this form of hunting be accepted by normies. It's much easier to explain why a farmer wants you to shoot a fox for vermin control and also a more humane way to kill the fox.

    Hunting foxes with dogs is defended all the time on this shooting forum when someone speaks against it. How does that look for our community when someone comes along and reads these threads? I find it disheartening that more of ye don't see it this way because this is the kind of thing that immediately turns people off shooting.

    That's really all I want to say about that.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,628 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    Hunting foxes with dogs is defended all the time on this shooting forum when someone speaks against it. How does that look for our community when someone comes along and reads these threads? I find it disheartening that more of ye don't see it this way because this is the kind of thing that immediately turns people off shooting.
    Fair point. however there is a reason.

    How about ban pheasant shooting? I don't do it, don't eat them so won't bother me if its banned.

    While we're at it ban coursing. It serves no purpose, i don't do that either and it won't affect me if banned.

    Derogation is now pointless as the season for each species is enough to control their number so there will be no more derogation and with 50+% of the shooting community not affected that can be banned too.

    How about Foxing. I mean if all the other forms of traditional hunting is banned why not that? We done nothing, didn't pull together when they went after the other stuff so what support do we have now?

    Seeing as how most of the vermin stuff and some game stuff is banned might as well ban semi auto shotguns and any centrefire rifles as they're not needed.

    Fishing, well that is easy. Doesn't involve shooting and i don't do it so that can be banned too.

    While some of the above is clearly not as simple as its written you get the point. At what stage do we stop saying "not my circus, not my monkeys"?

    We don't have to defend anything. Being on the defensive means we are somehow in the wrong or guilty/shameful. If its legal then the "offence" so many claim as justification for the canceling of everything is moot.

    There is no point of acceptable loss. The notion of unity has been spoken about ad nauseum on this forum and i was one of the first to say, from first hand experience, how it doesn't exist, but it was brought up in this thread for this very reason and without getting any further than simple discussion "our own" have already begun to "cut the fat".

    If we cannot find consensus on a discussion forum then how are we meant to find unity in real life and move forward a single cohesive community?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,431 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    [
    QUOTE=The Rifleman;115965361]You are right, but whether you like it or not it is tied to the shooting community.

    How???Thats like saying cars are the same as Xwing fighters from Star Wars.
    PR has been mentioned a few times on this thread and for the shooting community to be allied to hunting foxes with dogs is like tying ourselves to a sinking ship. NEVER will this form of hunting be accepted by normies. It's much easier to explain why a farmer wants you to shoot a fox for vermin control and also a more humane way to kill the fox.

    Ever hear of the Domino theory?,Plus there are more influencers and legislators in society in Ireland in the horsey set than there is in the shooting set.Whether we find it agrees or disagreeable on a personal level.
    [I just cant figure out how they ever catch one of the smartest critters in nature, with all that racket and charging about the place]. We need allies as well to our cause, and the enemy of mine enemy...

    How does that look for our community when someone comes along and reads these threads? I find it disheartening that more of ye don't see it this way because this is the kind of thing that immediately turns people off shooting.

    Then maybe they should ask themselves WHY? Unless they are too narrow-minded to ask us? And they will get the following answer...
    I
    'ts not about whether we hunt with a gun or a pack of hounds. It's to those who wish to ban it a part of a totalitarian CLASS WAR iconography.IE they perceive it that anyone on a horse dressed in hunting pink or out with a firearm is some upper-class triple barrelled named chinless wonder twit, whose ancestors oppressed the workers to build their fortunes and must be destroyed in any way possible. All you have o do is look at any of the anti websites in Ireland like NARA or Lenstir hunt sabs on FB to see this kind of Anarchostic/Socialist babble on their position IOW they don't give a flying Fiddlers FK about the ethics of this it is and always has been a political movement hijacked off the Bambiists,old dear animal lovers, and pearl clutchers. That has spilt over into violence, intimidation, arson, destruction of property, animal cruelty,and bomb-making.
    I dont think any shooting organisation has ever needed to publish a manual like the Sabs have called "arson around with Auntie Alf" or needed to bring Ex Loyalist bomb makers to a hunt sab meeting in Dublin either.
    THAT is why we are allied with hunting with horse and hound.Not because we outright approve of it, but because we are lumped into the same hole..So if you are going to be branded a bastard...Might as well act like one then.:mad:

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,431 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    kick 1
    They are not involved and will not do anything to help but they are quick out of the traps to run down those that are involved on committees and so on when something happens. If you have better ideas, volunteer and help.
    Kick 2

    They , like taxes and death, are part of life. Best ignored and walked away from. IE[ F88k the begrudgers]Where they are dangerous is when they decide to sabotage willfully and spitefully the good guy's work out of childish reasons.


    FFS stop putting pictures of half decapitated foxes or car bonnets filled with woodcock on Facebook and so on, as it reinforces the stereotype and provides ammo to the enemies.
    I am all for controlling foxes but FFS some of the pics are ridiculous.
    Some people do not have a brain cell to spare.

    On that point. I'd actually say post away if you must, but could you at least adjust your settings to PRIVATE or just post in private hunting & shooting groups? That simple job does seem to be too difficult for some Simps out there... Or they just do not give a...:rolleyes:

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Registered Users Posts: 500 ✭✭✭ Munsterlad102


    Cass wrote: »
    Agreed, and also a consensus of members, groups, associations and shooting bodies. Like them or not they're involved and it's silly to proceed alone when they are established and can provide the very unity we are seeking.

    That is simply not going to happen. The broken system still works so they'll ignore, as they have done, the pleas for a restatement of the acts.

    Whatever we think off it needs to be "innocent". Zeroing is a good starter because it was never meant to be so can be argued we only want what the Minister said was a mistake.

    However pushing for say reloading and other firearm specific stuff is too much to start with because it requires not only an SI/Act amendment/repeal (IOW work), it will seen to lessen the restrictive nature of gun licensing will be met with serious opposition or outright dismissal.

    Start small, baby steps that are easy to implement, require no money or action (really) on the part of the PTB, and won't be seen as "gun nuts seeking further proliferation of guns".

    Alot of the other changes can be on club, range and association level without the need for Governmental/Garda interaction. Membership, PR, Lobbying (local to start with), open days, guest days, charity events, flyers, etc.


    Perhaps, but only from the point of view of the above.

    Just as I’m thinking about it now, maybe increasing the non restricted pistol capacity to 10 so you don’t have to go through the trouble to getting magazines pinned, or at the very least allowing 6 rounds for revolvers.

    If we take a leaf out of the Canadians book and allow non restricted firearms to be used outside of ranges, but maybe that’s further down the road.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,225 ✭✭✭ Feisar


    Cass wrote: »
    This thread is for ideas and brainstorming, but don't take offence when (like i'm going to) a rebuttal is thrown up.

    You’ll have to try harder to offend me!

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,431 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    Just as I’m thinking about it now, maybe increasing the non restricted pistol capacity to 10 so you don’t have to go through the trouble to getting magazines pinned, or at the very least allowing 6 rounds for revolvers.

    If we take a leaf out of the Canadians book and allow non restricted firearms to be used outside of ranges, but maybe that’s further down the road.

    I would consider if we got these things sorted ou in Ireland by this time next year a job of work done.

    1] A written assurance in the Dail form the minister in charge from our revelant orgs that there will be no further fukups with the pigeon deregation this or any other years.

    2] A written response to a Dail question, from relevant orgs, that for the 21 seasons the deer licenses will be issued by Sept 1st. Will also show which one has an intrest in actually looking out for its members too.

    3]
    Kind of an "UP yours Govt" this one
    That we push for a proof house to be re-established here in the ROI, as it will be now uneconomical to ship firearms to the Continental EU to have them proofed for steel shot, and the paperwork for ex and re-import from the UK is now too arduous and impossible for the DOJ to handle in the COVID due to being understaffed. Ireland is also obligated to provide this service now as it is stated EU practise, and it is now the equivalent of us having to drive to France for an NCT. As well as the point of product liability with the fact we have some "gunsmiths" here selling guns that are dreadful constructions and are possible Wli E Coyote "ACME" quality with possibly the same results.
    They signed us up to this...They can provide the service to test these guns.

    4] Push for the "safe spaces to shoot" in as many counties as possible Whether indoors or some outdoor range or even former disused ex military ranges]. Still a few about since when the Brits went home 100 years ago.

    5] We start growing the Green party membership with "active members":)

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭ tudderone


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    I would consider if we got these things sorted ou in Ireland by this time next year a job of work done.

    1] A written assurance in the Dail form the minister in charge from our revelant orgs that there will be no further fukups with the pigeon deregation this or any other years.

    2] A written response to a Dail question, from relevant orgs, that for the 21 seasons the deer licenses will be issued by Sept 1st. Will also show which one has an intrest in actually looking out for its members too.

    3]
    Kind of an "UP yours Govt" this one
    That we push for a proof house to be re-established here in the ROI, as it will be now uneconomical to ship firearms to the Continental EU to have them proofed for steel shot, and the paperwork for ex and re-import from the UK is now too arduous and impossible for the DOJ to handle in the COVID due to being understaffed. Ireland is also obligated to provide this service now as it is stated EU practise, and it is now the equivalent of us having to drive to France for an NCT. As well as the point of product liability with the fact we have some "gunsmiths" here selling guns that are dreadful constructions and are possible Wli E Coyote "ACME" quality with possibly the same results.
    They signed us up to this...They can provide the service to test these guns.

    4] Push for the "safe spaces to shoot" in as many counties as possible Whether indoors or some outdoor range or even former disused ex military ranges]. Still a few about since when the Brits went home 100 years ago.

    5] We start growing the Green party membership with "active members":)


    OOH i dunno about that, Grizz, anything like that in Ireland turns into a cash cow/scam run by some bent TD's brother in law. The NCT springs to mind, thats a complete racket.


  • Registered Users Posts: 263 ✭✭ Mississippi.


    I support everything yous are suggesting in this thread especially the plinking as I have a 28ft/lb airrifle and 12 bad acres but unfortunately no innovative ideas to help it all happen


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭ tudderone


    I support everything yous are suggesting in this thread especially the plinking as I have a 28ft/lb airrifle and 12 bad acres but unfortunately no innovative ideas to help it all happen

    Thats a massive way into shooting sports in the Uk, Europe, America and practically everywhere else apart from here, namely air rifle shooting. It can be done anywhere, old industrial buildings converted into ranges, village halls, barns etc, no licence needed.

    Of course here the 12 ft/lb air rifle is treated like a .308 :rolleyes:, and the range needed has to meet the same specs afaik.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,431 ✭✭✭✭ Grizzly 45


    tudderone wrote: »
    OOH i dunno about that, Grizz, anything like that in Ireland turns into a cash cow/scam run by some bent TD's brother in law. The NCT springs to mind, thats a complete racket.

    Not if it is staffed by foreigners it won't.;) we don't have any proof masters here,so they have to come from the continent, and if they can issue free deer licenses, why not free proofing?FIK it has also got to be a full state body,not some semi private-public money maker. Otherwise, it would have been hoyed out along time ago in Germany.Like DHL/Deutshe Post:rolleyes:

    Confucius say."He who says one man cannot change World. Never has eaten bat soup in Wuhan!"



  • Registered Users Posts: 232 ✭✭ dto001


    I think here there should be a 2 pronged approach to bringing Hunting shooting into a good light:
    1: hound the politicians from personal to the various groups and increase PR
    2: the old hearts and minds approach, Like we did at our club release Adult birds early on in spring with the kids of one of the local schools, We were hoping to do it every year but the covid put a stop to it for now which would educate them and the teachers from what I saw.
    I've also seen in the UK that they collect Prepared game and donate it to the homeless groups and to help feed a lot of people (although I see one charity refused it because of the anti's) but if you keep at it eventually you can not only help people but you can also shame the Anti's and also no politician would try to go against a charity (well you would hope not)


  • Registered Users Posts: 263 ✭✭ Mississippi.


    dto001 wrote: »
    (although I see one charity refused it because of the anti's) but if you keep at it eventually you can not only help people but you can also shame the Anti's and also no politician would try to go against a charity (well you would hope not)


    Yeah, even the Irish Cancer society refused funding here because it came from a hunt


  • Registered Users Posts: 500 ✭✭✭ Munsterlad102


    dto001 wrote: »
    I think here there should be a 2 pronged approach to bringing Hunting shooting into a good light:
    1: hound the politicians from personal to the various groups and increase PR
    2: the old hearts and minds approach, Like we did at our club release Adult birds early on in spring with the kids of one of the local schools, We were hoping to do it every year but the covid put a stop to it for now which would educate them and the teachers from what I saw.
    I've also seen in the UK that they collect Prepared game and donate it to the homeless groups and to help feed a lot of people (although I see one charity refused it because of the anti's) but if you keep at it eventually you can not only help people but you can also shame the Anti's and also no politician would try to go against a charity (well you would hope not)

    I really like your 2nd suggestion but I have a few points to critique your first, if you don't mind. If we hound politicians they could always just ignore us and they could always just bin our letters, which is a probability so that won't really be a source of PR. I strongly agree that we need to increase PR, but I think that doing interviews in local newspapers/radio stations. Also it is essential that we have public figures, someone to put a face to a message, charisma is a must.

    Does anyone know if any big party has an official pro gun stance? I was talking to one of the lads from the National Party any he said that they in favour of a "Swiss system", where people can own military grade firearms for national defense, with military training of course so Joe Soap can't just go out and buy an AK47. I'm not sure I agree with this, but it's certainly a step in the right direction, even if it's coming from the polar opposite attitude. Maybe worth giving them a vote if they're the only pro gun party.

    Also just as I think of it, if the gun community did a big fund raiser for charity and got national news coverage we could really get some notoriety that way. Whatever that fundraiser should be, I think it should be more target shooting aimed so it would be held in a range for example. My logic for that is it's really not the farmers or hunters that are getting their firearms banned, but more the target shooters. A lot of people don't know that target shooting is a thing, so I think this would be a great PR approach as it gets our name out there and gets people thinking about us.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,280 ✭✭✭ tudderone


    Yeah, even the Irish Cancer society refused funding here because it came from a hunt

    They cannot be as stuck for money as they bang on about then can they ? If they can refuse money like that.


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