Cross Pens

DroidJoi

mik_da_man wrote: »

I ordered on the 1st, just over 100 quid.
Nada from then yet
So going on others experience I guess it will be 26 quid.
I have emailed them already about the VAT and plan to get them to refund that.

It isn't as easy as that. They already paid UK VAT, refunding the customer will lead to double VAT, etc. and a non-taxable expense for Cross i.e. it come out of their net revenue.

At this stage I personally see just one option for orders already dispatched which is to pay the charges and at least get a product. The other option of refusing delivery is another uncertainty, won't be straightforward getting your money back!

For orders not yet dispatched, we probably have one last chance to cancel.

Luckycharms_74

GalwayGaillimh wrote: »

Rang Cross talked to a gentleman named Steve he said same thing warehouse had a covid outbreak hence the delay , orders being processed and they use DHL for delivery and as regards vat dutys etc he said price you see is price you pay :-)

I emailed a few days about order update but no reply yet. I think I’ll call them tomorrow as one pen is engraved for a birthday gift for end of January

beardybrewer

I got my ship notification yesterday.

richardw001

endacl wrote: »

Not that simple. If they refund the value of the VAT, they are essentially reducing the purchase price. VAT would still be due @ 21% of (just over 100 quid, minus 26 quid). Revenue would owe you about a fiver back, which would be a pain in the arse to chase on principle.


Joys of Brexit.

This is an interesting read guys

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/consumer/online-shopping-from-the-uk-delivers-financial-shocks-1.4451638

The thing that bugs me - is that I dont think we should be getting hit with admin fees from an post and courier companies.

Paying the VAT is one thing - and I didn't mind paying these extra sort of charges before for stuff from China or the US - however, the way the Irish and UK governments have left this is - the UK or Irish customer is paying VAT in both countries and admin fees to various companies.

And every time you order online you have to check whether something is being shipped from the UK or the EU - really not ideal

vicwatson

richardw001 wrote: »

This is an interesting read guys

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/consumer/online-shopping-from-the-uk-delivers-financial-shocks-1.4451638

The thing that bugs me - is that I dont think we should be getting hit with admin fees from an post and courier companies.

Paying the VAT is one thing - and I didn't mind paying these extra sort of charges before for stuff from China or the US - however, the way the Irish and UK governments have left this is - the UK or Irish customer is paying VAT in both countries and admin fees to various companies.

And every time you order online you have to check whether something is being shipped from the UK or the EU - really not ideal

Paywall

A lot of misinformation going on here

It doesn’t matter where the goods are shipped from, vat registration of the seller is the key definer.

If the company is vat registered in Ireland then Irish vat is charged at invoice. This is why the big retailers (next, screwfix, Amazon etc) won’t fall foul what happened cross. Key example here is screwfix, no ROI presence / warehouse (same owner as b&q but completely independent).

In crosses case they likely never had an obligation to register in Ireland as I assume they never sold enough to breach the registration threshold. They like plenty of other uk exporters didn’t do their Brexit homework, customer experience own goal for them. The company I work for did their due diligence and have the adequate plans in place.

As for those “threatening” to send a dear John email to cross saying hello I availed a loophole in your ordering system were I stacked discount codes now I demand another 21% refund to cover Irish vat. Dream on if you thing cross are effectively going to give you another 21% discount which it will be for them.

Some posters need a reality check, much of the bargains on here are risky, you win some and lose some so grow up and put this in the missed out pile.

I’d suggest those who want to continue to chance their arm with purchases from outside the European Union should do some research so they know the risks and can decide it worth it

dakar

My DHL tracking has ‘Customs Status Updated’ at Shannon (I assume the DHL depot there) as the second step before the package was even collected. Item still in the UK, due for delivery on Tuesday. I’m guessing I’ll get a customs payment request after it lands in Ireland.

Still, €37.78 (+ whatever charges) for €130 rrp of pens is still ok by me.

Blanchy90

Mayo_fan wrote: »

A lot of misinformation going on here

It doesn’t matter where the goods are shipped from, vat registration of the seller is the key definer.

If the company is vat registered in Ireland then Irish vat is charged at invoice. This is why the big retailers (next, screwfix, Amazon etc) won’t fall foul what happened cross. Key example here is screwfix, no ROI presence / warehouse (same owner as b&q but completely independent).

Bit off topic but Screwfix do have shops in Ireland so they should be sorting out the vat on any online orders. I'd be pretty annoyed if I ordered from them and had to pay vat on top.

whiterebel

I ordered on 3rd. 2 pens total €36.25. Shipped on Friday, departed E Midlands early hours. No notification of more charges, although it says they may be due.

whiterebel

Blanchy90 wrote: »

Bit off topic but Screwfix do have shops in Ireland so they should be sorting out the vat on any online orders. I'd be pretty annoyed if I ordered from them and had to pay vat on top.

"Orders made from our Screwfix Ireland website will not have any export tax attached to them.
I hope this helps,
If you have any further inquiries please do not hesitate to get back in contact with us."

Jonesy101

Mayo_fan wrote: »

A lot of misinformation going on here

It doesn’t matter where the goods are shipped from, vat registration of the seller is the key definer.

If the company is vat registered in Ireland then Irish vat is charged at invoice. This is why the big retailers (next, screwfix, Amazon etc) won’t fall foul what happened cross. Key example here is screwfix, no ROI presence / warehouse (same owner as b&q but completely independent).

In crosses case they likely never had an obligation to register in Ireland as I assume they never sold enough to breach the registration threshold. They like plenty of other uk exporters didn’t do their Brexit homework, customer experience own goal for them. The company I work for did their due diligence and have the adequate plans in place.

As for those “threatening” to send a dear John email to cross saying hello I availed a loophole in your ordering system were I stacked discount codes now I demand another 21% refund to cover Irish vat. Dream on if you thing cross are effectively going to give you another 21% discount which it will be for them.

Some posters need a reality check, much of the bargains on here are risky, you win some and lose some so grow up and put this in the missed out pile.

I’d suggest those who want to continue to chance their arm with purchases from outside the European Union should do some research so they know the risks and can decide it worth it

Well said! So many whingers on here about scamming a price mistake likely getting someone in trouble or fired or whinging about a few cents saved when buying a product they dont even want.

lawred2

Mayo_fan wrote: »

A lot of misinformation going on here

It doesn’t matter where the goods are shipped from, vat registration of the seller is the key definer.

If the company is vat registered in Ireland then Irish vat is charged at invoice. This is why the big retailers (next, screwfix, Amazon etc) won’t fall foul what happened cross. Key example here is screwfix, no ROI presence / warehouse (same owner as b&q but completely independent).

In crosses case they likely never had an obligation to register in Ireland as I assume they never sold enough to breach the registration threshold. They like plenty of other uk exporters didn’t do their Brexit homework, customer experience own goal for them. The company I work for did their due diligence and have the adequate plans in place.

As for those “threatening” to send a dear John email to cross saying hello I availed a loophole in your ordering system were I stacked discount codes now I demand another 21% refund to cover Irish vat. Dream on if you thing cross are effectively going to give you another 21% discount which it will be for them.

Some posters need a reality check, much of the bargains on here are risky, you win some and lose some so grow up and put this in the missed out pile.

I’d suggest those who want to continue to chance their arm with purchases from outside the European Union should do some research so they know the risks and can decide it worth it

Surely the refund request would be for the UK VAT.

Do you really think that their sales into Ireland didn't exceed 35k? If so Ireland is a mickey mouse market for them. Can't see them bothering to serve Ireland with a dedicated operation. They'll have to append us to another EU operation.

I'd agree that seeking a VAT refund from them after using a stack of discount codes would be rather brass faced.

swingking

Did anyone who ordered on the 1st NOT get a shipping notification.

I ordered a pen on the 1st and a pen on the 3rd but haven't got a shipping notification for either.

Nigel Fairservice

swingking wrote: »

Did anyone who ordered on the 1st NOT get a shipping notification.

I ordered a pen on the 1st and a pen on the 3rd but haven't got a shipping notification for either.

I ordered on the first but haven’t got a shipping notification. I got mine engraved so that might be the source of the delay.

Unknownability

I ordered on the 1st and have heard nothing.

the pen is mightier than the boards

mik_da_man

DroidJoi wrote: »

It isn't as easy as that. They already paid UK VAT, refunding the customer will lead to double VAT, etc. and a non-taxable expense for Cross i.e. it come out of their net revenue.

At this stage I personally see just one option for orders already dispatched which is to pay the charges and at least get a product. The other option of refusing delivery is another uncertainty, won't be straightforward getting your money back!

For orders not yet dispatched, we probably have one last chance to cancel.

Well that's not correct, they have not paid any VAT yet.
They have only charged the customer.

They obviously don't have their IT systems setup correctly as the transaction should have not attracted VAT in the first place, (place if supply) they are not liable to pay the sakes VAT on a transaction to Ireland. So honestly I don't see the issue claiming it back.
In fact if they had their systems setup correctly or revised invoices to Irish customers a refund is due.

The code stacking is a different issue, some codes stacked and some did not. We don't know for sure but they could have intentionally let them stack.

august12

Unknownability wrote: »

I ordered on the 1st and have heard nothing.

Same here, no shipping notification, ordered on the 1st and no engraving.

mik_da_man

august12 wrote: »

Same here, no shipping notification, ordered on the 1st and no engraving.

Same here

DroidJoi

mik_da_man wrote: »

Well that's not correct, they have not paid any VAT yet.
They have only charged the customer.

They obviously don't have their IT systems setup correctly as the transaction should have not attracted VAT in the first place, (place if supply) they are not liable to pay the sakes VAT on a transaction to Ireland. So honestly I don't see the issue claiming it back.
In fact if they had their systems setup correctly or revised invoices to Irish customers a refund is due.

The code stacking is a different issue, some codes stacked and some did not. We don't know for sure but they could have intentionally let them stack.

UK VAT already prepaid. That was always the arrangement.

Wolftown

Ordered on the 1st, no engraving and received a shipping notification yesterday

mik_da_man

DroidJoi wrote: »

UK VAT already prepaid. That was always the arrangement.

But it shouldn't.. it's a zero rated export.
Either that or they charge Irish VAT

Anyway I'll wait and see what happens, I've no issues paying VAT but not twice.

DroidJoi

mik_da_man wrote: »

But it shouldn't.. it's a zero rated export.
Either that or they charge Irish VAT

Anyway I'll wait and see what happens, I've no issues paying VAT but not twice.

That's the whole point. No one expected to be paying VAT in two countries. Cross were clueless about paying Irish VAT thinking paying UK VAT covers them. Now customer are being charged Irish VAT. When you say you will ask for VAT back they need to apply for a UK refund the success of which is anyone's guess...

This isn't a unique Cross problem, they were just too ignorant... and still are!

M&S, Tesco, etc. having even greater problems regarding re-exporting...

The fault lies in Mr. Johnson selling a narrative that nothing changes, when in fact every process changes... maybe not the end result which is "tariff free" after jumping through multiple hoops.

Prefect_1998

Orderd 2 seperste pens and confirmation mail received for both.

First order i have a DHL tracking, this was not an engraved pen.

Second order was engraved, just received a refund of the payment to revolut. Very strange experience so far

Gerard93

Anyone compare prices against Easons? I checked one Roller Ball pen and it's the same price and free delivery over €10, the only discount that seems available now with Cross is the introductory discount when you sign up, but anything over €22 is liable for Customs etc as mentioned/

Lucifer

They do not need to seek a refund. They won't have paid the VAT to HMRC yet. They will have accounted for it on their books. They could do a refund for the full amount. Then invoice at 0 rate for export.

Example.

They charged 100. They owe 20 to HMRC.

They credit 100, 20 of which is VAT, cancelling the previous that they owe.

They then charge 80 at 0% as an export.

They still have their 80 that they originally would have been keeping. HMRC shouldn't have got the 20 on the export in the first place, so they are not suffering.

You receive the goods, and pay Irish VAT here.


I personally am not going to do this as on my order its not a huge amount of money for the time involved for myself and cross staff. By the time I get through, explain above and then hope the person on the other end of the phone will understand, be willing, and have the ability to do a 0% rate on their system, this is just not worth the €5 involved.

Nunu

Nunu wrote: »

Just noticed on their ‘shipping & delivery’ page there is the line, ‘We are currently unable to process any engraved orders’. So these orders might not be processed?

Although all other info on the page has not been updated since Christmas period because it still has Christmas dates etc.

... just reposting this info in case it was missed. Because reading through last few pages a lot of questions re engraved orders.

I have feeling no engraved orders will be fulfilled?

Prefect_1998

Nunu wrote: »

... just reposting this info in case it was missed. Because reading through last few pages a lot of questions re engraved orders.

I have feeling no engraved orders will be fulfilled?

Mine was just refunded

eclipsechaser

glasso wrote: »

the pen is mightier than the boards

Too soon.

kollegeknight

danielle_door wrote: »

Mine was just refunded

Just refunded also.