Schools closed until March/April? (part 4) **Mod warning in OP 22/01**

TheValeyard

is_that_so wrote: »

We can't keep hiding behind potential risks. If you've survived this far without COVID you know what to do. If there were no vaccines you'd still be doing it.

Doesnt work that way. I followed all the rules and guidelines still got infected.

is_that_so

Harleigh Fluffy Muscle wrote: »

Where is this claim about such speed? He said 7 more weeks to finish just the over 70s. Are you saying an official claim has been made that all adults will be vaccinated by June 2021?? I'd love to read that, thank you.

But this is not the same as "everywhere else" - why would you claim that when workers such as teachers have been vaccinated ahead of other groups in many countries. Why be dishonest?

Always good to come in swinging! Martin listed it all off yesterday. If the supplies materialise we will be doing 1m+ just a month. Can't tell here if it's being in with gen pop is your issue. Group 10 as was would have been June anyway. It's about everyone and based on other countries, it's a far simpler way to do it. I'll also ask you to back your claim of my dishonesty, for learning purposes you know.

wirelessdude01

am_zarathustra wrote: »

It's strange given the localized nature of schools they couldn't be done quickly. There are a around 750 secondarys, surely mobile units could be organized. Everyone is on site anyway.

Smells like there are more scandals in the wings and the logistics to prevent them going forward are lacking so a blunt instrumental approach is being taken

Seemingly the story is that they cannot be sure who is and isn't a teacher. Wonder what the TC database is for then?

irishblessing

TheValeyard wrote: »

Doesnt work that way. I followed all the rules and guidelines still got infected.

And some of us have children in school, and we can't socially distance from young children living with us.

Teens now may be a different story. :P

jimmytwotimes 2013

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

Already said groups who can't social distance at work should be up next after vulnerable.

Vaccinating somebody working from home before people working on site and engaging with high numbers of people in close quarters makes zero sense.

Many posters on here often accuse others of being close-minded to possibilities when it came to keeping schools open. Now all of a sudden, an employer can't compile an alphabetical list of their workers for vaccination.

Funny, oppositional posting for the sake of it.

Sure by the time teachers get fully vacillated if prioritised it will be the summer holidays anyway. Much better to go with hospitality working over the summer first

is_that_so

TheValeyard wrote: »

Doesnt work that way. I followed all the rules and guidelines still got infected.

Indeed. I've also followed guidelines and not been infected. Even at this stage I only know two people who've caught it.

TheValeyard

irishblessing wrote: »

And some of us have children in school, and we can't socially distance from young children living with us.

Teens now may be a different story. :P

Teens definitely cannot socially distance themselves. Particularly at breaktime. They dont give a fcuk.

Also you're right about young kids. They literally crawl, jump, climb all over us. No chance to separate.

is_that_so

Deleted User wrote: »

Sure by the time teachers get fully vacillated if prioritised it will be the summer holidays anyway. Much better to go with hospitality working over the summer first

Or anyone else who can make a case!

TheValeyard

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Seemingly the story is that they cannot be sure who is and isn't a teacher. Wonder what the TC database is for then?

Charging people money for a job for the boys. Quango.

r93kaey5p2izun

is_that_so wrote: »

Always good to come in swinging! Martin listed it all off yesterday. If the supplies materialise we will be doing 1m+ just a month. Can't tell here if it's being in with gen pop is your issue. Group 10 as was would have been June anyway. It's about everyone and based on other countries, it's a far simpler way to do it. I'll also ask you to back your claim of my dishonesty, for learning purposes you know.

What a really weird post. I don't have an issue? I'm not affected by this is any way. I find your post difficult to decipher tbh. I listened to Martin, there was no indication of 1M a month by June.

Many countries have vaccinated their teachers as a priority group, for example Estonia, Slovakia, Poland, Italy and USA.

average_runner

Harleigh Fluffy Muscle wrote: »

What a really weird post. I don't have an issue? I'm not affected by this is any way. I find your post difficult to decipher tbh. I listened to Martin, there was no indication of 1M a month by June.

Many countries have vaccinated their teachers as a priority group, for example Estonia, Slovakia, Poland, Italy and USA.

But why make them a priority group if by the time they get to them, they won't be in school?

Uk didn't have teachers in priority group and things going well there now.

TheValeyard

average_runner wrote: »

But why make them a priority group if by the time they get to them, they won't be in school?

Suppose you'd want them all vaccinated by the start of the next school year, so a school can become a normal place of learning and socialising rather than the grim reality it currently is.

wadacrack

SNA's getting vaccinated beinga priority I understand. Teachers and Gards no Im in my opinion. I think going by age after the most vulnerable are vaccinated is the correct step. Theirs a reason that is the protocol in most countries. Display bas for a certain job/role could lead to alot of upheaval and anger. It could set a precedent of people just getting vaccinated because they work in a certain role. Which is fundamentally wrong . When does that end with retail, meat plant workers or college workers etc.

average_runner

TheValeyard wrote: »

Suppose you'd want them all vaccinated by the start of the next school year, so a school can become a normal place of learning and socialising rather than the grim reality it currently is.

Not really, i want the correct people that are more likely to be severely affected by the virus.


For too long the under 40's have been raving on that this virus is harmless to the younger group. Stats strongly support this also.


So it makes sense to work from older generation down. If a 30 year old teacher gets the virus and is already vaccinated, brings the virus home, here 55 year old parent could get it from them and die.



Have to protect the weaker groups first

r93kaey5p2izun

average_runner wrote: »

But why make them a priority group if by the time they get to them, they won't be in school?

Uk didn't have teachers in priority group and things going well there now.

Yes, UK is doing it differently. Do you think our vaccine supply is comparable to the UK so as to draw reasonable comparison? But my post merely stated that it was untrue to state "everywhere else" is going just on age after elderly and HCW. It's just a factually incorrect statement, so I wonder why make it?

As for school holidays - I don't believe teachers would be done before August anyway, under any system. Now I believe it will be well into the new school year, probably 2022 for many teachers. Why prioritise them? For me the main argument would be so that children's education is prioritised and not disrupted into another school year. I thought that was a priority for parents. Their reaction is not what I expected at all.

is_that_so

Harleigh Fluffy Muscle wrote: »

What a really weird post. I don't have an issue? I'm not affected by this is any way. I find your post difficult to decipher tbh. I listened to Martin, there was no indication of 1M a month by June.

Many countries have vaccinated their teachers as a priority group, for example Estonia, Slovakia, Poland, Italy and USA.

That's 4 countries! The 1m+ shots is from the HSE and Reid and others have said has said it more than once, supposedly from April. If it's been adjusted down that's because of the unreliability of AZ supplies.

average_runner

Harleigh Fluffy Muscle wrote: »

Yes, UK is doing it differently. Do you think our vaccine supply is comparable to the UK so as to draw reasonable comparison? But my post merely stated that it was untrue to state "everywhere else" is going just on age after elderly and HCW. It's just a factually incorrect statement, so I wonder why make it?

As for school holidays - I don't believe teachers would be done before August anyway, under any system. Now I believe it will be well into the new school year, probably 2022 for many teachers. Why prioritise them? For me the main argument would be so that children's education is prioritised and not disrupted into another school year. I thought that was a priority for parents. Their reaction is not what I expected at all.

All the more important to protect the people that are more likely to be affected the virus. Teachers in their 50's will get done before teachers in their 30's. Everyone in their 50's should be done before the 30's as it affects them more

josip

Harleigh Fluffy Muscle wrote: »

Personally, as someone totally unaffected in any way by this change to vaccine priority lists, I am just very surprised at how well parents are accepting it.

Probably because more parents of school children fall into the 45-54 cohort than any other new cohort.
This is the cohort that will benefit most from the change.

irishblessing

Harleigh Fluffy Muscle wrote: »

Yes, UK is doing it differently. Do you think our vaccine supply is comparable to the UK so as to draw reasonable comparison? But my post merely stated that it was untrue to state "everywhere else" is going just on age after elderly and HCW. It's just a factually incorrect statement, so I wonder why make it?

As for school holidays - I don't believe teachers would be done before August anyway, under any system. Now I believe it will be well into the new school year, probably 2022 for many teachers. Why prioritise them? For me the main argument would be so that children's education is prioritised and not disrupted into another school year. thought that was a priority for parents. Their reaction is not what I expected at all

I'm a parent and I think it's a sham. It puts all of us at greater risk and also increases the likelihood that their class would revert to home teaching if the teacher were to fall ill. Honestly I'd be so utterly stressed if I were a teacher. I don't know how they face it especially in primary school with a small over crowded classroom of unmasked pupils...

is_that_so

irishblessing wrote: »

I'm a parent and I think it's a sham. It puts all of us at greater risk and also increases the likelihood that their class would revert to home teaching if the teacher were to fall ill. Honestly I'd be so utterly stressed if I were a teacher. I don't know how they face it especially in primary school with a small over crowded classroom of unmasked pupils...

We'd still be into the summer for shots regardless of how they are done.

irishblessing

average_runner wrote: »

All the more important to protect the people that are more likely to be affected the virus. Teachers in their 50's will get done before teachers in their 30's. Everyone in their 50's should be done before the 30's as it affects them more

But doesn't the risk factor of this particular profession put them in a far worse position than age does?

irishblessing

is_that_so wrote: »

We'd still be into the summer for shots regardless of how they are done.

And what about for next year? You don't forsee more issues with supply and rollout?

r93kaey5p2izun

average_runner wrote: »

All the more important to protect the people that are more likely to be affected the virus. Teachers in their 50's will get done before teachers in their 30's. Everyone in their 50's should be done before the 30's as it affects them more

I don't disagree, my concerns are based purely around disrupted education, not the health of education staff. And as I said, I'm really surprised to see parents accept that health outcomes of adults outside the high risk groups will be prioritised over children's school attendance for another school year.

average_runner

irishblessing wrote: »

But doesn't the risk factor of this particular profession put them in a far worse position than age does?

How many 30/40 year old teachers have died ? Virus has minimum impact on the most that age.

is_that_so

irishblessing wrote: »

And what about for next year? You don't forsee more issues with supply and rollout?

Nope, at that stage we'll be awash in vaccines! I reckon it'll become more like the flu' jab programme.

r93kaey5p2izun

is_that_so wrote: »

We'd still be into the summer for shots regardless of how they are done.

You have great confidence in our vaccine programme. I think it's likely we will be well into a new school year and indeed a new calendar year by the time most education staff are vaccinated, let alone the summer! If I had your faith I would fully understand this change to roll out, but as it stands I'm really surprised by it and by how supportive parents are being of it.

average_runner

Harleigh Fluffy Muscle wrote: »

I don't disagree, my concerns are based purely around disrupted education, not the health of education staff. And as I said, I'm really surprised to see parents accept that health outcomes of adults outside the high risk groups will be prioritised over children's school attendance for another school year.

Because losing a parent has more of an effect on a kid than losing 6 weeks of education.

average_runner

irishblessing wrote: »

And what about for next year? You don't forsee more issues with supply and rollout?

Come summer vaccines will be well in supply. Uk already said they will supply Ireland also, as the north can't open fully they said

JDD

is_that_so wrote: »

Nope, at that stage we'll be awash in vaccines! I reckon it'll become more like the flu' jab programme.

This is the thing. I think this is a once off issue. And at this stage we don't even know if we need to roll out another round of vaccines next year. So far, those that were vaccinated in stage 1 of the vaccine trials early last year are still immune, so lets see how long it lasts.

In practical terms, teachers wouldn't have been vaccinated until the summer anyway. I understand that teachers are annoyed as it is the principle of the thing and symptomatic of the way they have been left to get on with it without any real investment in their protection. But the reality of it is that they would never have received a vaccine before the end of summer term, so they are no more at risk today than they were yesterday.

r93kaey5p2izun

average_runner wrote: »

Because losing a parent has more of an effect on a kid than losing 6 weeks of education.

Absolutely. But that's not what I have been hearing from parents or media commentators over the past few months. Quite the opposite in fact - they had no concern for anything other than their children's classroom attendance so long as the elderly were protected, and in many cases even that was not important to them.