Brexit discussion thread XIV (Please read OP before posting)

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119375656#Comment_119375656

One upside to Brexit, if economic self-sabotage can be called thus, is that it immediately nuked many Eurosceptic parties' narrative of ejecting their own country from the EU. Support bounces about country to country, crisis to crisis, but Brexit will exist as a cautionary tale for all those empty polemics who preach the myth of the totally sovereign state, curtailed by EU bureaucracy.

The obvious example being the speed with which Marine LePen dropped her own Frexit dreams from their manifesto. I don't it'll speed up the move to a totally federalists bloc, but for now it kicked a lot of malcontents to the ha'penny place.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119375916#Comment_119375916

Stinks of desperation, frankly. Whoever wins knows that they'll be calling an election relatively quickly. That's not a lot of time to make a mark or build a narrative upon which to campaign.

The party has resurrected Brexit because it has no ideas. It has purged itself of talent and this is the result. People here seem to have been conditioned to despise EU red tape while being completely unable to name any EU regulations. They think regulations hold business back and that, therefore, burning them en masse will unleash growth. Regulations do impose a burden on business but they also provide stability and a framework in which to operate. Conveniently ignored are other, constraints on growth such as unaffordable housing, appalling productivity, hostility to immigration and weak infrastructure. Also, Brexit for obvious reasons.

I don't know if there'll be a trade war. The UK have postured for years and haven't advanced beyond antagonising the EU into taking legal action. It has a current account deficit with the EU as well as being a net importer of food. In the middle of a cost of living and climate crisis, I struggle to think of a surer way to destroy the cancerous Tory party. Part of me would like to see it if I'm being honest. It'd put the little Englanders in their place but at great cost.

I don't see it happening though. All the EU would have to do is suspend parts of the deal and middle England will be up in arms when they can't get their German Percy Pigs and trips to their Spanish villas.

farmerval

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119375050#Comment_119375050

While the British are blaming the French, no one mentions Heathrow chaos, or just about every other major Airport in Europe. Christ it's like little babies crying. In all likely hood dover will be back to normal next week and this will all be tomorrows chip wrapper, loads of noise about nothing.

The real thing with Brexit is that every economic indicator is painting brexit as an economic drag on the UK, it's making the UK and it's citizens worse off, yet the most likely next UK PM believes they need to double down on it. Truly bonkers, you really couldn't make it up!!!!

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376047#Comment_119376047

It's like the new neoliberalism. If it's not working, it's because you haven't implemented enough of it.

retalivity

This is the conservative MP for Dover, the lack of self-awareness is astonishing. Although she has published it in the express, so will be red meat for the base.

https://twitter.com/NatalieElphicke/status/1550745703621738496

salonfire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376047#Comment_119376047

Just like how the feckless Greece, Spain and now Italy are an economic drag on the eurozone.

Italy can't keep their Government together and when in Government can't keep their trousers up.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376214#Comment_119376214

What has this whataboutery to do with Brexit?

salonfire

To those blaming staff shortages, you'll notice all French officials are in Dover today. Didn't take them long to resolve those shortages.

fly_agaric

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376232#Comment_119376232

I doubt any of it is or was deliberate (quoting you - "imposed by the French") though.

Was there some nefarious plan "imposed by the Irish" to put Dublin airport in a jocker earlier in the summer and make tourists suffer?

FraserburghFreddie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376232#Comment_119376232

Principles and "teaching the British a lesson "soon disappeared when greed and the thought of loosing all that British tourist money sunk in. And before the standard sarcastic replies about British delusional thinking that "they need us more" start,there's little love between France and Britain, never has been so keeping the chaos going would have rubbed it in to the British but greed put paid to all that noble idealism.

moon2

Or, quite simply, there was a staffing shortage (as reported) and it was addressed (as reported) and queues are now not as bad as they were (as expected).

The UK papers ramped it up to 90 (as usual), and turned it into the EU/France deliberately ruining the lives of Brits (as usual), UK politicians (as usual) demanded France fix the problem. The temporary issue had been resolved and now people are attempting to claim France/the EU capitulated (as usual).

So what was the actual problem? Did 1/2 the staff get stuck on, or miss, a train for the first half of a day? Is this what everything is predicated on?

ArmaniJeanss

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376232#Comment_119376232

Yes, they arrived yesterday for Day 1 of their shift, after delays in the Channel Tunnel. Presumably they stay overnight in the area for a couple of days before heading home, so there would be no staff shortage today. If the next 'relief' get delayed on Monday/Tuesday by events outside their control, then more delays are possible.

This seems logical enough to me, rather than just a 'blame the French' attitude of the authorities yesterday, which they seem to have rolled back on today.

yagan

As has been the norm for decades family loaded cars and campervans from northern Europe, including Britain make the exodus to the med, except this year brits have to wait in customs queues. This is a self imposed impediment.

They've always got Blackpool.

Sam Russell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376385#Comment_119376385

The ones that do not go via Dover on their holliers generally join the traffic jams on the M5, and M4 on their way to Devon and Cornwall.

This year must be unusual in that there are no reports of the French causing those jams on the routes into Cornwall. No, wait, the French do not cause those jams, they are quite normal at this time of year, as are the Dover ones.

FraserburghFreddie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376592#Comment_119376592

I hope the link I've attached is within forum guidelines.I believe it illustrates the attitude of the French when called out for their own incompetence and bare faced lies.

https://www.lemonde.fr/en/sports/article/2022/05/30/champions-league-fiasco-french-authorities-don-t-admit-to-failures-despite-evidence_5985082_9.html

yagan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376681#Comment_119376681

You appear indicative of the brexiter mindset that dictates that something and nothing are related.

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376681#Comment_119376681

It took over 20 years for the UK government to finally admit that fans were not the cause of the Hillsborough disaster and officially apologise.

The phrase "perfidious albion" exists for a very good reason.

FraserburghFreddie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376685#Comment_119376685

I'm not nor ever have been in favour of brexit.

Doesn't my link which shows how French authorities will lie to divert blame elsewhere suggest they're probably at it again this time?

54and56

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119375065#Comment_119375065

Yes the need for extra checks is 100% UK but if France wants the revenue available from UK visitors they need to make it as smooth as possible for them to enter France and by all means build the additional cost into the visa charge but if their priority is political and sticking it to Brexiteers then by all means choke off UK tourism but IMHO that would be pointless and self defeating as it would just play into the Brexiteers narrative of how the EU is punishing the UK blah blah blah and just to be clear I'm not suggesting any dilution or waiving of the entry requirements for 3rd country citizens which the UK has voted to be.

It's just good business to make your (tourism) service as easy as possible for your customers to access.

FraserburghFreddie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376800#Comment_119376800

People died at Hillsborough, your comparison is in remarkably bad taste.

wexfordman2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376970#Comment_119376970

What a ridiculous statement, so because peoole died, the topic and incident should be buried along with the victims ?

Besides that, during the actual reporting of the french incident, british media were frequently comparing it to hillsborough!

Are you sure you are not a tory in disguise ?

FraserburghFreddie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119377178#Comment_119377178

British people died at a British event,how does that relate to brexit and the comment "perfidious albion?"

wexfordman2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119377189#Comment_119377189

Because the event was similar to the one which was raised by you in the first place, becayse during and after the event media were comparing both events, and because the hillsborough event was infamous for its rsther quick attempt at cover up and the decades of effort that followed of victims and relatives to force the british government to expose the truth!

Now, why again is it in bad taste, explain to us why you think it should not be mentioned, despite british media howling the comparison from the rooftops at the time ?

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119377189#Comment_119377189

You brought up an example of a catastrophe at a football match in France and the authorities blaming the fans as an example of the French being incompetent and lying, I countered to show that the same thing happens at football matches in other countries, speficially in the UK as we are talking about Brexit. Trying to claim just because people died my example was in bad taste is pretty childish moving of the goalposts when shown that your argument is ridiculous.

I mentioned the phrase perfidious albion is to show that historically the british are internationally know for not keeping to their word or agreements so much so theres a very well know phrase to describe them as such. I dont believe theres a french comparison to perfidious albion or at least not one that is anywhere near as well known.

Ramasun

Boris Johnson leaving office, is a loss to the political establishment here.

I think all political parties in Ireland have enjoyed the reflected competence.

looksee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119377266#Comment_119377266

That's probably Bingo!

yagan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119376830#Comment_119376830

Like English authorities lied to divert blame after Hillsborough?

Now that we've got that squared perhaps you can explain why any EU country should prioritize trade with an ex member that's acting the bollix?

Edit to add I've seen the other comments making the same point. If I was a ref I'd be handing out a red card for time wasting.

Pete_Cavan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119374920#Comment_119374920

What would the French economy have lost from a delay to one days worth of British tourists - the first nights evening meal plus croissants the next morning? All those delayed will still travel as they have accommodation committed to, are already at Dover with the car fully loaded for holidays and have taken the next X number of days off work. Domestic holiday options at such short notice will be very limited, particularly on the south coast. The subsequent days travelers will all still go to, they will just arrive earlier and sacrifice their time queuing in Britain so they still get their full holiday.

No matter what way people try to spin these things, it is the British who ultimately lose out. They will put up with the additional hardship and any impact on the French economy will be negligible. It will be the same with the next similar incident, people will desperately look for the "well it hurts them too" angle and cod themselves that the pain is somewhere close to equal.

FraserburghFreddie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119377228#Comment_119377228

Hardly describe events in Paris as a "catastrophe "worthy of comparison with Hillsborough.The reference to "perfidious albion "should be consigned to the bin along with other mocking ethnic stereotypical urban myths like the French tend to surrender at the drop of a hat or the ridiculous jokes about Italian tanks.

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119377388#Comment_119377388

I didnt say they were worthy comparisons of being a disaster, but they are both examples of local police forces corruption and lying about the truth which was why you originally posted the article about the champions league game.

Perfidious albion isnt an ethnic stereotype its an observation about british political class behaviours based on the actions of multiple governments over several centuries of history. Also some of the most nationalistic english politicians wear it as a badge of pride.

https://twitter.com/channel4news/status/1115661494170079233

But keep trying to dig up harder, your original point was absurd and every preceding post has made even less sense and shown you haven't a clue what you are talking about.